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Free Agent Frenzy Trade rumors, transactions, and free agent talk. Rumors must contain the word RUMOR in post title. Proposals must contain the word PROPOSAL in post title.

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Old
07-11-2012, 11:39 PM
  #1
Joe Sakic
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Ottawa - Colorado

To Colorado:

Jared Cowen

To Ottawa:

Duncan Siemens
2013 3rd
2014 4th

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Old
07-11-2012, 11:44 PM
  #2
OmniSens
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This won't end well...Cowen ain't going for that little package.

edit: especially not with Ottawas current needs.

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Old
07-11-2012, 11:44 PM
  #3
Joe Sakic
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I was afraid of that...

What would it take?

Also, what are your needs?

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Old
07-11-2012, 11:44 PM
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IranCondraAffair
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No, thank you.

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07-11-2012, 11:45 PM
  #5
BrickAHL
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No point for Ottawa.

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Old
07-11-2012, 11:46 PM
  #6
ReginKarlssonLehner
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If Cowen is heading your way, it's in a package for Duchene. That's about it.

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Old
07-11-2012, 11:47 PM
  #7
IranCondraAffair
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Quote:
Originally Posted by talkmtv com View Post
I was afraid of that...

What would it take?

Also, what are your needs?
A defenseman of similar ability, salary, and equivalent development.

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Old
07-11-2012, 11:47 PM
  #8
Lonewolfe2015
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Yeah, don't see the desire to add a couple late picks for the already developed/developing Cowen when there's still the uncertainty for Duncan, even if his potential is arguably along the same lines as Cowen.

I imagine if we wanted Cowen they'd ask for one of our young core and try to unload some of their forward prospects to even the difference, which is simply not going to work for our club.

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Old
07-11-2012, 11:48 PM
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danishh
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I dont get it, we take 2 years off the development of cowen why?

If you want cowen, from the avs, we want EJ.

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Old
07-11-2012, 11:51 PM
  #10
Joe Sakic
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IranCondraAffair View Post
A defenseman of similar ability, salary, and equivalent development.
You could argue Siemens is. Similar size, drafted just 2 spots later, and both played in the WHL with Siemens putting up better point totals, and Siemens is younger.


I understand that Siemens isn't 'NHL proven' and that Cowen is, but that's why I've added the two draft picks.

Quote:
Originally Posted by danishh View Post
I dont get it, we take 2 years off the development of cowen why?

If you want cowen, from the avs, we want EJ.
Understandable, and a fair point. The only defense I have for that is for the risk that Siemens develops into a better hockey player than Cowen. That's also the reason I added the two draft picks to acquire Cowen.

And the whole reason we would want Cowen is to have a good, young lefty to play with EJ, so it could not be EJ going the other way.

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Old
07-11-2012, 11:52 PM
  #11
Manked
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Not a chance.

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Old
07-12-2012, 12:01 AM
  #12
EssendonBombers
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Quote:
Originally Posted by talkmtv com View Post
Also, what are your needs?
A solid young defensive defenseman who plays the left side to compliment Karlsson. AKA Cowen.

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Old
07-12-2012, 12:03 AM
  #13
dan1el
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What in god's name?

To Ottawa: Gabriel Landeskog

To Colorodao: Peter Regin
2013 2nd
2013 3rd

How about that?

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Old
07-12-2012, 12:04 AM
  #14
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Cowen is what you hope Siemans projects to be and the addition of late pick doesn't even out the years of development put into Cowen. Although Cowen can improve, he was not that good in the playoffs and I expected big things since he had the experience with Binghamton and their run to the Calder Cup.

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Old
07-12-2012, 12:05 AM
  #15
PAZ
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EssendonBombers View Post
A solid young defensive defenseman who plays the left side to compliment Karlsson. AKA Cowen.
What about a 7th and Cowen's identical twin brother that plays defense on a professional polo team?


Quote:
Originally Posted by dan1el View Post
What in god's name?

To Ottawa: Gabriel Landeskog

To Colorodao: Peter Regin
2013 2nd
2013 3rd

How about that?
Ok come on, the OP's proposal wasn't great, but yours is on a whole different level.

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Old
07-12-2012, 12:07 AM
  #16
number72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by talkmtv com View Post
To Colorado:

Jared Cowen

To Ottawa:

Duncan Siemens
2013 3rd
2014 4th

The value is pretty close though the might need to be 2nd. And Ottawa needs a to replace the dman so a prospect is nice but does nothing for them today. Actually Avs have quite a few dman signed so maybe a trade for dman + siemens for cowen could work in theory.

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Old
07-12-2012, 12:07 AM
  #17
IranCondraAffair
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Quote:
Originally Posted by talkmtv com View Post
You could argue Siemens is. Similar size, drafted just 2 spots later, and both played in the WHL with Siemens putting up better point totals, and Siemens is younger.


I understand that Siemens isn't 'NHL proven' and that Cowen is, but that's why I've added the two draft picks.
No one is taking anything away from Siemens, he might even be a better NHL player some day, I'm not an expert. The problem is that, if anything, Ottawa would love if Cowen had an extra year of NHL experience, not less. Even if Siemens is a similar player, even a year less experience screws us.

Long-term, Cowen looks like a permeant partner for Karlsson. They compliment one another well, and looked good together with limited exposure last season. The problem is that Karlsson only has three seasons under his belt and Cowen has one. For a team that made the playoffs, putting them together would be a BIG gamble.

As it stands, Ottawa is probably going to be forced to play Methot beside Karlsson, and give Cowen another season with Gonchar. Methot is, arguably, not someone you want to rely on for 20 minutes a game, so it's not a good situation. Ideally, we'd be able to play Phillips with Karlsson and move Methot down to the third pairing, but that didn't exactly work very well when we tried it.

Long-term, Ottawa probably wants a long-term Cowen-Karlsson super pairing like Weber-Suter used to be for Nashville. In order to do so however, we need to get them playing together and we need experience. Adding a 3rd and a 4th when we have one of the deepest prospect pools in the league also doesn't help us.

TL: DR Siemens would screw us because we need to find a permanent partner for Karlsson and it would set us back significantly finding out if he'd be able to replace Cowen. Also a 3rd and 4th doesn't help us as much as you might think.

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Old
07-12-2012, 12:09 AM
  #18
BrickAHL
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dan1el View Post
What in god's name?

To Ottawa: Gabriel Landeskog

To Colorodao: Peter Regin
2013 2nd
2013 3rd

How about that?
Lol are you drunk? The OP's proposal wasn't good but it wasn't this bad either.

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Old
07-12-2012, 12:12 AM
  #19
Kershaw
 
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Originally Posted by BrickAHL View Post
Lol are you drunk? The OP's proposal wasn't good but it wasn't this bad either.
Terrible example for sure.

A better one would've been

Zibanejad
4th rounder
5th rounder

for

O'Reilly

In comparison to the OP.

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Old
07-12-2012, 12:22 AM
  #20
BrickAHL
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kershaw View Post
Terrible example for sure.

A better one would've been

Zibanejad
4th rounder
5th rounder

for

O'Reilly

In comparison to the OP.
Agreed, this proposal and the OP are comparable.

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Old
07-12-2012, 12:23 AM
  #21
Lonewolfe2015
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Rather than try to replicate the OP's proposal, how about we be straight forward and see what Ottawa has to offer that might come close to the value of what they want to move Cowen.

If you want Duchene, Landeskog or EJ, what do you have to make up the difference?

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Old
07-12-2012, 12:24 AM
  #22
cgf
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lonewolfe2015 View Post
Rather than try to replicate the OP's proposal, how about we be straight forward and see what Ottawa has to offer that might come close to the value of what they want to move Cowen.

If you want Duchene, Landeskog or EJ, what do you have to make up the difference?
Not that I think either team does it but Siemens and Dutchy for Turris and Cowen is probably as close to even value as you're going to get

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Old
07-12-2012, 12:32 AM
  #23
WhiteLight
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Quote:
Originally Posted by talkmtv com View Post
You could argue Siemens is. Similar size, drafted just 2 spots later, and both played in the WHL with Siemens putting up better point totals, and Siemens is younger.


I understand that Siemens isn't 'NHL proven' and that Cowen is, but that's why I've added the two draft picks.



Understandable, and a fair point. The only defense I have for that is for the risk that Siemens develops into a better hockey player than Cowen. That's also the reason I added the two draft picks to acquire Cowen.

And the whole reason we would want Cowen is to have a good, young lefty to play with EJ, so it could not be EJ going the other way.
No chance Siemens becomes as good as Cowen. None.

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Old
07-12-2012, 12:38 AM
  #24
IranCondraAffair
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lonewolfe2015 View Post
Rather than try to replicate the OP's proposal, how about we be straight forward and see what Ottawa has to offer that might come close to the value of what they want to move Cowen.

If you want Duchene, Landeskog or EJ, what do you have to make up the difference?
Roster players? Greening, Smith, JOB, Michalek,
NHL ready? Z-Bad, Silfverberg,

There's also a bunch of middling prospects that every team has, like, a lot of them. I cat imagine any of it is really going to improve the Avs either though.

It's not that the Avs don't have players Ottawa wants, but if Ottawa moved Cowen, we open a huge hole in our roster. Would Duschene or Landeskog be better than Turris as out 2nd Center? Of course. If we moved Cowen + more assets for those players we actually make our team worse though. Why improve a position, marginally, at the expense of significantly weakening another one.

As far as EJ goes, he's a RD who is not going to displace Karlsson, so it's kind of a lateral move. Why add assets to move a player from a place of weakness (top-4 LD) and trade to a position of strength ( top-4 RD).

If anything we'd probably want trade Cowen for a guy like who can play LD with Karlsson next season. I don't see any teams offering up anyone though, which is why we traded Foligno and settled on Methot.

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Old
07-12-2012, 12:47 AM
  #25
cgf
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Originally Posted by 19sens11 View Post
No chance Siemens becomes as good as Cowen. None.
Well that's a silly thing to say. There's absolutely no telling what Siemens' ceiling is going to be just as there's no way to know for sure how much better Cowen will get. Cowen is more developed, more proven and better right now isn't it enough to just say that?

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