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Old
01-04-2013, 10:06 PM
  #676
Bender
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Originally Posted by Drizzt1 View Post
I agree that our defensive stocks seem at least on the upside with Siemens (who some say has regressed), Barrie, and Elliott (who some people also have suggested may have regressed).

I'm actually very disappointed that Rutkowski was not given an opportunity at least in Lake Erie. I thought he'd be pretty good, but admittedly, that was only going off reading reviews and looking at stats.

Gaunce was, is, and is going to be one of my favorite players. I really hope the guy does well and take that next step, but he, along with Elliott seems to have production problems in Lake Erie at the moment, and he's meant to be a puck moving defensemen, with a gritty side to him.

My main issue with the squad (defense), is the length of contracts. I personally think we have little options with Hejda. He's by no means getting better, but he sure as hell getting older, and being 37 at contracts end, and earning 3.25 million throughout is horrible. Plain horrible. No-one would take that on for what value he adds to the team.

I'm mortified we let Liles go for what we did. I don't buy this BS that he just "wouldn't have signed" at contracts end. Guess what, he's exactly the defensemen our team needed. He almost got 50 points that last season with us. He played PP time. He quarter backed the rush quite often.

I don't get it.

What do we do going forward though? It's going to take a lot of time, patience and persaverence just to "wait" for our young guys to develop. If you look team by team, other teams have potential rookies also set to make a name for themselves (Schultz for example), so who's to say our young guys are going to be better than other teams? We do need to be better than other teams, because we need to improve to contend. Pinning all our hopes on Siemens, Barrie and/or Elliott is a concern to me. Also, "waiting" for some magical button to make moves is another move that worries me.

At this point in our proud clubs point in time, what this playing group needs is certainty.

Our defense is, and has been our weakness for years. We've lost so many good players. Leopold could still be here. Boychuk could still be here. Liles could still be here. Shattenkirk could still be here. In my opinion, I thought having Cohen on our squad with guys like Yip & Shattenkirk could be beneficial. I loved what I saw with Cohen. The kid wouldn't even take any guff from Iginla !!

Anyways, I'm a negative nancy to be honest, so I hope I am proven wrong. I hope our defense is, and will become the envy of the league - because as of now, I think it's a farce, and to be honest, think it is currently the worst NHL quality defense in the league, on the back of people "hoping" our rookies can stand up, and dominate the game in years to come. People are suggesting Siemens could be Foote, and Barrie could be Boyle or Keith. Yeah, I'm negative, but that's the complete opposite. It's the same as Lacroix suggesting Anderson was the next Roy, Duchene the next Forsberg, and Stazz the next Sakic. I'm happy with people arguing my negative stand point, but these past players are generational players, of which, we have none at the moment.
I don't think that ever happened.

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01-05-2013, 01:00 AM
  #677
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I don't think that ever happened.
Read this whole article how you want, but the connotation I took from the appropriate parts suggested that Stazz, Duchene and Anderson were the new coming of Sakic, Forsberg and Roy.

Try and twist it how you like, Pierre was trying to ensure fans, by making the comparison.

This is why I suggest that sometimes, things don't turn out the way we want them to. This article was written in 2009...you all know why the coaching changes were made...

http://www.denverpost.com/ci_12818523


Last edited by SoundwaveIsCharisma: 01-05-2013 at 03:04 PM. Reason: Quoting Entire Article
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Old
01-05-2013, 09:39 AM
  #678
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Ok so you got that Lacroix said Anderson was the second coming of Roy from "Craig (Anderson) got Florida to one game of the playoffs last season, and that, honestly, wasn't a very good team," Pierre said. "We believe he can really help us as we develop a couple of kids that could be special."



If that's the way you understand things, no one can help you.

We believe the goalie we just signed as a UFA can HELP US as we develop our young goalie prospects = best goalie of all time.

Ok, gotcha.

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01-05-2013, 10:27 AM
  #679
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That article also lists Ryan Stoa as a budding young star. Things change.

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01-05-2013, 12:45 PM
  #680
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Originally Posted by chet1926 View Post
I honestly feel that our defense is under-rated by most people in this forum. I'm not saying we have a top flight defense but we do have a tolerable defense.

EJ has shown signs of progression towards a top flight dman.

Hejda is a 2nd pairing level guy

O'Bryne and O'Brien aren't world beaters but they quietly do a solid job most of the time and are decent 3rd pairing guys

Hunwick is hit or miss

Wilson is a wild card, some nights he looks amazing some not so much, if he can find consistency he could easily play 2nd or 3rd pairing.

Zanon I'm not that familiar with but I've heard he is kind of like O'Brien and O'Bryne.

We also have Barrie and Elliott. I think Barrie is going to be a stud kind of a Dan Boyle or Duncan Keith light version. Barrie played very well last season. Elliott if he can get a bit stronger could become a high end offensive dman. Not to mention Seimens who really could be the next Adam Foote.

I will agree we could use a top end dman, but those don't exactly grow on trees, and teams don't exactly just part ways with them. Sometimes you just got to make do until you can get one, which is what we are doing and its not as bad as people are making it out to be.
I think it depends on what your evaluation of these players is, and what you want out of the season. If you want a team that nibbles at the playoffs and either misses or just gets in - sure, this is probably tolerable. But if you want a team that is, say, top third in the NHL, no way is this an acceptable defense. And given the assumption that Barrie, Siemens, Gaunce, and Elliott aren't going to get much NHL time this year, I don't believe we can expect much improvement from any players except EJ and Wilson. The other guys are what they are.

I believe there are fairly massive holes in parts of their collective blue line game - namely foot speed, outlet passing, and general creativity/skill with the puck.

What I think this group will do well, is play decent, tough positional defense deep within their own zone, and/or in parts of the ice and game where they don't have to move that much. So, I believe that they'll defend well along the deep defensive zone boards (other teams' cycles) pretty well, they'll kill penalties pretty well, they'll cover the slot right in front of the goaltenders pretty well, etc.

Where I believe it will fall apart, is A) when they get possession of the puck deep in their own zone, and B) in transition all over the ice. Aside from EJ, there isn't a defender on the team who is adept at routinely executing a 40-60 foot outlet pass. And 4 of the 6 guys who are likely to play regularly (I'm putting Hunwick on the bench here) are below average from a speed/mobility standpoint. I believe the Avs are going to be quite easy to defend from deep in their own zone, other teams are going to simply put a defender or two at around the tops of the circles, and they're going to have a brutal time getting out of their own zone on a regular basis. Lots of 'bank it off the boards' type of stuff, which leads to lots of simplistic offensive transition if not neutral zone turnovers.

They're in a tough time - what their defense desperately needs does exist in the skillsets of Barrie and Elliott, but they're (evidently) not ready. Combine that with the Avs' resistance to hand out $5M UFA contracts, and we have a problem.

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01-05-2013, 01:11 PM
  #681
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Originally Posted by ABasin View Post
I think it depends on what your evaluation of these players is, and what you want out of the season. If you want a team that nibbles at the playoffs and either misses or just gets in - sure, this is probably tolerable. But if you want a team that is, say, top third in the NHL, no way is this an acceptable defense. And given the assumption that Barrie, Siemens, Gaunce, and Elliott aren't going to get much NHL time this year, I don't believe we can expect much improvement from any players except EJ and Wilson. The other guys are what they are.

I believe there are fairly massive holes in parts of their collective blue line game - namely foot speed, outlet passing, and general creativity/skill with the puck.

What I think this group will do well, is play decent, tough positional defense deep within their own zone, and/or in parts of the ice and game where they don't have to move that much. So, I believe that they'll defend well along the deep defensive zone boards (other teams' cycles) pretty well, they'll kill penalties pretty well, they'll cover the slot right in front of the goaltenders pretty well, etc.

Where I believe it will fall apart, is A) when they get possession of the puck deep in their own zone, and B) in transition all over the ice. Aside from EJ, there isn't a defender on the team who is adept at routinely executing a 40-60 foot outlet pass. And 4 of the 6 guys who are likely to play regularly (I'm putting Hunwick on the bench here) are below average from a speed/mobility standpoint. I believe the Avs are going to be quite easy to defend from deep in their own zone, other teams are going to simply put a defender or two at around the tops of the circles, and they're going to have a brutal time getting out of their own zone on a regular basis. Lots of 'bank it off the boards' type of stuff, which leads to lots of simplistic offensive transition if not neutral zone turnovers.

They're in a tough time - what their defense desperately needs does exist in the skillsets of Barrie and Elliott, but they're (evidently) not ready. Combine that with the Avs' resistance to hand out $5M UFA contracts, and we have a problem.
I don't know how much I buy it's a resistance as more of a 'choice' of not doing so. Who should we have signed over the past 3 years?

Martin? Pittsburgh wants to dump him
Wisniewski? Earning way to much for what he brings for way too long
Carle? At $5.5M, I'm glad the Avs didn't bite on that madness!
Wideman? The flames will REGRET this very, very soon. Insanity.

The list of GOOD UFA defenceman signings over $5M+ over the past 3-4 years is a very short one.

The Avs have positioned themselves in a great spot to either make a swap to upgrade for a very good player who is set to earn too much on a cap team.

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01-05-2013, 01:23 PM
  #682
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Originally Posted by ABasin View Post
I think it depends on what your evaluation of these players is, and what you want out of the season. If you want a team that nibbles at the playoffs and either misses or just gets in - sure, this is probably tolerable. But if you want a team that is, say, top third in the NHL, no way is this an acceptable defense. And given the assumption that Barrie, Siemens, Gaunce, and Elliott aren't going to get much NHL time this year, I don't believe we can expect much improvement from any players except EJ and Wilson. The other guys are what they are.

I believe there are fairly massive holes in parts of their collective blue line game - namely foot speed, outlet passing, and general creativity/skill with the puck.

What I think this group will do well, is play decent, tough positional defense deep within their own zone, and/or in parts of the ice and game where they don't have to move that much. So, I believe that they'll defend well along the deep defensive zone boards (other teams' cycles) pretty well, they'll kill penalties pretty well, they'll cover the slot right in front of the goaltenders pretty well, etc.

Where I believe it will fall apart, is A) when they get possession of the puck deep in their own zone, and B) in transition all over the ice. Aside from EJ, there isn't a defender on the team who is adept at routinely executing a 40-60 foot outlet pass. And 4 of the 6 guys who are likely to play regularly (I'm putting Hunwick on the bench here) are below average from a speed/mobility standpoint. I believe the Avs are going to be quite easy to defend from deep in their own zone, other teams are going to simply put a defender or two at around the tops of the circles, and they're going to have a brutal time getting out of their own zone on a regular basis. Lots of 'bank it off the boards' type of stuff, which leads to lots of simplistic offensive transition if not neutral zone turnovers.

They're in a tough time - what their defense desperately needs does exist in the skillsets of Barrie and Elliott, but they're (evidently) not ready. Combine that with the Avs' resistance to hand out $5M UFA contracts, and we have a problem.
I'm a realist when comes to what I expect out of the Avs. Currently they are a fringe playoff team. I'm not saying thats what I want, but thats we have.

We have holes offensively and defensively to be considered a Cup contender. So basically our defense is tolerable enough and talented enough to push for the playoffs, if they want to get better we will need better players.

I also would like to know how you know they are unwilling to hand out 5M + UFA contracts. What defensive player would you have given 5M + this offseason? Weber is the only one I would have given that to but there was no way we were going to win that sweepstakes.

Just because we haven't given any 5M + contracts in the past few offseasons doesn't mean we are unwilling. There have to be players A. willing to come here B. that deserve that kind of money, and there just haven't been too many UFAs that fit in that boat lately.

Another reason we have been more conservative is the whole lockout thing. We didn't want to get burned like last time. So we played it safe. If the cap goes down in year 2 like they are saying we will be in a good position, while other teams are going to be scrambling shedding salary, which means good players aren't going to be retained and teams that have space can explore adding them.

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01-05-2013, 01:31 PM
  #683
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Originally Posted by chet1926 View Post
I'm a realist when comes to what I expect out of the Avs. Currently they are a fringe playoff team. I'm not saying thats what I want, but thats we have.

We have holes offensively and defensively to be considered a Cup contender. So basically our defense is tolerable enough and talented enough to push for the playoffs, if they want to get better we will need better players.
Agreed. And I wasn't talking about Cup contender per se. Just 'solidly in the playoffs', if you will.

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I also would like to know how you know they are unwilling to hand out 5M + UFA contracts. What defensive player would you have given 5M + this offseason? Weber is the only one I would have given that to but there was no way we were going to win that sweepstakes.

Just because we haven't given any 5M + contracts in the past few offseasons doesn't mean we are unwilling. There have to be players A. willing to come here B. that deserve that kind of money, and there just haven't been too many UFAs that fit in that boat lately.

Another reason we have been more conservative is the whole lockout thing. We didn't want to get burned like last time. So we played it safe. If the cap goes down in year 2 like they are saying we will be in a good position, while other teams are going to be scrambling shedding salary, which means good players aren't going to be retained and teams that have space can explore adding them.
Yes, you and Bender bring up good points, and my comment about the Avs UFA spending is really part conjecture on my part. I made the comment because while the Avs have signed UFAs over the last 3-4 years, they've signed ones that aren't top shelf, or ones on the cheap. That, and they've been near the cap floor for a few years now. Thus, my comment. I'm not sure offhand who I would have liked to see them sign, but if these types of offensive defensemen FAs are so hard to get, then the Avs really gave Liles away cheap (though I don't miss him - his defense was lousy).

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01-05-2013, 03:45 PM
  #684
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Agreed. And I wasn't talking about Cup contender per se. Just 'solidly in the playoffs', if you will.



Yes, you and Bender bring up good points, and my comment about the Avs UFA spending is really part conjecture on my part. I made the comment because while the Avs have signed UFAs over the last 3-4 years, they've signed ones that aren't top shelf, or ones on the cheap. That, and they've been near the cap floor for a few years now. Thus, my comment. I'm not sure offhand who I would have liked to see them sign, but if these types of offensive defensemen FAs are so hard to get, then the Avs really gave Liles away cheap (though I don't miss him - his defense was lousy).
It sounds like we are kind of in the same boat. Our team is tolerable but we want to be better so we can be a solid playoff team.

Looking ahead to next UFA period it doesn't seem to get much better.

Only players I'd be interested in are

Edler (VAN), not very realistic lots of teams are going to go hard after him, and he'll get some ridiculous contract.

Raymond (VAN), would be a solid 2nd or 3rd liner

Filppula (DET), would be very solid LW addition

Smid (EDM), we all know how good this guy is ... but in seriousness would be a good addition

Bozak (TOR), only if we were to trade one of our centers

After that the pickings are slim, it looks like our best best for improvement might be through trades. We have some moveable pieces like one of our centers since Sgarbossa is coming along and Hishon looks to be getting healthier. Plus we could move one of Barrie or Elliott. We also a have a stable of decent goaltending prospects or even Giguere if we feel Pickard could be a backup.

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01-05-2013, 03:58 PM
  #685
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Originally Posted by chet1926 View Post
It sounds like we are kind of in the same boat. Our team is tolerable but we want to be better so we can be a solid playoff team.

Looking ahead to next UFA period it doesn't seem to get much better.

Only players I'd be interested in are

Edler (VAN), not very realistic lots of teams are going to go hard after him, and he'll get some ridiculous contract.

Raymond (VAN), would be a solid 2nd or 3rd liner

Filppula (DET), would be very solid LW addition

Smid (EDM), we all know how good this guy is ... but in seriousness would be a good addition

Bozak (TOR), only if we were to trade one of our centers

After that the pickings are slim, it looks like our best best for improvement might be through trades. We have some moveable pieces like one of our centers since Sgarbossa is coming along and Hishon looks to be getting healthier. Plus we could move one of Barrie or Elliott. We also a have a stable of decent goaltending prospects or even Giguere if we feel Pickard could be a backup.
You wouldn't be interested in Clowe, Perry or Getzlaf?

Smid would actually be a very good addition, capable of playing top pairing, mobile enough not to look like a tree stump. He could potentially give EJ the freedom to take a few more chances.

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01-05-2013, 04:04 PM
  #686
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If we can't get Edler, I wouldn't mind Ryan Whitney. He's a top pairing defenseman, as long as he can stay healthy.

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01-05-2013, 04:13 PM
  #687
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If we can't get Edler, I wouldn't mind Ryan Whitney. He's a top pairing defenseman, as long as he can stay healthy.
If he signed for cheap I may grow to like that signing. If he gets paid what he is worth when he is healthy I'll be irate.

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01-05-2013, 04:39 PM
  #688
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You wouldn't be interested in Clowe, Perry or Getzlaf?

Smid would actually be a very good addition, capable of playing top pairing, mobile enough not to look like a tree stump. He could potentially give EJ the freedom to take a few more chances.
I forgot about Perry would love to have him, but not interested in Clowe or Getzlaf.

Getzlaf is a center which we already have plenty of, and I can't stand Clowe. Everyone seems to think he is this awesome player but I just don't see it. We already have Downie, McGinn etc. to fill the role of decent scoring power forward.

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01-05-2013, 04:47 PM
  #689
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Raymond is not a solid 2nd liner. There are 10 forwards on our team that I would take over him.

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01-05-2013, 05:21 PM
  #690
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I forgot about Perry would love to have him, but not interested in Clowe or Getzlaf.

Getzlaf is a center which we already have plenty of, and I can't stand Clowe. Everyone seems to think he is this awesome player but I just don't see it. We already have Downie, McGinn etc. to fill the role of decent scoring power forward.
I think that Clowe would be a fantastic edition to this team. He'd fit in perfectly beside Duchene and Parenteau IMO. Plus, he is one of the best fighters in the league, and I don't think you can ever have enough Power Forwards. Just makes your team harder to play against.

I think that Perry would be the ultimate prize for the Avs, absolutely dynamic sniper, fits in with the team in terms of play style and he could absolutely take any of our three C's to the next level.

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01-05-2013, 05:22 PM
  #691
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Raymond is not a solid 2nd liner. There are 10 forwards on our team that I would take over him.
I agree with this. We really don't need a player like Raymond, and I think he'd demand quite a bit on the market (in terms of money).

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01-05-2013, 05:56 PM
  #692
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Clowe would be a terrific addition for this team, he can throw them with pretty much anyone, he could keep up the pace with Duchene and he's a proven 20 goal scorer in the league. Of course getting Perry would be way nicer, but that's a pipe dream.

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01-05-2013, 10:09 PM
  #693
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I am with Ivan, Clowe would be a great player to get if it's not a superstar.

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01-05-2013, 11:51 PM
  #694
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I think one of the misinterpretations that people have are that the Avs are building a team similar to the one that they had in the 90's-early 2000's. I don't think that they are building the same team, they don't have the same high end offensive talent. Instead, I think the Avs are building a much more defensively oriented, well-rounded team. I think they will actually end up resembling the Dallas Stars of that era more than the Avalanche team we knew.
This, so much of this. Our Defencemen just need to play the defense part very well for now, sure if both Barrie and Elliott become stars and EJ reaches his maximum potential things could change, but this is a group of players we're putting together is one that's more grueling to play against, the forward depth with an onus on physicality and two way play, the big burly defenders, the depth in net, our captain being a great defending physical player. With a more defense oriented playing style I think this group could be a very solid as we target a playoff berth, down the road we're going to need help from outside and from our kids, but for where we are right now, the defensive corps should be solid, with an EJ partnering being the most obvious issue.

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01-06-2013, 02:54 AM
  #695
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Not a huge fan of Clowe. He constantly gets ragged at by Sharks fans, and he's on a pretty skilled team right now. I do admit I haven't seen many of his games, but the ones I have seen he didn't seem too impressive. If we get him via FA, I guarantee we'd overpay and end up hating him.

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01-06-2013, 03:39 AM
  #696
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Not a huge fan of Clowe. He constantly gets ragged at by Sharks fans, and he's on a pretty skilled team right now. I do admit I haven't seen many of his games, but the ones I have seen he didn't seem too impressive. If we get him via FA, I guarantee we'd overpay and end up hating him.
Sharks fans started to turn on him this past season because he had a down year.

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01-06-2013, 10:31 AM
  #697
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Not a huge fan of Clowe. He constantly gets ragged at by Sharks fans, and he's on a pretty skilled team right now. I do admit I haven't seen many of his games, but the ones I have seen he didn't seem too impressive. If we get him via FA, I guarantee we'd overpay and end up hating him.
I agree with you. Clowe is super over-rated around here. He is your basic middle of the road power forward who brings nothing more than say a Downie or McGinn.

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01-06-2013, 10:48 AM
  #698
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Sharks fans started to turn on him this past season because he had a down year.
For good reason. He is just an above average grinder from everything I've seen recently. He's also too slow for our team and would get noticeably exposed that way.

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Old
01-06-2013, 10:51 AM
  #699
Ivan13
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Location: Zagreb
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chet1926 View Post
I agree with you. Clowe is super over-rated around here. He is your basic middle of the road power forward who brings nothing more than say a Downie or McGinn.
Say what? I don't know how anyone can put McGinn and Clowe in the same category (Clowe is by far better in every aspect of them game other than foot speed) and he's nothing like Downie. Downie is like Claude Lemieux only far less skilled, Clowe is a less talented version of Adam Deadmarsh.

Oh and I didn't know you aren't allowed to have more than three power forwards (Landeskog, McGinn, Downie) in your top 9.

On a different note here are the remaining RFA and UFA players:
Quote:
Kulikov, Dmitry D FLA 22 $1,325,000 2012 (RFA)
Petrecki, Nick D SAN 23 $1,125,000 2012 (RFA)
Del Zotto, Michael D NYR 22 $1,087,500 2012 (RFA)
O'Reilly, Ryan C COL 21 $900,000 2012 (RFA)
Subban, P.K. D MTL 23 $875,000 2012 (RFA)
Benn, Jamie C DAL 23 $821,667 2012 (RFA)
Palmieri, Nick R MIN 23 $801,667 2012 (RFA)
Franson, Cody D TOR 25 $800,000 2012 (RFA)
MacLean, Brett L PHO 24 $735,000 2012 (RFA)
Sheppard, James C SAN 24 $725,000 2012 (RFA)
Quote:
Clark, Brett D 36 TBL 82 2 13 15 -26 2145 14.87 2.06 1.43 18.37
Campoli, Chris D 28 MTL 43 2 9 11 -3 980 14.51 0.65 2.00 17.19
Hecht, Jochen C 35 BUF 22 4 4 8 1 497 14.41 1.82 0.55 16.82
Eaton, Mark D 35 NYI 62 1 3 4 -17 1293 14.03 1.97 0.03 16.05
Huselius, K. L 34 CLB 2 0 0 0 -2 43 12.00 0.00 4.00 16.00
Sykora, Petr R 36 NJD 82 21 23 44 4 1710 13.91 0.00 1.96 15.90
Foster, Kurtis D 31 MIN 51 4 10 14 -13 1080 12.61 0.16 3.10 15.88
Langkow, Daymond C 36 PHO 73 11 19 30 -4 1447 13.32 0.96 1.47 15.74
Moore, Dominic C 32 SAN 79 4 21 25 -18 1634 13.05 1.63 0.82 15.53
Huskins, Kent D 33 STL 25 2 5 7 9 573 14.48 0.72 0.20 15.44
White, Colin D 35 SAN 54 1 3 4 -5 1227 13.26 1.61 0.04 14.94
Jones, Randy D 31 WIN 39 1 1 2 4 757 13.15 1.56 0.05 14.79
Dvorak, Radek R 35 DAL 73 4 17 21 -16 1395 12.36 1.81 0.08 14.27
Rolston, Brian L 39 BOS 70 7 17 24 -5 1294 11.86 0.53 1.87 14.27
Blake, Jason L 39 ANA 45 7 5 12 -4 791 12.67 0.00 1.44 14.13
Arnott, Jason C 38 STL 72 17 17 34 13 1490 11.71 0.00 2.36 14.08
Mottau, Mike D 34 BOS 35 0 2 2 -11 659 13.11 0.89 0.03 14.06
Knuble, Mike R 40 WAS 72 6 12 18 -15 1337 11.64 1.14 1.14 13.93
Brunette, Andrew L 39 CHI 78 12 15 27 -13 1465 11.31 0.00 2.22 13.54
O'Donnell, Sean D 41 CHI 51 0 7 7 -6 951 12.08 1.41 0.00 13.51
Morrison, Brendan C 37 CHI 39 4 7 11 -5 679 11.90 0.26 1.18 13.33
Rodney, Bryan D 28 EDM 1 0 0 0 -1 21 11.00 0.00 1.00 13.00
Commodore, Mike D 33 TBL 30 0 2 2 7 550 11.70 0.83 0.03 12.60
Kostopoulos, Tom R 33 CGY 81 4 8 12 -15 1347 10.75 1.44 0.10 12.32
Sturm, Marco L 34 FLA 48 3 2 5 -13 903 10.40 1.04 0.85 12.31
Darche, Mathieu L 36 MTL 61 5 7 12 -4 989 9.82 1.79 0.49 12.11
Holmstrom, Tomas L 39 DET 74 11 13 24 -9 1105 8.80 0.00 3.05 11.86
Bell, Brendan D 29 NYR 1 0 0 0 -1 17 11.00 0.00 0.00 11.00
Pandolfo, Jay L 38 NYI 62 1 2 3 -14 973 9.10 1.76 0.03 10.92
Bradley, Matt R 34 FLA 45 3 5 8 -3 697 10.31 0.40 0.13 10.87
Winchester, Jesse C 29 OTT 32 2 6 8 2 556 8.38 2.22 0.00 10.63
Bitz, Byron R 28 VAN 10 1 3 4 2 174 10.40 0.00 0.00 10.40
Vandermeer, Jim D 32 SAN 25 1 3 4 3 367 9.92 0.40 0.04 10.40
Hunter, Trent R 32 LAK 38 2 5 7 -4 537 9.24 0.00 0.84 10.08
Ortmeyer, Jed R 34 MIN 35 1 1 2 -8 551 8.69 1.00 0.00 9.71
Fehr, Eric R 27 WIN 35 2 1 3 -6 459 9.26 0.00 0.43 9.69
Duco, Mike R 25 VAN 6 0 2 2 1 79 8.00 0.00 0.00 8.00
Winchester, Brad L 31 SAN 67 6 4 10 -5 849 7.63 0.01 0.15 7.81
Pelley, Rod C 28 ANA 52 2 1 3 -3 560 7.42 0.31 0.00 7.75
King, D.J. L 28 WAS 1 0 0 0 0 9 6.00 0.00 0.00 6.00
Oreskovich, V. R 26 VAN 1 0 0 0 0 9 5.00 0.00 0.00 6.00
L.-Leblond, P. R 27 CGY 3 0 0 0 1 25 4.67 0.00 0.00 4.67
Brophey, Evan C 26 COL 3 0 0 0 0 23 4.00 0.00 0.00 4.00

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Old
01-06-2013, 11:02 AM
  #700
chet1926
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ivan13 View Post
Say what? I don't know how anyone can put McGinn and Clowe in the same category (Clowe is by far better in every aspect of them game other than foot speed) and he's nothing like Downie. Downie is like Claude Lemieux only far less skilled, Clowe is a less talented version of Adam Deadmarsh.

Oh and I didn't know you aren't allowed to have more than three power forwards (Landeskog, McGinn, Downie) in your top 9.

On a different note here are the remaining RFA and UFA players:
I don't know what Clowe you watched last season but I saw a slow, average goal scorer, with some physical aspects.

Clowe would not fit in here due to his terrible skating ability. Plus the other aspects he brings we already have in Landy, Downie, McGinn.

We don't need any more power forward types, its time to add high end skill types. Preferably a high scoring/sniper winger.

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