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Just "entering" their prime

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Old
08-19-2012, 07:51 PM
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Bruins Atmosphere
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Just "entering" their prime

"If" we are to have this season start on time, with no setbacks, or shortening of the season, these are some fellas on our squad just "entering" their prime. Tyler Seguin.... still more upside coming as his body gets in NHL shape. Milan Lucic....people don't realize how young he is due to the games hes played, and that he's the most feared hockey player already.... but I think he still has more to add. David Krejci... he's very close, but I "hope" he has a little more. His passing skills are great, but he has to realize he has more than that. Brad Marchand.... he might already be there, but if not....look out. Tuukka Rask.... we saw his first full year go down in flames when Philly overtook our 3-0 lead when lost Krejci. Can he be better than that when he gets in NHL shape?? God, I hope so.
We have others already there... Chara, Seids, Bergy, Horton..(if hes 100%), Kelly...etc.
Very few may be past their prime.... but not by much. Thornton, Campbell, and Paille will always bring their speed and toughness... as will Ference. Guys that dont make bonehead mistakes. They have heart, and thats why theyre still Bruins.
My point is this... although we lost in 7 to Washington... and we haven't made any significant moves during the off-season.... WE STILL HAVE A DAMN GOOD CHANCE AT ANOTHER CUP RUN WITH THESE GUYS.

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08-19-2012, 08:03 PM
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Krejci and Bergy are entering their primes, Horton is in the middle of it, and like you said Seids and Kelly are as well.

Seguin and Marchand have quite a few years to go.

Lucic has two or three left, too.

Even though Chara is old, he's in the prime of his career now... He's never played better the past 3 seasons.

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08-19-2012, 09:24 PM
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Prime years are generally years 6-9 or ages 24-29. Prime would be where body,mind and experience are all converging at the top of the prism. Seguin's got a ways to go. Lucic is on the doorstep and Bergeron and Krejci are in it. Truly elite players will defy generalities and extend prime performances past where most players will drop off.

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08-19-2012, 09:48 PM
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He is in his prime on paper but one guy I always feel like there is more player in there is Krejci. And I think that's why people get frustrated with Krejci sometimes. He has done well but I think he should be in the 70-80 point range but he has a hard time with consistency and has battled some injuries.

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08-20-2012, 07:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 8th Rounder View Post
He is in his prime on paper but one guy I always feel like there is more player in there is Krejci. And I think that's why people get frustrated with Krejci sometimes. He has done well but I think he should be in the 70-80 point range but he has a hard time with consistency and has battled some injuries.
Always been my issue with him.

Segs/Marchand and even Looch, as stated, are years away from their prime, they`ll be hitting their`s when the Knight`s/Spooner`s/Koko`s/Hamilton`s are on the roster, and this team is so explosive that there will only be one word to describe them other than the greatest Hockey team ever...............DYNASTY

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08-20-2012, 04:38 PM
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Easy with that "DYNASTY" word

Its good to feel that way... but when the youngsters like Spooner/Knight and Hamilton come up and contribute... we have to hope our older fellas still have their game and leadership.
We also need Rask to be a true no.1 goalie. He should be, but he did have a serious injury.

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08-21-2012, 09:30 PM
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Agreed

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Originally Posted by 8th Rounder View Post
He is in his prime on paper but one guy I always feel like there is more player in there is Krejci. And I think that's why people get frustrated with Krejci sometimes. He has done well but I think he should be in the 70-80 point range but he has a hard time with consistency and has battled some injuries.
To me, the thing with Krejci is being "too" nice to his teammates and trying to hit each one with a nice pass.... even when he has a great opportunity to snipe one. He could easily net 25 goals playing on the top line with his skill-set.
JUst be nice if he added a little toughness.... not to fight or anything, but not be afraid to go to hard places. Things like that.

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08-21-2012, 11:39 PM
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Originally Posted by Bruins Atmosphere View Post
To me, the thing with Krejci is being "too" nice to his teammates and trying to hit each one with a nice pass.... even when he has a great opportunity to snipe one. He could easily net 25 goals playing on the top line with his skill-set.
JUst be nice if he added a little toughness.... not to fight or anything, but not be afraid to go to hard places. Things like that.
I think Krejci has some skill in the tough places. He works the corners very well and plays solid defense down low as well.

With Segs growing as a 2 way forward, I think theyll be able to put him with Krejci and Looch without that line being a liability this season.

I think giving Krejci a top end talent on the wing with speed and scoring ability will push him up to a 70-80 point season.

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08-22-2012, 12:19 AM
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Originally Posted by Bruins Atmosphere View Post
To me, the thing with Krejci is being "too" nice to his teammates and trying to hit each one with a nice pass.... even when he has a great opportunity to snipe one. He could easily net 25 goals playing on the top line with his skill-set.
JUst be nice if he added a little toughness.... not to fight or anything, but not be afraid to go to hard places. Things like that.
I think Krejci's toughness is a little underrated,maybe a lot underrated. When he's hustling he's producing but he's also been hampered by a hip injury,hip surgery,concussion and some unknown lower body injuries.

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08-22-2012, 05:35 AM
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Originally Posted by Bruins Atmosphere View Post
To me, the thing with Krejci is being "too" nice to his teammates and trying to hit each one with a nice pass.... even when he has a great opportunity to snipe one. He could easily net 25 goals playing on the top line with his skill-set.
JUst be nice if he added a little toughness.... not to fight or anything, but not be afraid to go to hard places. Things like that.
my feelings on DK are well known however, there are aspects to his game that I do not ignore

A- very solid positioning defensively without the puck

B- Internal toughness, not at all a creampuff

My problem with him is/has always been, consistency and urgency to his game. Too much "slow er down" and I agree, far too much generosity in his game, be nice to see him get selfish and take a shot that`s there, by the time he feeds Horty, and Horty spends his usual 8-10 seconds unleashing that shot, I`ve already taken the pooch around the block for his morning stroll

Nobody can bring "it" for 82 games + playoffs, but DK has shown, he`s got it within himself to singlehandedly change the complexion of the game when he is 100% focused and committed, far too often I question those/that area of his game/mindset, and in spite of Looch`s success on the #1 line, I`ve never been a fan of Looch playing on that line, love to see DK play with a few guys who have great first steps, Looch can get it going and move well, but it takes time, love to see DK play with a guy who can explode from stride 1

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08-22-2012, 12:02 PM
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I used to make a ritual of coding the career stage of players as follows:

1. greener than spinach

2. producing, getting better, not as good as he's gonna get

* prime

3. high mileage but still performing at a high level

4. twilight of his career

Now it's difficult to make such a system stand on four legs (ie. hold up to scrutiny where it concerns a consistent application of age, experience, expectation, health, etc. ... no system can be perfect, but the process if what makes it fun, not any notions of infallability). So, without further adieu, this is how I viewed the Bruins when they won the Cup in 2011 and how I view them heading into a possible 2012-13 season ...

2011 [injured]
17ML-2 ... 46DK-2 ... [18NH-*]
63BM-2 ... 37PB-* ... 28MR-4
73MR-* ... 23CK-* ... 49RP-*/19TS-1
20DP-2 ... 11GC-* ... 22ST-*

33ZC-* ... 44DS-*
21AF-* ... 55JB-2
22TK-3 ... 54A-2

30TT-*
40TR-2

2013
17ML-2 ... 46DK-* ... [18NH-*]
63BM-2 ... 37PB-* ... 19TS-2
38JC-2 ... 23CK-* ... 49RP-*
20DP-* ... 11GC-* ... 22ST-3

33ZC-3 ... 44DS-*
21AF-3 ... 55JB-*
--TK-2/27DH-1 ... 54A-2

40TR-2
1AK-2

I didn't take long to decide where players were/are and might revise upon review, but the exercise is fun. Mostly, it illustrates where a team is in its evolvement (totally apart from being good/successful), shows where a team is experienced vs. green, where it has young legs vs. broken-down bodies, etc.

I started doing this in the early 80's, when Park and Cashman were really old, Middleton, Milbury and McNab were in their prime, and Bourque, Pederson, Kasper and Fergus were very young. There is definitely a correlation between contenders and teams that are anchored around a nucleus mostly in its prime years. Teams that are mostly made up of young and old players without many in that sweet spot where they've got a head for the game and still got the legs as well generally don't reach the deep rounds.

The Bruins are still in very good shape for Cup contention from a general standpoint.

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08-22-2012, 12:18 PM
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Krejci and Bergy are entering their primes, Horton is in the middle of it, and like you said Seids and Kelly are as well.

Seguin and Marchand have quite a few years to go.

Lucic has two or three left, too.

Even though Chara is old, he's in the prime of his career now... He's never played better the past 3 seasons.
Seguin will reach his prime sooner than later. I think a good barometer is having success multiple years in a row.

Marchand won't get that much better offensively, but I think he can get better defensively and become more of a complete player.

Lucic I think will top out as a 55-65 point winger, but like Marchand, become a more complete player. Better positioning, better defensively, etc.

Chara I have NO idea lol. Like you said, hes played the best hes ever played in the last three seasons. Hes also a workout and health freak so Im not sure anyone can accurately gauge Chara, hes not human as far as im concerned

Seids and Kelly are in their primes, no question. Peverley too.

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08-22-2012, 12:40 PM
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Originally Posted by Tim Vezina Thomas View Post
Seguin will reach his prime sooner than later. I think a good barometer is having success multiple years in a row.

Marchand won't get that much better offensively, but I think he can get better defensively and become more of a complete player.

Lucic I think will top out as a 55-65 point winger, but like Marchand, become a more complete player. Better positioning, better defensively, etc.

Chara I have NO idea lol. Like you said, hes played the best hes ever played in the last three seasons. Hes also a workout and health freak so Im not sure anyone can accurately gauge Chara, hes not human as far as im concerned

Seids and Kelly are in their primes, no question. Peverley too.
If Seguin is the next Yzerman,we'll see his best offense in seasons 5-11.
As for Chara,he may be the most flawed but unique elite defenseman ever. Plenty of elite defenseman continue to excel through their late 30s. Slower reactions of aging players isn't as exposed on defense,more time to make decisions and usually more options.

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08-22-2012, 12:45 PM
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Originally Posted by BNHL View Post
If Seguin is the next Yzerman,we'll see his best offense in seasons 5-11.
As for Chara,he may be the most flawed but unique elite defenseman ever. Plenty of elite defenseman continue to excel through their late 30s. Slower reactions of aging players isn't as exposed on defense,more time to make decisions and usually more options.
I think Seguin will top out as an 80-90 point center, which he could feasibly reach as soon as next year.

I guess I meant he'll reach his prime point production years sooner than later. I think he'll take longer to develop his 2 way game tho. I think he has the skillset to develop a David Krejci like defensive game (good but not Selke level).

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08-22-2012, 12:55 PM
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Originally Posted by Tim Vezina Thomas View Post
I think Seguin will top out as an 80-90 point center, which he could feasibly reach as soon as next year.

I guess I meant he'll reach his prime point production years sooner than later. I think he'll take longer to develop his 2 way game tho. I think he has the skillset to develop a David Krejci like defensive game (good but not Selke level).
I think he'll be a 90 point+ player minimum. He's got work to do,a lot of it. Has shown immaturity in his game and his commitment. Leads the team in scoring based on not much more than skill.

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08-22-2012, 01:01 PM
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Originally Posted by BNHL View Post
I think he'll be a 90 point+ player minimum. He's got work to do,a lot of it. Has shown immaturity in his game and his commitment. Leads the team in scoring based on not much more than skill.
On the Bruins, that is highly unlikely.

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08-22-2012, 01:25 PM
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On the Bruins, that is highly unlikely.
He's projecting out at 82 points right now based on a premature projection. By age 22 we'll know more. How long will Clode be here? Seguin?

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08-22-2012, 01:26 PM
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Love this topic

Krejci takes a lot of heat from bruin fan's and I do see some reasoning for it but on the other hand I see other problems that prevent him from getting these 70pt + seasons ... Right now most agree he's a lock for 60pts

#1 problem PP is BRUTAL ...better PP Krejci gets more pts

#2 problem Our system prevents Huge pts by players specially when we role all 4 lines like we do

#3 problem injuries and not just Krejci anyone on your line getting hurt throws a wrench in your comfort level until you learn your new linemates habits ..

IMO underrated by most people and I still believe at age 26 he has better years ahead of him specially if we put Segs with him

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08-22-2012, 01:40 PM
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Love this topic

Krejci takes a lot of heat from bruin fan's and I do see some reasoning for it but on the other hand I see other problems that prevent him from getting these 70pt + seasons ... Right now most agree he's a lock for 60pts

#1 problem PP is BRUTAL ...better PP Krejci gets more pts

#2 problem Our system prevents Huge pts by players specially when we role all 4 lines like we do

#3 problem injuries and not just Krejci anyone on your line getting hurt throws a wrench in your comfort level until you learn your new linemates habits ..

IMO underrated by most people and I still believe at age 26 he has better years ahead of him specially if we put Segs with him
Krejci probably has star potential but needs to ramp up the effort,get some healthy seasons or both. Seguin has elite potential who will probably attain star numbers on skill alone,the question is will he jump to the elite level? On a team with 2 number 1 centers,he figures to leave them both as #2s on this team,neither can touch his raw skill. The number 1 center figures to be a much more clearly defined player by Seguin,who would then garner the minutes needed to separate himself.

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08-22-2012, 02:12 PM
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Krejci probably has star potential but needs to ramp up the effort,get some healthy seasons or both. Seguin has elite potential who will probably attain star numbers on skill alone,the question is will he jump to the elite level? On a team with 2 number 1 centers,he figures to leave them both as #2s on this team,neither can touch his raw skill. The number 1 center figures to be a much more clearly defined player by Seguin,who would then garner the minutes needed to separate himself.
Yes I hear this a lot and totally get it but I feel there is no rush to put Segs at Center others will disagree I'm a firm believer that Segs speed makes him a great winger ... I HATE using kessel as an example cause he's a 1 trick pony but Segs is just as fast and way more creative and then you add Krejci and Lucic for linemates and let them really gel ... Sounds pretty Scary to me ..Huge potential on that line

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08-22-2012, 03:37 PM
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Yes I hear this a lot and totally get it but I feel there is no rush to put Segs at Center others will disagree I'm a firm believer that Segs speed makes him a great winger ... I HATE using kessel as an example cause he's a 1 trick pony but Segs is just as fast and way more creative and then you add Krejci and Lucic for linemates and let them really gel ... Sounds pretty Scary to me ..Huge potential on that line
I'm in no rush either. He can learn one side of the ice and be the go to guy before he learns the whole ice and controls the game.

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08-23-2012, 02:05 AM
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Don't forget ....

Quote:
Originally Posted by BergyWho37 View Post
Love this topic

Krejci takes a lot of heat from bruin fan's and I do see some reasoning for it but on the other hand I see other problems that prevent him from getting these 70pt + seasons ... Right now most agree he's a lock for 60pts

#1 problem PP is BRUTAL ...better PP Krejci gets more pts

#2 problem Our system prevents Huge pts by players specially when we role all 4 lines like we do

#3 problem injuries and not just Krejci anyone on your line getting hurt throws a wrench in your comfort level until you learn your new linemates habits ..

IMO underrated by most people and I still believe at age 26 he has better years ahead of him specially if we put Segs with him
Would also be nice to have a "real" puck moving D-Man to help control the PP. Always kills me to see a 6'9 guy trying to manuver at the blue line. I pray Dougie Hamilton can light up the PP. Then Krejci wouldn't have to try and control everything.

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08-23-2012, 06:47 AM
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Would also be nice to have a "real" puck moving D-Man to help control the PP. Always kills me to see a 6'9 guy trying to manuver at the blue line. I pray Dougie Hamilton can light up the PP. Then Krejci wouldn't have to try and control everything.
I am really taking the cautious approach with personal expectations for DH in year one when it comes to what he may accomplish on the ice however, even as green as he`ll be, I have a gut feeling that his presence will be most felt on the PP when given the chance which may not come early on but who knows.

Chia/Cam and CJ all know they have a potentially special player, they will not force feed him minutes of any kind until/unless he displays an ability to not get overwhelmed. Some fans and media will undoubtedly express anger/frustration, there will be claims here screaming at Julien for "ruining" the kid as he has with Segs and the way he handled him in year one but........

I`ll allow CJ the grace period to make these decisions, I suppose he`s got his finger on the pulse just a touch more than I do

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08-23-2012, 08:39 AM
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I think he'll be a 90 point+ player minimum. He's got work to do,a lot of it. Has shown immaturity in his game and his commitment. Leads the team in scoring based on not much more than skill.
Minimum? Ehhh. Not so sure about that my man. I wouldnt put it out of reach, but do you know how many people consistently put up 90+ points in a year? You're talking the Crosbys, Malkins, Stamkos', etc.

I think he'll top out as a player a notch below the best players in the league. I'm thinking guys like Spezza, Hossa, and Parise. The ability to put up 90+ points in a season but more often than not a 80+ point guy.

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08-23-2012, 08:45 AM
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Krejci probably has star potential but needs to ramp up the effort,get some healthy seasons or both. Seguin has elite potential who will probably attain star numbers on skill alone,the question is will he jump to the elite level? On a team with 2 number 1 centers,he figures to leave them both as #2s on this team,neither can touch his raw skill. The number 1 center figures to be a much more clearly defined player by Seguin,who would then garner the minutes needed to separate himself.
At this point I think you're seeing what Krejci as he will be. A 60-70 point 2-way tweener 1/2 center.

As to your Seguin to center remark, I have to disagree. As long as Krejci is here, I think he'll remain at wing. Bergy will be here for the long haul, PC didnt re sign Kelly to play 3rd line winger, and Campbell is a 4th line center. Hardly much room for mobility into the top six center role.

The other thing I think people dont bring up enough is our depth at wing if hes moved to center. Who moves to wing? Kelly? Krejci? Kelly and Krejci are BOTH better centers than wing, and Seguin has proven to be successful at the position...so why rock the boat?

If Krejci for Ryan materializes then I move Seguin between Lucic and Ryan and never look back, but I think as long as Krejci remains Seguin is a winger.

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