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2012 Free Agency Thread - Part XXI: Weepy Tears & Angst (A. Kostitsyn Edition)

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Old
07-26-2012, 07:42 PM
  #151
Ogrezilla
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eyes of Orpik View Post
I don't think Paul Martin will be on the top pair with Letang. I think Despres will earn that spot, not just because Bylsma likes the idea, but because I think he is capable of earning top spot next year.

Then moving Orpik to the 2nd pair would improve our D, IMO.

Despres-Letang
Orpik-Niskanen
Martin-Engelland

Despres-Letang
Orpik-Martin
Niskanen-Engelland
Lot's of ?s there after last year, but all of those guys are capable of being good to very good.

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07-26-2012, 07:43 PM
  #152
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Originally Posted by Ogrezilla View Post
that bolded bit is very much wrong. We are a top 3 or 4 team in the east as things stand right now. I'd put us at 2 behind the Rangers but you could argue Boston and Philly. Anything worse than 5th would be badly underachieving.
And as I stated before, if we don't win our division, we are at best a 4 seed come playoffs. But, just within our division, I'd put the Rags easily ahead of us (they got scoring, tons of grit, muscle, and great goaltending), Philly ahead of us (smoked us in the playoffs), and NJ ahead of us (sure they lost Parise, but they are big, solid defensively, have always beaten us, and comparing even an ancient Brodeur to Fleury is like comparing George Washington to Jimmy Carter).

I wish I was as optimistic as some of the cheerleaders on here, but I'm just not seeing it.

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07-26-2012, 07:43 PM
  #153
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Originally Posted by Ogrezilla View Post
that bolded bit is very much wrong. We are a top 3 or 4 team in the east as things stand right now. I'd put us at 2 behind the Rangers but you could argue Boston and Philly. Anything worse than 5th would be badly underachieving.
I'm not so sure we aren't already the best team in the East. Yes we lost Staal, but Sutter isn't much worse, and we nearly won the division this year despite Sid missing the majority of the year.

Sid playing a full year more than makes up for the downgrade from Staal to Sutter.

The Rangers did seemingly get better with Nash, but imo they overperformed this year. We had a much better goal differential than they did. I think we're as good as they are and it will be a tossup between them and us for the division and Eastern Conference, just like this year. The only other team that threatens us and them for the conference is Boston who is still ridiculously good and plays in a weak division.

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07-26-2012, 07:44 PM
  #154
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Originally Posted by redsono93 View Post
So who's left as far as UFA forwards? AK, Doan, Kristian Huselius, RJ Umberger thats all I have on my list. BTW it says J.P. Dumont is a UFA what ever happened to him? I wouldnt mind giving AK and Huselius a chance on a cheap contract kind of like Sullivan and or Sykora deals of the past.
Umby is signed for another 4-5 years.

Oddly, Tangradi still hasn't re-signed ...

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07-26-2012, 07:45 PM
  #155
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Originally Posted by Terrapin View Post
And as I stated before, if we don't win our division, we are at best a 4 seed come playoffs. But, just within our division, I'd put the Rags easily ahead of us (they got scoring, tons of grit, muscle, and great goaltending), Philly ahead of us (smoked us in the playoffs), and NJ ahead of us (sure they lost Parise, but they are big, solid defensively, have always beaten us, and comparing even an ancient Brodeur to Fleury is like comparing George Washington to Jimmy Carter).

I wish I was as optimistic as some of the cheerleaders on here, but I'm just not seeing it.
I'm talking about regular season standings. How are two teams we were better than last year who also got worse (i'd argue both have lost more than we did as far as regular season goes) somehow better than us now?

On paper we are the 2nd best team in our division right now. I think we'll finish in our classic 4th seed spot.

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Originally Posted by Pancakes View Post
I'm not so sure we aren't already the best team in the East. Yes we lost Staal, but Sutter isn't much worse, and we nearly won the division this year despite Sid missing the majority of the year.

Sid playing a full year more than makes up for the downgrade from Staal to Sutter.

The Rangers did seemingly get better with Nash, but imo they overperformed this year. We had a much better goal differential than they did. I think we're as good as they are and it will be a tossup between them and us for the division and Eastern Conference, just like this year. The only other team that threatens us and them for the conference is Boston who is still ridiculously good and plays in a weak division.
I actually agree, but on paper there's really nothing to support us being better than the Rangers after last season and the moves made so far

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Old
07-26-2012, 07:47 PM
  #156
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What I SHOULD be saying...

Guys, we'll be fine. We battled through countless injuries over the past few years, had players like Mark Letestu, Alex Kovalev, Dustin Jeffrey and Justin Williams on our top units, and still fought through and made the playoffs with ease. If our centers can stay healthy and our defense doesn't completely fall apart, we'll at the very least make the playoffs and have nothing to worry about until we get to the trade deadline.

What I WANT to say...

**** Shero. Get Crosby a damn winger you imbecile

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Old
07-26-2012, 07:48 PM
  #157
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Originally Posted by Terrapin View Post
We're a Stanley Cup favorite supposedly right? We must get through the Rags, Flyers, and NJ, who are all bigger, more physical than us right? And you're seriously comfortable with Paul frickin Martin on the top D pairing? You're also cool with Eric Tangradi, the man that has 1 goal in 40'some games in the top 6? We aren't going to intimidate or grind any teams down (like Boston can), and outside of about 3 guys, we don't have much scoring either.

I said many pages ago this team (currently constructed) will be fighting hard for a 7 or 8 seed, and that's assuming Sid and Geno stay completely healthy.

If we 'underachieve' again this year, it will be the end of Bylsma, and likely the end of Shero. He'll be free to build his minor league defensive dynasty elsewhere.
I really hope Tangradi gets a shot with Sid/Geno and runs with it. We need size on the wing. Guys who can battle for pucks in the corners and buy some time for plays to be set up. Tangradi is an upgrade over Sully in that regard. I don't care if Joe Vitale outscores him, he serves a role.

If we're battling for a playoff spot with a healthy Sid/Geno and D-corps, I'll eat ****. Literally, I'll eat ****.

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07-26-2012, 07:49 PM
  #158
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Originally Posted by mpp9 View Post
I really hope Tangradi gets a shot with Sid/Geno and runs with it. We need size on the wing. Guys who can battle for pucks in the corners and buy some time for plays to be set up. Tangradi is an upgrade over Sully in that regard. I don't care if Joe Vitale outscores him, he serves a role.
I agree

Quote:
Originally Posted by mpp9 View Post
If we're battling for a playoff spot with a healthy Sid/Geno and D-corps, I'll eat ****. Literally, I'll eat ****.
I do not agree

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Old
07-26-2012, 07:50 PM
  #159
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Originally Posted by DegenX View Post
Oddly, Tangradi still hasn't re-signed ...
I'd imagine Shero is seeing how things play out. But unless we're bringing in some size on the wing via trade, we better resign the kid. Give him another year to see if he can progress.

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07-26-2012, 07:51 PM
  #160
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Originally Posted by Aiastelmon View Post
We will snag Iginla at the deadline for very little, he will play on Sid's wing and score a butt pile of goals in the playoffs and beat a few guys down who mess with 87, then re-sign with us. Mark it down.
LOL. You're dreaming. He'll cost a lot to get. His value (as a player) likely is what Hossa/Kovy fetched. However his value to the Flames is higher than that. I would expect to see at least two of: BB, 1st, Despres, Morrow, Harrington, Dumoulin, Maatta, Pouliot. All for a rental - as there's no guarantee that Iggy would resign here.

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07-26-2012, 07:53 PM
  #161
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I don't think the Flames will be bad enough to want to trade Iginla at the deadline. They'll be fighting for a playoff spot if not in a very low one by then. Iginla isn't going anywhere unless they're a lottery team, which I find unlikely.

Even then, he might not go anywhere. The Flames ownership is evidently ardently against a re-build.

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07-26-2012, 08:21 PM
  #162
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Depending on what they would want, I'm still not against Hemsky as a trade target. I'm mostly convinced his surgeries worked, and they have a logjam of potential top-6 talent.

Let's just pretend we're playing NHL 12 here.

(Assume the trades somehow involve TK, Martin, picks, and prospects, I'm sure value could be found, I also rounded up FAs by 1m, just to be on the safe side, but I'm not sure either would actually make that money on the current market)
Trade for Hemsky
Trade for Scuderi
Sign Kostitsyn
Sign Colaiacovo

FORWARDS
Andrei Kostitsyn ($4.000m) / Sidney Crosby ($8.700m) / Ales Hemsky ($5.000m)
Chris Kunitz ($3.725m) / Evgeni Malkin ($8.700m) / James Neal ($5.000m)
Matt Cooke ($1.800m) / Brandon Sutter ($2.067m) / Pascal Dupuis ($1.500m)
Tanner Glass ($1.100m) / Joe Vitale ($0.550m) / Craig Adams ($0.675m)
DEFENSEMEN
Kris Letang ($3.500m) / Rob Scuderi ($3.400m)
Brooks Orpik ($3.750m) / Carlo Colaiacovo ($3.000m)
Matt Niskanen ($2.300m) / Deryk Engelland ($0.567m)
GOALTENDERS
Marc-Andre Fleury ($5.000m)
Tomas Vokoun ($2.000m)
------
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled without the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $70,200,000; CAP PAYROLL: $66,333,333; BONUSES: $0
CAP SPACE (20-man roster): $3,866,667

Leaves some space for upgrades(here's looking at you, Adams)/rookies who are totally going to win scoring awards. Gives a legitimate top-6, a solid D-core, and increases depth scoring.

/NHL 12.

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Old
07-26-2012, 08:21 PM
  #163
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NHLToday ‏@TheInsiderNhl
REPORT: Hearing that #Pens are out of the running for Doan

What a freaking train wreck of an off season...
You must not remember all those snarky posts of calenders from last thread. It doesn't matter if there's no FAs left, it's still July!!!!!

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07-26-2012, 08:24 PM
  #164
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Originally Posted by Ragamuffin Gunner View Post
You must not remember all those snarky posts of calenders from last thread. It doesn't matter if there's no FAs left, it's still July!!!!!
I'm sure we could clone Tangradi, he can play ALL the roles.

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07-26-2012, 08:24 PM
  #165
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Originally Posted by Ragamuffin Gunner View Post
You must not remember all those snarky posts of calenders from last thread. It doesn't matter if there's no FAs left, it's still July!!!!!
I'm not saying it doesn't matter. I'm saying don't freaking jump off any bridges. People are talking like we're going to struggle just to make the playoffs. We have a very good hockey team right now. Better than most.

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Old
07-26-2012, 08:30 PM
  #166
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Originally Posted by Ogrezilla View Post
I'm talking about regular season standings. How are two teams we were better than last year who also got worse (i'd argue both have lost more than we did as far as regular season goes) somehow better than us now?

On paper we are the 2nd best team in our division right now. I think we'll finish in our classic 4th seed spot.
Which is a pretty terrible position considering who we'll be playing in the first round. Unless we win the division we'll play Philly or the Rags in the first round, which is going to be extremely tough if we're rolling the line-up that's been posted in this thread.

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07-26-2012, 08:32 PM
  #167
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Originally Posted by Ragamuffin Gunner View Post
Which is a pretty terrible position considering who we'll be playing in the first round. Unless we win the division we'll play Philly or the Rags in the first round, which is going to be extremely tough if we're rolling the line-up that's been posted in this thread.
and I think we could beat either. I also think we'll have a different line-up by then.

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07-26-2012, 08:32 PM
  #168
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Remember when after the season ended for us, we were hoping for a big splash/change up in the off-season?

And what we end up with is a better back up goalie (who while I think will be better than BJ, will probably disappoint imo), dumping Michalek for nothing, swapping Staal for Sutter, and Tanner Glass?

Oh good times. Queue the Shero apologists (though I still like him as a G.M., his moves apart from some nice trades have left some to be desired, to say the least).

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07-26-2012, 08:34 PM
  #169
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Originally Posted by Ogrezilla View Post
I'm not saying it doesn't matter. I'm saying don't freaking jump off any bridges. People are talking like we're going to struggle just to make the playoffs. We have a very good hockey team right now. Better than most.
We'll make the POs, it's the actual winning in the POs that actually matters.

But keep telling yourself , "it's only July" if that makes you feel good inside.

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07-26-2012, 08:35 PM
  #170
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Still need a new username...

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Old
07-26-2012, 08:37 PM
  #171
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Originally Posted by PensFanSince1989 View Post
Remember when after the season ended for us, we were hoping for a big splash/change up in the off-season?

And what we end up with is a better back up goalie (who while I think will be better than BJ, will probably disappoint imo), dumping Michalek for nothing, swapping Staal for Sutter and Tanner Glass?

Oh good times. Queue the Shero apologists (though I still like him as a G.M., his moves apart from some nice trades have left some to be desired, to say the least).
I have no concerns about Vokoun, he has a better career GAA and Save% than Flower, last year he even had a better save%, he'll be miles ahead of BBJ.

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07-26-2012, 08:41 PM
  #172
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So who is left as a possible UFA option? Leaving out ancient and/or broken guys like Rolston, Blake or Sturm).

LW Andrew Brunette (38, last salary 2.0 million)
Industrious and extremely durable garbage goal specialist who has missed only 6 games since the lockout. Used to be a lock for 20-25 goals despite being a notoriously slow skater. Fell to only 12 tallies last season playing reduced minutes with Chicago. Also not a forechecker at all.

RW Mike Knuble (40, 2.0 million)
See Brunette, only bigger and better along the boards. And shooting right instead of left.

LW Kristian Huselius (33, 4.75 million)
The best pure skill guy left. Playmaking winger with nice moves and vision. A 20-40-60 player when healthy, with a reputation for being tissue-soft. Extreme injury troubles (ankle, lower-body, pectoral, groin) limited him to just 2 games last season, and 39 the year before.

LW/RW Andrei Kostitsyn (27, 3.25 million)
Three-time 20 goal scorer in Montreal, wore out his welcome with the Habs but had a good finish with Nashville. Good hands, sometimes surprisingly physical, but also considered lazy and a questionable team player.

LW/RW Petr Sykora (35, 0.65 million)
Comeback season with 21 goals for New Jersey after some injury-riddled years. We all know what he can and can't provide. A non-factor in the Devils playoff run. Likely to stay with buddy Elias in Jersey rather than butt heads with Bylsma again.

RW Gilbert Brule (25, 1.8 million)
Rushed to the NHL, and almost ruined, by Columbus. Was on his way to a 20 goal season with Edmonton two year ago before getting into all kinds of injury trouble. Has talent and drive but lacks the size to survive in the NHL with his gung ho style.

C Jason Arnott (37, 2.5 mio)
Big forward with a good, right-handed shot and the strength to create space for his linemates. Getting to the end of the line in age and mileage with over 1,200 games. Could be good for one more 20 goals season if he can switch back to wing.


Yeah... slim pickings indeed.

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07-26-2012, 08:42 PM
  #173
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Originally Posted by Ragamuffin Gunner View Post
We'll make the POs, it's the actual winning in the POs that actually matters.

But keep telling yourself , "it's only July" if that makes you feel good inside.
I think we can win in the playoffs. The team fell apart last year but I don't buy that it was a bad team. Certainly not as bad as they looked in that Philly series. I think Orpik and Martin will play better. Maybe not great, but they'll be good players again. I think Despres will be good. Overall we will have an above average defense. Having a dedicated defensive 3rd line will go a long way to helping that. I think Tangradi could put up something like 15G 20A numbers if he gets a spot with Geno and Neal while playing on the 2nd powerplay. TK will get similar numbers on the third line. And then we'll add something mid-season. Not necessarily a guy like Neal but probably trade someone from D (Martin or Niskanen + prospects/picks) to get a Kunitz quality guy and trade a prospect/pick for a vet bottom pairing guy.

Or maybe we'll sign AK and be a step ahead of that whole scenario. I'd love if we did.

Maybe I'm hopelessly optimistic (my fiance will tell you I am) but I really don't care: it's way better than the alternative.

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07-26-2012, 08:47 PM
  #174
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Brule could be an interesting pickup, so long as he is picked up on the cheap (relatively speaking off course).

I just moved out of Columbus after living there for four years, and lived in Cincy prior to that. Brule has the tools to be a consistent 15-25 goal guy in the league.

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Old
07-26-2012, 08:51 PM
  #175
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really is a weird off season. Have any of the top teams other than the Rangers actually gotten better this off-season? I'd say Minnesota, Dallas, Carolina and Tampa are the most improved from last year.

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