HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Western Conference > Pacific Division > Los Angeles Kings
Notices

Flames fan in peace

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
07-18-2012, 01:01 PM
  #1
Flamesarmstrong22
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Toronto
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,410
vCash: 500
Flames fan in peace

With Jonathan Bernier demanding a trade I think it would be excellent for Calgary to acquire him to become in 1 or 2 seasons our starting goalie when kipper retires or is traded. I know there is a rumor offer from the maple leafs of Matt frattin and a 3rd. Whether that rumor is true or not I think Calgary could beat that offer with something like, henrik Karllson, Greg nemisez and a 4th.

You guys get a similar prospect in nemisez to frattin, you guys also receive a goalie who can take Bernier's spot of quicks back up. Plus a 4th.

Thoughts?

Ps. I think the flames would consider making the 4th a 3rd, but no higher, seeing as we have no 2nd round pick in 2013.

Flamesarmstrong22 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
07-18-2012, 02:02 PM
  #2
DeeMeck
Registered User
 
DeeMeck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 3,366
vCash: 50
Bernier has asked to be traded, but Lombardi doesn't have to trade him. I do think Lombardi will trade him as bernier has paid his dues with the Kings and in the league.

I just don't see a package of mid-range prospects and picks getting the deal done, which is what most of the proposals I have seen seem to include.

I think it will be a Varlmaov type deal involving a 1st.

DeeMeck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-18-2012, 02:08 PM
  #3
kovacro
"Jazz Hands" by Alec
 
kovacro's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Hamilton, ON
Country: Croatia
Posts: 2,256
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by DeeMeck View Post
I think it will be a Varlmaov type deal involving a 1st.
I'd love a 1st in return for Bernier but I think they may end up getting something more along the lines of what Nashville got for Lindback, maybe multiple 2nd round picks and a prospect.

I would just wait it out until the season and once a few goalies go down then see what the market will bring. There is no rush to move him.

Btw, I actually think I'd rather have Frattin. I watched him with the Marlies during the AHL playoffs and he was a difference maker and really excelled until he got injured versus OKC in the conference finals.

kovacro is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-18-2012, 02:16 PM
  #4
BringTheReign
Registered User
 
BringTheReign's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Orange County
Country: United States
Posts: 2,257
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by DeeMeck View Post
Bernier has asked to be traded, but Lombardi doesn't have to trade him. I do think Lombardi will trade him as bernier has paid his dues with the Kings and in the league.

I just don't see a package of mid-range prospects and picks getting the deal done, which is what most of the proposals I have seen seem to include.

I think it will be a Varlmaov type deal involving a 1st.
That deal was after Varlamov had a great postseason for the Capitals. What has Bernier done to deserve that return? I just don't see how we are going to get a 1st for Bernier. Yes, he has paid his dues, but he has not done much to prove himself in the NHL, and with the relatively weak returns on goalies the last few season, I just don't see a team giving up a 1st.

However, I don't think Lombardi is going to budge on what he is looking for (whatever that may be), and that's why I see Bernier being our backup for most of the season.

BringTheReign is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-18-2012, 02:24 PM
  #5
BigBrown
They did it again!
 
BigBrown's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Sweden
Country: Sweden
Posts: 4,048
vCash: 500
I wouldn't put too much stock into the Frattin rumor, it was just posted by one of those random Eklund wannabes on twitter.

Still looks to me like Kipper has got plenty of gas left in the tank though, I mean look at Brodeur.

BigBrown is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-18-2012, 02:27 PM
  #6
Perro
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Calgary, AB
Country: Canada
Posts: 5,130
vCash: 500
As a King's fan living in Calgary I would love it if he came here.
I just am not sure the Flames would have the assets required. I look at what the price for Lindback was and figure that is what the Kings sould get with Bernier.

Perro is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-18-2012, 02:29 PM
  #7
Perro
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Calgary, AB
Country: Canada
Posts: 5,130
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by DeeMeck View Post
Bernier has asked to be traded, but Lombardi doesn't have to trade him. I do think Lombardi will trade him as bernier has paid his dues with the Kings and in the league.

I just don't see a package of mid-range prospects and picks getting the deal done, which is what most of the proposals I have seen seem to include.

I think it will be a Varlmaov type deal involving a 1st.
Most people think that Colorado overpaid for Varlmaov, and it was not worth it.

Perro is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-19-2012, 09:04 AM
  #8
kingsfan
#SutterforanOscar
 
kingsfan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Manitoba, Canada
Country: Canada
Posts: 8,940
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flamesarmstrong22 View Post
With Jonathan Bernier demanding a trade I think it would be excellent for Calgary to acquire him to become in 1 or 2 seasons our starting goalie when kipper retires or is traded. I know there is a rumor offer from the maple leafs of Matt frattin and a 3rd. Whether that rumor is true or not I think Calgary could beat that offer with something like, henrik Karllson, Greg nemisez and a 4th.

You guys get a similar prospect in nemisez to frattin, you guys also receive a goalie who can take Bernier's spot of quicks back up. Plus a 4th.

Thoughts?

Ps. I think the flames would consider making the 4th a 3rd, but no higher, seeing as we have no 2nd round pick in 2013.
Karlsson isn't really any good IMO. Frankly, if I had to take a goalie back from Calgary, give me Irving.

And I'd rather have Frattin than Nemisz. I think he has 20 goal potential next year. Nemisz still has to show he can reach 20 in the AHL. He's really not done much of anything to impress me at all and I was high on him in his draft year.

A depth goalie, a so-so prospect and a mid round pick ain't getting you Bernier. Try Irving, Horak and a pair of 2nds or a 2nd and a 3rd. We don't have to have the picks in 2013 either.

kingsfan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-19-2012, 01:03 PM
  #9
Shootmaster_44
Registered User
 
Shootmaster_44's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Lloydminster, AB
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,165
vCash: 500
I would think Bernier would be worth a reliable backup goalie plus some picks. I'm not sure that Calgary has what the Kings need, if Bernier is to be traded.

What I'd like to see is a goalie who is content being a backup but is a solid goalie that could step in, if the Kings needed, and not cause them to plummet down the standings. What they need is someone who was once an NHL starter and was quite good, but it nearing the end of his career but still has something left. Do what the Rangers did behind Lundquist, they Martin Biron who I'd say is a solid goalie and at this point in his career a backup who can step in when needed. I'm not sure who is still out there that fits this description, but what the Kings also need is to trade with a weaker team so that the picks given in return aren't high picks.

I think Bernier deserves to go to a team where he will be a number 1. So I'd be willing to give Mathieu Garon a second turn in LA, along with Tampa's 1st (or a 2nd and a 3rd) for Bernier. Garon was always a solid goalie. Quite honestly, with the team the Kings assembled now, I don't doubt the Kings could have still been Cup contenders with him in net. Garon is not anywhere near Quick territory, but he is a serviceable goalie who would make a great backup for the Kings.

For that matter I'd take Dwayne Roloson from Tampa too. But that would definitely take Tampa's 1st and a prospect too (though I'm not sure who exactly Tampa has that the Kings would want, Manchvegas is pretty well stocked too).

Shootmaster_44 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-19-2012, 01:15 PM
  #10
Jason Lewis
Hockey's Future Staff
 
Jason Lewis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 5,014
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Perro View Post
Most people think that Colorado overpaid for Varlmaov, and it was not worth it.
I think people should wait 2-3 more years before they make that decision.


Varlamov is 24, and he didn't have a bad year at all least year. That Colorado defense is also quite average.

Once the Avs hit that youth movement in a season or two, with Varlamov going into his prime at 26-27 with 2-3 years under his belt as a starter...

a 1st round pick might seem like absolutely nothing.

Jason Lewis is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-19-2012, 01:47 PM
  #11
kingsfan
#SutterforanOscar
 
kingsfan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Manitoba, Canada
Country: Canada
Posts: 8,940
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shootmaster_44 View Post
I would think Bernier would be worth a reliable backup goalie plus some picks. I'm not sure that Calgary has what the Kings need, if Bernier is to be traded.

What I'd like to see is a goalie who is content being a backup but is a solid goalie that could step in, if the Kings needed, and not cause them to plummet down the standings. What they need is someone who was once an NHL starter and was quite good, but it nearing the end of his career but still has something left. Do what the Rangers did behind Lundquist, they Martin Biron who I'd say is a solid goalie and at this point in his career a backup who can step in when needed. I'm not sure who is still out there that fits this description, but what the Kings also need is to trade with a weaker team so that the picks given in return aren't high picks.

I think Bernier deserves to go to a team where he will be a number 1. So I'd be willing to give Mathieu Garon a second turn in LA, along with Tampa's 1st (or a 2nd and a 3rd) for Bernier. Garon was always a solid goalie. Quite honestly, with the team the Kings assembled now, I don't doubt the Kings could have still been Cup contenders with him in net. Garon is not anywhere near Quick territory, but he is a serviceable goalie who would make a great backup for the Kings.

For that matter I'd take Dwayne Roloson from Tampa too. But that would definitely take Tampa's 1st and a prospect too (though I'm not sure who exactly Tampa has that the Kings would want, Manchvegas is pretty well stocked too).
Tampa Bay just got Lindback, they won't trade for Bernier too. Also, Roloson is a UFA, so if you want him, we can just sign him. I personally don't want him.

kingsfan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-19-2012, 01:55 PM
  #12
Shootmaster_44
Registered User
 
Shootmaster_44's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Lloydminster, AB
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,165
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by kingsfan View Post
Tampa Bay just got Lindback, they won't trade for Bernier too. Also, Roloson is a UFA, so if you want him, we can just sign him. I personally don't want him.
After I posted that I noticed that Tampa had Lindback, but I had never heard of him, so I assumed he was something they picked up cheap and would still want Bernier.

At any rate, someone along the Garon lines would be what I'd be shooting for in a trade. But from the Kings end only Bernier and draft picks can go the other way. I don't want to see the Kings trade away a piece of the Cup to receive a veteran backup goalie. If DL intends to do that, he might as well trade Bernier for picks only and dress Jones as the backup.

Shootmaster_44 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-19-2012, 02:18 PM
  #13
KingsFan7824
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 3,826
vCash: 500
Lombardi isn't looking to trade Bernier. Smyth wanting to back to Edmonton for family is one thing, Bernier wanting to go somewhere else for playing time is another. Other teams will have to call about Bernier. However, how many teams around the league need a young(unproven) goalie as the #1 going into next season? Not many, if any at this point. Calgary doesn't even solve Bernier's problem of playing time. Maybe in a year or two, or whenever, when Kiprusoff is done, but not next year.

Bernier may want to play, but there aren't many places for him to play. If he's sitting behind Quick here next year, or sitting behind someone else somewhere else next year, what's the difference? He just plays the wrong position at the wrong time.

KingsFan7824 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
07-19-2012, 03:03 PM
  #14
Perro
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Calgary, AB
Country: Canada
Posts: 5,130
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by KingsFan7824 View Post
Lombardi isn't looking to trade Bernier. Smyth wanting to back to Edmonton for family is one thing, Bernier wanting to go somewhere else for playing time is another. Other teams will have to call about Bernier. However, how many teams around the league need a young(unproven) goalie as the #1 going into next season? Not many, if any at this point. Calgary doesn't even solve Bernier's problem of playing time. Maybe in a year or two, or whenever, when Kiprusoff is done, but not next year.

Bernier may want to play, but there aren't many places for him to play. If he's sitting behind Quick here next year, or sitting behind someone else somewhere else next year, what's the difference? He just plays the wrong position at the wrong time.
I don't think Bernier expects to go somewhere where he will be #1 next year, but wants to go somewhere where he can have that chance in the next couple of years. I am not Bernier or his agent so cannot say 100% but that would be my guess.

Perro is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-19-2012, 10:59 PM
  #15
RonSwanson*
Gadfly
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Food 'N Stuff
Country: United States
Posts: 8,769
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flamesarmstrong22 View Post
With Jonathan Bernier demanding a trade I think it would be excellent for Calgary to acquire him to become in 1 or 2 seasons our starting goalie when kipper retires or is traded. I know there is a rumor offer from the maple leafs of Matt frattin and a 3rd. Whether that rumor is true or not I think Calgary could beat that offer with something like, henrik Karllson, Greg nemisez and a 4th.

You guys get a similar prospect in nemisez to frattin, you guys also receive a goalie who can take Bernier's spot of quicks back up. Plus a 4th.

Thoughts?

Ps. I think the flames would consider making the 4th a 3rd, but no higher, seeing as we have no 2nd round pick in 2013.
How does that make LA a better team? I'd keep Bernier.

RonSwanson* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-20-2012, 12:59 AM
  #16
DryIslandBartender
KCCO
 
DryIslandBartender's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Country: United States
Posts: 3,278
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by KingsFan7824 View Post
Lombardi isn't looking to trade Bernier. Smyth wanting to back to Edmonton for family is one thing, Bernier wanting to go somewhere else for playing time is another. Other teams will have to call about Bernier. However, how many teams around the league need a young(unproven) goalie as the #1 going into next season? Not many, if any at this point. Calgary doesn't even solve Bernier's problem of playing time. Maybe in a year or two, or whenever, when Kiprusoff is done, but not next year.

Bernier may want to play, but there aren't many places for him to play. If he's sitting behind Quick here next year, or sitting behind someone else somewhere else next year, what's the difference? He just plays the wrong position at the wrong time.
Whoa whoa whoa, everyone including Lombardi knows the Smyth thing was a lie. He didn't want to go back for family reasons, that was a BS move on his part.

DryIslandBartender is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-20-2012, 01:01 AM
  #17
savemefromtears
Bravo Viva la France
 
savemefromtears's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: City of Angels
Country: United States
Posts: 1,885
vCash: 500
If Bernier is requesting a trade to be a starting goalie as opposed to backing up one, what makes you think he'd enjoy backing up Kipper? Think about that for a moment.

savemefromtears is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-20-2012, 01:41 AM
  #18
DryIslandBartender
KCCO
 
DryIslandBartender's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Country: United States
Posts: 3,278
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by savemefromtears View Post
If Bernier is requesting a trade to be a starting goalie as opposed to backing up one, what makes you think he'd enjoy backing up Kipper? Think about that for a moment.
I don't think Bernier specifically stated he wants to go to a place and immediately start there.

Bernier's POV is that he doesn't want to be playing a handful of games in an NHL season behind Quick, he thinks that is wasting his talents.

You do have a good point, Kipper is going to start a ton of games and that's not a good situation for Bernie.

DryIslandBartender is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-20-2012, 09:16 AM
  #19
kingsfan
#SutterforanOscar
 
kingsfan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Manitoba, Canada
Country: Canada
Posts: 8,940
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shootmaster_44 View Post
After I posted that I noticed that Tampa had Lindback, but I had never heard of him, so I assumed he was something they picked up cheap and would still want Bernier.

At any rate, someone along the Garon lines would be what I'd be shooting for in a trade. But from the Kings end only Bernier and draft picks can go the other way. I don't want to see the Kings trade away a piece of the Cup to receive a veteran backup goalie. If DL intends to do that, he might as well trade Bernier for picks only and dress Jones as the backup.
Garon likely could be had for a 3rd, maybe less. It wouldn't cost us Bernier, or Bernier-plus to get him.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BerniernextRoy View Post
Whoa whoa whoa, everyone including Lombardi knows the Smyth thing was a lie. He didn't want to go back for family reasons, that was a BS move on his part.
While I think it was too, I have never seen anything actually said to prove Smyth was lying just to pull a fast one and head back to Edmonton. How do you know it's a lie?

kingsfan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-20-2012, 11:33 AM
  #20
Reaper45
Registered User
 
Reaper45's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: South Bay
Country: United States
Posts: 30,736
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to Reaper45
Quote:
Originally Posted by kingsfan View Post
Garon likely could be had for a 3rd, maybe less. It wouldn't cost us Bernier, or Bernier-plus to get him.



While I think it was too, I have never seen anything actually said to prove Smyth was lying just to pull a fast one and head back to Edmonton. How do you know it's a lie?
It was obviously a lie. If he was so adamant about having his kids back in Edmonton for school, he should've thought about that before he went and signed with Colorado. Just a convenient excuse.

Reaper45 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-20-2012, 01:14 PM
  #21
Rorschach
33 #nottobedenied
 
Rorschach's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Los Angeles
Country: United States
Posts: 6,101
vCash: 500
Back on topic...I don't see us trading with Calgary unless it's the deadline, Calgary has no hope and thus they trade Kipper.

Maybe they trade Kipper to LA in the same deal? We talk a lot about getting Iggy the Cup but what about Kipper? I'd sleep soundly knowing he was LA's second goalie...he could play 30 games a year and another 8 or so games in the playoffs. Heck, trade both Iggy and Kipper to us and we'll rebuild half your farm right there, Calgary.

(I know, wishful thinking. )

Rorschach is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-20-2012, 01:34 PM
  #22
Perro
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Calgary, AB
Country: Canada
Posts: 5,130
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rorschach View Post
Back on topic...I don't see us trading with Calgary unless it's the deadline, Calgary has no hope and thus they trade Kipper.

Maybe they trade Kipper to LA in the same deal? We talk a lot about getting Iggy the Cup but what about Kipper? I'd sleep soundly knowing he was LA's second goalie...he could play 30 games a year and another 8 or so games in the playoffs. Heck, trade both Iggy and Kipper to us and we'll rebuild half your farm right there, Calgary.

(I know, wishful thinking. )
Kipper is an amazing goalie but both him and Quick both deserve to be starters in this league, and that would be too much $$ tied to our tenders if you ask me.
We would have to add a fair bit to gte Iggy, even if he is an upcoming UFA. Look at what Gausted got Buffalo and add alot to that.

Perro is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-20-2012, 03:12 PM
  #23
kingsfan
#SutterforanOscar
 
kingsfan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Manitoba, Canada
Country: Canada
Posts: 8,940
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Reaper45 View Post
It was obviously a lie. If he was so adamant about having his kids back in Edmonton for school, he should've thought about that before he went and signed with Colorado. Just a convenient excuse.
So because he signed in Colorado 4 years ago, that means it was a lie?

That's just guess work on your part. A lot can change in four years from what you expected them to be. Maybe the issue of schooling wasn't as big of a concern for the family then as it is now.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rorschach View Post
Back on topic...I don't see us trading with Calgary unless it's the deadline, Calgary has no hope and thus they trade Kipper.

Maybe they trade Kipper to LA in the same deal? We talk a lot about getting Iggy the Cup but what about Kipper? I'd sleep soundly knowing he was LA's second goalie...he could play 30 games a year and another 8 or so games in the playoffs. Heck, trade both Iggy and Kipper to us and we'll rebuild half your farm right there, Calgary.

(I know, wishful thinking. )
He has a cap hit of $5,833,333 for this year and next (actually slightly higher than Quick's cap hit when his new deal starts). Why would we want to tie almost $6 million up in a backup goaltender? And that's not to mention the assets we'd have to give up to get him, which (if we were to go with strictly draft picks) would likely cost 2 1st rounders plus.

kingsfan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-20-2012, 08:26 PM
  #24
cneil99
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 156
vCash: 500
To be honest thats a terrible offer. I'm also a kings fan in Calgary. Karlsson is terrible for as big as he is and nemisz has shown nothing. Calgary may think they have the assets but they have nothing to offer. No point in trading Bernier unless needed, and there's no need.

cneil99 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-20-2012, 11:43 PM
  #25
DryIslandBartender
KCCO
 
DryIslandBartender's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Country: United States
Posts: 3,278
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by kingsfan;



While I think it was too, I have never seen anything actually said to prove Smyth was lying just to pull a fast one and head back to Edmonton. How do you know it's a lie?
Kings had a deal in place with Calgary for Smyth. I think it was a third rounder and Smyth nixed that.

It had nothing to with his kids education. Secondly, there's some really good private school in the area he lived that he can afford. I'm sure some king players with kids have sent them off to good schools.

DryIslandBartender is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 08:40 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.