HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Metropolitan Division > Pittsburgh Penguins
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

2012 Off Season Thread - Part dreiundzwanzig: Boring Summer edition

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
08-07-2012, 10:52 PM
  #201
JTG
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Country: Sierra Leone
Posts: 38,679
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rowdy Roddy Peeper View Post
...and hitting.

If they do the rest of what Engelland's been doing much better than how Engelland's been doing it, they'll basically be top 4 guys.
Precisely my point. They both bring more well rounded skillsets. They are better hockey players.

JTG is offline  
Old
08-07-2012, 10:53 PM
  #202
mpp9
Registered User
 
mpp9's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Country: United States
Posts: 17,470
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by jmelm View Post
I also would not be surprised AT ALL if Despres is the D prospect of ours who is the one that gets traded for a forward. I'd rather lose him than Harrington, Dumoulin, Morrow or Pouliot.
I wouldn't be surprised if he is moved. One would have to imagine his play last year caught the eye of several GMs.

But it'd have to be the right deal. A longterm linemate for Sidney Crosby.

mpp9 is offline  
Old
08-07-2012, 10:56 PM
  #203
Zen Arcade
eat the record cover
 
Zen Arcade's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Pittsburgh
Country: United States
Posts: 14,209
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by JTG View Post
Precisely my point. They both bring more well rounded skillsets. They are better hockey players.
Yeah, but is it better to have a guy that's really good at one thing, or a guy that's ok at a bunch of stuff, but doesn't stand out much in any particular area? Especially when that area is something your defense is lacking.

Zen Arcade is online now  
Old
08-07-2012, 11:01 PM
  #204
JTG
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Country: Sierra Leone
Posts: 38,679
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zen Arcade View Post
Yeah, but is it better to have a guy that's really good at one thing, or a guy that's ok at a bunch of stuff, but doesn't stand out much in any particular area? Especially when that area is something your defense is lacking.
Robert Bortuzzo brings physicality. It's not like you'd be replacing Engelland with MAB or something. He's just not as physical and he doesn't fight as much.

I think it's Engo's position to lose, but I won't be surprised if he's sitting in the press box when the games start to matter.

JTG is offline  
Old
08-07-2012, 11:03 PM
  #205
SCUDeriMISSILE
We traded Staal
 
SCUDeriMISSILE's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Country: United States
Posts: 14,134
vCash: 500
What has Bortuzzo done at the NHL level besides be knocked unconscious that allows for any type of solid projection? A lot of people bring physicality in the AHL.

SCUDeriMISSILE is offline  
Old
08-07-2012, 11:05 PM
  #206
ThosePuckingPenguins
Registered User
 
ThosePuckingPenguins's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Pennsylvania
Country: United States
Posts: 2,250
vCash: 500
With Meszaros out for Philly, I believe it just became a two team race for the Atlantic. Though you never know, especially with the Flyers.

ThosePuckingPenguins is offline  
Old
08-07-2012, 11:11 PM
  #207
Von Malkin*
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 202
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by ThosePuckingPenguins View Post
With Meszaros out for Philly, I believe it just became a two team race for the Atlantic. Though you never know, especially with the Flyers.
Holmgren isn't going to sit on his ass passively waiting until the deadline to make a move. I still think philly will acquire a big name dman before the season begins. Seems kind of premature to count our Philly of the Atlantic

Von Malkin* is offline  
Old
08-07-2012, 11:13 PM
  #208
Zen Arcade
eat the record cover
 
Zen Arcade's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Pittsburgh
Country: United States
Posts: 14,209
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by JTG View Post
Robert Bortuzzo brings physicality. It's not like you'd be replacing Engelland with MAB or something. He's just not as physical and he doesn't fight as much.

I think it's Engo's position to lose, but I won't be surprised if he's sitting in the press box when the games start to matter.
Bortuzzo isn't soft or anything, but he and Engelland aren't in the same league in that regard. Engelland's hitting is only part of it, he makes life miserable for people out there.

Like the Dr. Crane said, lots of guys can look physical in the AHL. I saw Ben Lovejoy doing a lot of the same stuff that endeared Bortuzzo to some people here during the AHL playoffs. I don't think that will be his game if he makes it to the NHL, and certainly not his bread and butter.

Zen Arcade is online now  
Old
08-07-2012, 11:18 PM
  #209
mpp9
Registered User
 
mpp9's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Country: United States
Posts: 17,470
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Von Malkin View Post
Holmgren isn't going to sit on his ass passively waiting until the deadline to make a move. I still think philly will acquire a big name dman before the season begins. Seems kind of premature to count our Philly of the Atlantic
I'm not seeing too many options for them. And if they move Couturier/Schenn for a #1 D-man, then I'm cool with it.

mpp9 is offline  
Old
08-07-2012, 11:21 PM
  #210
Jacob
Registered User
 
Jacob's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Country: United States
Posts: 25,860
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zen Arcade View Post
Bortuzzo isn't soft or anything, but he and Engelland aren't in the same league in that regard. Engelland's hitting is only part of it, he makes life miserable for people out there.

Like the Dr. Crane said, lots of guys can look physical in the AHL. I saw Ben Lovejoy doing a lot of the same stuff that endeared Bortuzzo to some people here during the AHL playoffs. I don't think that will be his game if he makes it to the NHL, and certainly not his bread and butter.
I think it will be. I'm not like, super high on Bortuzzo, but I think he brings what we're lacking on the back end: size and physical play. And he's not a complete idiot with the puck, either.

Jacob is offline  
Old
08-07-2012, 11:26 PM
  #211
Zen Arcade
eat the record cover
 
Zen Arcade's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Pittsburgh
Country: United States
Posts: 14,209
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jacob View Post
I think it will be. I'm not like, super high on Bortuzzo, but I think he brings what we're lacking on the back end: size and physical play. And he's not a complete idiot with the puck, either.
I see him as more of a positional guy that uses his size to angle guys off the puck, rather than a guy that's going to be throwing a ton of hits.

Zen Arcade is online now  
Old
08-07-2012, 11:28 PM
  #212
Ominous Grey
Registered User
 
Ominous Grey's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Pennsylvania
Country: United States
Posts: 2,992
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by jmelm View Post
I also would not be surprised AT ALL if Despres is the D prospect of ours who is the one that gets traded for a forward. I'd rather lose him than Harrington, Dumoulin, Morrow or Pouliot.
Agreed.

I'm more sold on Niskanen having a breakout season than Despres. I loved the way he looked in the Q, but his weaknesses have been really obvious at the pro level thus far.

Ominous Grey is offline  
Old
08-08-2012, 12:06 AM
  #213
ColePens
Global Moderator
Your Savior
 
ColePens's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Pittsburgh
Country: United States
Posts: 32,484
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to ColePens
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jacob View Post
Despres will/should start in the minors because he at least has that option. Once injuries hit or trades open things up he'll be in Pittsburgh to stay. Kinda like Whitney in 05-06, or Letang in 07-08.
Agree completely. It's proven to work. But I'm expecting the forums/websites/etc. to act the same way as the last two times this happened.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rowdy Roddy Peeper View Post
...and hitting.

If they do the rest of what Engelland's been doing much better than how Engelland's been doing it, they'll basically be top 4 guys.
But do you believe they can do it? I sure as hell do not.

ColePens is offline  
Old
08-08-2012, 12:52 AM
  #214
Zbynek
Registered User
 
Zbynek's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Lisbon, Portugal
Country: Portugal
Posts: 863
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by mpp9 View Post
I wouldn't be surprised if [Despres] is moved. One would have to imagine his play last year caught the eye of several GMs.

But it'd have to be the right deal. A longterm linemate for Sidney Crosby.
Disagree.

Despres brings serious size to the table, something that no one else on the NHL roster really has. Brian Dumoulin would have to really, really impress for me to believe that Despres is expendable.

Zbynek is offline  
Old
08-08-2012, 01:12 AM
  #215
Riptide
Moderator
 
Riptide's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Yukon
Country: Canada
Posts: 8,747
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zen Arcade View Post
Bortuzzo isn't soft or anything, but he and Engelland aren't in the same league in that regard. Engelland's hitting is only part of it, he makes life miserable for people out there.

Like the Dr. Crane said, lots of guys can look physical in the AHL. I saw Ben Lovejoy doing a lot of the same stuff that endeared Bortuzzo to some people here during the AHL playoffs. I don't think that will be his game if he makes it to the NHL, and certainly not his bread and butter.
If he wants to stick in the NHL he will change his game slightly. Because being a bit more physical and having a slightly nasty streak is what will keep him here longer than almost anything else.

That being said I'm not sure that's his game, but I'd be content if he's sound defensively and half as physical as Engo.

Riptide is offline  
Old
08-08-2012, 01:18 AM
  #216
Riptide
Moderator
 
Riptide's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Yukon
Country: Canada
Posts: 8,747
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zbynek View Post
Disagree.

Despres brings serious size to the table, something that no one else on the NHL roster really has. Brian Dumoulin would have to really, really impress for me to believe that Despres is expendable.
Dumoulin is suppose to be just as ready as Despres according to the TSN guys when he was acquired. Dumoulin is 6-4, as is Bortuzzo. That said I agree that you only move Despres in the right deal.

Riptide is offline  
Old
08-08-2012, 01:21 AM
  #217
Zen Arcade
eat the record cover
 
Zen Arcade's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Pittsburgh
Country: United States
Posts: 14,209
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Riptide View Post
If he wants to stick in the NHL he will change his game slightly. Because being a bit more physical and having a slightly nasty streak is what will keep him here longer than almost anything else.

That being said I'm not sure that's his game, but I'd be content if he's sound defensively and half as physical as Engo.
I don't know, there's something to be said for a huge guy that's got pretty good mobility and very good positioning. His reach alone will help him a lot.

For whatever we all may disagree on here, at least we're not touting Joe Morrow as a big hitter with little offensive upside.

Zen Arcade is online now  
Old
08-08-2012, 01:24 AM
  #218
Honour Over Glory
Registered User
 
Honour Over Glory's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: North America
Country: United Kingdom
Posts: 9,668
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Von Malkin View Post
Holmgren isn't going to sit on his ass passively waiting until the deadline to make a move. I still think philly will acquire a big name dman before the season begins. Seems kind of premature to count our Philly of the Atlantic
Like most Pens fans, I hate the Flyers, but I kind of admire that Holmgren does go out and make changes...he does make a lot of stupid ones too, but his team is still competitive every year, can't hate on that as a hockey fan.

The only thing that sort of irks me about the Pens right now is how Bylsma treats young forwards trying to make an impact on the roster.

Honour Over Glory is offline  
Old
08-08-2012, 06:40 AM
  #219
bigd
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 4,772
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Frasier Crane View Post
I honestly don't care about losing Bortuzzo - and to a lesser extent Strait - to waivers.
That's why you're not a GM.

bigd is offline  
Old
08-08-2012, 06:51 AM
  #220
bigd
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 4,772
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by ColePens View Post
Agree completely. It's proven to work. But I'm expecting the forums/websites/etc. to act the same way as the last two times this happened.



But do you believe they can do it? I sure as hell do not.
I think Strait & Bortuzzo both have the ability to be much better players than Engelland and I think they will prove that in camp. Engelland is sooo overated by fans on this board. I love his hitting and his fighting just as much as any fan but I just don't see a skill set that is above what Strait and Bortuzzo already have. And they have age on their side.

bigd is offline  
Old
08-08-2012, 07:25 AM
  #221
Le Magnifique 66
Let's Go Pens
 
Le Magnifique 66's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Montreal
Country: Canada
Posts: 14,257
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Honour Over Glory View Post
Like most Pens fans, I hate the Flyers, but I kind of admire that Holmgren does go out and make changes...he does make a lot of stupid ones too, but his team is still competitive every year, can't hate on that as a hockey fan.

The only thing that sort of irks me about the Pens right now is how Bylsma treats young forwards trying to make an impact on the roster.
Yes Holmgren has guts to make big moves but at the end of the day i'm not so sure we would be too happy if he was our GM and woke up one day and decided to trade one of the 2 best players in the world just because he thinks we need to change things.

Le Magnifique 66 is offline  
Old
08-08-2012, 07:26 AM
  #222
Le Magnifique 66
Let's Go Pens
 
Le Magnifique 66's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Montreal
Country: Canada
Posts: 14,257
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by ThosePuckingPenguins View Post
With Meszaros out for Philly, I believe it just became a two team race for the Atlantic. Though you never know, especially with the Flyers.
All depends which Bryzgalov shows up for them, hopefully it's the one we saw late last year

Le Magnifique 66 is offline  
Old
08-08-2012, 07:47 AM
  #223
ColePens
Global Moderator
Your Savior
 
ColePens's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Pittsburgh
Country: United States
Posts: 32,484
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to ColePens
Quote:
Originally Posted by bigd View Post
I think Strait & Bortuzzo both have the ability to be much better players than Engelland and I think they will prove that in camp. Engelland is sooo overated by fans on this board. I love his hitting and his fighting just as much as any fan but I just don't see a skill set that is above what Strait and Bortuzzo already have. And they have age on their side.
This is my biggest argument about fans to think Engo is overrated. We need guys like him on defense. You can have all the skill you want... but it's not a need every time on defense. Do you think Scuderi has half the skill that Martin has? Hell no. What makes him better is his attention to detail in the defensive zone.

Engo punishes people in the d-zone. He also plays 1 on 1 very well. He joins the rush well. And the major thing we need is a guy willing to battle in front of the net to send a message. Engo does all of those things.

I'm not saying Strait or Bort aren't skilled. But we aren't in need of skill. We need simplicity in our d-zone. Hell, even Lovejoy had more skill than Engo. You know what you get with #5... and we need that in our d-zone.

ColePens is offline  
Old
08-08-2012, 07:49 AM
  #224
SEALBound
Registered User
 
SEALBound's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 7,137
vCash: 500
If Bortuzzo could make the team along with Despres and Dumoulin...maybe not this year but next....we'd have some serious size on the blue line.

I like Strait better than Bortuzzo...but I like Bortz size. Tough choice

SEALBound is online now  
Old
08-08-2012, 07:53 AM
  #225
Shady Machine
Registered User
 
Shady Machine's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 12,398
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Til the End of Time View Post
we always overrate mediocre prospects.

engelland has at least proven hes a capable physical bottom pairing d-man in the nhl, possibly more.

i would be thrilled if one of bortuzzo or strait ending up being a legit nhl defensemen. theyve proven next to nothing at the nhl level. if one of them leaves, i wouldnt be too upset.
What is next to nothing in your eyes? Strait has looked like an NHL defender every game he's played in, including the playoffs. How is that next to nothing?

Shady Machine is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 11:52 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2014 All Rights Reserved.