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[EDM] Taylor Hall signs seven year extension, $6m per

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08-22-2012, 10:22 AM
  #176
GO99
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I don't think having different contracts tells how close they really are. Friendship is one thing and business is another.

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08-22-2012, 10:33 AM
  #177
Reign Nateo
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For what it's worth, Hawks fans swore up and down for a couple years that the cap would never affect them and they'd never have to lose any of their important players... They had all the fancy cap breakdowns and development scenarios... Then they trade Byfuglien, Ladd etc...

I can see the Oilers hitting a situation like the Hawks did eventually (for their sake hopefully as successful) where they have to pick a few stars to build around and move a couple for assets and depth. Doesn't mean they'll instantly be a weak team again (still?) and it's a bad idea, look at the Hawks, but they'll likely hit the same crossroads and the Hawks have succeeded.

I just don't get why Oiler fans seems so dead against it, you need depth to win. You're not going anywhere with a 30 million dollar top line and a half, no depth on the bottom lines, no depth on defence and no goaltending. There are players coming through the system there that can fill those roles (except goaltending) and they'll need to be paid too. It won't be the most horrific thing in the world if they have to move someone to create some depth. If they're smart they'll do whatever it takes to keep Nugent-Hopkins and Eberle and go from there.

As is they'll go nowhere with that defence and goaltending. I've watched Dubnyk since I had season tickets to the Blazers, he should not be starting on an NHL team. Defence is a long way away from good enough to compete too. You can't be that top-heavy and win.

Anyway, my opinion. The Oilers will likely have to make some tough choices, signing Hall is a no-brainer at this point, it will be how Tambellini and co. handle those decisions that will decide whether the Oilers become the next Blackhawks or the Blue Jackets.

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08-22-2012, 10:41 AM
  #178
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Why would we hit the same crossroads as the hawks? We don't have a Campbell and Huet.

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08-22-2012, 10:50 AM
  #179
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Reign Nateo View Post
For what it's worth, Hawks fans swore up and down for a couple years that the cap would never affect them and they'd never have to lose any of their important players... They had all the fancy cap breakdowns and development scenarios... Then they trade Byfuglien, Ladd etc...

I can see the Oilers hitting a situation like the Hawks did eventually (for their sake hopefully as successful) where they...
The reason the Hawks had to sell was because Tallon didn't submit qualifying offers in time.

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08-22-2012, 10:52 AM
  #180
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Originally Posted by Kreator View Post
Why would we hit the same crossroads as the hawks? We don't have a Campbell and Huet.

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08-22-2012, 10:57 AM
  #181
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2 more years then he's off the books

just in time for RNH's new contract!

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08-22-2012, 10:58 AM
  #182
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I can't wait to see the deal here. I see major overpayment coming.

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08-22-2012, 11:07 AM
  #183
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Originally Posted by DJOpus View Post
I'd pay Eberle a hell of a lot more than Hall.
Most Oiler fans would pay Hall more than Eberle

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08-22-2012, 11:22 AM
  #184
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Originally Posted by Kreator View Post
Why would we hit the same crossroads as the hawks? We don't have a Campbell and Huet.
without a quality defenceman like campbell you wont have a cup either, no ones saying the oilers cant keep all of their kids together, the problem lies with keeping the kids togeather and also getting a number one defenceman and goalie, something a cup team almost needs to have, la with doughty, boston with chara chicago with keith/seabrook detroit with lidstrom and so fourth. Every cup finalist the past few years also has a great two way selke level forward on their roster, whose the oilers selke level player? they could aquire one for sure but then thats more $ to the cap, la with richards, boston with bergeron vancouver with kesler chicago with hossa/toews philly with richards detroit with zetterberg/datsyuk pittsburg with staal. The oilers just dont have the pieces right now and if they get them thats when they'll be in cap trouble

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08-22-2012, 11:34 AM
  #185
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Originally Posted by 5RingsAndABeer View Post
Most Oiler fans would pay Hall more than Eberle
I also get that feeling that Eberle wouldn't accept more than Hall. They'll probably all try and get the exact same contracts.

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08-22-2012, 11:35 AM
  #186
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhino Rilley View Post
without a quality defenceman like campbell you wont have a cup either, no ones saying the oilers cant keep all of their kids together, the problem lies with keeping the kids togeather and also getting a number one defenceman and goalie, something a cup team almost needs to have, la with doughty, boston with chara chicago with keith/seabrook detroit with lidstrom and so fourth. Every cup finalist the past few years also has a great two way selke level forward on their roster, whose the oilers selke level player? they could aquire one for sure but then thats more $ to the cap, la with richards, boston with bergeron vancouver with kesler chicago with hossa/toews philly with richards detroit with zetterberg/datsyuk pittsburg with staal. The oilers just dont have the pieces right now and if they get them thats when they'll be in cap trouble
Actually a lot of people here are saying that Oilers wont be able to keep all 4 of the kids together. Oilers are years away from contending for a cup. The goal for now is to make the playoffs.
Who knows what the new CBA will do to cap structure. It should be easier to acquire a top end Dman via free agency\trade when these kids prove that they could do real damage with the firepower up front.

If Rangers can be 10M under the cap with Richards\Gaborik\Nash then so can EDM with Hall\RNH\Ebs.

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08-22-2012, 11:36 AM
  #187
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhino Rilley View Post
without a quality defenceman like campbell you wont have a cup either, no ones saying the oilers cant keep all of their kids together, the problem lies with keeping the kids togeather and also getting a number one defenceman and goalie, something a cup team almost needs to have, la with doughty, boston with chara chicago with keith/seabrook detroit with lidstrom and so fourth. Every cup finalist the past few years also has a great two way selke level forward on their roster, whose the oilers selke level player? they could aquire one for sure but then thats more $ to the cap, la with richards, boston with bergeron vancouver with kesler chicago with hossa/toews philly with richards detroit with zetterberg/datsyuk pittsburg with staal. The oilers just dont have the pieces right now and if they get them thats when they'll be in cap trouble
Thanks for eloborating on my point so I didn't have to.

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08-22-2012, 11:37 AM
  #188
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Originally Posted by Petro Points View Post
Actually a lot of people here are saying that Oilers wont be able to keep all 4 of the kids together. Oilers are years away from contending for a cup. The goal for now is to make the playoffs.
Who knows what the new CBA will do to cap structure. It should be easier to acquire a top end Dman via free agency\trade when these kids prove that they could do real damage with the firepower up front.

If Rangers can be 10M under the cap with Richards\Gaborik\Nash then so can EDM with Hall\RNH\Ebs.
I think Oiler fans are reading it wrong. The question isn't can they keep and pay all four, it's should they. Will a team that top-heavy compete? Or should they at least entertain the crazy idea of 'depth'...

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08-22-2012, 11:41 AM
  #189
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Ya.. Pretty much everyone says "YOU CAN'T AFFORD TO SIGN ALL 4 SUPERSTARS!!.."

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08-22-2012, 11:42 AM
  #190
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Originally Posted by Kesler2Kesler View Post
I also get that feeling that Eberle wouldn't accept more than Hall. They'll probably all try and get the exact same contracts.
people dont realize that Hall is 20 and Eberle 22. Eberle broke out at age 21.
Hall has kept up with Ebs in production and has yet to break out.

If he stays healthy he should be worth a lot more then Eberle in his prime years.

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08-22-2012, 11:43 AM
  #191
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Reign Nateo View Post
I think Oiler fans are reading it wrong. The question isn't can they keep and pay all four, it's should they. Will a team that top-heavy compete? Or should they at least entertain the crazy idea of 'depth'...
I think you aren't crunching the numbers correctly. If the numbers being thrown out are accurate, the Oilers aren't that top-heavy. They'll be ~5th-10th in the league in that regard. Depth shouldn't be an issue

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08-22-2012, 11:44 AM
  #192
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Originally Posted by JackJ View Post
Hall - 6yr/30mil
Eberle - 6yr/33.6mil

Fair for both sides.
Not gonna happen with Hall, just no way. Hall is going to get at least what Skinner got, hed be stupid not to ask for that.

Plus, him and Tavares are very close production wise (although Hall has been injured more). Theres no reason Hall would even get less than 5.5, let alone 5.

I really think its going to be 6 and 6...6 years 36 million.

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08-22-2012, 11:45 AM
  #193
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Ya.. Pretty much everyone says "YOU CAN'T AFFORD TO SIGN ALL 4 SUPERSTARS!!.."
Being able to sign all 4 players isn't Edmonton's biggest problem.

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08-22-2012, 11:48 AM
  #194
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Originally Posted by Reign Nateo View Post
I think Oiler fans are reading it wrong. The question isn't can they keep and pay all four, it's should they. Will a team that top-heavy compete? Or should they at least entertain the crazy idea of 'depth'...
PHI, PIT, NYR are all top heavy as well and see to be doing fine when it comes to competing.

If guys like Simmonds, Gagner, Hartnell are making 4.5M+ then paying potential star players 6M should not be very crippling.

Depth players dont need to be paid very highly. There is nothing wrong with having guys like Smyth, Belanger, Jones etc as depth players.

EDM lacks a top pairing Dman but has plenty of 2nd\3rd pairing Dmen to cover the 'depth' issue.

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08-22-2012, 11:52 AM
  #195
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Originally Posted by The Last Dynasty View Post
2 more years then he's off the books

just in time for RNH's new contract!
Not quite, RNH will need to be re-signed a year before Horcoff's contract expires.

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08-22-2012, 11:53 AM
  #196
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Originally Posted by Tim Vezina Thomas View Post
Not gonna happen with Hall, just no way. Hall is going to get at least what Skinner got, hed be stupid not to ask for that.

Plus, him and Tavares are very close production wise (although Hall has been injured more). Theres no reason Hall would even get less than 5.5, let alone 5.

I really think its going to be 6 and 6...6 years 36 million.
As an example were the Sedin "stupid" not to ask for 7.5-8mil? Of course not. It's not always about money.

Not saying they won't ask for top dollars but the Oilers need Hall and Eberle to buy in otherwise the entire plan will fall apart. Huge signing bonuses for both could convince them to sign long term.

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08-22-2012, 11:57 AM
  #197
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Ya.. Pretty much everyone says "YOU CAN'T AFFORD TO SIGN ALL 4 SUPERSTARS!!.."
No, just that the rest of your team may suffer because of it.

Don't listen to everyone telling you they will have to trade 1 of them. Ducks fans have heard that for 3 years.

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08-22-2012, 11:58 AM
  #198
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The Oilers don't have a goalie remotely close to Lundqvist's level and probably won't for the next 5+ years, their defense is also barely NHL caliber.
from start of Jan. 2012
Starting Goalies (min 21GM) ranked by save %
1. Halak (27) 3.75M
29GM 19W - 5L - 2 OTL - 1 ND .769 Win% 1.71GA .938 SV%

2. Smith (30) 2.0M
39GM 23W - 8L - 7 OTL - 1 ND .697 Win% 2.00GA .937 SV%

3. Ward (28) 6.3M
34GM 17W - 8L - 8 OTL - 1 ND .636 Win% 2.26GA .932 SV%

4. Anderson (31) 3.19M
28GM 15W - 10L - 3 OTL .589 Win% 2.38GA .931 SV%

5. Varlamov (24) 2.83M
26GM 14W - 10L - 2 OTL .577 Win% 2.15GA .928 SV%

6. Rinne (30 yr) 7.0M
38GM 25W - 8L - 4 OTL - 1 ND .730 Win% 1.71GA .9257 SV%

7. Quick (26 Yr) 1.8M to 5.8M
37GM 18W - 11L - 8 OTL .595 Win% 1.86GA .9256 SV%

8. Luongo (33YR) 5.33M
29GM 15W - 6L - 6 OTL - 1 ND .643 Win% 2.32GA .9252 SV%

9. Miller (32 Yr) 6.25M
38GM 22W - 11L - 5 OTL .645 Win% 2.28GA .9243 SV%

10. Dubnyk (26 Yr) 3.5M
29GM 16W - 10L - 3 OTL .603 Win% 2.39GA .9239 SV%

11. Lundquist (30 yr) 6.875M
35GM 23W - 11L - 1 OTL .671 Win% 2.00GA .9237 SV%


12. Kipper (36 yr) 5.83M
37GM 18W - 10L - 9 OTL .608 Win% 2.32GA .9224 SV%

The rest are below .920 Sv%

So #6 to 12 were all in the .926-.922 SV% range.

Our d depth
Start of last year:
Smid - Gilbert
Sutton - Barker
Peckham - potter
Petry - Tuebert
(non mobile) Whitney

when any 3 of gilbert, Barker, INJ whitney, Tuebert were in our top 6 d
Dubnyk was 3.30GA and .890 sv%

when there was less than 3
Dubnyk was 1.75GA .944SV%
this is important.

We traded gilbert for N. Schultz a past 1st pairing shutdown Dman.
Barker was not brought back.
Whitney's showed more mobility by start of march and started to produce like the 1st comp 45P dman of 2 years ago.
the signing of schultz and return of fedun has pushed tuebert down the depth chart.

this years depth:
Smid - Petry
Whitney(mobile) - N. schultz
these 1st 4 have shown top 10 D pair results vs 1st comp for 40 games min.
Sutton - J. Schultz
Sutton had successful numbers at 2nd Comp and should be more successful vs 3rd.
Peckham - potter
Are our 7-8 options when they played as high as 3-4 last year.
Fedun - Tuebert
9-10 options we had tuebert at #6 for 24 games.

We are 4 D injuries in before we are at 1 of the poor 4.

would love to see one of Roszival, Coliacovo signed to rolled into the 5-6 rotation and a 2nd comp cover for whitney if his ankle regresses.

while dubnyk posted top 10 starter numbers fom Jan. on

KHB went
16GM 1W - 11L - 4 OTL .157 Win% 3.28GA .889 SV%

He was the only reason we stayed in the lottery


Last edited by oilerbear: 08-22-2012 at 12:22 PM.
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08-22-2012, 11:58 AM
  #199
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I think you aren't crunching the numbers correctly. If the numbers being thrown out are accurate, the Oilers aren't that top-heavy. They'll be ~5th-10th in the league in that regard. Depth shouldn't be an issue
Just saying, Hawks fans swore the same thing up and down. And you won't compete with the depth they have. There are questions that will need to be dealt with that won't be easy. This much is obvious.

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08-22-2012, 11:59 AM
  #200
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Originally Posted by Petro Points View Post
PHI, PIT, NYR are all top heavy as well and see to be doing fine when it comes to competing.

If guys like Simmonds, Gagner, Hartnell are making 4.5M+ then paying potential star players 6M should not be very crippling.

Depth players dont need to be paid very highly. There is nothing wrong with having guys like Smyth, Belanger, Jones etc as depth players.

EDM lacks a top pairing Dman but has plenty of 2nd\3rd pairing Dmen to cover the 'depth' issue
.
If you beleive this, and Oilers brass does too, get used to last place.

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