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Sam Gagner

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Old
08-17-2012, 04:09 PM
  #26
Jamin
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Gagner is easy to sum up. You have a very vocal group of haters from HFoil where he is useless and has no value. You have a less vocal group of supporters who think he is amazing and has 70 point potential. Then you have the large majority who havent been very impressed but realize he is only 22, was in a terrible situation on a terrible team and might have more potential.

One thing these three groups have in Common is none of them want to see Horcoff as the 2nd line center. So until a prospect outplays him and takes his job, a more physical but less skilled 2nd line center is made available or the return in a trade is just too much to turn down he is on the team for the near future at least.

Unlike some of the other kids though he doesnt seem to be a cornerstone or part of the core, depending on how he plays this year that could change

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Old
08-17-2012, 04:36 PM
  #27
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I would be hard pressed to give up a first rounder for him.... early to mid 2nd rounder is about what I feel his value is.... I am sure Oiler franchise values him more than that though.

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Old
08-17-2012, 06:45 PM
  #28
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Originally Posted by Badger Mayhew View Post
He's almost at Kessel/Sedin levels of softness, but I can't deny the kid has potential.

That being said, my team (Leafs) probably wouldn't be interested in him due to already having #2C taken care of, and wanting to get bigger.



It's not just his size. He's terrified of contact.

That video's not even funny, do you know how many times I've seen that on NHL12? JK that's some funny sh**!

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Old
08-17-2012, 06:47 PM
  #29
zytz
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I'll admit to being slightly interested in Gagner once upon a time from a CHI perspective... until one of those games the Oilers spanked us. He was racing toward a puck with Brian Bickell, but had him beat by roughly 3-4 strides. He saw Bickell coming and just slowed and backed off the puck, and basically stood and watched while Bickell took possession.

A few things here:

1) Bickell doesn't hit.... like ever. Hawks fans criticize him endlessly because he's SO damn good when he uses his size, but he just refuses to do so.
2) Even if Bickell was a hitter, Gagner had him beat
3) Even if Gagner didn't have him beat, he just freaking gave away the puck. That not playing smart, or tough, or being gassed, or even protecting yourself. That's just plain giving up, and fair or not I will never want him on the Hawks because he just completely gave up on that play.

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Old
08-17-2012, 06:53 PM
  #30
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To Toronto:
Gagner


To Oilers:
Frattin
Kenny Ryan

Toronto gets a # 1/2 Center,and Edmonton gets Hometown boy Frattin and Hall's former teammate in Kenny Ryan.

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Old
08-17-2012, 07:36 PM
  #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Uncle Howie View Post
I would be hard pressed to give up a first rounder for him.... early to mid 2nd rounder is about what I feel his value is.... I am sure Oiler franchise values him more than that though.
The Oilers got a 2nd for Andrew Cogliano who has never been close to Gagner.

The Oilers simply won't be trading him without another centre with some offensive skill coming back. I don't know why these ****ing threads keep popping up

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Old
08-17-2012, 07:41 PM
  #32
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Originally Posted by Homesick View Post
The Oilers got a 2nd for Andrew Cogliano who has never been close to Gagner.

The Oilers simply won't be trading him without another centre with some offensive skill coming back. I don't know why these ****ing threads keep popping up
Well, I am sure they would trade him in a package for a top 4 D as well, as long as they have some type of plan B for a 2C that ensures Horcoff is nowhere near the top 6 on this team next year.

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Old
08-17-2012, 07:46 PM
  #33
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I think it's going to be hemsky, not gagner that gets moved. Gagner is a good option for second line C moving forward.

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Old
08-17-2012, 07:50 PM
  #34
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I think the issue with Gagner that makes him very unattractive is that he has to be placed in the role of 2nd line centerman. Its the only fit for a player of his ilk. But how many teams would have Gagner as an upgrade as the #2 centerman and tack onto that the fact that he's soft as Charmin? He's not a good option as a 3rd line centerman.

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Old
08-17-2012, 09:35 PM
  #35
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I wouldn't say that we would move Gagner unless we're getting a top paring Dman or 2nd center with size. If I were to move one, it would be Hemsky, I would look for a top 4 Defecemen for him.

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Old
08-17-2012, 10:06 PM
  #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Uncle Howie View Post
I would be hard pressed to give up a first rounder for him.... early to mid 2nd rounder is about what I feel his value is.... I am sure Oiler franchise values him more than that though.
Unless the Oilers REALLY liked a player in that range that would be a dumb move for us and I'm not even a Gagner fan. I see no reason why a team like Chicago wouldn't give up a #20-30 overall pick for Gagner. That said again unless there is a player that we really like there it makes more sense for us to trade him for something more proven.

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Old
08-17-2012, 10:16 PM
  #37
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gagne + jones to the leafs for.....

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Old
08-17-2012, 10:17 PM
  #38
Bryanbryoil
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gagne + jones to the leafs for.....
Kulemin and ?

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Old
08-17-2012, 10:31 PM
  #39
JayBeautiful
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spitsfan67 View Post
To Toronto:
Gagner


To Oilers:
Frattin
Kenny Ryan

Toronto gets a # 1/2 Center,and Edmonton gets Hometown boy Frattin and Hall's former teammate in Kenny Ryan.
I thought they were trading Gagne? not RNH

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Old
08-17-2012, 10:46 PM
  #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Homesick View Post
The Oilers got a 2nd for Andrew Cogliano who has never been close to Gagner.

The Oilers simply won't be trading him without another centre with some offensive skill coming back. I don't know why these ****ing threads keep popping up
Because folks are so used to seeing Gagner as a throw in on about 50-75% of trade proposal threads started by Oil fans that they get to thinking that he's being shopped or something.

It's not the greatest of situations.

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Old
08-18-2012, 01:23 AM
  #41
CraniumCram
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How bout a 3-way?

To Edm:
Drew Stafford

To Anaheim:
Sam Gagner
Drej Sekera
Luke Adam
2013 1st

To Buffalo:
Bobby Ryan
Tony Lydman

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Old
08-18-2012, 02:31 AM
  #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FanHabtic View Post
I think the issue with Gagner that makes him very unattractive is that he has to be placed in the role of 2nd line centerman. Its the only fit for a player of his ilk. But how many teams would have Gagner as an upgrade as the #2 centerman and tack onto that the fact that he's soft as Charmin? He's not a good option as a 3rd line centerman.
And the fact you're full of it? It took us what, one page for someone to spew out that soft BS after multiple posts explaining it

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Old
08-18-2012, 03:33 AM
  #43
PETRYDISH
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zytz View Post
I'll admit to being slightly interested in Gagner once upon a time from a CHI perspective... until one of those games the Oilers spanked us. He was racing toward a puck with Brian Bickell, but had him beat by roughly 3-4 strides. He saw Bickell coming and just slowed and backed off the puck, and basically stood and watched while Bickell took possession.

A few things here:

1) Bickell doesn't hit.... like ever. Hawks fans criticize him endlessly because he's SO damn good when he uses his size, but he just refuses to do so.
2) Even if Bickell was a hitter, Gagner had him beat
3) Even if Gagner didn't have him beat, he just freaking gave away the puck. That not playing smart, or tough, or being gassed, or even protecting yourself. That's just plain giving up, and fair or not I will never want him on the Hawks because he just completely gave up on that play.
Great post. I also form my opinions of players based on single plays. I once saw Gretzky tail off slightly and dumb the puck with a streaking dale hunter coming his way even though he clearly had him beat, 2/10 would not want on my team. Soft player.

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Old
08-18-2012, 03:53 AM
  #44
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Gagner is the best second line center the Oilers have in their organization. He has proven himself capable of putting up 40+ points a season. Removing him from the team without another player capable of replacing his production would be just plain stupid.

It's that simple.

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Old
08-18-2012, 04:03 AM
  #45
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Originally Posted by tempest2i View Post
Gagner is the best second line center the Oilers have in their organization. He has proven himself capable of putting up 40+ points a season. Removing him from the team without another player capable of replacing his production would be just plain stupid.

It's that simple.
Exactly. And this will be the first season (*knock on wood*) he will be in the mix to play with some talent: Yakupov's will go guns blazing, Hemsky could actually show up healthy and confident, and maybe Paajarvi found his courage in the AHL.

Even if he only plays consistently with just one of those guys and they find a rhythm he could have a good season, assuming he doesn't have his typical first half doldrums.

He's a decent 2C in need of the right guy(s) on his line to play with. Complimentary, and that's perfectly fine with RNH as 1C.

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Old
08-18-2012, 09:41 AM
  #46
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I'm not saying we should deal Gagner but if the right deal is tabled and we do move him I think a viable option for 2C would be Lander. He is defensively responsible and the few times he has been given any offensive opportunity he has not looked out of place and given the fact that he would be playing with 2 higher end offensive talents I think he may surprise a lot of people and actually thrive. Does need to work on his faceoffs but is strong on the boards and doesnt shy away from grinding it out.

Now this one is a little out of left field but if Paajarvi is sent down to the AHL I think they should play him at center and see how he does. He will obviously need to work on faceoffs and positioning but he has good size, plays a solid 2 way game and has blinding speed. Given some time to grow into the position I think he may also surprise a few people.

Alright thats what I had to say on the matter and I'm sure many Oiler fans will tear me a new one but these are just some of my thoughts on filling the 2C slot if we were to move Gagner in a package for a top 4D.

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Old
08-18-2012, 09:53 AM
  #47
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David krecji and a Mid level prospect for Sam ganger and Magnus paajarvi is Something I'd do as a B's fan. Krecji replaces the #2 center void and improves it but giving up paajarvi might be too much. I'm not sure how fans value him now with such a strong core ahead of him on the depth chart.

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Old
08-18-2012, 10:23 AM
  #48
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For people saying that Gagner would be available for a less skilled bigger #2C I disagree. Gagner is averaging 45pts a year, that is pretty low on the scale for centres.

If you take a less skilled guy you are looking at 35-40pts a year, which should be no where near your top 6.

Right now the best option would be to trade for a guy of equal talent that is bigger but has a smaller ceiling.

I would like the Oilers to wait on both these guys to see how things click with the top 6 this year. A lot of people complain about size being an issue but when has that stopped Detroit? Plus you have to remember that most of our players are 18-22, they are going to fill out and get a lot stronger on the puck.

Gagner might not be good at retrieving pucks from the corners but as long as we keep him at centre the bulk of that load should go to the wingers.

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Old
08-18-2012, 11:06 AM
  #49
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Originally Posted by Montecristo View Post
David krecji and a Mid level prospect for Sam ganger and Magnus paajarvi is Something I'd do as a B's fan. Krecji replaces the #2 center void and improves it but giving up paajarvi might be too much. I'm not sure how fans value him now with such a strong core ahead of him on the depth chart.
I'd do it

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Old
08-18-2012, 11:29 AM
  #50
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He'd be a good fit in Chicago I think. Don't know how to give a value since I am not sure the value of Chi prospects and youth.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeModano9 View Post
I don't like the face Gagner is only 22 and going his 5th? Season I believe. Has had 40+pts every year and has showed glimpses of raising his play. No way the Oil can afford to lose a center and not get one back right now.

Chicago just wants him because that's one of the teams he seems to elevate his game against.
Chicago doesn't want Gagner, he doesn't improve our team in any way. We have enough offense to compete with the best, and his defense is not that great. Add to that we are already one of the softest teams in the league and Gagner doesn't bring grit or toughness.

I personally wouldn't give anything of value to get Gagner, he doesn't fill any needs, if we need a 2nd line C, I would rather just use Kane or move Bolland up than trade for Sam.

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