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Are enforcers really dying out?

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Old
08-06-2012, 12:15 PM
  #26
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Originally Posted by The Cheat View Post
It's the same basic concept of why guns will NEVER go away. Go ahead, take guns away from citizens, then the cops and make them illegal. Guess what? Someone will get the bright idea to go acquire a bunch of them and take over, with no one to stop them.


Is that a quote from the trailer of one of the worst movies of all time?


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08-06-2012, 01:44 PM
  #27
SauceHockey
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Originally Posted by tfong View Post
Doesn't Clarkson count?
Clarkson is way more of a hockey player then enforcer

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08-08-2012, 09:24 PM
  #28
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Originally Posted by asdwe1 View Post
Clarkson is way more of a hockey player then enforcer
Agreed. Janssen and Barch can be classified as "pure enforcers" or "goons". Janssen moreso than Barch.

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08-08-2012, 09:42 PM
  #29
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The NHL will always have their fare share of fighters/enforcers.

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08-08-2012, 10:31 PM
  #30
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Westgarth got playing time under Terry Murray, but not under Sutter when he took over. We'll see if Westy gets any ice time this year, but I don't think there's any room for him on the roster.

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08-08-2012, 11:21 PM
  #31
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Originally Posted by The Cheat View Post
One day enforcers will be a thing of the past, and hipster pacificsts and 'think about the children'-helicopter parents will rejoice.

And then one day, a team will recruit a bunch of thugs and win it all cause no one can stand up to, or deal with it.

Just like the 75, 76 Broad Street bullies.

And then, every other team will recruit enforcers to protect their stars, same as it ever was.
And the habs will go back to sign players that can actually skate around those goons and win the cup. I like your plan :p

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08-09-2012, 01:23 AM
  #32
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Originally Posted by Choralone View Post
Westgarth got playing time under Terry Murray, but not under Sutter when he took over. We'll see if Westy gets any ice time this year, but I don't think there's any room for him on the roster.
I don't think there's room for him, either.

1. Anze Kopitar
2. Mike Richards
3. Jeff Carter
4. Justin Williams
5. Dustin Penner
6. Simon Gagne
7. Dustin Brown
8. Jarret Stoll
9. Jordan Nolan
10. Brad Richardson
11. Dwight King
12. Kyle Clifford
13. Colin Fraser
14. Trevor Lewis

In my opinion, all of these guys are ahead of him on the depth chart. Clifford and King are both scrappy guys, so will they ship Westgarth off to where he'd get a better shot at some time? Put him on waivers?

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08-09-2012, 02:28 AM
  #33
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As long as fighting is part of the game, it makes sense to carry the best fighter. Same as carrying a pure goal score. He is useless when not shooting the puck, but since he can skate decent he gets a free pass? Am I reading this right? This skating thing is getting seriously overrated in the New NHL and their preachers. Heck the good skating is playing a huge part in the absurd amount of accidental blows to the head. In the golden era, only 6/23 players on the bench would be considered good/great skaters. Half the bench could not even skate better than todays "goons." Yet for most fans, that is the preferred era of hockey? This site is loaded with dimwitted brainwashed hypocrites.

I think most GMs would carry an enforcer. But Bettman and his cronies reduced the roster number down to 23 from 26 and created rules to make fighting useless. They only did it to be T.V. "friendly" and try to convince Americans (who dont give a **** about hockey) to watch their sport. Nice work since the NHL had rather poor Stanley Cup finals ratings in America. I think bowling beat out hockey in most of America... (Excluding cities with NHL teams in the playoffs.)

Now before I get this , NHL revenues are growing New NHL B.S., 67% of all NHL revenue comes from 6 Canadian teams. Of those 24 American teams, how many are making a profit? Mr. Bettman has yet to mention this in his "growth" speals.

So yes Enforcers are becoming extinct, but not because of natural reasons, for corporate reasons. Enforcers have a place in hockey, just not in the corporate, sold out NHL crap.

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Old
08-09-2012, 01:38 PM
  #34
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Originally Posted by thrillhouse99 View Post
Most fighters in the 90's could play hockey as well. Guys like tie domi and sandy McCarthy were more the norm than stu grimson, just like guys like Brandon prust are more the norm than guys like Andrew peters or ratis ivanis. "goons" have always been a bit of a novelty, I don't think much has changed. They will never be the norm but they will always find their way onto rosters.
No way. There were exceptions who could take a regular-ish shift (Domi, Simon), but there were far more complete bums who couldn't do anything (Worrell, Ciccone, Leroux, Grimson, Twist, Antosky, Berube, Dan Kordic etc).

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08-09-2012, 03:35 PM
  #35
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It is becoming common for teams to carry scrappers who can take a regular shift, without a doubt. Guys like Brandon Prust, Matt Martin, Ryan Reaves, and Zack Smith are more sought-after than guys like Eric Godard.

However, as I've shown in previous posts, "goons" are not extinct.

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08-09-2012, 08:55 PM
  #36
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Originally Posted by Bruise Bros 2426 View Post
Depends on what the definition of "enforcer" is. If it is defined as a goon who doesn't really do anything other than fight, then yes, they are a dying breed. However, they're not extinct, per se.

Here's a list of guys that can be defined as "goons" or "pure enforcers" who played in the year after the lockout, 2005/2006:

1. Jody Shelley-80 GP
2. Brian McGrattan-60 GP
3. Derek Boogaard-65 GP
4. Wade Belak-55 GP
5. George Parros-55 GP
6. Donald Brashear-76 GP
7. Gorges Laraque-72 GP
8. Eric Godard-57 GP
9. Eric Boulton-51 GP
10. Darcy Hordichuk-74 GP
11. Chris Simon-72 GP
12. Eric Cairns-50 GP
13. Cam Janssen-47 GP
14. Andre Roy-42 GP
15. Colton Orr-35 GP
16. Wade Brookbank-32 GP
17. Andrew Peters-28 GP
18. Jesse Boulerice-38 GP
19. Jason Wiemer-49 GP

Compare that with the "goons" or "pure enforcers" present in 2011/2012:

1. Brian McGrattan-30 GP
2. Eric Boulton-51 GP
3. George Parros-46 GP
4. Jody Shelley-30 GP
5. Cam Janssen-48 GP
6. Darcy Hordichuk-43 GP
7. Brad Staubitz-62 GP
8. John Scott-35 GP
9. Krys Barch-51 GP
10. Paul Bissonnette- 31 GP
11. Jay Rosehill-31 GP
12. Kevin Westgarth-25 GP
13. Matt Kassian-24 GP
14. Mike Rupp-60 GP
15. Pierre-Luc Letorneau-Leblond 3 GP
16. Raitis Ivanans 1 GP
17. Frazer McLaren 7 GP
18. Andre Deveaux 9 GP
19. Colton Orr 5 GP
20. Jay Rosehill 31 GP


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Old
08-09-2012, 08:57 PM
  #37
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Originally Posted by Bruise Bros 2426 View Post
It is becoming common for teams to carry scrappers who can take a regular shift, without a doubt. Guys like Brandon Prust, Matt Martin, Ryan Reaves, and Zack Smith are more sought-after than guys like Eric Godard.

However, as I've shown in previous posts, "goons" are not extinct.
Nothing wrong with that, and it's always been that way. There's room for enforcers though.

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08-09-2012, 09:00 PM
  #38
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Originally Posted by Bruise Bros 2426 View Post
I don't think there's room for him, either.

1. Anze Kopitar
2. Mike Richards
3. Jeff Carter
4. Justin Williams
5. Dustin Penner
6. Simon Gagne
7. Dustin Brown
8. Jarret Stoll
9. Jordan Nolan
10. Brad Richardson
11. Dwight King
12. Kyle Clifford
13. Colin Fraser
14. Trevor Lewis

In my opinion, all of these guys are ahead of him on the depth chart. Clifford and King are both scrappy guys, so will they ship Westgarth off to where he'd get a better shot at some time? Put him on waivers?
Can't play or fight, yeah that makes sense.

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Old
08-09-2012, 10:40 PM
  #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Puckclektr View Post
Goons should not be in the NHL. They are not there to play hockey they are there to fight. I hate staged fighting. Talking at a faceoff and saying "you wanna go" is not a hockey fight. Its a goon fight and there is no need for it.

Now before you go all Don Cherry on me, let me say this. I love a hockey fight. A hockey fight is guys that rough it up in the corners, battling the puck, roughing it up, showing so much aggression and then finally dropping the gloves to show your animosity for another. Guys like Thornton, Clarkson, Rupp, Lucic. Theses guys can play hockey as well.
Sometimes they are used to protect star players. Well, that is where the league should step in. If you try to take out a star player with a knee or late hit, the league should enforce longer suspensions to protect these players. Star players don't have to fight and many don't. It has always been like that. They just need to be able to take a hit and battle along the boards. But if you are a star player and are really dirty and chirpy, don't stand behind the refs or an enforcer and put your money where your moouth is and fight.
There are plenty of situations where somebody will and should stand up for a star player or any other teammate when the league probably won't do anything, and even if they did it wouldn't be very significant. I loved it when Adam McQuaid beat the **** out of Raffi Torres after he elbowed Andrew Ference. However I agree that if you play on the edge, star or not, you should be able to fight your own battles and be accountable for your actions.

The concept of a goon who can't play doesn't go back very far, I'd love to go back to a time when you needed toughness across your entire roster and even the best heavyweight fighters could play the game, but I see the disappearance of these players as a leaguewide trend towards taking fighting and physical play out of the game.

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Old
08-10-2012, 01:30 AM
  #40
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Originally Posted by noogies87 View Post
As long as fighting is part of the game, it makes sense to carry the best fighter. Same as carrying a pure goal score. He is useless when not shooting the puck, but since he can skate decent he gets a free pass? Am I reading this right? This skating thing is getting seriously overrated in the New NHL and their preachers. Heck the good skating is playing a huge part in the absurd amount of accidental blows to the head. In the golden era, only 6/23 players on the bench would be considered good/great skaters. Half the bench could not even skate better than todays "goons." Yet for most fans, that is the preferred era of hockey? This site is loaded with dimwitted brainwashed hypocrites.

I think most GMs would carry an enforcer. But Bettman and his cronies reduced the roster number down to 23 from 26 and created rules to make fighting useless. They only did it to be T.V. "friendly" and try to convince Americans (who dont give a **** about hockey) to watch their sport. Nice work since the NHL had rather poor Stanley Cup finals ratings in America. I think bowling beat out hockey in most of America... (Excluding cities with NHL teams in the playoffs.)

Now before I get this , NHL revenues are growing New NHL B.S., 67% of all NHL revenue comes from 6 Canadian teams. Of those 24 American teams, how many are making a profit? Mr. Bettman has yet to mention this in his "growth" speals.

So yes Enforcers are becoming extinct, but not because of natural reasons, for corporate reasons. Enforcers have a place in hockey, just not in the corporate, sold out NHL crap.
Source?

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Old
08-10-2012, 01:52 AM
  #41
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Originally Posted by ninetynine View Post
14. Mike Rupp-60 GP
15. Pierre-Luc Letorneau-Leblond 3 GP
16. Raitis Ivanans 1 GP
17. Frazer McLaren 7 GP
18. Andre Deveaux 9 GP
19. Colton Orr 5 GP
20. Jay Rosehill 31 GP

I kinda drew the line at 20 GP

Hopefully we see Orr play more this year.

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Old
08-10-2012, 01:53 AM
  #42
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Originally Posted by ninetynine View Post
Nothing wrong with that, and it's always been that way. There's room for enforcers though.
Agreed.

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Old
08-10-2012, 08:36 AM
  #43
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Originally Posted by IloveChrisNeil View Post
The hybrid enforcers are becoming more and more common these days. The classic definition of an 'enforcer' may be dying, but when one era ends, another begins.

Much like today's 'power forward' is much different then the 'power forwards' of the 80s/90s.
Jesus christ... perfect. End thread haha.

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Old
08-12-2012, 11:10 PM
  #44
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Originally Posted by tfong View Post
Doesn't Clarkson count?
I feel like he is trying to become a hockey player and move away from being a enforcer. If you can get atleast 20 points in 4 out of the last 5 seasons you should be out of that category.

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08-16-2012, 01:57 PM
  #45
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Originally Posted by iiTzLaMia View Post
I feel like he is trying to become a hockey player and move away from being a enforcer. If you can get atleast 20 points in 4 out of the last 5 seasons you should be out of that category.
Clarkson would be considered a power forward before he is considered an enforcer.

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