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Mon-Tor: a pre-trade talk around Komisarek+ for Kaberle

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Old
07-16-2012, 07:59 AM
  #51
KapG
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FF de Mars View Post
I'd trade Kaberle for Komisarek anytime. As a Habs fan.



Because he has excellent vision. And a history with Toronto. He got many points last year. I know he's a creampuff, but he might arrive to camp in shape and get his D game lower close to average. Who knows. Komisarek has his question marks too.
His game is garbage now. In fact, Kaberle hasn't been the same player ever since he got his bell wrung by Cam Jansenn.

Absolutely ZERO reason and interest in bringing him back to Toronto. Don't need anymore vets taking roster spots from our younger kids.

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Old
07-16-2012, 08:14 AM
  #52
FF de Mars
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Originally Posted by KapG View Post
His game is garbage now. In fact, Kaberle hasn't been the same player ever since he got his bell wrung by Cam Jansenn.

Absolutely ZERO reason and interest in bringing him back to Toronto. Don't need anymore vets taking roster spots from our younger kids.
The same could be said about Komisarek, ever since Lucic destroyed him in that fight.

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07-16-2012, 08:21 AM
  #53
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Originally Posted by FF de Mars View Post
The same could be said about Komisarek, ever since Lucic destroyed him in that fight.
FightS. Lucic had that scrap with him last season, too, where he caught him with the body blow.

Me personally I'd rather have Kaberle on any given team than Komisarek. They're both what I consider negligible talents (right now), and Tomas is just somehow more likeable.

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Old
07-16-2012, 08:28 AM
  #54
HANDZ 57
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This is a feeler, to the greatest trade in the world.

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07-16-2012, 08:34 AM
  #55
Boom Boom Anton
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Originally Posted by habs03 View Post
Not sure why Kaberle was SO bad with the Canes.
1) Because Carolina tried to play him in a top 4 role (like he was paid). Montreal played him as a bottom pairing defensemen, against the weakest competition, mostly offensive zone starts and as a PP specialist.

2) Kaberle came to camp woefully out of shape. He was terribly slow and lacked confidence so that his reported strengths (vision and passing) were never able to come to the forefront. That said, he was getting better as time wore on because he was getting in better shape and Carolina was using him in a much more limited role.

Being a budget team, Carolina couldn't afford to pay Kaberle >$4M to be a bottom pairing guy with PP time. If a team can afford to do that, then he could be a good fit.

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07-16-2012, 08:37 AM
  #56
Beendair Donedat
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A big nasty right handed defenseman that plays physical? I guess when Jack Martin ran poor Ryan O'Byrne out of town everyone was happy. All he did was lead Colorado's blueline in hits, and average 19 minutes a game last season. I'd take O'Byrne any day over Bouillon, Weber, Diaz...

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Old
07-16-2012, 08:47 AM
  #57
KapG
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Originally Posted by FF de Mars View Post
The same could be said about Komisarek, ever since Lucic destroyed him in that fight.
that's fine. You can argue that. It doesn't change the fact that we don't need or want Kaberle. His time with the leafs is long gone.

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07-16-2012, 08:50 AM
  #58
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Not going to happen, Komi is a shadow of his former self and if the Habs are going to trade Kaberle it would not be for him.

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Old
07-16-2012, 08:55 AM
  #59
Drydenwasthebest
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Montreal is better served keeping Kaberle over Komisarek. At least Kaberle has value, Komisarek doesn't. The only thing Komisarek does better than Kaberle is score goals in his own nets.

Komisarek was a product of a healthy Markov. Also, as has ben stated, Komisarek never recovered from that fight with Lucic. It is a shame, I like Komisarek, but he is not a worthwhile player anymore, especially at that cap hit.

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Old
07-16-2012, 09:02 AM
  #60
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Originally Posted by beowulf View Post
Not going to happen, Komi is a shadow of his former self and if the Habs are going to trade Kaberle it would not be for him.
and Kaberle isn't a shadow of his former self eh?

both players are pretty much dead weight now a days.

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Old
07-16-2012, 09:03 AM
  #61
Will Billiams
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Just say no to Kaberle.

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07-16-2012, 09:12 AM
  #62
Ricky Bobby
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Toronto has no interest or need in a disinterested Kaberle who literally runs away from any potential contact. I was happy when he left town cause he hadn't been a good dman for years. So many people praised him as some great PP QB yet as soon as he left town the Leafs powerplay finally got some puck movement which resulted in it instantly getting better.

We found a much better fit in Liles to take the place of Kaberle.

Komisarek isn't the best blueliner but he fills the needs of the Leafs a heck of a lot better because he adds to our toughness. Yes, he gets beat down by Lucic but so does everybody. The fact that he is willing to fight, defend his teammate and can hold his own against middleweights is the important part. Plus Komisarek can play the penalty kill which is an area that is a far bigger concern for the Leafs than our offensive game.

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Old
07-16-2012, 10:40 AM
  #63
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I would do a straight up trade Kaberle for Komisarek from a Montreal POV. I think Kaberle has more value out of the two, but if Komisarek could even regain some of his old form, he would be filling a need on our blue line. Maybe putting him back with Markov would help keep him steady.

Gorges-Subban
Markov-Komisarek
Emelin-Diaz
Bouillon/Weber

I'm happier with that than what we have currently, although we do lose a bit of puck moving insurance if Markov goes down.

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07-16-2012, 10:47 AM
  #64
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Kaberle is essentially a PP Specialist right now(but could bounce back to a top 4 role obviously) and Komisarek is a press box specialist really. As critical as I am, I still kind of like Komisarek and think he'd have a role on the habs, but kaberle is the superior player right now.

I would do:

Komisarek
2013 2nd

Kaberle
2013 3rd/4th

Or

Komisarek
3rd

Kaberle


but as evidenced by the reactions in this thread, no interest in kaberle and that's absolutely fine. TML have went a brand new direction.

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Old
07-16-2012, 10:55 AM
  #65
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I'll bet Brian has been thinking about this for some time now, perhaps even nefariously plotting to somehow get the Gome-N-ator thrown in

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Old
07-16-2012, 10:56 AM
  #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boom Boom Anton View Post
1) Because Carolina tried to play him in a top 4 role (like he was paid). Montreal played him as a bottom pairing defensemen, against the weakest competition, mostly offensive zone starts and as a PP specialist.

2) Kaberle came to camp woefully out of shape. He was terribly slow and lacked confidence so that his reported strengths (vision and passing) were never able to come to the forefront. That said, he was getting better as time wore on because he was getting in better shape and Carolina was using him in a much more limited role.

Being a budget team, Carolina couldn't afford to pay Kaberle >$4M to be a bottom pairing guy with PP time. If a team can afford to do that, then he could be a good fit.
Very good points, specially the out of shape part, seriously speaking, I think he just wasn't use to playing playoff games, and probaly took the summer off that long playoff run.

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07-16-2012, 10:57 AM
  #67
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1 - Montreal could probably get more for Kaberle from another team. Especially if they play him this season and he rebounds and ups his value.

2 - Toronto I think would have very little interest in Kaberle. They traded for Liles specifically to replace Kabs. When healthy, Liles is better. Not to mention Gardiner/Phaneuf/Franson are also puck movers, and Percy/Blacker/Rielly all have some puck skills as well.

3 - Despite Komi's contract being terrible, we also don't have a lot of heavy hitting / shot blocking D. So even though he's declined and not as effective as before, he does fill a niche on the team that we currently cannot fill from within.

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Old
07-16-2012, 10:58 AM
  #68
habs03
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KapG View Post
and Kaberle isn't a shadow of his former self eh?

both players are pretty much dead weight now a days.
All true, expect Kaberle is still a 40point dmen, while Komi isn't and both are just as bad in their own end.

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Old
07-16-2012, 11:02 AM
  #69
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This trade proposal is terrible for both teams.
1. The leafs need a 1C and goalie and I don't think the habs are desperate enough yet to deal either to the leafs
2. The habs have 8 defenders signed and probably want to upgrade other area instead of shuffling chairs

Both teams are better off trading the players to a cap floor team.

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07-16-2012, 11:05 AM
  #70
LyricalLyricist
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This trade proposal is terrible for both teams.
1. The leafs need a 1C and goalie and I don't think the habs are desperate enough yet to deal either to the leafs
2. The habs have 8 defenders signed and probably want to upgrade other area instead of shuffling chairs

Both teams are better off trading the players to a cap floor team.
To be fair, the trade wasn't really a trade designed to bring the leafs a #1 C or a #1 G. It wasn't designed to bring the habs a legit top 6 forward either. It is as you put it, shuffling of chairs, but sometimes it helps.

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07-16-2012, 11:07 AM
  #71
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Originally Posted by habs03 View Post
All true, expect Kaberle is still a 40point dmen, while Komi isn't and both are just as bad in their own end.
A 40 points dman who gets significant time as a powerplay QB so he's bound to get some points but the 4 powerplays he's bit a part of have all been amongst the worst in the time that he was that QB.

Toronto minus Kaberle instantly saw their powerplay get better.

Boston last season had a better powerplay minus Kaberle from the year before.

Carolina saw their powerplay get better once Kaberle was traded.

Montreal ended up with the 3rd worst powerplay by the end of last season.

His numbers have more to do with the type of minutes he plays as opposed to him contributing to winning. Boston saw this, which is why they didn't even tender him a contract.

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Old
07-16-2012, 11:22 AM
  #72
LyricalLyricist
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A 40 points dman who gets significant time as a powerplay QB so he's bound to get some points but the 4 powerplays he's bit a part of have all been amongst the worst in the time that he was that QB.

Toronto minus Kaberle instantly saw their powerplay get better.

Boston last season had a better powerplay minus Kaberle from the year before.

Carolina saw their powerplay get better once Kaberle was traded.

Montreal ended up with the 3rd worst powerplay by the end of last season.

His numbers have more to do with the type of minutes he plays as opposed to him contributing to winning. Boston saw this, which is why they didn't even tender him a contract.
Montreal's PP improved after he arrived.

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Old
07-16-2012, 11:25 AM
  #73
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Originally Posted by habs03 View Post
All true, expect Kaberle is still a 40point dmen, while Komi isn't and both are just as bad in their own end.
Kabs had 31 pts last season and looked washed up imo, so not sure if he ever sees 40 again. But there's no way Komi is just as bad as Kabs in their own end as Kabs is beyond terrible. Granted I don't watch any leafs games but I just can't see Komi being that useless in his own end.

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07-16-2012, 11:52 AM
  #74
habs03
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Originally Posted by montreal View Post
Kabs had 31 pts last season and looked washed up imo, so not sure if he ever sees 40 again. But there's no way Komi is just as bad as Kabs in their own end as Kabs is beyond terrible. Granted I don't watch any leafs games but I just can't see Komi being that useless in his own end.
If you look at Kaberle's numbers since joining the Habs, it would be prorated at around 42 points. Also while they are different type of dmen both are useless, Komi does okay on the boards, and throws some hits, but is horrible positionally, while its the other way around for Kaberle, he is soft as butter on the boards, but does well in regards to positioning.

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Old
07-16-2012, 05:13 PM
  #75
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I guess if we had an award for the NHL player whose proposal value decreased the most in the eye of Leafs fans in the past year and a half, Kaberle would win this award hand down.
Seeing as what Boston gave Toronto for him, and then what Montreal gave Carolina for him I'd wager its not just Leaf fans who believe his value has decreased but NHL GM's too.

What a dumb post.

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