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Kadri To Penguins

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Old
08-16-2012, 06:15 PM
  #126
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Originally Posted by Leaffan16 View Post
Haha I love when people try to make assumptions on a person when they haven't seen them play. And I'm guessing that Tyler Ennis is a bust also because he is small? Also I never knew a center had to be a powerforward. He is 6 foot and a half which is right on league par. He is doing training this summer with Gary freakin Roberts. Don't even try to put a report on a player again, unless you have seen them play. He never goes out of position to make a big hit.
This is seriously deja vu from Hodgson debates a year ago!

I don't think Kadri will bust, in fact I'd consider trading for him. A nearly PPG in the AHL player not yet 22 year old...

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08-16-2012, 06:15 PM
  #127
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As a Canucks fan who doesn't like the Leafs or most of their fans (heh), I hope that Kadri makes their team and just rips it up. The avalanche of disdain and invective aimed at that young guy irritates me even more than their fan base!

It would be freaking awesome to see him become a solid top six player.

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08-16-2012, 06:18 PM
  #128
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Toronto, please understand that no sane Penguins fan would do Despres+Harrington for Kadri+Leivo.

If that trade actually happened, it would be the worst trade in the history of the Penguins franchise. Drastically worse implications than the Jagr trade

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08-16-2012, 06:18 PM
  #129
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You have to think that the Pens would rather pony up a bigger deal for a more proven top 6 winger for Crosby. I am not saying Kadri will be a bust and I think it is stupid how people come in here and act like they are scouts

Edit: Was Kadri drafted a center? Is he learning the game at the wing position now?

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08-16-2012, 06:28 PM
  #130
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Originally Posted by Shrimper View Post
You're missing my point. What was I was saying was that you can't judge from ONE video.

You have to watch players in games and not just judge on videos like that.
Which was exactly my point. You have to watch a player in many games, not just the ones from a couple of years ago when said player wasn't ready to make the jump and simply needed more development to mature. This unsubstantiated bust labeling is becoming quite comical on this forum, really drags the place down.

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08-16-2012, 06:32 PM
  #131
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Originally Posted by DatsyukOwns View Post
You have to think that the Pens would rather pony up a bigger deal for a more proven top 6 winger for Crosby. I am not saying Kadri will be a bust and I think it is stupid how people come in here and act like they are scouts

Edit: Was Kadri drafted a center? Is he learning the game at the wing position now?
Yes and yes, he's also been moved back to center.

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08-16-2012, 06:33 PM
  #132
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bouwmeester for kadri and 2nd round pick.

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08-16-2012, 06:38 PM
  #133
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I like Kadri but I just don't think he's what the Pens need. IMO it will take some time for him to find his game but I do think of him as a center and not a winger.

As a Pens fan I would really hope that a deal can be struck for Kulemin. He would fit Malkins LW as Kunitz moves up to play with Sid.

Whats the asking price on him? Is Despres enough? Mobile, top 4 defenseman that is NHL ready.

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08-16-2012, 07:02 PM
  #134
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Originally Posted by Leaffan16 View Post
Yes he has been training in the Summer. With Gary Roberts. nuff said. So yes, you just wasted your time writing that.
Other players train to. True story. He may be training with Roberts, but that doesn't mean the issue will magically go away.

When he actually shows he can leverage himself against an AHL caliber blueliner who is leaning on him, then he should be ready for the NHL. I saw Kadri play a ton last season and anyone who tells me his strength isn't a big issue, is blind or related to him.

Two of the biggest things that can hold a talented player back from the NHL is skating and strength.

Despres and Morrow have just as much talent as Kadri and they are both country strong. Both of them are also exceptional skaters as well. So again, you want to know why Shrimper likes these two more than Kadri, there you go.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheFinnishKulemin View Post
Why would we want a player whose talent has nothing to do with dominating board play to do something he is neither well suited for nor needed for?

Sending Kadri in to do board play is like trying to fit a square peg in a round hole.
Board play is essential to being a successful NHL player. I'm not even going to get into this because it is a silly argument...

Quote:
Originally Posted by tbone87 View Post
I absolutely agree that Kadri needs to get stronger. That's not to say that he is soft because he definitely does like to throw his body around, but he does get knocked off the puck too easily. I'm hoping that a summer of training with Gary Roberts pays big dividends in that department.
That being said, I am definitely not worried about it. Kadri's still a young kid at 21 and still growing into his body. He may never be the strongest guy in the league but I don't believe it will be a major issue throughout his career.
I wasn't trying to bash Kadri, just explain to another poster why Shrimper had a very good reason to like Despres and Morrow over Kadri. I just feel like there are more questions around Kadri, than those two. Now if this was about trading Beau Bennett for Kadri, it would be a different story, because BB has some issues as well.

My wife is a die hard Leafs fan and I want to see Kadri do well. I'm just being flat out honest about him, eventhough I knew some Leaf fans such as the ones above would get all offended about it. I have no reason to blast the Leafs, although I do understand why some Leaf fans are so sensitive to thinking everyone is a troll if they say anything negative about the Leafs.

I just say what I see on the ice... I think Beau Bennett needs a ton of work on his skating and that worries the hell out of me. It is what it is. Just because he is a Pens prospect, doesn't mean I am going to be a homer about his issues.

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08-16-2012, 07:08 PM
  #135
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Originally Posted by Mr Jiggyfly View Post
Other players train to. True story. He may be training with Roberts, but that doesn't mean the issue will magically go away.

When he actually shows he can leverage himself against an AHL caliber blueliner who is leaning on him, then he should be ready for the NHL. I saw Kadri play a ton last season and anyone who tells me his strength isn't a big issue, is blind or related to him.

Two of the biggest things that can hold a talented player back from the NHL is skating and strength.

Despres and Morrow have just as much talent as Kadri and they are both country strong. Both of them are also exceptional skaters as well. So again, you want to know why Shrimper likes these two more than Kadri, there you go.



Board play is essential to being a successful NHL player. I'm not even going to get into this because it is a silly argument...



I wasn't trying to bash Kadri, just explain to another poster why Shrimper had a very good reason to like Despres and Morrow over Kadri. I just feel like there are more questions around Kadri, than those two. Now if this was about trading Beau Bennett for Kadri, it would be a different story, because BB has some issues as well.

My wife is a die hard Leafs fan and I want to see Kadri do well. I'm just being flat out honest about him, eventhough I knew some Leaf fans such as the ones above would get all offended about it. I have no reason to blast the Leafs, although I do understand why some Leaf fans are so sensitive to thinking everyone is a troll if they say anything negative about the Leafs.

I just say what I see on the ice... I think Beau Bennett needs a ton of work on his skating and that worries the hell out of me. It is what it is. Just because he is a Pens prospect, doesn't mean I am going to be a homer about his issues.
Really, then why did a good sum of his goals lately come from the dirty areas (ie overpowering defenders) in front of their own net?

Oh wait I forgot you're talking about last year.

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08-16-2012, 07:14 PM
  #136
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If the Penguins move Simon Despres it is for an established NHL veteran winger that can immediately come in and play in the top-6.

Trading Despres for Kadri is a lateral move for the Penguins at best. We become weaker defensively while adding to a position we are already deep at (center). Makes zero sense. Kadri still has a lot of development ahead of him - who knows if he's ready to make the transition to wing. If we were converting a center to wing I'd rather do this internally with Dustin Jeffrey.

Despres for Kulemin and we might have discussion. Although there would be other wingers I'd target first if Simon Despres was on the table.

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08-16-2012, 07:25 PM
  #137
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It's pretty safe to say Kadri isn't going to be moved.

He would have made the leafs roster out of camp last year but suffered a last minute knee injury. As a result, Frattin made the team and became the first call-up, as Kadri worked back into game shape.

If he makes it this year, it'll be in a top 6 role. The presence of Kulemin and MacArthur has made it difficult for him to break into the top6 over the past 2 years, but Carlyle will likely play one of these guys on the 3rd line (he played Steckel-MacA as his 3rd line heavily last year). So it looks like there will be a spot on the 2nd line for Kadri and Frattin to fight for, with Kadri likely getting the nod out of camp.

The only thing I can think of that would keep Kadri (or Frattin) from playing in the top6 would be JVR not working out at centre.

Lupul-JVR-Kessel
Kulie-Grabo-Kadri

OR

Lupul-Bozak-Kessel
Kulie-Grabo-JVR

Just my $0.02

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08-16-2012, 07:28 PM
  #138
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Originally Posted by Leaffan16 View Post
Okay, Find me some hits from Crosby, or is he soft as butter also?
Highlight reel hits have little to do with whether a player is soft or not. You can tell Crosby is not "soft as butter" because of the way he plays. He'll take a hit to make a play. He'll go to the corners hard, plays hard on the puck, battles players for the puck, and he goes to the front of the net even when he has to take punishment to do it. That's good, hard hockey. A soft player can still dish out a big hit, just by taking advantage of a vulnerable player. It's what a player does when he might be the one getting hit, that defines whether he's soft.

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08-16-2012, 07:33 PM
  #139
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Despres for Kulemin and we might have discussion. Although there would be other wingers I'd target first if Simon Despres was on the table.
Probably not. If we traded our arguably best and most NHL-ready prospect to Toronto for a proven winger, I would want Lupul. After all, we do have Princesss_Sass to cozy up with him...

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08-16-2012, 08:14 PM
  #140
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Originally Posted by thebluemachine View Post
Really, then why did a good sum of his goals lately come from the dirty areas (ie overpowering defenders) in front of their own net?

Oh wait I forgot you're talking about last year.
You know who scored mostly dirty goals in front of the net in the A, but lacked the strength to play in the NHL?

Caputi. I'm sure as a Leafs fan you may of heard the name...

Again, suggesting Kadri is some kind of bull in the A is comical. I see a ton of Leaf games every year. I see a ton of Marlie games every year. I'm willing to bet I know as much about the Leafs farm as any die hard Leafer.

You can tell me Kadri is talented. You can tell me he has good hockey sense. You can tell me he works hard on most of his shifts. But don't tell me he was strong enough for the NHL last season.

Maybe this season he will show he is strong enough, but that is a big maybe. Big enough to lend validity to Shrimper's statement that Despres and Morrow are preferable to Kadri.

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08-16-2012, 08:18 PM
  #141
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Originally Posted by Blitzburgh87 View Post
In my own opinion I feel as if Kadri could flourish on Crosby's wing if we could convert him to wing.

What would it take to get him?
I could flourish on crosby's wing

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08-16-2012, 08:47 PM
  #142
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explain? Why would a highly skilled prospect not work for us? don't get this negative attitude towards him. and I don't want to hear this "macA is great for the 2nd line because he scored 20 goals in 3 seasons" or anything like that (not putting words in your mouth, but that seems to be the lineups projected by many for next season) and I'd much rather have a highly skilled guy with decent size who can be physical on our 2nd line.
Because he needs a change of scenery. Kadri since he's been here has been told to be a complete player, that's not how you develop a guy of his skillset. That's how you ensure he's good at absolutely nothing by NHL standards. He needs to play in a top 6 with bigger guys who are going to cover for his defensive and puck possession issues, Toronto simply has far too many wingers better than him to allow that.

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08-16-2012, 10:00 PM
  #143
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Originally Posted by Mr Jiggyfly View Post
You know who scored mostly dirty goals in front of the net in the A, but lacked the strength to play in the NHL?

Caputi. I'm sure as a Leafs fan you may of heard the name...

Again, suggesting Kadri is some kind of bull in the A is comical. I see a ton of Leaf games every year. I see a ton of Marlie games every year. I'm willing to bet I know as much about the Leafs farm as any die hard Leafer.

You can tell me Kadri is talented. You can tell me he has good hockey sense. You can tell me he works hard on most of his shifts. But don't tell me he was strong enough for the NHL last season.

Maybe this season he will show he is strong enough, but that is a big maybe. Big enough to lend validity to Shrimper's statement that Despres and Morrow are preferable to Kadri.
For someone who claims he watched tons of Kadri (your words) you sure don't know much about how he played in the AHL and his most recent call ups in the NHL at all. His skating was more then fine, he was defensively responsible, he wasn't getting pushed around and he did not even look out of place with regular NHL'ers. In fact he was only sent down due to the numbers game at the end of the season and to aid in making a run at the Calder with the Marlies.

To be honest all I'm seeing is a lot of reaching and exaggerating on your part to make it appear to others that you know a lot about Kadri. As I mentioned earlier, you would have had a point if you were speaking about Kadri from two seasons ago, but a lot has changed since then. You're more then welcome to come ask us Leafs fans on the Leafs forum about how he is really doing but don't be surprised when you get the same answers from us Kadri "fanboys".


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08-16-2012, 10:16 PM
  #144
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Probably not. If we traded our arguably best and most NHL-ready prospect to Toronto for a proven winger, I would want Lupul. After all, we do have Princesss_Sass to cozy up with him...
lol at Lupul...

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08-16-2012, 10:20 PM
  #145
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Highlight reel hits have little to do with whether a player is soft or not. You can tell Crosby is not "soft as butter" because of the way he plays. He'll take a hit to make a play. He'll go to the corners hard, plays hard on the puck, battles players for the puck, and he goes to the front of the net even when he has to take punishment to do it. That's good, hard hockey. A soft player can still dish out a big hit, just by taking advantage of a vulnerable player. It's what a player does when he might be the one getting hit, that defines whether he's soft.
I wasn't implying that Crosby is soft, I was just trying to prove that just because a person doesn't have a highlight reel of hits, doesn't mean he is soft as butter. Kadri has done the same things that you are listing, but people that haven't watched the Leafs/Kadri play a bit are saying he is weak and soft as butter.

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08-16-2012, 11:11 PM
  #146
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For someone who claims he watched tons of Kadri (your words) you sure don't know much about how he played in the AHL and his most recent call ups in the NHL at all. His skating was more then fine, he was defensively responsible, he wasn't getting pushed around and he did not even look out of place with regular NHL'ers. In fact he was only sent down due to the numbers game at the end of the season and to aid in making a run at the Calder with the Marlies.

To be honest all I'm seeing is a lot of reaching and exaggerating on your part to make it appear to others that you know a lot about Kadri. As I mentioned earlier, you would have had a point if you were speaking about Kadri from two seasons ago, but a lot has changed since then. You're more then welcome to come ask us Leafs fans on the Leafs forum about how he is really doing but don't be surprised when you get the same answers from us Kadri "fanboys".
First of all I never mentioned his skating, which is average, but not something I have an issue with. You continue to defend his skating, yet I never talked about it. So you apparently have some worries there...

I also am not going to get into a childish game of how often I watched Kadri. I have no reason to lie. I could easily swing the pendulum the other way and say you didn't watch him very much this year, if you are under the impression he didn't have issues with his strength.

I don't have to ask you or other Leaf fans about something I saw with my own eyes. Last I checked, two years ago wasn't this past spring when I last saw him still having issues when he was being leaned on and his legs buckled, he struggled to leverage himself away from the boards, and he got out muscled way too often in 1-1 battles.

You call it exaggeration, I call it reality.

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08-16-2012, 11:18 PM
  #147
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Originally Posted by Mr Jiggyfly View Post
First of all I never mentioned his skating, which is average, but not something I have an issue with. You continue to defend his skating, yet I never talked about it. So you apparently have some worries there...

I also am not going to get into a childish game of how often I watched Kadri. I have no reason to lie. I could easily swing the pendulum the other way and say you didn't watch him very much this year, if you are under the impression he didn't have issues with his strength.

I don't have to ask you or other Leaf fans about something I saw with my own eyes. Last I checked, two years ago wasn't this past spring when I last saw him still having issues when he was being leaned on and his legs buckled, he struggled to leverage himself away from the boards, and he got out muscled way too often in 1-1 battles.

You call it exaggeration, I call it reality.
For someone claiming to dabble in reality you certainly dont find yourself securely planted in it. Kadri is a PPG player in the AHL who put up decent points in the NHL when there, has elite on ice playmaking and vision, and plays the game tough. His only two knocks were strength and defensive play. His defensive play has been much improved over this last season and he is training with roberst this summer. So before you decide to dump on another teams prospect for things done in the past remember that all prospects tend to do crazy things like develop their games over time. Each year he has gotten better and improved in areas he has been asked to improve in. He has potential to be an impact forward or even a bust but until theres a difinitive answer either way shut your toilet.

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08-16-2012, 11:20 PM
  #148
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Originally Posted by Mr Jiggyfly View Post
First of all I never mentioned his skating, which is average, but not something I have an issue with. You continue to defend his skating, yet I never talked about it. So you apparently have some worries there...

I also am not going to get into a childish game of how often I watched Kadri. I have no reason to lie. I could easily swing the pendulum the other way and say you didn't watch him very much this year, if you are under the impression he didn't have issues with his strength.

I don't have to ask you or other Leaf fans about something I saw with my own eyes. Last I checked, two years ago wasn't this past spring when I last saw him still having issues when he was being leaned on and his legs buckled, he struggled to leverage himself away from the boards, and he got out muscled way too often in 1-1 battles.

You call it exaggeration, I call it reality.
Baloney, you won't ask Leafs fans because you're afraid of the answer you'll get, that much is obvious. But carry on talking smack about a prospect you know little about now that the cat is out of the bag.

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08-16-2012, 11:29 PM
  #149
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I agree, strength and conditioning are the only things holding Nazem Kadri back. I think he'll develop (physically) and when/if he does, he would be a real treat to watch

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08-16-2012, 11:36 PM
  #150
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Originally Posted by thebluemachine View Post
Baloney, you won't ask Leafs fans because you're afraid of the answer you'll get, that much is obvious. But carry on talking smack about a prospect you know little about now that the cat is out of the bag.
It is becoming quite obvious I know more about him than you to be frank. After the Pens, there is no team whose prospects I follow and know better than the Leafs. If you don't like hearing something negative about Kadri, use the ignore function.

When someone is under a delusion, such as you are with thinking Kadri is this bull in the A who doesn't have strength issues, it is useless to even debate.

I'll state it one last time, Shrimper was spot on and there is no way in hell I would move Despres or Morrow for Kadri. I saw nothing throughout the season or during the Calder run to make me believe he is strong enough for the NHL yet. His strength issues are too worrisome (to give up a prospect like Despres or Morrow), but yes that can change this year perhaps.

Hopefully it does, because he has the talent to make an impact if he can handle the NHL grind.

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