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The Lockout Thread Part I

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Old
12-04-2012, 01:35 AM
  #876
Crede777
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Is it conceivable that, if Bobrovsky shows he's at least decent, we'll let Mason walk giving Bob the starter spot and give McElhinney the backup role?

Or do you think despite Curtis McElhinney's continued strong performance for Springfield he'll never rise above AHL starter / emergency backup?

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12-04-2012, 01:48 AM
  #877
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Originally Posted by jktsfan View Post
At this point, I'm hopeful that no agreement is EVER reached and that the NHL owners AND players suffer equally. . . . for eternity.
I'll remember this when you come crawling back after the lockout. People like you pretend to not care, yet you still feel the need to come around popping off about hoping to never see another NHL game. If it's really that important to you that you don't, then why does it still continue to eat at you? Why should we care if you choose not to watch the NHL when it returns? If that's the case, keep your comments to yourself, as it's likely that none of us will join your pathetic "cause".

We're all angry about the lockout, but that doesn't make us all hypocrites.

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Originally Posted by Crede777 View Post
Is it conceivable that, if Bobrovsky shows he's at least decent, we'll let Mason walk giving Bob the starter spot and give McElhinney the backup role?

Or do you think despite Curtis McElhinney's continued strong performance for Springfield he'll never rise above AHL starter / emergency backup?
I don't think McElhinney is capable of holding down an NHL job. I think he is what he is - a good AHL starter that can help mentor some of the younger goalies in the system. A good guy to keep around, but not a guy I want stopping pucks in the big show on a regular basis.

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12-04-2012, 05:27 AM
  #878
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Originally Posted by Sore Loser View Post
I'll remember this when you come crawling back after the lockout. People like you pretend to not care, yet you still feel the need to come around popping off about hoping to never see another NHL game. If it's really that important to you that you don't, then why does it still continue to eat at you? Why should we care if you choose not to watch the NHL when it returns? If that's the case, keep your comments to yourself, as it's likely that none of us will join your pathetic "cause".
Oh yay - one of those "your opinion doesn't count unless it agrees with mine and by the way, I speak for everyone". I bet your friends L O V E you.

That was my first post in at least two months and short of you misguidedly coming in and posting again that I'm not entitled to my opinion, this post will likely be my last for as much time.

I've attended around 110 blue jackets games in the last five years and I'm completely willing to never go again. When my ticket rep called, I expressed the same sentiment with him and unlike you, he didn't tell me I was full of it and that I'd come crawling back. Do all of us a favor, and don't immediately assume that everyone shares your own character flaws.

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12-04-2012, 08:07 AM
  #879
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Originally Posted by jktsfan View Post
That was my first post in at least two months and short of you misguidedly coming in and posting again that I'm not entitled to my opinion, this post will likely be my last for as much time.
You are welcome to your opinion.

Quote:
I've attended around 110 blue jackets games in the last five years and I'm completely willing to never go again.
And you are welcome to decide how to spend your time and money, but why come to a hockey fan site to announce you will no longer be a hockey fan and hope that those of us who remain fans will no longer have a league to follow?

Quote:
Do all of us a favor, and don't immediately assume that everyone shares your own character flaws.
Speaking for all of us?

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12-04-2012, 12:22 PM
  #880
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Originally Posted by jktsfan View Post
I'm thinking your political beliefs are bleeding over into your side-picking regarding the lockout.
So let me get this straight. Hoping the players don't fold, hoping that the lockout is worse so that lockouts become so distasteful that we don't see them ever again is a political statement.

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Originally Posted by jktsfan View Post
And to be clear, I haven't picked a side. At this point, I'm hopeful that no agreement is EVER reached and that the NHL owners AND players suffer equally. . . . for eternity.
...Hoping that neither side reaches an agreement and both sides suffer is not.

We're both hoping for chaos and assuming chaos now will promote order in the future. You're hoping things stay the same, I'm hoping the players don't fold (in other words, hoping things stay the same, because I really don't think the owners will fold) The difference is I mentioned a specific group that I hope doesn't change. You just hoped things don't change in general.

We think alike 'eh Comrade?


Last edited by Skraut: 12-04-2012 at 12:37 PM. Reason: clarification.
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12-04-2012, 09:52 PM
  #881
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Good lord, all this in-fighting and there isn't even a hockey season.

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12-04-2012, 10:19 PM
  #882
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Worth a read...
Quote:
Crosby, Penguins owners push to save NHL season
http://triblive.com/sports/nhl/30688...#axzz2E8uEkHed

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12-05-2012, 05:25 PM
  #883
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Donald Trump would have Don Fehr fired in about 2 minutes

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12-05-2012, 11:30 PM
  #884
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knock off the personal arguments. tensions are high, it's a polarizing issue and we are dealing with it however we think is best. Let's keep it topical and not attack people or their personal decisions.

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12-05-2012, 11:45 PM
  #885
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If I recall..... one lockout season resulted in a 40 or so game season.... few respect that season as being anything other than exhibition...... There is no trophy for winning a shortened season…. No intellectual trophy that is.

As Christmas approaches I would rather have my pre-paid hockey money back for gifts to the homeless than waste it on a season few will remember or care...

With some luck the NHL will cancel this season and give us our money back....


Last edited by Robert: 12-05-2012 at 11:56 PM.
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12-05-2012, 11:54 PM
  #886
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Crede777 View Post
Is it conceivable that, if Bobrovsky shows he's at least decent, we'll let Mason walk giving Bob the starter spot and give McElhinney the backup role?

Or do you think despite Curtis McElhinney's continued strong performance for Springfield he'll never rise above AHL starter / emergency backup?
Goal tending, most likely, will be priority #1 on Davidson's list.... if history is an indicator review the Blues under him....


Last edited by Robert: 12-06-2012 at 12:02 AM.
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12-06-2012, 08:41 AM
  #887
pete goegan
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert View Post
If I recall..... one lockout season resulted in a 40 or so game season.... few respect that season as being anything other than exhibition...... There is no trophy for winning a shortened season…. No intellectual trophy that is.

As Christmas approaches I would rather have my pre-paid hockey money back for gifts to the homeless than waste it on a season few will remember or care...

With some luck the NHL will cancel this season and give us our money back....
I know of no Stanley Cup winner that is thought less of because of a shortened season. As long as the playoffs remain the same, they continue to be the toughest test to a league championship among North American sports. The regular season is essentially for seeding (and selling 82 games worth of tickets, concessions, and merchandise!). 40, 52, 60 games? A legitimate champ will still emerge.

You may feel lucky if the season is cancelled, I won't.

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12-06-2012, 08:47 AM
  #888
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert View Post
If I recall..... one lockout season resulted in a 40 or so game season.... few respect that season as being anything other than exhibition...... There is no trophy for winning a shortened season…. No intellectual trophy that is.

As Christmas approaches I would rather have my pre-paid hockey money back for gifts to the homeless than waste it on a season few will remember or care...

With some luck the NHL will cancel this season and give us our money back....
So in a regular, full-length season... screw the homeless?

This attitude always gets me with regard to this lockout - people getting all moral about how not having hockey is going to make them a better person. Whatever.


Anyway, I'm encouraged by recent developments in discussions/negotiations, as well as the outlook of some contacts I have at Nationwide Arena. (I also love that Pens haters and Crosby haters in particular might have to deal with the idea that Sid and Ron Burkle had a significant role in moving things forward. But that's just me.)

I can't help but keep coming back to why the same level of diligence couldn't have been employed at an earlier date. Oh, I know the explanations, but I think they're a bunch of crap.

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"I'll have a chance to compete for the post of first issue. This is the most important thing." -- Sergei Bobrovsky, June 2012

Last edited by Double-Shift Lassé: 12-06-2012 at 09:08 AM.
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Old
12-06-2012, 09:09 AM
  #889
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert View Post
If I recall..... one lockout season resulted in a 40 or so game season.... few respect that season as being anything other than exhibition...... There is no trophy for winning a shortened season…. No intellectual trophy that is.

As Christmas approaches I would rather have my pre-paid hockey money back for gifts to the homeless than waste it on a season few will remember or care...

With some luck the NHL will cancel this season and give us our money back....
I am not in this camp. I still want to see some hockey.

My biggest fight, though, is going to be with the ticket department. With my F.D. schedule, I cannot make all the games, but in previous seasons I have managed to sell most of my firehouse days, and the few that I don't I give to family members as birthday gifts and what-not.

At this point, though, other than a few for family, I will be hard pressed to sell many games that I work, since many of my buyers are now pissed off, or cannot adjust their schedules this late in the game.

I will be more than willing to do my best, but the CBJ had better be willing to work with me on this. They better be prepared to eat some of my games that I cannot get rid of, since none of this is mine, or any fans fault.

I will take this matter all the way to Davidson if I meet a lot of resistance at the lower levels, because they need to be flexible on these types of issues.

I have always bought my entire package in the past, like a good little STH, but this year if they manage to salvage part of the season, they had better be willing to work with us on this. If they don't they will lose a lot of us.

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12-06-2012, 09:18 AM
  #890
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert View Post
If I recall..... one lockout season resulted in a 40 or so game season.... few respect that season as being anything other than exhibition...... There is no trophy for winning a shortened season…. No intellectual trophy that is.
48 game season:


50 game season:


80 game season:


82 game season:


You're right, nobody remembers who won the cup unless a full 82 games are played.

The cup is awarded to those who win the playoffs. The regular season determines who is in the playoffs, and their seeding. A championship is a championship no matter how much of a season is played, because you still have to go through every other team to get there. No matter how much my fellow Clevelanders who are NBA fans don't want to admit it.


Personally I'm getting excited to take my son to an NHL game again. But I still worry at the way it is playing out. I think the owners plan all along was to give the players a couple months, try to squeeze as much as possible out of them, then get back to the game and recoup their losses for the rest of the season.

What is to stop them from using the same tactic next time?

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12-06-2012, 09:32 AM
  #891
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pete goegan View Post
I know of no Stanley Cup winner that is thought less of because of a shortened season. As long as the playoffs remain the same, they continue to be the toughest test to a league championship among North American sports. The regular season is essentially for seeding (and selling 82 games worth of tickets, concessions, and merchandise!). 40, 52, 60 games? A legitimate champ will still emerge.

You may feel lucky if the season is cancelled, I won't.
As a Devils fan and as a CBJ fan, I certainly do not look down upon the Devil's 1st championship as a lesser title than the other 2 they won on 2000 and 2003.

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Old
12-06-2012, 09:33 AM
  #892
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I guess my biggest thing is that I still don't understand why people are taking this so personally. This is a dispute between the players and the owners. Unless you (general you) are part of those two groups you don't actually have a dog in this fight so why all the angst? All this talk of wanting to punish the league for the mistreatment of their fans and even wishes that the league would fold are simply beyond my understanding. What mistreatment of the fans? We have to find something else to do with our evenings for a while? Hell we're Jacket fans. We should be used to that. This is just an überextended off season for us.

HOWEVER, and this is a big however, depending on how STH's money is being handled I can totally get them being upset. If they have been or will be refunded for lost games well then all is good in Jacketland. If, on the other hand, they're losing money on this lockout then I totally get them being pissed. I think it's an unfortunate byproduct of this whole ****** business, I don't think there's a Mr. Burns character sitting behind the scenes going "Exxxxcellent" or anything, but I can totally back them being mad.

And now I feel like I'd be just rambling if I continue so I'm going to stop.

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12-06-2012, 11:10 AM
  #893
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Originally Posted by WinSock View Post
I guess my biggest thing is that I still don't understand why people are taking this so personally.
Because it is something people enjoy. I spent most of my life working in the entertainment industry, and people are more passionate about their form of entertainment than anything else.

When I had to disqualify a guy who spent all winter working on his dragster because it didn't pass technical inspection, I got called every 4 letter word in the book, screamed at because of all the gas money he spent to get to the track, wiped the spit off my face as his tirade continued about how he would never ever be back to our race track. 2 weeks later he gave me a big bear hug as I handed him his winner's check after he won. That is the passion that goes with working in the entertainment industry.

Now that I work in "Corporate America" I don't turn in my TPS reports on time, and I get a friendly worded email reminding me when my TPS reports are due.

Nobody cares, nobody gets passionate, because it is "just" a job.

Just to further the analogy, you're posting here because you care about hockey, it is something you're passionate about, so you spend some part of your day here. You spend far more time each day sitting under light bulbs. Time wise, light bulbs are far more important to you than hockey. Heck without light bulbs, there couldn't be hockey. But when is the last time you posted on a light bulb message board?

That's why people take this personally. It is the form of entertainment that they have chosen for themselves, and something they have invested their time, money, and (well I probably should have grabbed a thesaurus because I hate to mention it again, but...) passion into.

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12-06-2012, 11:45 AM
  #894
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Originally Posted by Skraut View Post
Because it is something people enjoy. I spent most of my life working in the entertainment industry, and people are more passionate about their form of entertainment than anything else.

When I had to disqualify a guy who spent all winter working on his dragster because it didn't pass technical inspection, I got called every 4 letter word in the book, screamed at because of all the gas money he spent to get to the track, wiped the spit off my face as his tirade continued about how he would never ever be back to our race track. 2 weeks later he gave me a big bear hug as I handed him his winner's check after he won. That is the passion that goes with working in the entertainment industry.

Now that I work in "Corporate America" I don't turn in my TPS reports on time, and I get a friendly worded email reminding me when my TPS reports are due.

Nobody cares, nobody gets passionate, because it is "just" a job.

Just to further the analogy, you're posting here because you care about hockey, it is something you're passionate about, so you spend some part of your day here. You spend far more time each day sitting under light bulbs. Time wise, light bulbs are far more important to you than hockey. Heck without light bulbs, there couldn't be hockey. But when is the last time you posted on a light bulb message board?

That's why people take this personally. It is the form of entertainment that they have chosen for themselves, and something they have invested their time, money, and (well I probably should have grabbed a thesaurus because I hate to mention it again, but...) passion into.
And I respect that you feel that way. I just don't feel the same. They're not doing anything to me personally. I love hockey. I love my team. I love the thrill of victory and even the far more frequent agony of defeat. I take each win and each loss personally. I just don't take these negotiations personally. Other than the fact that right now I have no hockey and once they get their **** together I will have hockey again they have nothing to do with me. That's why I don't understand the angst. I dunno, maybe I'm just not explaining myself well.

If they were to say we're going to limit contract lengths to 5years but only if you, WinSock, sacrifice your cats to the hockey gods and dance naked at center ice every second Tuesday of every month which contains the letter "r" well then I'd take it personally. I love my cats. And that'd be a rather chilly way to spend my time. But that's not what they're saying.


Last edited by Socks: 12-06-2012 at 11:52 AM.
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12-06-2012, 11:49 AM
  #895
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I think the angst turns up when you see the price of a beer and the price of tickets

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12-06-2012, 01:03 PM
  #896
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From Puck Daddy:

Quote:
The owners upped their so-called "make-whole" offer to $300 million -- up from $211 million, finding middle ground with the $393 million the players proposed previously. But that was tied to a 10-year collective bargaining agreement (with an out at eight years). The players haven't wanted to go longer than five years.

The owners also backed off on some contracting demands, keeping arbitration and free agency eligibility as it was in the last CBA. But they kept insisting on term limits -- five years, or seven if a team re-signs its own player -- and five-percent limit on salary variance to stop back-diving, cap-circumventing deals. The players have not wanted term limits, and they have their own proposal addressing cap circumvention in which a team's cap advantage is becomes a penalty if a player retires before his contract runs out.
Quote:
But the real danger is this: The players have gotten the owners to back off, and the rope-a-dope strategy has been effective. But if they keep ticking off the owners who came to make a deal, it could backfire. We could have another breakdown, another delay.
http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nhl-pu..._ylv=3#more-id

I also agree with a previous article from Puck daddy that the vast majority of fans, and corporate sponsors want the NHL contract of 10 years with the 8 year opt out. This is one that I think the players should agree to. They will be looked at as the bad guys on this issue.

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12-06-2012, 01:17 PM
  #897
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I haven't posted often, but I read just about everyday. We've been season ticket holders since the beginning.

I don't mind this lockout and I'll tell you why.

Last summer, I was VERY excited headed into the season. We had made moves, I thought things were going to swing in a positive direction and things would be good. Then the first two weeks of the season happened.

Having this break, and being able to step back from it, has been helpful on a personal level. I was emotionally invested last summer, then crushed by the dismal start (and everything else that happened).

At this point I'm optimistically curious about this season (or next) to see what we really have, but my expectations are lower. I see this as a rebirth of the team. If I have to wait a little bit to see it, so be it.

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12-06-2012, 03:04 PM
  #898
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I like your perspective cbjgirl..

I also am in the camp that this time away will be a rebirth. Our blue jackets need time and maturity, we have just pretty much bought an extra year of that. I want to see Hockey, and much of my anger at missing the start of the season has burnt off to the point I am just hopeful there is a season..

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12-06-2012, 03:29 PM
  #899
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Skraut View Post
But when is the last time you posted on a light bulb message board?
Just for fun, I looked up "light bulb message board." They exist!

http://boardreader.com/tp/osram%20light%20bulbs.html

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12-06-2012, 04:09 PM
  #900
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Even as a moderator how does one accumulate 34,000+ posts on a lightbulb message board?


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