HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > General Hockey Discussion > The Business of Hockey
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

The Business of Hockey Discuss the financial and business aspects of the NHL. Topics may include the CBA, work stoppages, broadcast contracts, franchise sales, NHL revenues, relocation and expansion.

NEWS LINKS ONLY - Lockout News & Updates

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
11-20-2012, 11:23 AM
  #451
LadyStanley
Elasmobranchology-go
 
LadyStanley's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: North of the Tank
Country: United States
Posts: 64,460
vCash: 500
SunGarrioch 9:07am via Web Steve Fehr and Bill Daly spoke. Union will work on something today and there's a good possibility it will be presented tomorrow. #NHL #NHLPA

LadyStanley is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-20-2012, 12:07 PM
  #452
Fugu
Administrator
HFBoards
 
Fugu's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: ϶(°o°)ϵ
Posts: 35,379
vCash: 500
CBC with a good overview:
http://www.cbc.ca/sports/hockey/nhl/...d-revenue.html
Quote:
Neither side has demonstrated a willingness to start trading concessions at the bargaining table.
...
The league is also looking for changes to rules governing entry-level deals, contract lengths and arbitration. On Monday night, Fehr presented details of a proposal designed to penalize teams who sign players to front-loaded, long-term contracts in the event they retire early — an area the NHL could have interest in.
Friedman's take:
http://www.cbc.ca/sports/hockey/opin...s-crucial.html
Quote:
There are a few reasons for this. The obvious one is it will allow the league to know where Fehr and the players stand on each of these critical areas. It also gives the NHL a better idea of where it is willing to concede to bridge the gaps. (Despite what it says, there is some room for compromise. How much is the question.) And finally, Fehr has kept his written proposals limited in scope at various points in the process -- in at least one case, just a few written lines.

CP Canada via TSN:
http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=409837

Fugu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-20-2012, 12:11 PM
  #453
ThirdManIn
Global Moderator
 
ThirdManIn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 49,617
vCash: 500
I don't think this has been posted yet. NHLPA expected to have proposal tomorrow.

http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=409911

__________________
http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/image.php?type=sigpic&userid=89413&dateline=146768  6770
ThirdManIn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-20-2012, 02:54 PM
  #454
Krishna
Registered User
 
Krishna's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: New Jersey
Country: Canada
Posts: 84,391
vCash: 50
Tim Panaccio ‏@tpanotchCSN
NHLPA will work this evening on its new #cba proposal; meet with NHL on WED morning in NYC. #gobblegobble.

__________________
Krishna is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-20-2012, 02:58 PM
  #455
LadyStanley
Elasmobranchology-go
 
LadyStanley's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: North of the Tank
Country: United States
Posts: 64,460
vCash: 500
DarrenDreger 12:07pm via Twitter for BlackBerry® Not official, but the NHL and PA are hoping to meet around 10am tomorrow morning.

LadyStanley is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-20-2012, 04:40 PM
  #456
Marc the Habs Fan
Moderator
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Longueuil
Country: Canada
Posts: 66,505
vCash: 567
http://www.thestar.com/sports/leafs/...osal-wednesday

Quote:
COMMON GROUND
The sides have more or less agreed to:

• Change the free agent calendar, meaning the market would open on June 15 or 48 hours after the awarding of the Stanley Cup — the players want whichever is later — instead of July 1. Arbitration dates may change as well.

• Allow cap space to be included in transactions, to encourage trades and get teams out from under heavy contracts.

• A joint health committee.

• Eliminate re-entry waivers.

• A neutral, third-party arbitrator to deal with appeals for on- and off-ice discipline.

• Minimum roster requirements to avoid situations where teams dress fewer than 18 players to save salary cap room.

GETTING CLOSER
The NHL has moved closer to the NHLPA position on:

• Entry-level contracts. The league still wants two-year limits. A club option on a third year is a sticking point.

• AHL salaries. The league is offering to count only those that exceed the NHL minimum ($525,000) against a team’s cap. The NHL had wanted the number closer to $95,000. The victory for the PA here is that AHL players won’t have their salaries count against the players’ share of hockey-related revenue. Accounting would be limited to players in the NHL.

• Unrestricted free agency. The league is offering freedom after eight years of service or age 28, after asking for 10 years. This year, players could become free agents after seven years of service, or age 27.

• Maintaining salary arbitration, but with eligibility pushed back to a player’s fifth season. The players are asking for arbitration after four years. The NHL initially wanted it abolished.

Marc the Habs Fan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-20-2012, 06:10 PM
  #457
pepty
Let's win it all
 
pepty's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 11,910
vCash: 395
Podcast this afternoon team 1200 with Paul Kelly
http://autopod.ca/chum/185/podcasts/

pepty is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-21-2012, 11:08 AM
  #458
cheswick
Non-registered User
 
cheswick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Peg City
Country: Canada
Posts: 5,405
vCash: 371
Some Tweets about Today's NHLPA proposal:

Bob McKenzie‏@TSNBobMcKenzie
We're also hearing the NHLPA proposal will work off a percentage of HRR -- as requested by NHL -- and not a guaranteed dollar amount. But what those percentages are, and whether the $180M increase in Make Whole acts as a guarantee of sorts, remains to be seen.


John Shannon‏@JSportsnet
Confirmation from meetings, PA makes major move towards owners side. Making players whole still big issue for Union. As part of the PA proposal, union would agree to small variance on contracts, but not agree to terms limit on deals.


Ian Mendes‏@ian_mendes
Fehr: "We've moved far more than halfway. Our expectation is the NHL is going to be willing to meet us if they want to reach an agreement."

cheswick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-21-2012, 11:10 AM
  #459
LadyStanley
Elasmobranchology-go
 
LadyStanley's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: North of the Tank
Country: United States
Posts: 64,460
vCash: 500
PollakOnSharks 9:08am via Web Multiple sources in NYC breaking that down to $1.2M per year per team, but multiple sources also point out NHL doesn't usually buy PA math.

PollakOnSharks 9:06am via Web World now awaiting NHL response to PA's plan that Fehr says has sides a mere $182M apart over five-year term. Bettman digesting over lunch.

LadyStanley is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-21-2012, 11:25 AM
  #460
MapleLeafsFan4Ever
Registered User
 
MapleLeafsFan4Ever's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Toronto, Ontario
Country: Canada
Posts: 10,075
vCash: 500
NHLPA sends letter to Parliament regarding lockout

http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=409973

MOD: From Monday, 11/19

MapleLeafsFan4Ever is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-21-2012, 11:44 AM
  #461
LadyStanley
Elasmobranchology-go
 
LadyStanley's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: North of the Tank
Country: United States
Posts: 64,460
vCash: 500
SunGarrioch 9:28am via Web NHLPA denies it will release its proposal to public. #NHL


ChrisBottaNHL 9:34am via Web
If NHLPA releases proposal publicly, have to think it's most likely because it wants you to see what the NHL is rejecting.

LadyStanley is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-21-2012, 01:02 PM
  #462
cheswick
Non-registered User
 
cheswick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Peg City
Country: Canada
Posts: 5,405
vCash: 371
Breakdown of proposal: http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=409992

cheswick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-21-2012, 02:11 PM
  #463
Fugu
Administrator
HFBoards
 
Fugu's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: ϶(°o°)ϵ
Posts: 35,379
vCash: 500
http://www.cbc.ca/sports/hockey/opin...contracts.html

Friedman with example on the back-diving contract proposal, using a 10 yrs/$55 MM contract.

Fugu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-21-2012, 02:59 PM
  #464
Hank Chinaski
Global Moderator
No mistakes...
 
Hank Chinaski's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Granola Belt
Country: Canada
Posts: 16,139
vCash: 50
For those who want to get right down to the nuts and bolts of it, here's an excellent breakdown by James Mirtle:

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/sport...rticle5530468/

Hank Chinaski is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-21-2012, 04:25 PM
  #465
Fugu
Administrator
HFBoards
 
Fugu's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: ϶(°o°)ϵ
Posts: 35,379
vCash: 500
Quote:
"Well, it's disappointing. I feel they're trying to bully us and trying to draw a line in the sand pretty much. It's tough. We want to be negotiating. We came their way again and nothing. They just keep telling us keep coming. They're staying where they are, so you end up negotiating with yourself, and that's definitely something we don't want to do."
"I don't know where we go from here. It's very frustrating."
http://www.tampabay.com/blogs/lightn...ppointing-day?

Not very optimistic at this point for a quick resolution. At least Bettman said they'd keep talking.


From TSN:
Quote:
Collective bargaining talks at the NHL's head office in New York on Wednesday did not produce any progress after the NHL Players' Association tabled a new five-year proposal to the league.
"Nothing on significant economic issues," NHLPA executive director Donald Fehr told reporters on Wednesday afternoon after receiving the league's response. "On the big things there was, as of today, no reciprocity in any meaningful sense."


While both sides are closer on revenue sharing, no concessions were made on contractual issues or the Make Whole provision as the league remains firm on its $211 million for the players.



"We're still far apart," NHL commissioner Gary Bettman told reporters on Wednesday. "But hopefully there's some momentum so we can bring this to a conclusion." Bettman added that league business is losing between $18 million to $20 million per day while players are losing between $8 million to $10 million per day.
http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=409972

Some quotes from Crosby and Brad Richards in the article as well, with the players sentiment being that they feel they've moved in the league's direction.

Fugu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-21-2012, 05:16 PM
  #466
Paranoid Android
mug mug mug
 
Paranoid Android's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: CO
Posts: 12,332
vCash: 500
Roman Hamrlik calls out Donald Fehr, calls for NHLPA vote on deal

Quote:
"I am disgusted. We have to push Fehr to the wall to get the deal. Time is against us. We lost 1/4 season, it is $425 million. Who will give it back to us? Mr. Fehr?
"There should be voting between players. Four questions - YES or NO - then count it. If half of players say let's play, then they should sign new CBA. If there is no season he should leave and we will find someone new. Time is our enemy."

Paranoid Android is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-21-2012, 06:53 PM
  #467
LadyStanley
Elasmobranchology-go
 
LadyStanley's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: North of the Tank
Country: United States
Posts: 64,460
vCash: 500


Fehr presser today.

LadyStanley is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-21-2012, 07:22 PM
  #468
Marc the Habs Fan
Moderator
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Longueuil
Country: Canada
Posts: 66,505
vCash: 567
http://espn.go.com/blog/nhl/post/_/i...er-contracting

Quote:
ESPN.com's Pierre LeBrun has learned from a source what the NHL has offered to do on matters of player contracts. Unedited, from source:

On main areas:

(1) offered to give back the year in ELS (NHL has moved from 2+3 to 2 and now back to 3).
(2) dropped/withdrew request for mutuality of Salary Arb rights but maintained request for extra year to Salary Arb, also offered to synchronize timing of Club-elected Salary Arbs as per NHLPA request.
(3) suggested willingness to be flexible of 5% contract variability proposal but maintained request for 5 year term limits on contracts.
(4) maintained request for extra year to free agency, but gave on UFA interview period and pointed out that 3 year EL deal plus 5 year max contract puts Player right into UFA for their third contract
(5) embraced Union's request to allow retained salary in trades subject to upwardly revised parameters
(6) embraced Union's request for Payroll Range determined as a percentage of Midpoint as opposed to flat $16 million
(7) embraced Union's Cap Advantage Recapture concept subject to several minor modifications and application to existing long-term contracts
(8) agreed to eliminate Re-Entry Waivers
(9) Performance Bonus Cushion in every year of new agreement
(10) extension of No Move/No Trade clauses to last year of "extended" SPC

other "system-related things" league has agreed to:

(1) no Union guarantee of Escrow shortfall and more discretion to Union in setting Escrow rate
(2) increase in Playoff Pool
(3) mechanism to allow for Cap exception for recalled players for roster emergencies
(4) changes to waiver rules for Emergency recalls and mid-season European signings
(5) agreement to continue increasing Minimum Salaries over life of new CBA
(6) Lower Limit to be satisfied without regard to performance bonuses
(7) agreed to limitations on "second/salary arb" buyout provisions
(8) agreed to re-work Critical Date Calendar
(9) $60 million Cap in Year 1 (with transition rules allowing Clubs to go to $70.2 million for full year) and guaranteed cap of $60 million in Year 2 even though HRR formula would have provided for lower Cap
So the cap floor will now be based on a % rather than 16 M under the cap.

Marc the Habs Fan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-21-2012, 08:42 PM
  #469
Fugu
Administrator
HFBoards
 
Fugu's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: ϶(°o°)ϵ
Posts: 35,379
vCash: 500
To juxtapose Hamrlik's comments, here's Detroit's player rep, Dan Cleary and Tampa Bay's St. Louis:
http://www.freep.com/article/2012112.../1053/sports05
Quote:
After attending today’s afternoon session in New York, Cleary told the Free Press, "it didn't go well. We pretty much agreed on everything, except stuff that matters. A lot of players today are extremely upset about this."
...
"As players, the word would be: Frustrated, disappointed," Cleary said. He was at the meetings as a player representative. "It's just, it seems almost after every proposal, we haven't gotten anything on our side, and we've continually moved towards them. I think as players, we really felt that we've come a long way. They just didn't budge on the bigger issues with us. It seems like a lot of give from players, and all the taking is on their side."

...Cleary said the league "didn't move at all on the $211 million" make-whole provision, which centers on how the league should fully honor existing contracts. Cleary also said there was "no movement in the player rights," such as capping contracts at five years.
http://www.tampabay.com/blogs/lightn...ppointing-day?
Quote:
"Well, it's disappointing. I feel they're trying to bully us and trying to draw a line in the sand pretty much. It's tough. We want to be negotiating. We came their way again and nothing. They just keep telling us keep coming. They're staying where they are, so you end up negotiating with yourself, and that's definitely something we don't want to do."
"I don't know where we go from here. It's very frustrating."

Fugu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-21-2012, 09:11 PM
  #470
Fugu
Administrator
HFBoards
 
Fugu's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: ϶(°o°)ϵ
Posts: 35,379
vCash: 500
Cole vents about Hamrlik; also points out that (like any good HF mod or admin), PA brass have suggested to players that personal attacks aren't a good idea.

http://www.hockeyinsideout.com/news/...nhls-rejection

Fugu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-22-2012, 06:19 PM
  #471
UsernameWasTaken
Let's Go Hawks!
 
UsernameWasTaken's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Toronto
Country: Canada
Posts: 23,506
vCash: 500
In Bob McKenzie's new article he discusses the decertification issue:

MCKENZIE: THREE CBA-RELATED ISSUES TO BE DEALT WITH SOON
http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=4100...ce=twitterfeed

Quote:
3. Decertification.

It's already the word-du-jour, and for good reason.

On pretty much every NHLPA conference call with the players in past weeks, there's been some discussion on the potential of decertification as an NHLPA strategic tool. But on each of those calls, the emphasis always turned towards negotiating a settlement with the NHL and decertification was shelved.

Until last night's conference call, that is. For the first time, when decertification was brought up, there was no stated objective to it. A number of NHL players who might have otherwise have raised an objection or concern to it didn't because they said the climate on the call, after the NHL rejected what the players thought was a significant proposal, was too hot to talk of moderation.

After last night's player call, it is fair to say that NHLPA executive director Don Fehr has the mandate or green light to go down the decertification road. That doesn't necessarily mean decertification is imminent or that the actual process is underway, but multiple sources say it is unquestionably on the next page of the NHLPA playbook and that is a viable option that may soon become reality.

...
First, the NHLPA must petition for the mere opportunity to decertify. A petition signed by one-third of the NHLPA is required to launch the process. If that petition is successfully executed, decertification could go to a membership vote, with simple majority rules.

UsernameWasTaken is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-22-2012, 06:41 PM
  #472
sawchuk1971
Registered User
 
sawchuk1971's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 772
vCash: 500
ryan miller advocating decertification...

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/sport...article5578329

Quote:
“After watching the other sport leagues go through labour disputes last year, it is apparent that until decertification is filed, there will not be any real movement or negotiation,” Miller wrote in an e-mail to The Globe and Mail. “Many things in our negotiation are very consistent with the NFL and NBA negotiations, and both of those leagues filed papers necessary to decertify.

“It seems like the players in any league are going to be subjected to the same scripted labour dispute developed by [NHL and NBA law firm] Proskauer Rose in all collective bargaining discussions now and in the future. Decertification becomes part of the script because Gary Bettman and the owners are trying to get a sense of how far they can push us and at some point we have to say ‘enough.’

“They want to see if we will take a bad deal because we get desperate or if we have the strength to push back. Decertification is a push back and should show we want a negotiation and a fair deal on at least some of our terms.”

sawchuk1971 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-23-2012, 12:25 PM
  #473
cbcwpg
Registered User
 
cbcwpg's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Between the Pipes
Country: United Nations
Posts: 8,857
vCash: 500
Daly speaks

http://plus.sites.post-gazette.com/i...70-daly-speaks

He said further cancellations are "imminent" as the lockout continues.

If the players vote to decertify their union it would "likely lead to the end of the season

Daly said he "underestimated the magnitude of the gulf between us. ... I don't really understand how we got where we are."

He also took a shot at NHLPA executive director Donald Fehr, saying he's not sure the union leadership wants to get a deal done.

cbcwpg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-23-2012, 01:04 PM
  #474
Freudian
Clearly deranged
 
Freudian's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Country: Sweden
Posts: 37,761
vCash: 50
NHL announces cancellation of games through 14th December and the All Star game.

Freudian is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-23-2012, 06:34 PM
  #475
UsernameWasTaken
Let's Go Hawks!
 
UsernameWasTaken's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Toronto
Country: Canada
Posts: 23,506
vCash: 500
another good article from the G&M re decertification [James Mirtle]:

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/sport...medium=twitter


Last edited by Fugu: 11-23-2012 at 07:06 PM. Reason: ...
UsernameWasTaken is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:48 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2016, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2016 All Rights Reserved.