HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > General Hockey Discussion > The Rink
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

The Rink For the not so ready for prime-time players, coaches, referees, and the people that have to live with them. Discuss experiences in local leagues, coaching tips, equipment, and training.

More flex for week skills?

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
10-15-2012, 05:02 PM
  #1
mistrhanky
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 216
vCash: 500
More flex for week skills?

Old man with bad knees joing a beer league. I am still learning how to use my weight and body to produce good shots(don't have a slapshot yet) and getting a decent wrister is my first goal, then I want to work on the rest. My current stick was an 87 cut down to about 100 unfortunately for stick height. I have been considering getting something like a 75 flex Mako($ friendly) in hopes of being able to generate a lot more flex until I learn how to get a shot going. I am worried that I might break the stick to easily or that it would set back my overall development. I am at a cross roads between wanting to contribute to a team but knowing it will take time to develop a proper shot mechanics. Any help?

mistrhanky is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-15-2012, 06:10 PM
  #2
uncleodb
Registered User
 
uncleodb's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Vancouver
Country: Canada
Posts: 31
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by mistrhanky View Post
Old man with bad knees joing a beer league. I am still learning how to use my weight and body to produce good shots(don't have a slapshot yet) and getting a decent wrister is my first goal, then I want to work on the rest. My current stick was an 87 cut down to about 100 unfortunately for stick height. I have been considering getting something like a 75 flex Mako($ friendly) in hopes of being able to generate a lot more flex until I learn how to get a shot going. I am worried that I might break the stick to easily or that it would set back my overall development. I am at a cross roads between wanting to contribute to a team but knowing it will take time to develop a proper shot mechanics. Any help?
From what I read from the several older threads regarding stick length and flex, your height, weight, strength will determine if a lower flex would be better for you. See if you can find these older topics as they are quite informative. If you already feel that your wrist shot is weak b/c you are not generating enough flex, you can definitely try a lower flex. A good deal of your shot power comes from flexing the stick, from what I understand. Good luck!

uncleodb is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-15-2012, 10:05 PM
  #3
AIREAYE
Moderator
 
AIREAYE's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Country: China
Posts: 4,495
vCash: 500
^ +1

AIREAYE is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-15-2012, 10:32 PM
  #4
Feed Me A Stray Cat
Registered User
 
Feed Me A Stray Cat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Boston, MA
Country: United States
Posts: 14,016
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to Feed Me A Stray Cat
I've heard more flex is better for weekend skills.

Feed Me A Stray Cat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-16-2012, 09:55 AM
  #5
Jarick
Doing Nothing
 
Jarick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: St Paul, MN
Country: United States
Posts: 25,249
vCash: 500
How tall and strong are you?

Jarick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-16-2012, 03:25 PM
  #6
mistrhanky
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 216
vCash: 500
I am a big lurch. 6'3", 230. So, strength wise an 85/87 flex should not really be an issue for me. It is more of a terrible-mechanics-but-want-to-contribute-as-I-learn issue. Without the stability, my strength does not help me much.

mistrhanky is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-16-2012, 03:29 PM
  #7
Jarick
Doing Nothing
 
Jarick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: St Paul, MN
Country: United States
Posts: 25,249
vCash: 500
Yeah at your height 100 flex is the norm and 85 would be the choice if you like them whippy. There is nothing wrong with trying a whippier stick though, especially to learn on as you figure out how the flex works. When you can maximize the flex with a whippy stick, you can slightly adjust the timing and possibly get a bit more power out of a stiffer one.

What stick are you using now?

Jarick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-16-2012, 03:35 PM
  #8
mistrhanky
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 216
vCash: 500
My current stick was an 87 flex Nexus 400 cut down to about 100 flex unfortunately for stick height. That was initially quite helpful as the smaller stick helped me get more comfortable with puck handling. I think I am ready to use a stick uncut, so maybe the 85 flex will feel like a big difference anyway instead of going down into the 70's? I was looking at something like a Mako M1 if that makes a difference...

mistrhanky is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-16-2012, 03:40 PM
  #9
Jarick
Doing Nothing
 
Jarick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: St Paul, MN
Country: United States
Posts: 25,249
vCash: 500
You won't be getting any benefit going from the Nexus 400 to the Mako M1. At that end of the stick spectrum, you have a fancy paint job on frankly a cheap fiberglass stick.

I would stick with the 400 until you can spring for something in the $100-125 range, or else if you can find a good clearance or slightly used stick that's an option as well.

Jarick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-16-2012, 04:30 PM
  #10
mistrhanky
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 216
vCash: 500
What is really the difference between that next level Of stick and the one i have? I've handled in the stores but I really can't feel a difference other than weight. I need to get a second stick for league play but I can't see how the stick would make a huge difference when my mechanics are really are not there yet. it's like having a great Golf Club and being a novice golfer, no?

mistrhanky is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-16-2012, 05:00 PM
  #11
Jarick
Doing Nothing
 
Jarick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: St Paul, MN
Country: United States
Posts: 25,249
vCash: 500
Expensive sticks are made of graphite, which is light weight and quickly snaps straight when bent (kick). Cheap sticks are made of fiberglass, which is heavy and does not perform like graphite.

$100 is about the sweet spot for sticks where you have good amount of graphite and they flex and kick pretty close to high end sticks. Those $50 sticks are a complete crapshoot. Never once have I heard anyone say they have been even close to satisfactory.

The best on the market are the Nexus 600, Reebok Ai5, those are good bang for the buck sticks around $100. And they may feel completely different than your 400 in terms of flex, meaning you might be able to use an 85 with them much more comfortably.

Jarick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-16-2012, 06:03 PM
  #12
hyster110
Registered User
 
hyster110's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 1,072
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by mistrhanky View Post
My current stick was an 87 flex Nexus 400 cut down to about 100 flex unfortunately for stick height. That was initially quite helpful as the smaller stick helped me get more comfortable with puck handling. I think I am ready to use a stick uncut, so maybe the 85 flex will feel like a big difference anyway instead of going down into the 70's? I was looking at something like a Mako M1 if that makes a difference...
try a 85 uncut because you will notice a big difference in flex and the feel when you shoot.

hyster110 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-16-2012, 07:10 PM
  #13
newfr4u
Registered User
 
newfr4u's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 381
vCash: 500
i've become more of a believer in practicing/dryland-shooting with a heavier and stiffer stick, and then playing with a ligher/whippier one.

in practice, you generally are not contested, so quickness is less of a concern, but form is. most people will try to make a good shot, apply good downward pressure, bend their knees, etc. getting used to a heavier/stiffer stick also promotes maximal effort out of your muscles.

in a game though, you don't have time to think about technique or anything, but using a lighter/whippier stick will immediately speed up your movements and release.

newfr4u is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-16-2012, 09:32 PM
  #14
AIREAYE
Moderator
 
AIREAYE's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Country: China
Posts: 4,495
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jarick View Post
Expensive sticks are made of graphite, which is light weight and quickly snaps straight when bent (kick). Cheap sticks are made of fiberglass, which is heavy and does not perform like graphite.

$100 is about the sweet spot for sticks where you have good amount of graphite and they flex and kick pretty close to high end sticks. Those $50 sticks are a complete crapshoot. Never once have I heard anyone say they have been even close to satisfactory.

The best on the market are the Nexus 600, Reebok Ai5, those are good bang for the buck sticks around $100. And they may feel completely different than your 400 in terms of flex, meaning you might be able to use an 85 with them much more comfortably.
This. See if you can try finding some older $100 pricepoint sticks on clearance. You will have a hard time finding anything below an 85 flex on most entry level sticks at retail.

AIREAYE is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-16-2012, 09:41 PM
  #15
nullterm
Registered User
 
nullterm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Port Moody, BC
Country: Canada
Posts: 2,559
vCash: 800
You'll find a lower flex # to be alot more forgiving and easier to get the most out of in a real game situation, when you are already focused on everything else going on around you.

I'm 6ft, 195lbs and using a 65/70 flex cut down (to a 75-80 flex?) and never had any durability issues. *knock on wood*

nullterm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-16-2012, 11:03 PM
  #16
Clarkington III
Rebuild? Refresh?
 
Clarkington III's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: San Diego
Posts: 1,941
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by mistrhanky View Post
My current stick was an 87 flex Nexus 400 cut down to about 100 flex unfortunately for stick height. That was initially quite helpful as the smaller stick helped me get more comfortable with puck handling. I think I am ready to use a stick uncut, so maybe the 85 flex will feel like a big difference anyway instead of going down into the 70's? I was looking at something like a Mako M1 if that makes a difference...
How much stick are you cutting off in length?

Clarkington III is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-17-2012, 09:29 AM
  #17
mistrhanky
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 216
vCash: 500
I had cut about an inch off of it. The marking on the shaft indicated it should be right about 100 now. If I can find a good deal on a clearance $100 stick, I will give that a shot as an 85. Otherwise, I think I am going to try to get a cheaper 75 type stick at least until I can afford to up my game. My preference is to find one of the $100 ones though and see how much difference the quality of stick makes to me.

mistrhanky is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-17-2012, 10:31 AM
  #18
Jarick
Doing Nothing
 
Jarick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: St Paul, MN
Country: United States
Posts: 25,249
vCash: 500
Wow, there's no way a stick should go from 85 to 100 flex with 1". Maybe 3" cut off. Are you sure you didn't get a 100 flex?

I honestly don't think you're going to see much difference between those $50 sticks regardless of flex.

Also, I should be clear, there is no standard definition of flex, so one company's 75 flex could be another company's 100 flex. It changes even within brands among models and price points.

So that 87 flex stick could actually be 110 flex, or it could be 65 flex, you have no idea really until you test the flex in the store or on the ice and have used enough sticks to get a feel for it.

But those $200 sticks tend to be much, much closer to stated flex, with a couple exceptions (Nexus being whippy for one).

Jarick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-17-2012, 11:12 AM
  #19
mistrhanky
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 216
vCash: 500
Let's assume for the moment that I am correct and it is a 100 flex stick right now. Are you saying I won't see much difference going from the 100 to the 85 or lower because they are cheap sticks, or are you saying I won't see much difference between the two cheap sticks I mentioned?

mistrhanky is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-17-2012, 11:42 AM
  #20
Jarick
Doing Nothing
 
Jarick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: St Paul, MN
Country: United States
Posts: 25,249
vCash: 500
I think with the cheap sticks the flex rating is inaccurate and the performance of the stick means the flex won't help you as much.

Look, the big thing is comfort. You want to feel like the stick "gives" just a little bit when you are shooting. That means it's storing and releasing energy while you shoot. Granted you need to learn how to use that energy in your timing and mechanics, but that's the goal.

You don't want a stick that feels like it's bending in half or going to break. That means you are losing power and accuracy. You also don't want a stick that feels like it doesn't bend at all. That means you are losing power and potentially accuracy.

For you, I would first figure out what flex feels like.

This video shows how you can scientifically test the actual flex of a stick. The machine "holds" the stick where your two hands would go and deflects the blade portion:



Now in the real world, we don't have machines and we don't want to break sticks. So we grab them off the shelf, get in a shooting position, and just lean a little bit on them.

If the stick doesn't move much and requires you to really push down, it's too stiff. If it the stick feels like it's bending way too easily, it's too whippy. If it gives just a little bit and then springs back when you let up, it's perfect.

I would go to the store and push down on some sticks and get a feel for them. Try the $200 sticks in all the flexes, try different brands and models, try an intermediate stick, try a 110 flex, etc. Then feel your stick.

My gut says that cheap stick probably feels way stiffer than the same flex rating of a higher level stick.

Jarick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-17-2012, 02:53 PM
  #21
mistrhanky
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 216
vCash: 500
Appreciate all of the help. So, I am looking at around at a few places and considering that move up to the next level of stick.

Are there any particular opinions on the
Bauer one60
Warrior Double D Dolomite
Easton S13-S15

Are there any particular difference or values in there. These seem like they might be that next tier sort of sticks that I can find some decent clearance values on. I currently play with a Backstrom P92 curve now and I like the way it helps lift my shot, but it is pretty rough on my backhand. Will probably look for something similar yet a bit kinder. Either way, I appreciate all of the advice.

mistrhanky is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-17-2012, 03:14 PM
  #22
Jarick
Doing Nothing
 
Jarick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: St Paul, MN
Country: United States
Posts: 25,249
vCash: 500
Dolomite > S15 > S13 > One60 IMO. I'd go with the Dolomite if you can since it was a $180 stick when new. I used to have one of that year's models and it was excellent.

Personally I use the P92 as well. I take 10 times as many shots on the forehand than the backhand so I will take a better forehand shot and a little less backhand. I have probably scored 75 forehand goals in league compared to maybe 1 or 2 backhand.

Jarick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-17-2012, 04:03 PM
  #23
nullterm
Registered User
 
nullterm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Port Moody, BC
Country: Canada
Posts: 2,559
vCash: 800
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jarick View Post
Dolomite > S15 > S13 > One60 IMO. I'd go with the Dolomite if you can since it was a $180 stick when new. I used to have one of that year's models and it was excellent.

Personally I use the P92 as well. I take 10 times as many shots on the forehand than the backhand so I will take a better forehand shot and a little less backhand. I have probably scored 75 forehand goals in league compared to maybe 1 or 2 backhand.
I'll second the Dolomite. I got one in a 70 flex for 1/2 price clearance. LOVE IT.

nullterm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-18-2012, 11:01 AM
  #24
mistrhanky
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 216
vCash: 500
Ok. Going to give the Dolomite a shot. Which curve comes closest to the Backstrom, the Draper or Vanek? I think a 5 lie is probably what I need, but my choices are limited to a 75 Draper 5 lie, or an 85 Vanek. So, wippiness vs lie, which way would you opt?

mistrhanky is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-18-2012, 11:20 AM
  #25
AIREAYE
Moderator
 
AIREAYE's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Country: China
Posts: 4,495
vCash: 500
You can get used to the curve, the Draper is the Backstrom clone and very similar lie/blade rocker. Vanek is a slightly open heel, a toned down P106 or a slightly deeper more open PM9 with a lower lie than the Draper.

AIREAYE is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 02:02 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2016, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2016 All Rights Reserved.