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Hockey News predicts Jets 14th in East

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Old
08-08-2012, 04:40 PM
  #26
garret9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KevFist View Post
lol.

Complete embarrassment is a bit of an overstatement, don't ya think?
hyperbolization to stress point I think

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08-08-2012, 04:43 PM
  #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KevFist View Post
lol.

Complete embarrassment is a bit of an overstatement, don't ya think?
Maybe it is a little harsh. I was thinking in terms of their defensive play / goals against etc which was really really bad.

Embarrassment was probably a little much.

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08-08-2012, 04:51 PM
  #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by truck View Post
Maybe it is a little harsh. I was thinking in terms of their defensive play / goals against etc which was really really bad.

Embarrassment was probably a little much.
Ya...
But an improvement from 49.05 (20th) to 51.05 (11th) fenwick close is pretty impressive coaching/progress

I know what my next project is for the stats thread

Edit for WJG:
The Jets improved from being a Thrashers team that had possession approximately 49.05% of the time to 51.05% of the time
I'm going to finish my Pav's writeup in the analytical thread and then add on a Thrashers vs Jets writeup and then I'll be done for heavy analytics on last year hahah promise!


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Old
08-08-2012, 05:49 PM
  #29
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You stats people...

I feel like I'm back in my Arthur A. Leach Jr. High statistics class.

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08-08-2012, 07:09 PM
  #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by truck View Post
Hockey news... More like Hockey Poos! Am I right?

Most "experts" believe the Jets are among the most improved teams in the league.

I don't know why or how they figure they got worse.

One of my compadres broke down their piece and shredded them -> here.
1st, your buddy did a good job.

THN used to be a worthwhile read but has really become just a pile of bloggers with a guaranteed paycheck.
There are 2 (I won't mention their names) that I see as comedians rather then reputable reporters. A few others are OK but few present media seem to have more insight then the average blogger or poster.

The Jets were a bubble team until near the end of the season (they had a good chance of being the #3 seed) & I believe they've improved. No real roster loses & Joker & Poni look like upgrades over last year.
There are others in the SE that have added talent & look good (Carolina) but I figure we'll finish anywhere between 7-12 (again with that slight chance of winning the SE for the #3 seeding if the 'Canes run into injury problems).

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Old
08-08-2012, 08:25 PM
  #31
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I kind of agree, sorry fellas

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08-08-2012, 08:30 PM
  #32
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Jets should be closer to 8th than 14th.

But, no one can predict injuries and their impact, especially to key players. For instance, Pavs being out for significant time may just make that lottery pick a reality.

That said, the Jets were flirting with 1st place in the SE near the end of the season, even with those dreaded games in hand. It's not out of the realm of possibility they are right back there this year.

IMO, we didn't have a solid #2 center or #2 RW'er for most of last year. The GST line was a fantastic #4 line that played too many minutes and against far greater quality opponents. Jokinen and Poni offers better options for 3 'solid' lines (with a hole here or there). If Mittens or Welly or better yet Machacek fills that hole, our depth is better than some teams (couldn't always say that).

We're still a player or two away (upgrades are still needed) at forward, but they are getting close, IMHO, to a solid playoff team.

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Old
08-09-2012, 12:16 AM
  #33
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Anything can happen. And it probably will.

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Old
08-09-2012, 12:49 AM
  #34
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What a joke.
Proves once again how terrible the Hockey News is.
Just terrible.

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Old
08-09-2012, 02:18 AM
  #35
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Please don't try to sound like childish Bomber fans when you hear a pre-season prediction, people.

IMO, you need to look at who is up, who is down, and who is breaking even. For every up, there needs to be a down. Here's my list, based solely on off-season transactions and the injury situation:

The "ups" are:
NY Rangers - up
Pittsburgh - up
Winnipeg - up
Tampa Bay - up
Carolina - up
Minnesota - up
Colorado - up
Edmonton - up
Dallas - up

And the "downs" are:
Philadelphia - down
New Jersey - down
Boston - down
Washington - down
Vancouver - down
Calgary - down
Detroit - down
Nashville - down
Phoenix - down

And the "evens" are:
NY Islanders - even
Ottawa - even
Buffalo - even
Toronto - even
Montreal - even
Florida - even
St. Louis - even
Chicago - even
Columbus - even
San Jose - even
Los Angeles - even
Anaheim - even

For various reasons, I suspect that some teams will drop or improve even though there has been no change in the apparent quality of their personnel. But that is another matter.

I would be thrilled to see the Jets in 8th. All told, I suspect anywhere from 7th to 12th.

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08-09-2012, 06:35 AM
  #36
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I feel their prediction is a bit low but we did squeeked out a ton of OT wins and one goal games that could of went either way last season. That being said it is a team sport and anything can happen. My hope is that joki and poni click with their new linemates and we secure Kane. I feel we will finish anywhere from 8-12 in the east.


Last edited by tacogeoff: 08-09-2012 at 09:02 AM.
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Old
08-09-2012, 08:14 AM
  #37
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Wouldn't be surprised if a few things went right and we made the playoffs, or if a few things went wrong and we ended up between 13th and 9th.

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08-09-2012, 09:40 AM
  #38
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I believe that with the decent top-9 that we have, we will improve on our back to back record and our road record. That said, we should be able to improve on our 11th place finish in the East.

14th? I know some teams have improved in the off-season but I don't think we've peaked at 11th place... our team is full of young talent that will continue to improve.

Perhaps THN doesn't pay attention to Winnipeg and treats us like they would Atlanta? Or they wanted to stir up some controversy and get website traffic?

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08-09-2012, 04:46 PM
  #39
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I hate predictions before the season starts. This goes with the NFL as well. They have nothing to talk about lol.

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Old
08-09-2012, 07:20 PM
  #40
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I think this rating has more to do (regardless of what's printed) with the thought that everyone around the Jets in the SE improved, and were better than the Jets to begin with (down seasons aside in Carolina, Tampa and Washington).

That the Jets still had a mathematical chance as late as they did last year says more IMO about how poorly other teams did than how good the Jets were.

I would hope the team continues to improve; this could happen and the Jets could still end up with fewer points because of stronger opposition teams.

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Old
08-10-2012, 03:07 PM
  #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by trebendan View Post
The Hockey News' website predicts the Jets will finish in 14th place in the East for 2012-13. Isn't that a virtual guarantee that the Jets will now make the playoffs?
Aw poo

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Old
08-10-2012, 06:01 PM
  #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KevFist View Post
lol.

Complete embarrassment is a bit of an overstatement, don't ya think?
No kidding. We were even in a playoff position at one point. Now the franchise's history is embarrassing. Zero playoff wins in 12 years.... eeek!!!

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Old
08-20-2012, 08:24 PM
  #43
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I didn't want to start a new thread, and I am preparing to get a mountain of stats thrown at me, but I think we (Jets Board posters) are getting dangerously close to overating our team/players as much as Leafs fans. While 14th in the East may be a bit low, my guess is we will end up roughly where we did last year (11th) same as the year before, and the year before that etc. This franchise has made the post season once and has never won a playoff game. While I think we have a good young core to build around, we are probably 4-5 years away from contending (best case senario and if everything falls perfectly into place).

However, if someone was just to read this board over the summer and never actually watched the Jets play you could come to no other conclusion other then that we are a perenial power house

A summary would read something like this: We have 3 #1 defenseman. Buff top 5 if only he would tighten up his defense a bit, Toby top 15, tough a bit undersized, Bogo on the verge of stardom and future Norris throphy candidate (okay I believe that one )

On forward we have 2 #1 lines - 1a and 1b (even though perenial journey-man Kyle Wellwood will likely be rounding out the 2nd line). Never mind we have one of the best 4th lines in the game. In goal we also have one of the best young goalies in the game.

That team sounds more like the Habs of the late 70's than the Jets of 2012.

I'm usually one of the guys that goes around with rose coloured glasses on but I think we are in need of some of the glass half empty posts. But man I wish we actually had the team listed above

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Old
08-20-2012, 08:36 PM
  #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KingBogo View Post
I didn't want to start a new thread, and I am preparing to get a mountain of stats thrown at me, but I think we (Jets Board posters) are getting dangerously close to overating our team/players as much as Leafs fans. While 14th in the East may be a bit low, my guess is we will end up roughly where we did last year (11th) same as the year before, and the year before that etc. This franchise has made the post season once and has never won a playoff game. While I think we have a good young core to build around, we are probably 4-5 years away from contending (best case senario and if everything falls perfectly into place).

However, if someone was just to read this board over the summer and never actually watched the Jets play you could come to no other conclusion other then that we are a perenial power house

A summary would read something like this: We have 3 #1 defenseman. Buff top 5 if only he would tighten up his defense a bit, Toby top 15, tough a bit undersized, Bogo on the verge of stardom and future Norris throphy candidate (okay I believe that one )

On forward we have 2 #1 lines - 1a and 1b (even though perenial journey-man Kyle Wellwood will likely be rounding out the 2nd line). Never mind we have one of the best 4th lines in the game. In goal we also have one of the best young goalies in the game.

That team sounds more like the Habs of the late 70's than the Jets of 2012.

I'm usually one of the guys that goes around with rose coloured glasses on but I think we are in need of some of the glass half empty posts. But man I wish we actually had the team listed above
....

Well who asked you?

Didn't your mother tell you that if you had nothing nice to say, don't say anything at all?

I think I've made my point.

Did that go as you expected? Nope, I don't think it did.

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Old
08-20-2012, 08:54 PM
  #45
KingBogo
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sully1410 View Post
....

Well who asked you?

Didn't your mother tell you that if you had nothing nice to say, don't say anything at all?

I think I've made my point.

Did that go as you expected? Nope, I don't think it did.
I may have been a bit of a smart***, but I was under the impression it was okay to be a little more critical and not just be a cheerleader.

And Yea it went almost exactly how I expected.

I wasn't around the board last summer, so maybe it's a off season thing where we pump the tires a lot. But I remember a team that earned it's 22nd place finish in league standings, while we may have improved a bit overall I don't see us moving out of the bottom third.

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08-20-2012, 08:55 PM
  #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KingBogo View Post
I may have been a bit of a smart***, but I was under the impression it was okay to be a little more critical and not just be a cheerleader.

And Yea it went almost exactly how I expected.

I wasn't around the board last summer, so maybe it's a off season thing where we pump the tires a lot. But I remember a team that earned it's 22nd place finish in league standings, while we may have improved a bit overall I don't see us moving out of the bottom third.
It will happen every summer.

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Old
08-20-2012, 09:05 PM
  #47
garret9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KingBogo View Post
I didn't want to start a new thread, and I am preparing to get a mountain of stats thrown at me, but I think we (Jets Board posters) are getting dangerously close to overating our team/players as much as Leafs fans. While 14th in the East may be a bit low, my guess is we will end up roughly where we did last year (11th) same as the year before, and the year before that etc. This franchise has made the post season once and has never won a playoff game. While I think we have a good young core to build around, we are probably 4-5 years away from contending (best case senario and if everything falls perfectly into place).

However, if someone was just to read this board over the summer and never actually watched the Jets play you could come to no other conclusion other then that we are a perenial power house

A summary would read something like this: We have 3 #1 defenseman. Buff top 5 if only he would tighten up his defense a bit, Toby top 15, tough a bit undersized, Bogo on the verge of stardom and future Norris throphy candidate (okay I believe that one )

On forward we have 2 #1 lines - 1a and 1b (even though perenial journey-man Kyle Wellwood will likely be rounding out the 2nd line). Never mind we have one of the best 4th lines in the game. In goal we also have one of the best young goalies in the game.

That team sounds more like the Habs of the late 70's than the Jets of 2012.

I'm usually one of the guys that goes around with rose coloured glasses on but I think we are in need of some of the glass half empty posts. But man I wish we actually had the team listed above
I think I'm one of the people you directed this towards.
There is a difference between being optimistic and unrealistic, and I think you're confusing the two.

I think this team has improved greatly, but I think that puts them realistically as a 7th-8th seed upside with 12th place low (obviously in East not overall haha... I wish), dependent on injuries and hot/cold streaks... I think most of the people you're mentioning think the same. That sounds pretty realistic and reasonably level headed to me. No Habs of the 70's and no plan-the-parade attitude. The only one's like that I've seen is tongue-and-cheek being silly.

What most of us have seen is that we had a few major problems and many of these have been addressed. They may have not been perfected, but most of the ones not addressed could possibly be dealt with internally:
  • Goaltending - TNSE is hoping Pav's can reach his potential as shown by his contract extension; I'm skeptical and have been vocal here of it but I still hope
  • Centre Depth - Jokinen was signed pushing a top6 C into third and third to fourth; we're not a golden team by any level but I think last year we were terrible here, arguably one of the weakest
  • Scoring Depth - Ponikarovsky with the person pushed down by Jokinen creates a competent third line
  • Penalty Kill - personally I think loss of GST as a 3rd line will help this but not be enough, we will probably be sub-par here but hopefully better; hopefully we can at least improve our number of penalties
  • Shots against - we improved here last year from league worst to simply bellow-avg and hopefully the improved depth and lack of GST as 3rd line will improve this
  • Defense/GoalsAgainst - to me this is a combo of a few problems: Buff's over pinching (slightly improved over season), poor covering Buff by offence (slightly improved over season), GST as third line, centre depth (they act as 3rd Dman), and Pavelec's lack of consistency
  • Penalties/Back-to-Backs/Away - a lot of these problems arise when you have weak depth. Without depth you are easier to be linematched against, especially away. You get outplayed, then tired, then make dumb penalties. Also, Pavelec has a bad history with back-to-backs

I think what most of us see is improvement and potential; it's a step forward. Not a contender.
Also, I stand by my 1a) 1b) statement. It doesn't mean that our team is filled of All-Stars. It means we have two lines that, if used appropriately (AKA shelter that 1b line), the Jets can have average first lines production from two lines. The Jets roster is built as a community scoring team, and will succeed and fail as such.


I'm curious why you don't think they are first line players. Too often we mix up Elite with 1st line value. If they score at first line rates than they are first line players don't you think?
In my post I calculated:
*2 to be elite (top 10): Kane and Wheeler
*2 to be average (11-20): Ladd and Little
*1 to be mix bag (2nd line C but 1st line PP): Jokinen
*1 to be weak (20-30): Wellwood... and I've stated multiple times he is unlikely (but still possible) to reach that scoring level again


Last edited by garret9: 08-20-2012 at 10:12 PM.
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Old
08-20-2012, 09:22 PM
  #48
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Here is the thing, I cant believe how long the Jets competed for a playoff spot last year without a third line. I cant think of any other teams in the league that had a lack of depth on the third line as the Jets did (and yes, I loved the GST line but they should be a fourth line in the NHL not a third line on the depth chart but they had to be with the lack of third liners on the squad)
Having said this, I still think the Jets will finish 8-10th in the East and that is with many guys having career years. The key will be their defensive posture and how low their team GAA will go.
But, having said all that, they will sneak in

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08-20-2012, 09:52 PM
  #49
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I guess I just feel a bit of a disconnect from all the positives I keep reading about and between a team I remember having a lot of needs and deficencies. I guess a more critical analysis will come when they actually start playing hockey again.

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08-20-2012, 10:08 PM
  #50
garret9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KingBogo View Post
I guess I just feel a bit of a disconnect from all the positives I keep reading about and between a team I remember having a lot of needs and deficencies. I guess a more critical analysis will come when they actually start playing hockey again.
Most likely... then you'll see everyone getting angry at me for slamming Pavelec again...

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