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*OFFICIAL* Windsor Spitfires 2012-13 Season Thread (Part 3)

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Old
08-11-2012, 05:51 PM
  #426
PhlyerPhanatic
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Originally Posted by RayzorIsDull View Post
Here's the rub if what Rychel says is correct and the league did not follow due process or procedural fairness in regards to the investigation then the league has opened themselves up to a lawsuit and legal consequences.
One could read into that anything they want. I could perceive that as Rychel saying it was an unfair procedure because he didn't have enough time to cover his tracks. Just sayin

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08-11-2012, 05:52 PM
  #427
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Originally Posted by RayzorIsDull View Post
Here's the rub if what Rychel says is correct and the league did not follow due process or procedural fairness in regards to the investigation then the league has opened themselves up to a lawsuit and legal consequences.
True enough but the Spits shouldnt be given extra picks and cash. The league would have to drop the hammer on itself, having lost all credibilty moving forward

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08-11-2012, 05:59 PM
  #428
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Originally Posted by RayzorIsDull View Post
Here's the rub if what Rychel says is correct and the league did not follow due process or procedural fairness in regards to the investigation then the league has opened themselves up to a lawsuit and legal consequences.
i dont get it what didn't the league do correctly, can someone please explain!

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08-11-2012, 06:02 PM
  #429
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i dont get it what didn't the league do correctly, can someone please explain!
It sounds like the league is supposed to have a plan for how investigations like this are done and it wasn't followed properly. That's how I take it.

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08-11-2012, 06:07 PM
  #430
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i dont get it what didn't the league do correctly, can someone please explain!
Im not sure they did. It was the response from the Spits org that has left some fans thinking wishfully.
You gotta think with that extreme penalty there has to be some wrong doing but well see how it plays out.

A little more info sure would help out. But I doubt we ever get the whole story.

Did the Spits say they did nothing wrong or did they say the league didnt follow procedures correctly or both?

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08-11-2012, 06:08 PM
  #431
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I agree that the idea of extra picks if somehow this was all proven to be wrong makes no sense since it is then penalizing 19 other teams for a specific issue that they (likely) had nothing to do with.

Now if this is all proven wrong through the appeal process in this day and age of litigation over much less than this the idea of financial compensation for this would make sense.

I tend to agree, even as a Windsor fan that if the league goes public with this as they have than they must have something they strongly believe in that can support their case. The appeal process to me will determine how much public damage is acceptable to the league and address the penalties accordingly.

Is it more important for the league to bring Windsor down a few notches through harsh penalties to prove a point to someone, not exactly sure who or is it better in the end to lighten up a bit, ensure one of their flagship franchises remains competitive while making a ceremonial statement about the issue through reasonable penalties being issued?

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08-11-2012, 06:11 PM
  #432
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Originally Posted by aresknights View Post
True enough but the Spits shouldnt be given extra picks and cash. The league would have to drop the hammer on itself, having lost all credibilty moving forward
Here's the issue though if it does go into a legal forum any extra picks and cash could be decided by a judge in the form of costs. The league could be opening themselves up to something they have never seen before. They have already lost a lot of credibility in my mind.

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08-11-2012, 06:15 PM
  #433
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Ok, keep out hope extra picks are coming.

Cant see it, not fair to everyone else who, havent as yet been caught. (or allegdedly caught if you will)

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08-11-2012, 06:35 PM
  #434
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Originally Posted by aresknights View Post
Ok, keep out hope extra picks are coming.

Cant see it, not fair to everyone else who, havent as yet been caught. (or allegdedly caught if you will)
I get what u are saying however if a team successfully appeals there should be something forth coming
To drag a team thru the mud and wind up being innocent [maybe] is just as unfair as the 19 teams u talk about

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08-11-2012, 07:13 PM
  #435
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I get what u are saying however if a team successfully appeals there should be something forth coming
To drag a team thru the mud and wind up being innocent [maybe] is just as unfair as the 19 teams u talk about
Cant punish the innocent if Windsor was wronged. You gotta punish the league and the ones who did wrong is all Im saying.

If it holds up, I agree with a few others, it isnt a death sentence. Just a huge hurdle theyll have to deal with moving forward.

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08-11-2012, 07:17 PM
  #436
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And that's it and that's the only thing I need, is this. I don't need this or this. Just this ashtray. And this paddle game, the ashtray and the paddle game and that's all I need. And this remote control. The ashtray, the paddle game, and the remote control, and that's all I need. And these matches. The ashtray, and these matches, and the remote control and the paddle ball. And this lamp. The ashtray, this paddle game and the remote control and the lamp and that's all I need. And that's all I need too. I don't need one other thing, not one - I need this. The paddle game, and the chair, and the remote control, and the matches, for sure. And this. And that's all I need. The ashtray, the remote control, the paddle game, this magazine and the chair.
Nice one Navin! I also doubt we'll get anything like picks as compensation should this be overturned, maybe just some cash we could use to lure Schmaltz number 2.

It's probably pie in the sky to think they are going to overturn these sanctions on our team, even if Branch isn't making the decision. I'm just going to move on and assume we've lost some picks because that's likely going to be what happens. The best we can hope for in my opinion is some sort of reduction. If we lose all the picks, I don't think we're facing a doom and gloom scenario, it puts us behind the 8 ball but if we're going to be losing a chunk of the future at least we already have a great chunk of the future in place to mitigate the loss to our competitiveness.

I'd be willing to put money on Dubas/Campbell being the rats, even if it's total speculation. Campbell is the one guy who might have a valid reason for not caring about the fallout something like this might cause after he was traded to siberia and treated like crap by most of our fans half the time. Dubas was molested by our management in so many ways this offseason that it wouldn't surprise me to see him bringing this to league attention. If they are handing our fines like this you'd think they have a player who squealed because that's the only reasonable evidence somebody could find. Campbell is the only guy who'd have a good enough reason to be that much of a dick and Dubas is the only GM green and stupid enough to think doing something like this would be a good idea.

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08-11-2012, 07:20 PM
  #437
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I'd be willing to put money on Dubas/Campbell being the rats, even if it's total speculation. Campbell is the one guy who might have a valid reason for not caring about the fallout something like this might cause after he was traded to siberia and treated like crap by most of our fans half the time. Dubas was molested by our management in so many ways this offseason that it wouldn't surprise me to see him bringing this to league attention. If they are handing our fines like this you'd think they have a player who squealed because that's the only reasonable evidence somebody could find. Campbell is the only guy who'd have a good enough reason to be that much of a dick and Dubas is the only GM green and stupid enough to think doing something like this would be a good idea.
Quote:
And that's it and that's the only thing I need, is this. I don't need this or this. Just this ashtray. And this paddle game, the ashtray and the paddle game and that's all I need. And this remote control. The ashtray, the paddle game, and the remote control, and that's all I need. And these matches. The ashtray, and these matches, and the remote control and the paddle ball. And this lamp. The ashtray, this paddle game and the remote control and the lamp and that's all I need. And that's all I need too. I don't need one other thing, not one - I need this. The paddle game, and the chair, and the remote control, and the matches, for sure. And this. And that's all I need. The ashtray, the remote control, the paddle game, this magazine and the chair.


I dont care who ya are- dat dere is funny

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08-11-2012, 07:30 PM
  #438
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Originally Posted by jughead42 View Post
Nice one Navin! I also doubt we'll get anything like picks as compensation should this be overturned, maybe just some cash we could use to lure Schmaltz number 2.

It's probably pie in the sky to think they are going to overturn these sanctions on our team, even if Branch isn't making the decision. I'm just going to move on and assume we've lost some picks because that's likely going to be what happens. The best we can hope for in my opinion is some sort of reduction. If we lose all the picks, I don't think we're facing a doom and gloom scenario, it puts us behind the 8 ball but if we're going to be losing a chunk of the future at least we already have a great chunk of the future in place to mitigate the loss to our competitiveness.

I'd be willing to put money on Dubas/Campbell being the rats, even if it's total speculation. Campbell is the one guy who might have a valid reason for not caring about the fallout something like this might cause after he was traded to siberia and treated like crap by most of our fans half the time. Dubas was molested by our management in so many ways this offseason that it wouldn't surprise me to see him bringing this to league attention. If they are handing our fines like this you'd think they have a player who squealed because that's the only reasonable evidence somebody could find. Campbell is the only guy who'd have a good enough reason to be that much of a dick and Dubas is the only GM green and stupid enough to think doing something like this would be a good idea.
NOT that I'm saying you're right and Dubas/Campbell had anything to do with this, but given how the Tolchinsky situation has unfolded, I could see this being more accurate than not.

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08-11-2012, 07:43 PM
  #439
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Then why would Jack Campbell play in the alumni game?

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08-11-2012, 07:47 PM
  #440
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Management needs to play this carefully if they are only appealing to mitigate damage. If they are truly guilty, you can bet that more than 2 players were the recipients of extra benefits. If the Spits protest too loudly, other players/cases may be found and the damage could be even greater. If they really are innocent, yell to the rafters....if they're guilty, I think they go silent pretty quickly.

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08-11-2012, 08:08 PM
  #441
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Originally Posted by jughead42 View Post
Nice one Navin! I also doubt we'll get anything like picks as compensation should this be overturned, maybe just some cash we could use to lure Schmaltz number 2.

It's probably pie in the sky to think they are going to overturn these sanctions on our team, even if Branch isn't making the decision. I'm just going to move on and assume we've lost some picks because that's likely going to be what happens. The best we can hope for in my opinion is some sort of reduction. If we lose all the picks, I don't think we're facing a doom and gloom scenario, it puts us behind the 8 ball but if we're going to be losing a chunk of the future at least we already have a great chunk of the future in place to mitigate the loss to our competitiveness.

I'd be willing to put money on Dubas/Campbell being the rats, even if it's total speculation. Campbell is the one guy who might have a valid reason for not caring about the fallout something like this might cause after he was traded to siberia and treated like crap by most of our fans half the time. Dubas was molested by our management in so many ways this offseason that it wouldn't surprise me to see him bringing this to league attention. If they are handing our fines like this you'd think they have a player who squealed because that's the only reasonable evidence somebody could find. Campbell is the only guy who'd have a good enough reason to be that much of a dick and Dubas is the only GM green and stupid enough to think doing something like this would be a good idea.
They said the investigation was launched in 2010.

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08-11-2012, 08:09 PM
  #442
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Originally Posted by ForestGlade View Post
Then why would Jack Campbell play in the alumni game?
Wanted to play it cool, not to attract to much attention towards the Spits by saying no.

I thought it a bit strange though when I seen him geting out of his Suv that night in Tec.

Also maybe was told his name wouldnt come out.I also thought of him earlier but not Dubas.Both have a reason to have an axe to grind with Rychel.I would say those names are pretty accurate IMO.

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08-11-2012, 08:11 PM
  #443
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Then why would Jack Campbell play in the alumni game?
I didn't know he was there. I said it was only speculation. I'd have put money on it and lost, but that's what usually happens when I gamble. It's hard to keep from slinging mud when we're knee deep in the stuff.

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08-11-2012, 08:17 PM
  #444
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Exactly. It's all speculation and we can all run around with Velma and Daphne looking for clues to find out whodunit, but until the OHL or the Spits opens their mouth, this is a bad episode of Law & Order.

My entire basis of ruling out Fowler and Campbell were they volunteered to play in the Spits alumni charity game

Ugh, I thought this crap was over when Riolo sold the team

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08-11-2012, 08:18 PM
  #445
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Also with the board of Gov. meetings coming up.You would have thought they would have taken more thought into this and not allow the league look bush league.

Someone was def. overzealous in this IMO esp. if what Rychel says is true about procedures not being followed.

And just because these guys are board members or like Branch the commish doesnt mean anything in todays world.I know alot of management where I work you would think have it together and are really ********, so dont read to much into titles people hold.They make big errors in judgement too and alot of things are all politics these days.

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08-11-2012, 08:29 PM
  #446
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Originally Posted by PhlyerPhanatic View Post
I seriously doubt it gets overturned. Reduced is a possibility..but that could be even a stretch. The league wouldn't go public with something like this unless they felt 100% certain the Spits had no chance of winning an appeal.
Iím with ya on this one.. something of this magnitude if the league didnít have concrete evidence it would never have been made public. Iím hoping with an appeal something could be done to maybe lessen the penalty however Iím not holding my breath.
Hopefully within the next couple of weeks more info will come out of exactly what was done, and I dont see why they cant name names, until than all players are going to be talked about and painted with this. Its a shame.

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08-11-2012, 10:24 PM
  #447
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A couple of things - I don't think any other team will be caught right now as the league would have announced them all together rather than space them out with each new announcement as it is a black eye on the league and the CHL.

Rychel saying they didn't follow proper procedure could come from the independent investigator going above and beyond the scope of his job detail. The guy brings his findings back to OHL and they can't not act even if the evidence was found on the equivalent of an illegal police search because if the investigator goes to the press or the story is somehow otherwise broke that the OHL had evidence and didn't act then it would open up a lot more problems for the league.

Regarding the player(s) - I think it's Campbell. His parents were pissed he was traded and there was rumors around at that time that they were talking about promises made to Jack and how he was lied to. As for why Campbell was at the alumni game - maybe he didn't know this was all coming down at the time. Since this investigation has been going on for years maybe something his parents said in anger 8 months ago he thought simply went away.

I don't think Dubas would be involved at all.

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08-11-2012, 10:43 PM
  #448
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If that were true (which it could very well be), I would think they would take down the video feature on Campbell on the website

Blargh, this is my Saturday night entertainment. Speculating what kid ratted on his team. I suck

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08-11-2012, 11:24 PM
  #449
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just a few comments...1) no way in hell this gets turned around...best case scenario is a reducement (2)We will never find out what kid or kids they were talking about unless some1 slips up (3) I still think the mem cup ends up in Windsor,,,Think Branch made rychel a promise after he opened up the envelope from mr.melnyk 2yrs ago and maybe Branch has a conscience......

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08-12-2012, 02:01 AM
  #450
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Originally Posted by Ottomatic View Post

Regarding the player(s) - I think it's Campbell. His parents were pissed he was traded and there was rumors around at that time that they were talking about promises made to Jack and how he was lied to. As for why Campbell was at the alumni game - maybe he didn't know this was all coming down at the time. Since this investigation has been going on for years maybe something his parents said in anger 8 months ago he thought simply went away.

I don't think Dubas would be involved at all.
This is a good point, Campbell could be the player in question without having anything to do with leaking the evidence. A pissed off parent could be just as likely to let the cat out of the bag if there were any shenanigans.

As far as Dubas and his possible involvement, the investigation was launched because of a complaint. Branch never said who the complaint came from and was fairly vague on who is actually able to bring something like this to the league's attention. Having said that, they aren't going to waste their time investigating something just because saskasault on HF boards complained about it. It had to be somebody of significance in the league, it had to be somebody with some sort of connection to the player in question, it had to be somebody with an axe to grind over missing out on players, and someone who could benefit from seeing this happen. Connect the dots, it seems pretty obvious to me. The guy was an agent and knows the tricks these guys pull, he's seen Seiloff, Ho-Sang, and Tolchinsky all slip through his fingers because he's failed as a recruiter, and he's the GM of the poster team for have-nots. I'll try to act surprised if it ever comes out that his finger prints are on this somehow.

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