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I am a spoiled Wings fan-Talk me off the ledge!

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Old
07-16-2012, 04:32 PM
  #51
jacK
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain Bob View Post
If the Wings don't make the playoffs - it won't be because of Lidstrom or Bettman

It will be because Holland chose not to improve the team.
the team, as constructed, is good enough to make the playoffs. if they don't, it's on everybody; players, coaches, and management.

if you blame solely Holland, it's because you choose to blame Holland and not hold anybody else responsible for doing their job(s).


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Last edited by Fugu: 07-17-2012 at 12:55 AM. Reason: sigh
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Old
07-16-2012, 04:43 PM
  #52
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Originally Posted by ZetterBurger View Post
It probably would've had to be a 3rd round pick at least. Vancouver wouldn't have traded him to the Western Conference for a worse pick then Buffalo offered. On top of that Buffalo probably offers a 3rd and then you are getting into a stupid bidding war for negotiation rights. I would love to have Ehrhoff here. Also our defense at this point last year looked damn good so giving up a 3rd for his rights didn't make much sense.
Small nitpick, Vancouver didn't trade Ehrhoff's rights to the Sabres, they traded them to the Islanders. The Islanders couldn't sign him so they traded his rights to Buffalo to recoup their lost pick.

I agree though that for Detroit the price would be a 3rd rounder or 4th + another pick, why would they take the Wings offer when the Islanders were offering a better pick. Looking at who we picked with the 3rd round pick though (G-Jake Patterson) I would probably be ok making that deal.

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07-16-2012, 05:04 PM
  #53
jaster
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You're not spoiled schminksbro, stop insulting yourself!

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07-16-2012, 06:07 PM
  #54
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Originally Posted by Ricelund View Post

I'm disappointed with Holland too, but you can't expect him to trade Quincey and Abdelkader for a top-10 defenseman like you've been suggesting. If the trade's not out there, he can't make it.
That is one of the more laughable ideas I've ever read on here.

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07-16-2012, 06:24 PM
  #55
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Originally Posted by SoupNazi View Post
That is one of the more laughable ideas I've ever read on here.
Are you laughing at Ricelund's statement or the idea that we can turn Quincey and Gator into a good package?

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07-16-2012, 06:25 PM
  #56
RedWingsNow*
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jacK View Post
the team, as constructed, is good enough to make the playoffs. if they don't, it's on everybody; players, coaches, and management.

if you blame solely Holland, it's because you choose to blame Holland and not hold anybody else responsible for doing their job(s).


for those of you teetering on the ledge, please jump. these boards and the world would be a better place with less of you. if you're not here to support your team, no matter how good/bad they are, you're not a fan; get lost. the Leos are a chic team to follow these days, make football your flavor of the year.

Losing your two best defensive defensemen from last year's playoff team that won a single game ... that's a big loss.

And really, mods need to start doing something about posts like these. Or they need to get out of the way when I fire back.

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Old
07-16-2012, 06:27 PM
  #57
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Originally Posted by Hammerheart View Post
We all know how he didn't throw contracts at Suter or Parise or anything.

What do you want, a team ran by Vito Corleone?

"Ken Holland insisted to the two men that either their brains or their signatures would be on the paper."

Where did I imply that Suter or Parise were our only options?

In fact, from day 1, I've suggested alternatives to Suter and Parise.

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07-16-2012, 06:31 PM
  #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain Bob View Post

Where did I imply that Suter or Parise were our only options?

In fact, from day 1, I've suggested alternatives to Suter and Parise.
Indeed, a lot of people thought Semin should have been the number 1 forward option from day 1.

Unfortunately with Garrison seeming intent on Vancouver, the options on D were not nearly as attractive.

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07-16-2012, 06:31 PM
  #59
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Originally Posted by Fugu View Post
The single common denominator over that 20 yr period has been Lidstrom.

The Wings were not a normal hockey team during that time, a near dynasty in fact.

You'll never replace Lids, so we really do need to set our sights down a notch or two.


This is the attitude I knew would rear its head when Lidstrom retired.

Lidstrom was pretty pedestrian last year, and we still were a playoff team.
We don't need to replace the best defenseman of the last 20 years.

We need to replace a very skilled, but slowish defenseman who still had very strong technical skills even as his skills were declining.

Lidstrom can be replaced.

Even if he can't, we have the ability right now to improve. And we're sitting on our hands.

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07-16-2012, 06:33 PM
  #60
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Originally Posted by Henkka View Post
If we sign Scott Hannan and Semin, would you people be happy for that team?
I'd be concerned about the defense, still.

But if we sign Semin, we can trade forward + a pick for a defenseman who might be a better fit.

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07-16-2012, 06:34 PM
  #61
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Originally Posted by Claypool View Post
The way to win in the NHL now is suck for three years, get high draft picks, then go on a run.

Just accept the fact the Wings will suck for a little bit. It's much easier to live that way.
Wow.
A team with Datsyuk and Zetterberg is just supposed to tank?

How many top 5 picks did NJ have on its SCF roster?

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07-16-2012, 06:35 PM
  #62
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Originally Posted by Ricelund View Post
Let's ignore that it was a 10-year deal and Ehrhoff has hit 50 points once (on a loaded Vancouver team).
A 10-year deal for a 28 year old defenseman... He'd be 38 when done. And given the kind of game he plays, that's really not so bad.

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07-16-2012, 06:46 PM
  #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain Bob View Post
Wow.
A team with Datsyuk and Zetterberg is just supposed to tank?

How many top 5 picks did NJ have on its SCF roster?
They traded for him but Kovy is a former #1 pick

Larsson a top 5 draft pick

Zubrus, Parise, Zajac, Brodeur, Volchenkov, Josefson, Sykora are all 1st round picks before we would have selected.

They aren't exactly devoid of first round talent.

I agree we don't need to tank, but New Jersey has done a very good job with their picks and especially their higher value picks or turning them into things of value.

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07-16-2012, 07:07 PM
  #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RedWings19405 View Post
Are you laughing at Ricelund's statement or the idea that we can turn Quincey and Gator into a good package?
It's obvious that he's talking about the statement. Havent you been following these boards? Everybody wants to give us their stars for our spare parts.

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07-16-2012, 07:35 PM
  #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RedWings19405 View Post
Are you laughing at Ricelund's statement or the idea that we can turn Quincey and Gator into a good package?
The idea that we can turn Quincey + Gator into a top-2 d-man.

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07-16-2012, 07:48 PM
  #66
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When you buy tickets or even watch your team on tv you are purchasing a product. Who wants to purchase a product they know is of poor quality? That's just stupid.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jacK View Post
for those of you teetering on the ledge, please jump. these boards and the world would be a better place with less of you. if you're not here to support your team, no matter how good/bad they are, you're not a fan; get lost. the Leos are a chic team to follow these days, make football your flavor of the year.

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Old
07-16-2012, 07:55 PM
  #67
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Wanting to see the team improve after three years of getting worse doesn't make you a spoiled fan. Soon to be four years straight of getting worse. Sorry but losing lidstrom and Stuart and replacing them with kronwall and Quincey is not going to make the team better than last years defense. Adding Sammy as a top six player also doesn't help.

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07-16-2012, 07:57 PM
  #68
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Highs and lows bud. Thick and thin. Makes the next championship that much sweeter.

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07-16-2012, 07:59 PM
  #69
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You guys are worried about players, but what about the terrible special teams coaching last season? We brought in Renney, who was the architect of the #1 PP in the league last season. For as bad as the PP was last season, that's like signing a solid free agent.

We certainly still have the talent to have a fantastic PP. Now we have the mind to put it all together.

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07-16-2012, 07:59 PM
  #70
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Last year, Detroit was one of the best teams for much of the season. They seemed to have peaked at the wrong time, however.

Also, it feels like they've been treading water, not retrograding. This first season without Lidstrom is really the first chance at a real "step back".

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07-16-2012, 07:59 PM
  #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain Bob View Post


This is the attitude I knew would rear its head when Lidstrom retired.

Lidstrom was pretty pedestrian last year, and we still were a playoff team.
We don't need to replace the best defenseman of the last 20 years.

We need to replace a very skilled, but slowish defenseman who still had very strong technical skills even as his skills were declining.

Lidstrom can be replaced.

Even if he can't, we have the ability right now to improve. And we're sitting on our hands.
I never, ever, ever thought I'd find myself in agreement with Bobby about anything, but I actually agree with the bolded statement.

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07-16-2012, 08:17 PM
  #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain Bob View Post


This is the attitude I knew would rear its head when Lidstrom retired.

Lidstrom was pretty pedestrian last year, and we still were a playoff team.
We don't need to replace the best defenseman of the last 20 years.

We need to replace a very skilled, but slowish defenseman who still had very strong technical skills even as his skills were declining.

Lidstrom can be replaced.

Even if he can't, we have the ability right now to improve. And we're sitting on our hands.
Couldn't disagree with you more. Lidstrom was not the best Dman last year in the league, but he was by all means one of the best. To call him pedestrian is ridiculous. He wasnt in his prime, but to think we can replace him with anyone that had equal talent value without age being a factor is impossible without taking a massive hit to our roster and farm system. Can he be replaced? Yes. But it would take a player that plays far better than "Pedestrian".

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Old
07-16-2012, 08:26 PM
  #73
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I've probably said this in just about every thread already, but here it goes again. The team, as it stands now isn't horribly bad. We all know what Datsyuk and Z are capable of. We know what our role players are capable of. Without Lidstrom, yes on paper the D looks worse. We're really only two players away from still being a threat in the post season. Our biggest sticking point is our over abundance of role players and lack of true top six talent. IMO 1 top line winger and one defensive D man is all we trly need. There's still 5 UFA's that fit what I've said. If we go into preseason without making any other move... now that's where I'll get my life jacket on.

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Old
07-16-2012, 08:40 PM
  #74
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Originally Posted by garry1221 View Post
. The team, as it stands now isn't horribly bad. We all know what Datsyuk and Z are capable of. We know what our role players are capable of.
In response to we know what Datsyuk and Zetterberg are capable of. The Hudler-Zetterberg-Filppula line was our best line last year, but that line is broken up now. Datsyuk has needed a winger for years, but he isn't getting a legit top 6 linemate this year. So what are Datsyuk and Zetterberg capable of with the current top 6 corps? I'd say they will both be playing with probably the least talented linemates in awhile, and who knows how the chemistry will play out.

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07-16-2012, 08:58 PM
  #75
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Originally Posted by schminksbro View Post
When you buy tickets or even watch your team on tv you are purchasing a product. Who wants to purchase a product they know is of poor quality? That's just stupid.
Not being expected to finish first is different than being a "poor quality team" you're either over-reacting or trolling to get a rise out of us.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Frk It View Post
In response to we know what Datsyuk and Zetterberg are capable of. The Hudler-Zetterberg-Filppula line was our best line last year, but that line is broken up now. Datsyuk has needed a winger for years, but he isn't getting a legit top 6 linemate this year. So what are Datsyuk and Zetterberg capable of with the current top 6 corps? I'd say they will both be playing with probably the least talented linemates in awhile, and who knows how the chemistry will play out.
The season is months away, none of us have any idea who Datsyuk will get on his line. We made it to the Stanley Cup finals in 09 with Holmstrom on Datsyuk's wing so its not like we NEED a 7 million + winger to make things work.

Lets see how the offseason works out then we can assess how we did at re-tooling.

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