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Oilers re-sign Sam Gagner (1yr/$3.2M)

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Old
07-26-2012, 09:05 PM
  #276
9GWG9
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This deal is looking really sweet right now after the Semin signing. Less than half the price for the same production lol.

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07-26-2012, 11:26 PM
  #277
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Originally Posted by President Van Buren View Post
Even Gagner considers himself inconsistent. Who knew.
This isn't some new revelation, he's said more than once over the last couple years that he needs to find ways to be more consistent.

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07-26-2012, 11:38 PM
  #278
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Originally Posted by 9GWG9 View Post
This deal is looking really sweet right now after the Semin signing. Less than half the price for the same production lol.
WHAT?!?

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07-27-2012, 12:06 AM
  #279
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WHAT?!?
I know I had to read that a few times to make sure I wasnt reading it wrong.

Maybe he was confused and thought 48 & 84 both equal 50.

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07-27-2012, 12:59 AM
  #280
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Originally Posted by Supermullet View Post
WHAT?!?
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Originally Posted by nabob View Post
I know I had to read that a few times to make sure I wasnt reading it wrong.

Maybe he was confused and thought 48 & 84 both equal 50.
Simple math really...

47 points in 75 games vs 54 in 77 games.

Not really sure what is so funny? Are you saying you would be happy to pay a player 7 mil who only put up 54 points last year?

my turn.... : laugh:

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07-27-2012, 01:11 AM
  #281
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I would've paid Semin 7 million for one year. He's still a 30/40 guy in my mind, with very realistic 40 goal potential. Either way he's a guaranteed 25 goal guy, and that's if just about everything goes wrong.

Edit: I mean if everything goes wrong with Carolina. I know he scored 21 last year with Washington but frankly that team was a mess.

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07-27-2012, 01:14 AM
  #282
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The Voracek signing on the main board is considered a bargain @4/4.2m

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07-27-2012, 01:19 AM
  #283
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Originally Posted by Arpeggio View Post
I would've paid Semin 7 million for one year. He's still a 30/40 guy in my mind, with very realistic 40 goal potential. Either way he's a guaranteed 25 goal guy, and that's if just about everything goes wrong.

Edit: I mean if everything goes wrong with Carolina. I know he scored 21 last year with Washington but frankly that team was a mess.
Well he did hit 40 once THREE years ago. He is not worth 7 mil per season.

If the players were to switch teams we are in a far worse position IMO.

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07-27-2012, 10:06 AM
  #284
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Originally Posted by 9GWG9 View Post
Simple math really...

47 points in 75 games vs 54 in 77 games.

Not really sure what is so funny? Are you saying you would be happy to pay a player 7 mil who only put up 54 points last year?

my turn.... : laugh:
People don't get it. Sam is Pathetic because he puts up 47pts in the league. Thats the impression one gets around here. Doesn't matter if guys like Semin or Rick Nash are in the same ballpark.

47pts is inconsistent peanuts. You have to remember that script.

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07-27-2012, 10:07 AM
  #285
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Originally Posted by Homesick View Post
The Voracek signing on the main board is considered a bargain @4/4.2m
4.2/4 is fair for Voracek, but would be a serious overpay for Gagner.

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07-27-2012, 10:10 AM
  #286
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Originally Posted by Arpeggio View Post
I would've paid Semin 7 million for one year. He's still a 30/40 guy in my mind, with very realistic 40 goal potential. Either way he's a guaranteed 25 goal guy, and that's if just about everything goes wrong.

Edit: I mean if everything goes wrong with Carolina. I know he scored 21 last year with Washington but frankly that team was a mess.
Gagner has played his whole career on teams that are a mess. Do you think about what you post? How is that an excuse for Semin in this comparison?

Semin is a big talent but he had a lukewarm year for a player of his stature and thats all on him.

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07-27-2012, 10:14 AM
  #287
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Originally Posted by tiger_80 View Post
4.2/4 is fair for Voracek, but would be a serious overpay for Gagner.
How? They have had mirrored production over almost their entire careers. Both are softish, second-tier offensive players.

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07-27-2012, 10:14 AM
  #288
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I wouldn't give Semin a plug nickel. Plays when he feels like it, and is a cancer.

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07-27-2012, 10:31 AM
  #289
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
Gagner has played his whole career on teams that are a mess. Do you think about what you post? How is that an excuse for Semin in this comparison?

Semin is a big talent but he had a lukewarm year for a player of his stature and thats all on him.
I wasn't comparing anybody hotshot. I was justifying the contract given to Semin by saying that he is a 30 goal, potentially a 40 goal talent. His upside is so high that on a one-year deal, if I have the capspace, I want him on my team.

I'm a Gagner supporter too. Hence why I didn't say anything about Gagner in my post. I was replying to the notion that 7 million was too much for Semin on a one-year deal.

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07-27-2012, 10:36 AM
  #290
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Originally Posted by Arpeggio View Post
I wasn't comparing anybody hotshot. I was justifying the contract given to Semin by saying that he is a 30 goal, potentially a 40 goal talent. His upside is so high that on a one-year deal, if I have the capspace, I want him on my team.

I'm a Gagner supporter too. Hence why I didn't say anything about Gagner in my post. I was replying to the notion that 7 million was too much for Semin on a one-year deal.
Your post was illogical. It didn't make sense. There may be an argument for paying Semin that kind of money but the notion was poorly supported by your post.

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07-27-2012, 10:47 AM
  #291
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Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
Your post was illogical. It didn't make sense. There may be an argument for paying Semin that kind of money but the notion was poorly supported by your post.
Uh-huh. I said I think he's still a 30 to 40 goal guy, with potential to score more. I also said he's a guaranteed 25 goal guy, which is a mark he's only missed once. I then said he was in a bad situation last season, leading to an off year. Therefore, I would pay Semin 7 million dollars to play on my team.

Nothing about this doesn't make sense, unless you frame it as if I was somehow comparing Semin's contract to Gagner's. Giving Semin 7 million after his last season is no different to giving Hemsky 5 million after his last season. You pay for the upside.

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07-27-2012, 11:12 AM
  #292
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Semin: A "guaranteed" 25 goal player who just got 21 goals. The logic stopped there.

Proofreading is good.

no biggy,

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07-27-2012, 11:51 AM
  #293
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Originally Posted by Skm View Post
How? They have had mirrored production over almost their entire careers. Both are softish, second-tier offensive players.
Voracek is a bigger, stronger player who has progressed better in the past couple of seasons, while Gagner's development stagnated since his rookie season. Since Voracek is a RW, the better comparison would be Hemsky rather than Gagner. I would take Voracek at 4M over Hemsky at 5 any day of the week.

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07-27-2012, 12:17 PM
  #294
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Forget it, it's not worth it.


Last edited by Arpeggio: 07-27-2012 at 12:24 PM.
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07-27-2012, 12:39 PM
  #295
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Originally Posted by tiger_80 View Post
Voracek is a bigger, stronger player who has progressed better in the past couple of seasons, while Gagner's development stagnated since his rookie season. Since Voracek is a RW, the better comparison would be Hemsky rather than Gagner. I would take Voracek at 4M over Hemsky at 5 any day of the week.
Huh. He has progressed better. How so? I guess since he got less points in his rookie year than Gagner, he has developed more? Very questionable logic.

Really the only difference is his stagnation started a year later and he did hit 50 points once, (one point more than Gagner) but after that 50 point season, he hit 46 and 49 points. Explain to me how that is progression in the last couple of seasons?

Gagner's rookie season was 49 points and like Voracek has been around the same every since.

Besides that they play a different position they are very comparable. Almost the exact same age, same draft, similar numbers. PPG Voracek .57, Gagner .60


Last edited by hockeyaddict101: 07-27-2012 at 12:49 PM.
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07-27-2012, 12:40 PM
  #296
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Originally Posted by tiger_80 View Post
Voracek is a bigger, stronger player who has progressed better in the past couple of seasons, while Gagner's development stagnated since his rookie season. Since Voracek is a RW, the better comparison would be Hemsky rather than Gagner. I would take Voracek at 4M over Hemsky at 5 any day of the week.
You care to check facts first?

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07-27-2012, 01:22 PM
  #297
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Originally Posted by hockeyaddict101 View Post
Huh. He has progressed better. How so? I guess since he got less points in his rookie year than Gagner, he has developed more? Very questionable logic.

Really the only difference is his stagnation started a year later and he did hit 50 points once, (one point more than Gagner) but after that 50 point season, he hit 46 and 49 points. Explain to me how that is progression in the last couple of seasons?

Gagner's rookie season was 49 points and like Voracek has been around the same every since.

Besides that they play a different position they are very comparable. Almost the exact same age, same draft, similar numbers. PPG Voracek .57, Gagner .60
Voracek was also a legitimate top 6 forward on a very good Philly team scoring at nearly PPG pace in this year's play-offs. Gagner would have been burried down Philly's depth chart. Let's see if Gagner can produce 50 points this season. I am not convinced he will match his rookie point total without much PP time, even playing with Hemsky and Yakupov in a top 6 role.

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07-27-2012, 01:43 PM
  #298
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Voracek was also a legitimate top 6 forward on a very good Philly team scoring at nearly PPG pace in this year's play-offs. Gagner would have been burried down Philly's depth chart.
That's a pretty baseless assumption.

Quote:
Let's see if Gagner can produce 50 points this season.
I can't figure out why 50 points is some kind of magic marker for people. Guess they like round numbers?

Quote:
I am not convinced he will match his rookie point total without much PP time, even playing with Hemsky and Yakupov in a top 6 role.
He was 6th among forwards in PP TOI/G last year by a hair. Unless Horcoff keeps eating up PP minutes, he should get more PP time, not less.

I mean, does it need to be pointed out that last season was Gagner's best as an Oiler? Best +/-/60, best PPG, best FO%. Doesn't seem like stagnating to me.

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07-27-2012, 02:01 PM
  #299
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Originally Posted by Moose Coleman View Post
That's a pretty baseless assumption.



I can't figure out why 50 points is some kind of magic marker for people. Guess they like round numbers?



He was 6th among forwards in PP TOI/G last year by a hair. Unless Horcoff keeps eating up PP minutes, he should get more PP time, not less.

I mean, does it need to be pointed out that last season was Gagner's best as an Oiler? Best +/-/60, best PPG, best FO%. Doesn't seem like stagnating to me.
But your points go against his argument, so therefore they're wrong.

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07-27-2012, 02:04 PM
  #300
hockeyaddict101
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Originally Posted by Moose Coleman View Post
That's a pretty baseless assumption.



I can't figure out why 50 points is some kind of magic marker for people. Guess they like round numbers?



He was 6th among forwards in PP TOI/G last year by a hair. Unless Horcoff keeps eating up PP minutes, he should get more PP time, not less.

I mean, does it need to be pointed out that last season was Gagner's best as an Oiler? Best +/-/60, best PPG, best FO%. Doesn't seem like stagnating to me.
Agreed, really it speaks to all the negative threads about Gagner than any semblance of reality.

Gagner is stagnating but somehow Voracek is a legitimate top 6 forward? They are both legitimate top 6 forwards.

I really can not think of two more comparable players than these 2 in almost every way.

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