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Another ex-Whalers Owner on whether Hartford gets back a team

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Old
12-18-2011, 12:21 PM
  #1
whalers2010
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Another ex-Whalers Owner on whether Hartford gets back a team

Interesting stuff on our local tv station
http://dennishouse.wordpress.com/201...k-the-bishops/

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Old
12-18-2011, 02:10 PM
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Guardian17
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I would love to see the Whalers back in the NHL.

Great logo.

Took me ten years before I realized there was an "H" in it!

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Old
12-18-2011, 03:03 PM
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headsigh
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If you think Atlanta will take 10-20 years to get back in the NHL

Hartford will probably take a very long time.

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12-18-2011, 04:12 PM
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Ugmo
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If I were gung ho about the return of the Whalers, I wouldn't be after watching that interview.

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Old
12-18-2011, 04:45 PM
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Cynicaps
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Quote:
Originally Posted by transcend View Post
If you think Atlanta will take 10-20 years to get back in the NHL

Hartford will probably take a very long time.
Hartford has a head start of 15 years and if Winnipeg is a runaway success it'll open a door for Hartford.

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Old
12-18-2011, 06:11 PM
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whalers2010
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Picture of proposed Hartford arena

Here are some picture of the proposed renovated XL Center in Hartford, formerly the Hartford Civic Center. Future home of Hartford Whalers?
http://dennishouse.wordpress.com/201...al-to-economy/

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Old
12-18-2011, 09:19 PM
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Senacus Maximus
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Quote:
Originally Posted by transcend View Post
If you think Atlanta will take 10-20 years to get back in the NHL

Hartford will probably take a very long time.
You've got it backwards.

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Old
12-18-2011, 09:50 PM
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Would like to see Hartford get a team back, but I think that's quite down the list for a relocation/expansion.

You're nuts to think the NHL will never try Atlanta again. It was ownership that was the problem, rather than attendance/fanbase.

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12-19-2011, 04:38 AM
  #9
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I'd be cool with the Whalers coming back, but as I've said several times before here I just don't think it's at all likely. Any number of issues aside, I just don't see the Bruins or the Rangers being all too happy with the notion of a team being dropped down in what they view to be their own backyard, which is also the reason why I doubt that Hamilton will never get a team. I don't doubt for a second that Hartford (and Hamilton) could support a team, but I just don't think they'll get the opportunity any time soon due to powerful opposition coming from their would-be-neighbors in the BoG.

And before it's brought up, I don't care if one of the owners of the two teams I mentioned has said that they'd be cool with the Whalers coming back. From a simple business perspective, that's the only logical thing he could say so long as it's just a hypothetical. If he said he was opposed to Hartford getting a team back, all that it'd do is piss off potential fans in Connecticut. Not exactly a smart business move.

Let's see what the owners of the Bruins and the Rangers say when a real concrete expansion/relocation plan that involves Hartford actually develops.

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12-19-2011, 06:35 AM
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IIRC, Whalers tickets were going real cheap, not Expos low but still pretty low. Also the Whale haven't been much of a success on the level of the Manitoba Moose, which is what is expected if a city wants a team back.

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12-19-2011, 06:43 AM
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I would be very surprised if the League shows any real interest towards Hartford as market. How would Hartford benefit the League?

New Whalers could be modest success for whoever owns them, but a relatively small market in the middle of area already having numerous teams nearby would bring nothing, not even sufficiently large expansion fee, to the League to warrant serious consideration.

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12-19-2011, 07:12 AM
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I miss my Whale and would love to see them back, but that stretch from Buffalo to New Jersey has way too many teams. Unless the Islanders move, which I doubt, no chance.

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12-19-2011, 08:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cynicaps View Post
Hartford has a head start of 15 years and if Winnipeg is a runaway success it'll open a door for Hartford.
lol, Winnipeg and Hartford have absolutely nothing to do with each other. Does Hartford have a new arena? An extremely rich owner akin to TruNorth? Exactly.

Not to mention, unlike Winnipeg, Hartford would have to get the permission of the Rangers, Islanders, and Bruins to have a team play there.

Hartford was an even bigger joke than Winnipeg and Quebec - who at least had fans even if they couldn't find ownership or financing for new arenas. Hartford will never have another NHL team again.

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12-19-2011, 08:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EbencoyE View Post
lol, Winnipeg and Hartford have absolutely nothing to do with each other. Does Hartford have a new arena? An extremely rich owner akin to TruNorth? Exactly.

Not to mention, unlike Winnipeg, Hartford would have to get the permission of the Rangers, Islanders, and Bruins to have a team play there.

Hartford was an even bigger joke than Winnipeg and Quebec - who at least had fans even if they couldn't find ownership or financing for new arenas. Hartford will never have another NHL team again.
First off, the article discusses a total renovation of an arena in Hartford.

Not sure where your getting the fans statement either. Winnipeg and Hartford both had awful attendance.

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12-19-2011, 09:09 AM
  #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AtlantaWhaler View Post
First off, the article discusses a total renovation of an arena in Hartford.

Not sure where your getting the fans statement either. Winnipeg and Hartford both had awful attendance.
A renovation can only go so far... the fact that they aren't willing to build a brand new arena should speak volumes for their confidence of attracting a major league team.

And yes, I'm aware the Jets also had horrible attendance. But not anywhere near as bad as the Whalers had.

In 93-94:

Hartford: 10,492
Winnipeg: 13,297

Winnipeg's last year was lower but you cant blame them for not coming out when the team was about to move.

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Old
12-19-2011, 09:30 AM
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One thing going for Hartford is money. Connecticut is a wealthy state, and so is the Metro Hartford area. The city itself is poor, but it is surrounded by wealthy towns There are also big companies Travelers, the Hartford, Lego, Aetna, Cigna, United Technologies, ESPN who would likely commit to skyboxes. A lot of markets don't have that. Boston and NY might want the Whalers back for that regional rivalry.

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12-19-2011, 10:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AtlantaWhaler View Post
Not sure where your getting the fans statement either. Winnipeg and Hartford both had awful attendance.
Don't know how reliable these links are, but assuming they are accurate, Winnipeg very consistently hovered around 13K for its entire NHL existence (the first time around). Hartford varied a bit, but was quite regularly a couple of thousand lower than Winnipeg. Not that I'm taking sides, because I would love for both to be in the NHL, but at the moment there appears to be a "Winnipeg had terrible attendance" meme here that isn't borne out by the numbers.

http://www.curtiswalker.com/jets/attendance.aspx

http://www.hockeydb.com/nhl-attendan...h.php?tmi=6045

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Old
12-19-2011, 10:16 AM
  #18
AtlantaWhaler
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I'm not stating that Hartford had more fans. Just saying that using the example of Winnipeg in the 90's as a comparison isn't a good one. Both teams had trouble drawing and both moved. Now Winnipeg is back and is, so far, doing well. As I said though, with the number of teams in the northeast, I see no reason why the NHL should/could add another in that area.

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12-19-2011, 10:26 AM
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Ugmo
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AtlantaWhaler View Post
I'm not stating that Hartford had more fans. Just saying that using the example of Winnipeg in the 90's as a comparison isn't a good one. Both teams had trouble drawing and both moved.
I disagree that that was the problem with Winnipeg. Their problem was an outdated arena and the Canadian dollar. Hartford's problem was an outdated arena, and arguably a lack of fan support.

Again, not a knock on the Whale - I supported them for a year after the Nords moved and would love to see them return.

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12-19-2011, 10:48 AM
  #20
kdb209
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ugmo View Post
Don't know how reliable these links are, but assuming they are accurate, Winnipeg very consistently hovered around 13K for its entire NHL existence (the first time around). Hartford varied a bit, but was quite regularly a couple of thousand lower than Winnipeg. Not that I'm taking sides, because I would love for both to be in the NHL, but at the moment there appears to be a "Winnipeg had terrible attendance" meme here that isn't borne out by the numbers.

http://www.curtiswalker.com/jets/attendance.aspx

http://www.hockeydb.com/nhl-attendan...h.php?tmi=6045
Cool. When did those attendance numbers go up on hockeydb?

Now I can stop using my local copy of the hockeyresearch.org spreadsheet.

Looking at the source notes on hockeydb, they used that data as one of their primary sources for '60-'61 thru '92-'93 numbers.

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Old
12-19-2011, 07:03 PM
  #21
Lazyking
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Like how everyone is saying that the rangers, Islanders and Bruins would have a problem with this and they don't live in the state like I do. FYI, The Bruins get the most coverage in most of the state with Nesn. Unless you live in New haven or really southern CT (I live in Southeast CT and still don't really get NY Games) then you're not likely to see many ranger games on TV.

The distance to go to the game? Sure not bad, about 2 hours at most but Rangers or any new york team don't have the coverage the bruins have so I think that's moot point.

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Old
12-20-2011, 01:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lazyking View Post
Like how everyone is saying that the rangers, Islanders and Bruins would have a problem with this and they don't live in the state like I do. FYI, The Bruins get the most coverage in most of the state with Nesn. Unless you live in New haven or really southern CT (I live in Southeast CT and still don't really get NY Games) then you're not likely to see many ranger games on TV.

The distance to go to the game? Sure not bad, about 2 hours at most but Rangers or any new york team don't have the coverage the bruins have so I think that's moot point.
I agree and disagree.
1) The Rangers are the most popular NHL team in Connecticut. The Bruins base is a very isolated portion of Northeast Connecticut where nobody lives.
Outside of that, Hartford, the Bruins never took off, unlike the Celtics.
Most people in Hartford dislike the Bruins for being an ex-Whaler rival.

The Rangers are very popular in Western and Southern Connecticut.
However, past New Haven, nobody really cares. The Hartford market largely is angry at the NHL.

2) I agree that the Whalers getting a team would have a nominal affect on the Rangers, Bruins, and Islanders.
Very few if any people in the Hartford market actually attend Rangers, Islanders, or Bruins games. It just is too far, most actually do not care at all.

The Rangers do get a fair number of ticket holders in Fairfield County, but that area would be completely unaffected by a Whaler return. You can't expect people in Fairfield to commute weeknights to Hartford.

3) The biggest deal for the Whalers would be TV rights.
Not only would they need a carrier, but the question becomes what happens to Bruins, Rangers, and Islanders feeds?

Right now, Hartford gets NESN and MSG games. I would think the Whalers would want a certain zone of exclusivity (probably from New Haven North and East) and an overlay throughout the whole state of Connecticut.

This would be tricky.

I think as well, something not mentioned is the knowledge corridor proposed high-speed rail. I would imagine if this gets passed, this would greatly increase the chances of Hartford getting a team as they could count on transit service.

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Old
12-20-2011, 09:03 AM
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My parents are from CT and I had family members who were Whaler fans so I would love to see them back.

But you HAVE to engage those Fairfield County people. The franchise is DOA otherwise. There is money in the Hartford suburbs, but with FC money, that would be enough to support a team. If not, then there isn't.

I think UCONN has showed a new team something that didn't really exist in 1995 or 96 - that the people of CT, who are normally seen as attached to Boston or NY but not their own state, do actually have more state pride than people thought. If the Whalers could tie into that it would work.

There's a lot of ifs though, and I can see (especially with the congestion around that area) why it wouldn't be high on the NHL's list.

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Old
12-20-2011, 10:59 AM
  #24
Lazyking
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IIRC, when Whalers were still here, They were on Sportschannel which turned into FSN. They also had a few local CBS games... I'm sure they could find a home.

My comcast package has Nesn, CSN sports, YES and SNY.. The rangers do get their games shown on MSG which takes over the CSN channel but unless you get MSG on your cable package, you'd never know rangers were on unless it was on. Same with the Knicks in basketball.

i figure if the Whalers returned, I think Nesn would have to be blacked out during bruins games

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Old
12-20-2011, 11:01 AM
  #25
karnige
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I can't see why the nhl will give them a team again considering their attendance was poor before

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