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leafs defence pairings 12-13

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Old
08-21-2012, 02:41 PM
  #26
rdawg1234
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we're definitely in need of a defensive d-man. Not dire need so i'd definitely be willing to wait until the deadline but still a need.

Who would you go for anyway that could be had for a low/fair price?

wasn't a big fan of schenn anyway, seem to always choose to hit instead of make the smart play and JVR's upside is much higher.

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08-21-2012, 02:47 PM
  #27
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i'm 50/50 on this D. On the one hand we're gonna destroy some teams due to our ability, but on the other hand some teams will come in and dominate because practically none of these guys are stay-at home hitting d-men. The only one that really hits is Phaneuf.

Even with Schenn this still wouldn't look great, YET. Holzer will help with the stay at home a bit, but we need another one for sure. Komi is useless and Franson is another puck-mover.

Phaneuf-Gunnar
Gardiner-????(new stay at home d)
Liles-Holzer
Komi

Trade franson and MacA for either a goalie or another d-man. I'm sure we can get a stay at home guy for cheap near the deadline.

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08-21-2012, 02:53 PM
  #28
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Originally Posted by rdawg1234 View Post
we're definitely in need of a defensive d-man. Not dire need so i'd definitely be willing to wait until the deadline but still a need.

Who would you go for anyway that could be had for a low/fair price?

wasn't a big fan of schenn anyway, seem to always choose to hit instead of make the smart play and JVR's upside is much higher.
I've already mentioned JayBo, who is said to be available. he's not your prototypical defencive defenceman but he plays huge, very tough minutes in Calgary and can skate very very well.

What would he cost? Hard to say, but Calgary seems intent to win now so perhaps we could entice them with a mix of MacA, Connolly, Franson, or perhaps hometown boy Joe Colborne for the future.

Perhaps Colborne and Blacker?

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08-21-2012, 02:54 PM
  #29
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Confirmation bias. You remember all of the negative things most vividly because they support your agenda, whilst ignoring the abundance of positives.
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08-21-2012, 02:54 PM
  #30
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Originally Posted by rdawg1234 View Post

Phaneuf-Gunnar
Gardiner-????(new stay at home d)
Liles-Holzer
Komi

Trade franson and MacA for either a goalie or another d-man. I'm sure we can get a stay at home guy for cheap near the deadline.
I think a top defencive defenceman to play with Phaneuf, and move Gunnar down to play with Gardiner would be the best case scenario.

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08-21-2012, 02:59 PM
  #31
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Originally Posted by TopProspect91 View Post
Wow our defense sucks.
I am in...agreement.


If the OP's pairings are what we have we are in big trouble.

Gunn Dion
Liles Holzer
Gardiner Komi
Franson
(maybe) Blacker or Fraser

Defensively - extremely weak on the left side after Gunn
Offensively - left side carries the play with the exception of Dion on the right

The Buds will still place 12th in the East with who we have.

Improvements need to be made with toughness, 1 more defensive player, and 1 more Vet.

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08-21-2012, 03:08 PM
  #32
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Originally Posted by ForSpareParts View Post
I am in...agreement.


If the OP's pairings are what we have we are in big trouble.

Gunn Dion
Liles Holzer
Gardiner Komi
Franson
(maybe) Blacker or Fraser

Defensively - extremely weak on the left side after Gunn
Offensively - left side carries the play with the exception of Dion on the right

The Buds will still place 12th in the East with who we have.

Improvements need to be made with toughness, 1 more defensive player, and 1 more Vet.
Bang on.

Face it guys, we had the exact same D-core last year and failed miserably. Mix that with the fact that the goalie situation is the same as last years and we could be faced with another difficult year (whats new).

Guys like Holzer, Blacker, and Reilly are all promising but really won't be making much of an impact for another 2-3 years. If we're gonna do anything next year, then we've definitely got to add at least 1 more top 4 guy.

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08-21-2012, 03:10 PM
  #33
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Originally Posted by TopProspect91 View Post
Wow our defense sucks.
Dont worry, our goalie will bale them all out... oh wait.

Perhaps our forwards will back check and make up for it... or?

I think playing the trap is our only hope to be at least hard to score against next season.

Our D will look good in 5 years time if all the prospects hit their potential imo. But the current group will struggle.

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08-21-2012, 03:29 PM
  #34
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Originally Posted by johnny_rudeboy View Post
Dont worry, our goalie will bale them all out... oh wait.

Perhaps our forwards will back check and make up for it... or?

I think playing the trap is our only hope to be at least hard to score against next season.

Our D will look good in 5 years time if all the prospects hit their potential imo. But the current group will struggle.
Who is the current group?

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08-21-2012, 03:29 PM
  #35
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Originally Posted by TopProspect91 View Post
Face it guys, we had the exact same D-core last year and failed miserably. Mix that with the fact that the goalie situation is the same as last years and we could be faced with another difficult year (whats new).
We did not have the same defense core last year. We do not have the same goalie situation as last year. And even if we did, they are almost all young and improving.

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08-21-2012, 03:31 PM
  #36
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Originally Posted by TopProspect91 View Post
Bang on.

Face it guys, we had the exact same D-core last year and failed miserably. Mix that with the fact that the goalie situation is the same as last years and we could be faced with another difficult year (whats new).

Guys like Holzer, Blacker, and Reilly are all promising but really won't be making much of an impact for another 2-3 years. If we're gonna do anything next year, then we've definitely got to add at least 1 more top 4 guy.
I bet Carlyle will use Wilson's system too.

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08-21-2012, 03:34 PM
  #37
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We did not have the same defense core last year. We do not have the same goalie situation as last year. And even if we did, they are almost all young and improving.
Am I missing something? Did we sign Weber? Or trade for Luongo? Cause as of right now, it looks exactly the same to me (minus the Monster).

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08-21-2012, 03:36 PM
  #38
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Am I missing something? Did we sign Weber? Or trade for Luongo? Cause as of right now, it looks exactly the same to me (minus the Monster).
Addition by Subtraction plus a new Coach.

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08-21-2012, 03:38 PM
  #39
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Addition by Subtraction plus a new Coach.
But we didn't subtract anyone. All we did was switch the Monster for Scrivens.

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08-21-2012, 03:43 PM
  #40
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Originally Posted by smoke meat pete View Post
Short term, trade Franson and MacA for a good defencive defenceman who can play with Phaneuf:

Phaneuf-JayBo
Because it worked so great for the flames?

And you think you get JayBo for a bottom pairing guy and a rental?

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08-21-2012, 03:44 PM
  #41
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But we didn't subtract anyone. All we did was switch the Monster for Scrivens.
Subtracted Gustavsson and Schenn.

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08-21-2012, 03:45 PM
  #42
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Originally Posted by TopProspect91 View Post
Am I missing something? Did we sign Weber? Or trade for Luongo? Cause as of right now, it looks exactly the same to me (minus the Monster).
You're somewhat right. Gardiner now has a year of experience behind him so he should improve a bit. Gunnar is almost always solid and you can except at least decent things from Phaneuf on most nights. Also Holzer should be a new addition and he is a defensive d-man although he'll most likely be the 3rd-pairing guy.

After that it's alot of mobility but not much toughness, hard hitting or anything really. We can hope the old komi comes back but we do indeed need a new d-man by the deadline.

IMO a goalie is a much more important need, can't blame the defense AS much last year when half the goals i saw were really soft.

Still it's a small need IMO, one good defensive d-man added and the defense will look alot better, it's just too offensive right now.

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08-21-2012, 03:45 PM
  #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TopProspect91 View Post
But we didn't subtract anyone. All we did was switch the Monster for Scrivens.
...and Wilson for Carlyle

The majority of the year they played quite well.

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08-21-2012, 03:50 PM
  #44
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Franson was a plus hockey player when he was on the ice last year. He should be in the top 6 over both Komisarek and Holzer.

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08-21-2012, 03:51 PM
  #45
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Originally Posted by smoke meat pete View Post
I've already mentioned JayBo, who is said to be available. he's not your prototypical defencive defenceman but he plays huge, very tough minutes in Calgary and can skate very very well.

What would he cost? Hard to say, but Calgary seems intent to win now so perhaps we could entice them with a mix of MacA, Connolly, Franson, or perhaps hometown boy Joe Colborne for the future.

Perhaps Colborne and Blacker?
the Jaybo and Phaneuf experiment didn't work out well in Calgary why would it work here?

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08-21-2012, 03:56 PM
  #46
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Originally Posted by TopProspect91 View Post
Am I missing something? Did we sign Weber? Or trade for Luongo? Cause as of right now, it looks exactly the same to me (minus the Monster).
Liles went through a concussion last season. Reimer went through a concussion last season. Neither were the same after, likely because of lost training. Schenn is no longer on the team. Holzer likely will be. Gardiner (especially), Gunnarsson, Franson and Phaneuf can all benefit from an extra year of development.

We also have a new coach and team system (under which Komisarek did look a bit better), and none of us really know how Scrivens will do, if he is on the starting roster.

You don't need to add a Weber and Luongo to make a difference with a team, even a bottom-feeder.

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08-21-2012, 04:07 PM
  #47
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Originally Posted by -DeMo- View Post
the Jaybo and Phaneuf experiment didn't work out well in Calgary why would it work here?
My understanding is they didn't play much together. I think they'd work fine.

i understand JayBo played with Giordano.


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08-21-2012, 04:08 PM
  #48
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Because it worked so great for the flames?

And you think you get JayBo for a bottom pairing guy and a rental?
I don't actually know what it would cost. I've left a number of scenarios but I'd need to know what the Flames are looking for before guessing a trade proposal.

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08-21-2012, 04:14 PM
  #49
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lookin at some d-men that interest me due to high hits or blocked shots or both:

Mark fistric-Dallas
Mark Stewart-WPG
Eric Brewer-TB
Stephane Robidas- Dallas
Ryan O'Byrne-Colorado.

You think any of these guys are available? All of them are pretty much low point, high hitting d-men who block a fair amount of shots. I also have hardly heard of any of them! They all have close to 200 hits and around 100+ blocked shots this year.

Edit: Maybe we could pry one of these two guys from Dallas for a puck-mover and a pick or whatever?
Ryan O'Bryne was given to Colorado for a mid-level prospect, we could get him for pretty cheap too.

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08-21-2012, 04:18 PM
  #50
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Sometimes people with high hits and blocked shots are in that scenario because they are unable to clear their own zone.

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