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Well thats two players out of 5 you named on the PP. Who's the other 3 .
Maybe you should name your 5 PP guys and cut the crap by just naming two.
I want to know who the other 3 great PP that your puting out before the great B.Ryan.P.K is on our 1st pp unit.
finally someone knows what hes talking about.
people are way too biased for Bobby Ryan. loll funny..
PLEASE TELL ME YOU DIDN'T JUST COMPARE CAM FOWLER TO SUBBAN !!
wow you are biased buddy. im not even going to answer your comments
anymore....
why not?? Fowler in his first season had 40 points, thats more in a season then what PK has done in a single season...he regressed last season, you can blame it on the sophomore slump, and this next season we will see what the kids got, yeah he's not as physical as PK, but he is also younger, so he still has time to develop to a stronger man, because he still looks like a kid to me, im going here by using the same crap term you used, unlimited potential!!
I agree, i rather keep Ryan then have PK Subban, we dont need him, we have our equivalent in Cam Fowler...we both are happy!!
and to your next question the pp
Getzlaf, selanne, perry, Fowler and Lubo last season, this season it looks like its going to be Getzlaf, Selanne, perry, fowler and Souray...on paper that looks pretty good, so you are saying?
Subban is way better then Fowler defensively....Subban is MTL best defenceman on the PK who finnish 2nd in the NHL last year, just sayin
Plekanec + Kristo for Ryan would make sense for both teams
Subban is way better then Fowler defensively....Subban is MTL best defenceman on the PK who finnish 2nd in the NHL last year, just sayin
I cant dispute that, i know PK is better defensively, but im just saying that as a pmd which that is what you guys are saying PK is, he can skate from end to end, he has amazing hands, well so does Fowler, Defensively yes i agree PK is better, but thats why i said fowler is still young, and we will see what the kid does this next season defensively.
I cant dispute that, i know PK is better defensively, but im just saying that as a pmd which that is what you guys are saying PK is, he can skate from end to end, he has amazing hands, well so does Fowler, Defensively yes i agree PK is better, but thats why i said fowler is still young, and we will see what the kid does this next season defensively.
Well thats two players out of 5 you named on the PP. Who's the other 3 .
Maybe you should name your 5 PP guys and cut the crap by just naming two.
I want to know who the other 3 great PP that your puting out before the great B.Ryan.P.K is on our 1st pp unit.
Selanne, Getzlaf, Perry, Visnovsky(likely replaced by Souray), Fowler. A PP unit isn't just about having the 5 best players. There are roles to fill, and chemistry is importqnt, and the three spots that would be available for Ryan's role are currently filled by Selanne, Perry, and Getzlaf.
It's rather absurd that you're trying to use Ryan's placement on the 2nd unit as some kind of knock against him, given the players he's competing against. One of the best goal scorers in NHL history, and one of the best one-two forward duos in the NHL. It's not especially difficult to see why Ryan gets bumped.
Then we'd finish last because of lack of C depth. Imagine DD, Gomez, Eller and White/Nok
The argument can be made that if Eller has the upside people claim he does(I personally don't see him as that 70 point center others do, I think he's a 40-50 point guy better used as 3rd line cnter).
Because Eller, Desharnais, Galchenyuk, would be on the team the following year. Now...having pacioretty, ryan in the top 6 + whoever we managed to suck enough to get...Well thats a pretty balanced and young top 6. Top 9 if we include say whoever becomes our 3rd line center of the 3, along with guys like leblanc, gallagher who also could be NHL ready by end of next year(if not already).
Long story short, if habs can make the deal I do it. The team will be stacked the year after if we win or if we lose.
Gionta, Cole, etc... all vets that could be staying and who could help as well.
At this point? I certainly think it's a stretch, as he is not a Norris caliber defenseman. You're extrapolating a curve in his development based on your own expectations. It's easy to see the best in a young player you're cheering for. He might fulfill those expectations, but for my money the top young defensemen, looking forward, are young defensemen like Pietrangelo, OEL, Doughty, Karlsson, etc... Defensemen who are not only younger than him, but already a step ahead. Frankly, the one characteristic they all share, that I think will hold Subban back, is hockey IQ. The best defensemen are typically the smartest as well.
I'm definitely extrapolating, no question, but I think it's justified since PK's good at literally everything. Great at some things, just good at others, but his work ethic is second to none. He doesn't take many shifts off. Workhorses like that are guys who have long and successful careers in one way or another, and given PK's talents, I think it's a safe bet he'll become one of the better defencemen in the league.
Don't get me wrong. I'm not going off my rocker and saying he's one of the best defencemen in the league right now, but it certainly didn't take long for him to become the #1D on an NHL team (regardless of that team's placement in the standings, because I think it's naive to say that's even close to where they would've finished had they not lost a ridiculous amount of man-games to injury for roster players). I think his full potential and the likelihood of reaching that potential (we'll use Hockey's Future prospect grades, for fun) is about a 9.0 B.
why not?? Fowler in his first season had 40 points, thats more in a season then what PK has done in a single season...he regressed last season, you can blame it on the sophomore slump, and this next season we will see what the kids got, yeah he's not as physical as PK, but he is also younger, so he still has time to develop to a stronger man, because he still looks like a kid to me, im going here by using the same crap term you used, unlimited potential!!
Fowler's awesome. I have no issue with someone saying he's anaheim's own young potential star d-man like subban is for us. He's got ways to go, but he could end up awesome.
I'm definitely extrapolating, no question, but I think it's justified since PK's good at literally everything. Great at some things, just good at others, but his work ethic is second to none. He doesn't take many shifts off. Workhorses like that are guys who have long and successful careers in one way or another, and given PK's talents, I think it's a safe bet he'll become one of the better defencemen in the league.
Don't get me wrong. I'm not going off my rocker and saying he's one of the best defencemen in the league right now, but it certainly didn't take long for him to become the #1D on an NHL team (regardless of that team's placement in the standings, because I think it's naive to say that's even close to where they would've finished had they not lost a ridiculous amount of man-games to injury for roster players). I think his full potential and the likelihood of reaching that potential (we'll use Hockey's Future prospect grades, for fun) is about a 9.0 B.
Fair enough. I can respect that. He's definitely an intriguing player.
The argument can be made that if Eller has the upside people claim he does(I personally don't see him as that 70 point center others do, I think he's a 40-50 point guy better used as 3rd line cnter).
Because Eller, Desharnais, Galchenyuk, would be on the team the following year. Now...having pacioretty, ryan in the top 6 + whoever we managed to suck enough to get...Well thats a pretty balanced and young top 6. Top 9 if we include say whoever becomes our 3rd line center of the 3, along with guys like leblanc, gallagher who also could be NHL ready by end of next year(if not already).
Long story short, if habs can make the deal I do it. The team will be stacked the year after if we win or if we lose.
Gionta, Cole, etc... all vets that could be staying and who could help as well.
Fowler's awesome. I have no issue with someone saying he's anaheim's own young potential star d-man like subban is for us. He's got ways to go, but he could end up awesome.
It's worth noting he's, what? 3 years younger than Subban? He's definitely more raw, but given the developmental gap, and the high end talent already obvious in Fowler, I don't think the comparison is undeserved, in the sense that Fowler is also a young star potential d-man(let's face it, comparisons beyond that are tough because they are very different players). I just think there is a bit more doubt associated with Fowler, considering his age and the distance left for him to go. Like Subban, he's a very intriguing player.
Wait, how is it a stretch to say that Fowler is comparable to Subban? Because as one of the best young defensemen in the game, he certainly is "comparable". It's not like the person was comparing Thomas Hickey to PK.
listen i was one of the first ones to want to trade subban.
but im not going to agree with you on your comment.
all the defensemen you named are all amazing defensemen.
Subban is as important as all of them. hes just different.
its all about opinion when it comes to there. some GMs would
prefer subban over pietrangelo. some wouldn't.
I highly doubt that a single GM would prefer Subban over Pietrangelo.
Quote:
Originally Posted by hairygigolo
PLEASE TELL ME YOU DIDN'T JUST COMPARE CAM FOWLER TO SUBBAN !!
wow you are biased buddy. im not even going to answer your comments
anymore....
I fail to see what is so outrage with the comparison. Subban and Fowler are most certainly within the same tier of defenseman.
Your comparison to Pietrangelo is much worse than a comparison to Fowler.
It's worth noting he's, what? 3 years younger than Subban? He's definitely more raw, but given the developmental gap, and the high end talent already obvious in Fowler, I don't think the comparison is undeserved, in the sense that Fowler is also a young star potential d-man(let's face it, comparisons beyond that are tough because they are very different players). I just think there is a bit more doubt associated with Fowler, considering his age and the distance left for him to go. Like Subban, he's a very intriguing player.
2.5 years younger, but yes, it is worth noting. I'd be very excited about Fowler if I were a ducks fan. I hope you guys don't listen to that 1 habs fan who thinks that. Sure, subban is superior overall right now and may always be(who knows) but Fowler is no slouch himself. He's got a lot to learn but I'm confident he'll improve(safe assumption) and be a pretty good player himself. He's already producing now, he's just gotta round out his game.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gustafsson
Wait, how is it a stretch to say that Fowler is comparable to Subban? Because as one of the best young defensemen in the game, he certainly is "comparable". It's not like the person was comparing Thomas Hickey to PK.
I agree. Please dismiss the person who said it. Fowler is a great young talent.
I highly doubt that a single GM would prefer Subban over Pietrangelo.
I agree. I think the world of PK Subban but let's be honest here.... Pietrangelo is better at every facet of the game than Subban other than maybe the art of irritation. I'd assume that if GMs were building a team from scratch right now, Alex Pietrangelo would be in the top 3 defensemen taken to build around..... factoring in youth and the rest of it. Subban, while very good, is in a tier or two below Pietrangelo. I mean, Subban is in a tier below Ekman-Larsson and he's not as good as Pietrangelo either.
I agree. I think the world of PK Subban but let's be honest here.... Pietrangelo is better at every facet of the game than Subban other than maybe the art of irritation. I'd assume that if GMs were building a team from scratch right now, Alex Pietrangelo would be in the top 3 defensemen taken to build around..... factoring in youth and the rest of it. Subban, while very good, is in a tier or two below Pietrangelo. I mean, Subban is in a tier below Ekman-Larsson and he's not as good as Pietrangelo either.
Pietrangelo will likely be the one who gets multiple norris nominations, not subban. Maybe subban will emerge elite and part of the mix but right now they are ahead.
Perhaps, but his analysis of PK's play and abilities are exactly what we see from him night in, night out. I don't think it's a stretch to see him with multiple Norris nominations by the end of his career, at the very least.
setting the bar a bit high up there don't you think?
edit: and stop quoting hairygigolo, if he's not trolling, at the very least he's not worth responding to...
Last edited by MasterDecoy: 07-19-2012 at 03:09 AM.
Comparing Subban to Fowler is an insult to PK. Obviously Subban isn't in Pietrangelo territory, but he's astronomically better than Fowler defensively and on the same level offensive.
I agree, i rather keep Ryan then have PK Subban, we dont need him, we have our equivalent in Cam Fowler...we both are happy!!
and to your next question the pp
Getzlaf, selanne, perry, Fowler and Lubo last season, this season it looks like its going to be Getzlaf, Selanne, perry, fowler and Souray...on paper that looks pretty good, so you are saying?
Fair enough but please don't try saying that Fowler = P.K.
Thats just insulting to P.K and most anyone that knows hockey.
Fair enough but please don't try saying that Fowler = P.K.
Thats just insulting to P.K and most anyone that knows hockey.
Insulting? It absolutely isn't. It's not true, but if that's insulting, your life must be a constant journey from one vicious verbal attack to the next.
