I can't figure out why 50 points is some kind of magic marker for people. Guess they like round numbers?
He was 6th among forwards in PP TOI/G last year by a hair. Unless Horcoff keeps eating up PP minutes, he should get more PP time, not less.
I mean, does it need to be pointed out that last season was Gagner's best as an Oiler? Best +/-/60, best PPG, best FO%. Doesn't seem like stagnating to me.
That and Voracek was barely a top 6 in PHI.
Voracek also had the 2nd highest PPtoi/g time on PHI last year as a forward. That going to happen again?
Voracek was also a legitimate top 6 forward on a very good Philly team scoring at nearly PPG pace in this year's play-offs. Gagner would have been burried down Philly's depth chart. Let's see if Gagner can produce 50 points this season. I am not convinced he will match his rookie point total without much PP time, even playing with Hemsky and Yakupov in a top 6 role.
He had but 2pts less than his rookie year in 4 games less than he played that season (and 7 shy of a full year). You honestly don't think he has 2 more points in him than this season?
How? They have had mirrored production over almost their entire careers. Both are softish, second-tier offensive players.
Voracek is quite simply a better player. He's bigger, stronger, faster and better defensively.
That's a solid contract for him and would be an overpay for Gagner.
Voracek also had the 2nd highest PPtoi/g time on PHI last year as a forward. That going to happen again?
Well, Voracek just got a 16.8M 4 year contract from a good team that has no problem attracting free agents. If Gagner is as good as advertized in this thread, why did not the Oilers give him the contract Flyers gave to Voracek? Well, from where I sit, the answer is obvious, they do not consider him as reliable a player as Flyers consider Voracek whatever the stats.
He was 6th among forwards in PP TOI/G last year by a hair. Unless Horcoff keeps eating up PP minutes, he should get more PP time, not less.
I mean, does it need to be pointed out that last season was Gagner's best as an Oiler? Best +/-/60, best PPG, best FO%. Doesn't seem like stagnating to me.
Why would Gagner be moved up to the top PP unit ahead of Yakupov? Hell make a case for him to play there over Smyth or *gulp* Horcoff? He is not a net presence, nor is he a better offensive player than Eberle, Hall, Nail, or RNH up front.
As for this last season being Gagner's best, it may have been in a number of metrics, however with the exception of about 5 games last year I haven't seen the same Gagner that I saw in his rookie year, creative, exceptional passing, etc. He looked slightly stronger and quicker, but through it all there's still a LOT of work to be done if he wants to be part of the long term plans here IMO.
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Voracek is quite simply a better player. He's bigger, stronger, faster and better defensively.
That's a solid contract for him and would be an overpay for Gagner.
Point totals in relation to other centers seems to be the main metric that some use to pump Gagner's tires. I remember people saying that he outscored Mike Richards last year, now let's see a show of hands, who would rather have Gagner on their team than Mike Richards? If Gagner had some Mike Richards or Mike Peca in his game we wouldn't give a rip that he hasn't topped 50 points. He doesn't, he is a one way forward that needs to be a lot more productive to warrant his spot in our lineup. RNH at 18 was already the better defensive player of the two.
Last season is where Semin's similarity to Gagner's production starts and ends.
Semin's best season is over twice the PPG of Gagner's best season. He had three seasons where he registered(or was on pace for) at least 40 goals. In 09/10, Semin had 1 less goal than Gagner had points.
Not sure how this came to be a Gagner vs Semin discussion as they are totally different players... Gagner is all-world heart and limited skills, Semin is all-world skill and no heart.
Gagner at half the price of Semin? I'll take that deal. Semin will get more points than Gagner but be AWOL as well at times when you may need him the most. Gagner at least will be there doing his damnedest with his 40-49 points year in and year out like clockwork. Sammy isn't the best but he's all we've got for a #2C man until better is found elsewhere or developed in-house.
Semin wasn't even an option... a heartless winger that brings no intangibles beyond a scoring touch isn't something they needed at all.
Not sure how this came to be a Gagner vs Semin discussion as they are totally different players... Gagner is all-world heart and limited skills, Semin is all-world skill and no heart.
Gagner at half the price of Semin? I'll take that deal. Semin will get more points than Gagner but be AWOL as well at times when you may need him the most. Gagner at least will be there doing his damnedest with his 40-49 points year in and year out like clockwork. Sammy isn't the best but he's all we've got for a #2C man until better is found elsewhere or developed in-house.
Semin wasn't even an option... a heartless winger that brings no intangibles beyond a scoring touch isn't something they needed at all.
Gagner has long stretches of games with zero pts. He goes AWOL quite often. Did I mention that he falls down a lot?
Gagner has long stretches of games with zero pts. He goes AWOL quite often. Did I mention that he falls down a lot?
For all of the talk of his improvement last year there were far too many games where he had nothing going when we DESPERATELY needed secondary scoring. To be fair this wasn't his problem alone, but he is an offense first kind of a player and he should be one of the guys that creates for his less offensive linemates.
For all of the talk of his improvement last year there were far too many games where he had nothing going when we DESPERATELY needed secondary scoring. To be fair this wasn't his problem alone, but he is an offense first kind of a player and he should be one of the guys that creates for his less offensive linemates.
I will give you Gagner being a 40+ point player but I could also say that semin is a 50 point player with three above average seasons.
I guess we will see wont we.
Huh? Gagner IS a 40+ player, you're not giving anything and Semin's "above average" seasons destroy anything that Gagner has ever done.
You are sinking fast with that comparison.
Sammy isn't the best but he's all we've got for a #2C man until better is found elsewhere or developed in-house.
and then I realized it was
