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Eastern Conference Outlook for 2012-2013.

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Old
07-25-2012, 04:47 AM
  #101
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Essentially move Montreal up a couple spots from where most of you have them, for obvious reasons.

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07-25-2012, 09:05 AM
  #102
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Originally Posted by Duke Silver View Post
1. New York Rangers
2. Washington Capitals
3. Boston Bruins
4. Pittsburgh Penguins
5. Philadelphia Flyers
6. Ottawa Senators
7. Toronto Maple Leafs
8. Tampa Bay Lightning

9. Carolina Hurricanes
10. Florida Panthers
11. New Jersey Devils
12. Buffalo Sabres
13. Montreal Canadiens
14. Winnipeg Jets
15. New York Islanders
That seems highly optomistic IMO. As far as I'm concerned we've lost ground in the race in the East, not gained it.

We've done nothing to improve while the Islanders, Jets, Canadiens, Hurricanes, Lightning, Washington and of course the big boys (Philly, Pittsburgh, Boston, and the Rangers) all improved.

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07-25-2012, 10:56 AM
  #103
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Originally Posted by Sypher04 View Post
That seems highly optomistic IMO. As far as I'm concerned we've lost ground in the race in the East, not gained it.

We've done nothing to improve while the Islanders, Jets, Canadiens, Hurricanes, Lightning, Washington and of course the big boys (Philly, Pittsburgh, Boston, and the Rangers) all improved.
How did Boston improve? Winnipeg? Islanders? Tampa?

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07-25-2012, 11:27 AM
  #104
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outlook looks grim

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07-25-2012, 11:48 AM
  #105
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Originally Posted by CrazeeEddie View Post
How did Boston improve? Winnipeg? Islanders? Tampa?
Tampa got a decent goalie and a good new D-man. Winnipeg got Jokinen. Islanders got Visnovsky. Not sure about Boston but they're ahead of us anyway.

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07-25-2012, 11:53 AM
  #106
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So the Leafs play 60ish games of a season as a playoff team and as high as 5/6 seed around game 55-60.

Then they go on an unprecedented collapse which has rarely ever been seen before and finish 5th worst in the league and we are acting like 5th worst is a true representation?



Then we trade arguably our worst Dman last year for a forward with size and skill who will put up at least 55-60 points if he is healthy...

We have a core of players getting older and gaining experience and only 2 had career type years last year and both are likely to match if not improve.

We never ever had a solid #1 goalie after game 6 but we still managed to be in the playoffs for 60 games.

Our 25YO 25-30 goal scorer had 7 goals last year.

Our UFA signing (Connolly) had the worst statistical year of his career.

Grabo was average

We had 1/2 season of Liles due to concussion ( he was poor after that)

We played Lombardi who missed all of the last season and off-season.

We added a well known bottom 6 veteran C from Toronto.

Frattin was very insignificant but looks poised to be significant next year.

We have a highly skilled KAdri chomping at the bit to get his chance and stick.

We have a 22YO Gardiner who skates like the wind and WILL improve on last season.



Basically, we managed to be a playoff team for 60 games with a young team, No solid goaltending, and a group of players who underachieved.

Then we trade our worst D last year for a 55-60 point Forward at worst who brings size to our top 6.

With a young developing team why in the heck would any of these facts suggest the LEafs absolutely will not make the playoffs next year??
A lot of NOTHING...... So every year fans want to take a slice out of the season and say see..we were a playoff team for X amount of games. You can talk all you want but if you were a betting man....I highly doubt you would be as loose with your money as you are with your fanatical views. Your excuses sound ridiculous...like the Leafs are the only team to face any adversity or poor goaltending or underachieving players or......stop living in a bubble and realize that the Leafs are one of 30 teams and that life in the NHL exists outside of our franchise. All teams go through everything you just mentioned at some point over 82 games. All teams have players with Kulemin type years. Underachieving. But also, is Kulie a 30 goal scorer because he did it once?

He has played 4 full seasons (70+ games) and scored 15,16, 30 and 7

Just curious, exactly how much money would you put on the Leafs to finish in the top 8 with this current roster? I think if I got 10-1 odds, I wouldn't wager more than 50 bucks.

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Old
07-25-2012, 01:11 PM
  #107
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Originally Posted by CrazeeEddie View Post
How did Boston improve? Winnipeg? Islanders? Tampa?
Boston lost Thomas and really did nothing to improve.

Horton and McQuaid are cleared for contact and if they can stay healthy that is a boost to the team, as when Horton went down the team followed and played mediocre at best.

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07-25-2012, 01:14 PM
  #108
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Originally Posted by tpc77 View Post
With a young developing team why in the heck would any of these facts suggest the Leafs absolutely will not make the playoffs next year??
The fact is; a young developing team does not equate to a playoff team when most of these teams tend to have veteran leadership to become annual playoff contenders.

Potential issues for the Leafs this upcoming season:

Joffery Lupul regresses under Carlyle while the coach juggles the lines like he did in Anaheim.

Other teams will focus more on Kessel who still doesn’t have a decent center to play alongside.

Jake Gardiner will most likely have a sophomore slump as most second year players tend to have.

James van Riemsdyk injury history shows he could become injured throughout the season, especially under the system Carlyle will have in place.

Nazem Kadri will still be with the Marlies and will need to get his repaired shoulder back into game shape.

James Reimer will have to become a significant contributor to the team, which is unlikely for a full season. There is no veteran backup goaltender at this time to help the Leafs if Reimer falters.

No additional veteran defenseman that can help log heavy minutes to help the Leafs goals against. Franson, Gardiner, Gunnarsson, Komisarek, Liles, and Phaneuf all remain on defense for next season. This same defense core was 29th overall in goals against last year. Burke hasn’t addressed defense upgrades, and this can become a problem.

There are some good scenarios with Jay McClement bolstering the third line, and the team can have some new positive dynamic changes happen. Nikolai Kuelmin should be poised to have a bounce back year. In most likelihood the team will be a bottom dweller and the team shows many possible aspects where they may not end up becoming playoff bound.

Here is how the standings could shape out.

1. Pittsburgh Penguins
2. Boston Bruins
3. Washington Capitals (SE division leader in 3rd spot)
4. Philadelphia Flyers
5. Tampa Bay Lightning
6. Montreal Canadiens
7. New York Rangers
8. Buffalo Sabres

9. Carolina Hurricanes
10. New Jersey Devils
11. Florida Panthers
12. Ottawa Senators
13. Winnipeg Jets
14. Toronto Maple Leafs
15. New York Islanders

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Old
07-25-2012, 01:26 PM
  #109
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nimrods74 View Post
Improved special teams, steady goaltending, no collapse. More from Kulemin, TimmyC. Decent contributions from Lombardi and Kadri/Frattin. JVR proves valuable. Improve goals against. All within the realm of possibility. These things happen, I believe we make it, 6th-8th place.
Its this

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07-25-2012, 02:01 PM
  #110
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Originally Posted by LeafsandSharksfan View Post
Tampa got a decent goalie and a good new D-man. Winnipeg got Jokinen. Islanders got Visnovsky. Not sure about Boston but they're ahead of us anyway.
-Lindeback has good numbers as a backup in a defensive system in Nashville, but he has proven nothing. I wouldn't consider their goaltending situation as a sure thing by any means. And Salo is now 37 years old and on the decline. Their D is still weak. Tampa is getting way too much love this offseason.

-Jokinen sucks, its the equivalent of the Leafs signing Connolly last year. They played better than they actually were last year due to the motivation of returning to Winnipeg, and the horrible travel for visiting teams in the East. These two factors accounted for a ridiculous home/road record split. They were the 13th best team in the East on the road, but 7th at home. Take into account the novelty of playing in Winnipeg wearing off, and the fact that relocation will happen with the new CBA and they are not that good.

-Islanders got Visnovsky, okay... the guy is now 35 years old and put up just 27 points last year. In fact, his 68 point season from 2 years ago is an anomaly, not the norm. Anaheim wouldn't give him up for a 2nd rounder if he was still as amazing as you think. He also hated the trade and filed a grievance to try and void it... you think he will play great when he's clearly unhappy? Islanders are a mess, continue to rush/ruin prospects and make stupid moves, this team will be near the bottom again.

-Boston is ahead of us, but they lost Tim Thomas. Don't underestimate that loss, he was the main reason they won the cup. Rask has been outstanding as a BACKUP, but so was Toskala. I'm not saying he will be as bad as Toskala, but you have to see how he handles the pressure of being a starter before crowning Boston as unbeatable, especially when he has had emotional issues in the past.

What's going on in this thread is the opposite of homerism. Its classic "grass is greener" syndrome. You guys are vastly overrating many teams in the East, and not giving enough credit to many good things on this team. Don't forget how epic that collapse was, and how well we were playing up until then. Every year, an average of 7/8 teams sitting in the playoffs around America Thanksgiving make the playoffs. This year we were THAT team. Just very unlucky, basic math tells us its unlikely to happen twice in a row. We have a good shot at the playoffs whether you guys want to believe it or not.

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Old
07-25-2012, 02:04 PM
  #111
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Originally Posted by 1927 View Post
The fact is; a young developing team does not equate to a playoff team when most of these teams tend to have veteran leadership to become annual playoff contenders.

Potential issues for the Leafs this upcoming season:

Joffery Lupul regresses under Carlyle while the coach juggles the lines like he did in Anaheim.

Other teams will focus more on Kessel who still doesn’t have a decent center to play alongside.

Jake Gardiner will most likely have a sophomore slump as most second year players tend to have.

James van Riemsdyk injury history shows he could become injured throughout the season, especially under the system Carlyle will have in place.

Nazem Kadri will still be with the Marlies and will need to get his repaired shoulder back into game shape.

James Reimer will have to become a significant contributor to the team, which is unlikely for a full season. There is no veteran backup goaltender at this time to help the Leafs if Reimer falters.

No additional veteran defenseman that can help log heavy minutes to help the Leafs goals against. Franson, Gardiner, Gunnarsson, Komisarek, Liles, and Phaneuf all remain on defense for next season. This same defense core was 29th overall in goals against last year. Burke hasn’t addressed defense upgrades, and this can become a problem.

There are some good scenarios with Jay McClement bolstering the third line, and the team can have some new positive dynamic changes happen. Nikolai Kuelmin should be poised to have a bounce back year. In most likelihood the team will be a bottom dweller and the team shows many possible aspects where they may not end up becoming playoff bound.

Here is how the standings could shape out.

1. Pittsburgh Penguins
2. Boston Bruins
3. Washington Capitals (SE division leader in 3rd spot)
4. Philadelphia Flyers
5. Tampa Bay Lightning
6. Montreal Canadiens
7. New York Rangers
8. Buffalo Sabres

9. Carolina Hurricanes
10. New Jersey Devils
11. Florida Panthers
12. Ottawa Senators
13. Winnipeg Jets
14. Toronto Maple Leafs
15. New York Islanders
Sure he has: Randy Carlyle. Give him a full training camp with this team and see. Don't underestimate how much of an impact coaching and system can have on a team's goals against.

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Old
07-25-2012, 02:54 PM
  #112
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When I look at the teams in the East, the only team I see without question marks are the Rangers. It's wide open. Some teams have goaltending concerns, others scoring, while others have depth or defensive issues. The Leafs have a good chance, along with about six other teams, to take one of the last three playoff spots.

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07-25-2012, 03:42 PM
  #113
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When I look at the teams in the East, the only team I see without question marks are the Rangers. It's wide open. Some teams have goaltending concerns, others scoring, while others have depth or defensive issues. The Leafs have a good chance, along with about six other teams, to take one of the last three playoff spots.
While the leafs have problems everywhere...

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Old
07-25-2012, 03:54 PM
  #114
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Potential issues for the Leafs this upcoming season:

Joffery Lupul regresses under Carlyle while the coach juggles the lines like he did in Anaheim.
I can't see that happening for this reason. When Lupul was still with Anaheim and returned to play in December 2010 other players on the Ducks roster were ahead of him and etc. The difference is he has proven he can play with Kessel and belongs on a line with him.

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07-25-2012, 04:03 PM
  #115
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This thread should be renamed: "Who among you has the spine to declare the Leafs a playoff team?"

Let's be honest here.

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07-25-2012, 04:09 PM
  #116
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This thread should be renamed: "Who among you has the spine to declare the Leafs a playoff team?"

Let's be honest here.
I bought more RIM today. What do you think?

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07-25-2012, 04:50 PM
  #117
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How did Boston improve? Winnipeg? Islanders? Tampa?
Winnipeg added a former top center in Olli Jokinen who had 23-38-61 points last season, which is going to increase the scoring potential of a Evander Kane in the process, by having a playmaking center feeding him the puck.

That is almost the same as Joffrey Lupul scored for us last season 25-42-67 points.

They also added Alexei Ponikarovsky and now he can be teamed with his old pal Nik Antropov again as they have great chemistry together.. Jets can even put Kyle Wellwood in the middle and reunite the 3 former Leafs to form a new trio.

Jets finished ahead of the Leafs last year no reason they couldn't do it again now with reinforcements.

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07-25-2012, 05:04 PM
  #118
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Winnipeg added a former top center in Olli Jokinen who had 23-38-61 points last season, which is going to increase the scoring potential of a Evander Kane in the process, by having a playmaking center feeding him the puck.

That is almost the same as Joffrey Lupul scored for us last season 25-42-67 points.

They also added Alexei Ponikarovsky and now he can be teamed with his old pal Nik Antropov again as they have great chemistry together.. Jets can even put Kyle Wellwood in the middle and reunite the 3 former Leafs to form a new trio.

Jets finished ahead of the Leafs last year no reason they couldn't do it again now with reinforcements.
Ignoring the fact that you are completely manipulated stats in this answer, I do agree that winnipeg is underrated. They have a better top 4 D than we do and a better goalie than we do. They also have some good wingers in kane, ladd and wheeler and have added jokenin at a position which has been their achilles heel imo. They also have a few players who are poised for a breakout. Dont count them out.

Montreal is another underrated team who could make the dance.

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07-25-2012, 05:07 PM
  #119
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While the leafs have problems everywhere...
Not with scoring.

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07-25-2012, 05:28 PM
  #120
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That seems highly optomistic IMO. As far as I'm concerned we've lost ground in the race in the East, not gained it.

We've done nothing to improve while the Islanders, Jets, Canadiens, Hurricanes, Lightning, Washington and of course the big boys (Philly, Pittsburgh, Boston, and the Rangers) all improved.
What have the Isles, Jets, Habs, or Lightning done to improve significantly?? Isles downgraded Parenteau to Boyes and added Visnovsky(they think). Jets added Poni and Jokinen and only one of those is a decent player. Habs added bottom 6 guys. Lightning added an unproven goalie. Caps just replaced Semin with Ribeiro. All the Bruins did was lose Thomas. Pittsburgh lost Staal and Michalek and only added Sutter to the roster. Meanwhile the Leafs added a top 6 forward with potential and a PK specialist. I'm not saying the Leafs will be better than any of them but to say they didn't improve while everyone else did isn't correct.

Anyway, my prediction(if nothing changes, and I expect at least 1 more significant change):

1. New York R. (didn't lose anything significant, only added Nash)
2. Buffalo (Miller returns to Vezina form)
3. Washington (run and gun system returns)
4. Philadelphia (Young team keeps getting better)
5. Pittsburgh (Losing Staal hurts more than they know, especially if Sid goes down again)
6. Carolina (Add Staal. Ward plays well)
7. Boston (No Thomas. Lose a bit of mojo)
8. Montreal (full season of Markov. Subban gets better. Price)
----------------------------
9. Tampa (Lindback helps. Still inconsistency in net)
10. Toronto (No late season collapse, still fall short)
11. Winnipeg (Jokinen gives them a boost. Kane breaks out)
12. Ottawa (Inconsistent goaltending. Alfie declining. Karlson slight step back)
13. Florida (I just can't see them making the playoffs 2 years in a row lol)
14. New Jersey (Brodeur declining, Hedberg declining. No Parise)
15. New York I. (same ol' song and dance)

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07-25-2012, 06:21 PM
  #121
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That seems highly optomistic IMO. As far as I'm concerned we've lost ground in the race in the East, not gained it.

We've done nothing to improve while the Islanders, Jets, Canadiens, Hurricanes, Lightning, Washington and of course the big boys (Philly, Pittsburgh, Boston, and the Rangers) all improved.
Boston has done nothing. And Thomas is not returning.

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07-25-2012, 06:58 PM
  #122
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A...****ing....Men!

Its true, just about everybody, thinks the collapse team is the real team.
LOL why shouldn't we believe it? That "collapse team" was there for a good 30+ games. That almost half the season of collapsing. IMO if we can say teams like Ottawa and Florida overachieved then its not to far fetched to have the possibility that Toronto overachieved as well?either way I want the leafs to pick their path early and stay on it. Play well and make the playoffs or tank and draft us a franchise player for once. None of the in-between **** were so use to.

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07-25-2012, 07:12 PM
  #123
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This group did not play Carlyles system well. Wilson sucked but at least the team was built for run and gun. Expecting the same guys minus Schenn to play tough D is being optimistic. We have a pretty good shot at 30th this year.

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07-25-2012, 08:11 PM
  #124
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This group did not play Carlyles system well. Wilson sucked but at least the team was built for run and gun. Expecting the same guys minus Schenn to play tough D is being optimistic. We have a pretty good shot at 30th this year.
I wouldn't mind seeing it, but no chance whatsoever.

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07-25-2012, 08:14 PM
  #125
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In the East, I think 15 teams have a shot at the playoffs. If the Leafs get solid goaltending, they're in imo.

I think Tampa will bounce-back nicely. The Islanders always have that question of if their young talent will take the next step. Didn't happen (Again) last year.

Montreal will be better. So will Washington. Florida imo will be worse. New Jersey will be worse. Carolina will be better.

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