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Ownership Cluster**** Thread: This is the last one, Really!

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Old
07-31-2012, 01:14 PM
  #401
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Killion View Post
$325M promise

$325M is quite the motivator.

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07-31-2012, 01:23 PM
  #402
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Originally Posted by Killion View Post
... I just cant see it playing out any other way quite frankly. Relocations' not an option, not now, no way no how. Forget about Contraction. The BOG's would have Bettman & Dalys' heads on a platter.

Furthermore, as hard as it is too stomach for the unbelievably loyal & faithful Coyotes fans, Im afraid they'll be facing another year of uncertainty, caught in a twilight zone of limbo. I just dont see how, practically speaking, if your Jamison or more importantly one of the investors, having lost the momentum, critical time, why you wouldnt just hold off?

Let the NHL continue on as defacto owner, let them collect the $17M AMF through 12-13, sort out the CBA. The only reason youd close right now is to get the COG's signatures on the 20yr $325M promise (that quite frankly sends shivers down my spine) so it is possible Jamison could close within days, weeks, or, sign off on it, before the municipal elections & changing of the guard, taking possession in the new year. A lot of smoke in the air.
I agree with this post. I don't see them moving this year and contraction won't happen. I see the NHL owning the team for another year if Jamison can not buy the team. The window to buy the team could be closing as new Glendale leadership might not be willing to bend as far to keep the team. That is the one reason it makes more sense for a buyer (Jamison), to purchase them now as the window could close.

I doubt he gets a better deal in 6 months unless the NHL thinks they can add 2 expansion teams, and collect those fee's. If so, they can cut Jamison a better deal so they don't have to move the coyotes to an expansion market.

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07-31-2012, 02:22 PM
  #403
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Originally Posted by cobra427 View Post
If so, they can cut Jamison a better deal so they don't have to move the coyotes to an expansion market.
... pretty much. What people who cry out for relocation seem to over-look is that once that takes place to wherever it winds up, potential Expansion Fee's are lost, gone forever, unless of course that "wherever" goes bust, moves yet again, taking up another slot on the board & thus eliminating the possibility of yet more Expansion Fee's arriving unencumbered.

Had ASG for example cared enough to have managed & run the Thrashers properly, hung in there, made something of things which quite frankly was not a difficult task (they wilfully destroyed the franchise) then the League couldve realized $200M (or thereabouts) from TNSE & lets say QC (another $200M) to balance things out Divisionally. Id call that a near on half a billion dollar MISTAKE. Flying by the seat of their pants.

Everyone knew at League level that Atlanta & Phoenix were in trouble, that Ownership was killing the Golden Goose, for years, but did nothing. Just let it all unwind. Threw some serious cash at them expecting the likes of ASG or Moyes to actually do something with it. Doesnt work that way, and they left a coupla loopholes in their Franchise Agreements, within the NHL's Constitution & By-Laws etc that these guys were able to drive a Mac clean on through. The agreement with Moyes in particular circa fall 08 & early winter 09 when he was advanced monies against Rev-Sharing & Broadcast proceeds a mess.

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07-31-2012, 02:30 PM
  #404
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Some math: If the NHL can expand into QC and Seattle, that could be 400 million in expansion fee's in the next few years. How many other locations are even close to ready or viable for expansion? None

I can see why they are trying to keep the coyotes in Phoenix and why it would make sense to discount the deal to Jamison to get it completed. The option of moving the team will be way less profitable to owners even if a lower price discounts NHL franchise value. I doubt that it does, just a fire sale price like any other business forced to sell.

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07-31-2012, 02:56 PM
  #405
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Or admit that it was opinion only but backed up by experience, which he did several condescending posts ago.
Pretty much.

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07-31-2012, 03:01 PM
  #406
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It's never going to end and nothing will ever happen.

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Old
07-31-2012, 03:13 PM
  #407
Killion
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And more math;

Quote:
Originally Posted by cobra427 View Post
Some math;
... ya, well, heres where the stupidity & short term gain resulting in long term pain comes into the equation. They received a $60M Relo Fee from TNSE, split 29 ways thats about $2M & change per team. Wow. That two million bucks is gonna save my franchise.

Now, we dont know that they havent done so, theyd never announce it if they have, but apply that $60M to bringing down the NHL's line of credit with BankAmerica that theyve been dipping into, used to buy the Coyotes out of Bankruptcy, and youve got yourself a new sale price with a huge discount being offered. Lets say $110M. (and they can announce whatever sale price they want, like Tampa, claiming it was $180M when in fact it was about 1/2 that when you remove the goodies that came with, St.Louis same thing)

Then lets say your Jamison or Reinsdorf, you offer $70-$80M cash and take over the remaing balance on the NHL's Line of Credit from Bank America (app $30M-$50M), paper exchange. Negotiated a reasonable market-value Arena Management Contract (and fee structure that wouldnt cause panic in the streets) & Lease that included a 5-7yr "Out Clause", demanding the NHL provide you with an All Star Game & a Draft, capping the Consent Form pursuant to losses with anything over & above applied to the waiving of relocation fee's.

Just all kinds of ways a creative formula couldve been found by now, but for the league being obtuse, stubborn, short-sighted, foolish, I just dont get it. How can they be so sharp in so many other areas yet when it comes to something so drop dead stupid-easy....

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07-31-2012, 08:28 PM
  #408
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cobra427 View Post
Some math: If the NHL can expand into QC and Seattle, that could be 400 million in expansion fee's in the next few years. How many other locations are even close to ready or viable for expansion? None

I can see why they are trying to keep the coyotes in Phoenix and why it would make sense to discount the deal to Jamison to get it completed. The option of moving the team will be way less profitable to owners even if a lower price discounts NHL franchise value. I doubt that it does, just a fire sale price like any other business forced to sell.
Kansas City has a shiny arena waiting. Not sure if it works there though.

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07-31-2012, 10:25 PM
  #409
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Kansas City has a shiny arena waiting. Not sure if it works there though.
... "iffy", but you never know, under good ownership the NHL should be able to thrive almost anywhere. The Mayor of KC, one "Sly" James is a real piece of work. The Sprint Centre turns a profit with nothing but Concerts & Events, and whenever he's asked about an NHL or NBA franchise, he basically states that if they do come, forget about the Red Carpet, forget about Tax Breaks or Concessions, Subsidies, whatever, and they'd better put a winning team on the ice or court every single year or just dont bother coming at all!. Raconteur Don Cherry called Kansas City the "Graveyard of Hockey". The Penguins were threatening to move in unless Pittsburgh & the state stepped up with a new building; the Islanders have played pre-season games at the Sprint to abysmal crowds, Charles Wang long thought to be considering it if Nassau County doesnt relax & a new arena fails to materialize out of thin air by 2015.

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08-01-2012, 12:11 AM
  #410
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Originally Posted by Killion View Post
... "iffy", but you never know, under good ownership the NHL should be able to thrive almost anywhere. The Mayor of KC, one "Sly" James is a real piece of work. The Sprint Centre turns a profit with nothing but Concerts & Events, and whenever he's asked about an NHL or NBA franchise, he basically states that if they do come, forget about the Red Carpet, forget about Tax Breaks or Concessions, Subsidies, whatever, and they'd better put a winning team on the ice or court every single year or just dont bother coming at all!. Raconteur Don Cherry called Kansas City the "Graveyard of Hockey". The Penguins were threatening to move in unless Pittsburgh & the state stepped up with a new building; the Islanders have played pre-season games at the Sprint to abysmal crowds, Charles Wang long thought to be considering it if Nassau County doesnt relax & a new arena fails to materialize out of thin air by 2015.
Good info. I don't think anyone wants to see The Scouts revived. Do not resuscitate.


Last edited by Seedling: 08-01-2012 at 12:34 PM.
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08-01-2012, 05:21 AM
  #411
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Killion View Post
... "iffy", but you never know, under good ownership the NHL should be able to thrive almost anywhere. The Mayor of KC, one "Sly" James is a real piece of work. The Sprint Centre turns a profit with nothing but Concerts & Events, and whenever he's asked about an NHL or NBA franchise, he basically states that if they do come, forget about the Red Carpet, forget about Tax Breaks or Concessions, Subsidies, whatever, and they'd better put a winning team on the ice or court every single year or just dont bother coming at all!. Raconteur Don Cherry called Kansas City the "Graveyard of Hockey". The Penguins were threatening to move in unless Pittsburgh & the state stepped up with a new building; the Islanders have played pre-season games at the Sprint to abysmal crowds, Charles Wang long thought to be considering it if Nassau County doesnt relax & a new arena fails to materialize out of thin air by 2015.
They actually had a pretty good crowd when the Penguins and Kings were there, don't remember if it was a sellout though.

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08-01-2012, 07:29 AM
  #412
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Originally Posted by Shepard View Post
They actually had a pretty good crowd when the Penguins and Kings were there, don't remember if it was a sellout though.
It absolutely was a sellout.
http://kings.nhl.com/club/news.htm?id=590005

KC is a great hockey market.
http://videos.kansascity.com/vmix_ho...4331&sort=NULL

Missouri Mavericks, a non NHL affiliated CHL team pull in 5500 per night playing in Independence (just outside KC FYI)
http://www.hockeydb.com/nhl-attendan...h.php?tmi=9729

Those attendance numbers are about average for an AHL team.
http://theahl.com/stats/schedule.php...e&season_id=37


Last edited by MIG: 08-01-2012 at 08:12 AM.
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08-01-2012, 11:21 AM
  #413
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If this means I no longer have to see Sanderson Ford commercials during Coyotes games, then at least that's a plus.
According to an email I got late yesterday from the Coyotes in response to my question as to what car dealerships are current sponsors, "we currently have corporate partnerships with Sanderson Ford and all valley Chrysler, Jeep, Dodge and RAM dealerships." I was a bit surprised that Sanderson Ford was one given their opposition to the sales tax... but maybe they expect the tax increase will cost them more than they spend on the sponsorship...?

I was going to add - I don't know how brand loyal hockey fans are continent wide in terms of patronizing the corporate sponsors. I have heard that Nascar fans are some of the most brand loyal fans in the world - and I see more '88' stickers on Chevy's than I do on Fords or Toyotas. But that aside, I wonder how often sponsors hear from their customers that 'the reason I bought from you as opposed to one of your competitors, is that you sponsor my hockey team, thanks'. I'd guess less often than once in a blue moon that happens. Closer to almost never.

And really that's a shame. Especially in markets where hockey isn't the only high profile pro sport in town.


Last edited by yotesreign: 08-01-2012 at 11:31 AM.
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08-01-2012, 02:02 PM
  #414
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@judefox10: Are we just a day away from a new owner for your Phoenix Coyotes?”

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08-01-2012, 02:07 PM
  #415
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Originally Posted by SAUCE BAUCE View Post
@judefox10: Are we just a day away from a new owner for your Phoenix Coyotes?Ē
Huh?

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08-01-2012, 02:19 PM
  #416
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Huh?



This guy might know something. Although he forced me to walk around him on a sidewalk 5 years ago, I have forgiven him since he was the first person to break the news about Jamison and the press conference in May.

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08-01-2012, 02:34 PM
  #417
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This guy might know something. Although he forced me to walk around him on a sidewalk 5 years ago, I have forgiven him since he was the first person to break the news about Jamison and the press conference in May.
Yeah. I know who they guy is. Just seems out of nowhere. Doan met with Jamison Saturday and apparently, nothing good came of it. Now, we might get an owner tomorrow? Whatever ppl are on, must be really good!!

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08-01-2012, 02:39 PM
  #418
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That's a question that can be asked every day. Eventually the answer will be yes. It's just a matter of time. I'm waiting for the "I spoke with Greg Jamison and he said ..." report, instead of all of the useless speculation.

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08-01-2012, 03:26 PM
  #419
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SAUCE BAUCE View Post
@judefox10: Are we just a day away from a new owner for your Phoenix Coyotes?”
@FullOf****: Am I trying to drum up some publicity?

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08-01-2012, 04:06 PM
  #420
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Isnít Jude the only reporter to have actually interviewed Jamison before? Other than the circus act of a presser during the playoffs?

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08-01-2012, 04:12 PM
  #421
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Originally Posted by BuffaloAZ View Post
Isnít Jude the only reporter to have actually interviewed Jamison before? Other than the circus act of a presser during the playoffs?


Yep, and I think Roc on 1060am had a fluff interview with him once or twice but nothing that meaningful.

Not getting excited but its nice to see positive news; better to have false positives than false negatives

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08-01-2012, 04:14 PM
  #422
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Isnít Jude the only reporter to have actually interviewed Jamison before? Other than the circus act of a presser during the playoffs?
He's the perfect example of a local media person who ignores the Coyotes as much as possible, and then swoops in at the last second after he gets wind of a major development, and reports it as if he's been involved all along.

It makes me wonder if there is some validity to his tweet.

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08-01-2012, 04:15 PM
  #423
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Isn't it ironic that nobody else is saying anything like this? If we can't get an owner, just move the team already. Stop putting of the inevitable!

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08-01-2012, 04:44 PM
  #424
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Does Jude know something other media members don't? Yes. He's the first media person GJ met with a couple of months ago. If there are 2 reliable media sources on the topic it's Roc and Jude. Nobody else.

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08-01-2012, 04:48 PM
  #425
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Isn't it ironic that nobody else is saying anything like this? If we can't get an owner, just move the team already. Stop putting of the inevitable!
What do you know that Jude or the rest of us don't? The inevitable is getting this deal done. Yotes are playing in AZ next year (assuming there's hockey next year), the 30 day extension is better news than no news and most believe there is more POSITIVE than negative news right now.

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