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Colaiacovo: Wings Make Offer

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08-24-2012, 09:20 AM
  #1
eyeball11
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Colaiacovo: Wings Make Offer

http://www.truehockey.com/articles/D...ey-to-Business

I just thought this was interesting. We always hear how terrible Toronto players/prospects are yet the mighty Red Wings have recently flirted with Colaiacovo, Ian White, Jonas Gustavsson.....

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08-24-2012, 09:33 AM
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The honeymoon with White is over now that Lidstrom is gone. Dont get me wrong, I like Ian, but Lidstrom made him something hes not.

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08-24-2012, 09:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eyeball11 View Post
http://www.truehockey.com/articles/D...ey-to-Business

I just thought this was interesting. We always hear how terrible Toronto players/prospects are yet the mighty Red Wings have recently flirted with Colaiacovo, Ian White, Jonas Gustavsson.....
I don't think Toronto has terrible prospects or players. Toronto has just been terribly mismanaged over the years.

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08-24-2012, 09:53 AM
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The honeymoon with White is over now that Lidstrom is gone. Dont get me wrong, I like Ian, but Lidstrom made him something hes not.
No doubt he helped but I think the point is that a team most on these boards treat like gods seems to like our guys.

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08-24-2012, 09:55 AM
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Originally Posted by gilmourd View Post
I don't think Toronto has terrible prospects or players. Toronto has just been terribly mismanaged over the years.
Ian White was a great player when he was in Toronto, he is not a bad player.

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08-24-2012, 09:56 AM
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I don't think Toronto has terrible prospects or players. Toronto has just been terribly mismanaged over the years.
I don't either but many would have you believe they are all bums. That's not to say they are superstars but many of them are quite useful.

Here's an interesting one from the "take it for what it is worth world of stats":

Alex Steen last year

"Rel Corsi = 21.7 (2nd in the league behind D. Sedin who has 80% offensive zone starts)

+/- On the ice per 60 min = +2.26 (2nd in the league behind Crosby); +/- Off the ice per 60 min = -0.08; Difference = +2.34 (3rd in the league)"

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08-24-2012, 09:58 AM
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Ian White was a great player when he was in Toronto, he is not a bad player.
He was a good player. Not a great one.

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08-24-2012, 09:59 AM
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I still do not understand the Stempniak for Steen and Calaicovo deal. What was Flecther thinking.

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08-24-2012, 10:02 AM
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Guys like Steen, Wellwood, White, Colaiacovo, Gustavsson are all serviceable NHLers, but the problem in Toronto was always the lack of a Sundin-level replacement to slot ahead of them either up front or on defense, which may or may not be an issue going forward even now. But generally, they're not the toughest guys to replace, Steen was replaced with Grabs, Wellwood with Bozak, Cola a number of times over with other average defenders...

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08-24-2012, 10:03 AM
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Both Defensemen were decent. The Goalie not so much.

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08-24-2012, 10:05 AM
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Originally Posted by PasDaSquini View Post
I still do not understand the Stempniak for Steen and Calaicovo deal. What was Flecther thinking.
He probably thought he was getting "Stamkos" and not "Stempniak"

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08-24-2012, 10:10 AM
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Originally Posted by blasted_Sabre View Post
The honeymoon with White is over now that Lidstrom is gone. Dont get me wrong, I like Ian, but Lidstrom made him something hes not.
Ummm.....yeah...sure.

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08-24-2012, 10:13 AM
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Originally Posted by blasted_Sabre View Post
The honeymoon with White is over now that Lidstrom is gone. Dont get me wrong, I like Ian, but Lidstrom made him something hes not.
Yes. Now that Lidstrom is gone, people will see White for what he really is: A very reliable 2nd pairing guy, with a fantastic attitude that is well liked everywhere he goes.

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08-24-2012, 10:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eyeball11 View Post
http://www.truehockey.com/articles/D...ey-to-Business

I just thought this was interesting. We always hear how terrible Toronto players/prospects are yet the mighty Red Wings have recently flirted with Colaiacovo, Ian White, Jonas Gustavsson.....
Are the Detroit Management staff 100% in their player assessments? I like the Dmen you listed. Even as Leafs...were decent NHLers. Gustavsson has proven nothing. Carlo and Ian both played well on every NHL team they played on. Gustavsson has yet to prove he is anything more than a backup goalie..which is what he will continue to fight for in Detroit.

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08-24-2012, 10:44 AM
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Originally Posted by PasDaSquini View Post
I still do not understand the Stempniak for Steen and Calaicovo deal. What was Flecther thinking.
Honestly, my gut tells me Fletch had strict orders from ownership, to ship em all out.

The frozen 5 , first time in NHL history 5 players on the same team at the same time refused to waive NTC. Can't imaging how furious this made ownership , the plebes dare tell the King to eat cake.

The inmates had taken over the asylum, there was something seriously, seriously wrong in that dressing room.

Every intuition i have points to McCabe,Tucker and Sundin as the ring leaders of this whole blue and white country club atmosphere.

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08-24-2012, 10:48 AM
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Originally Posted by PasDaSquini View Post
I still do not understand the Stempniak for Steen and Calaicovo deal. What was Flecther thinking.
I personally hate the trade, both now and at the time it was made (was big Cola fan) but Fletcher was thinking of getting a 25 year old winger capable of potting 30 goals (hit 27g as a 23 yo) for two younger players that were down on the depth chart and had somewhat plateaued in their development at the time (this being the biggest problem as Steen and Cola were at their lowest value).

Steen was stuck playing bottom 6 and had 4 pts in 20 games at the time he was traded.

Cola (who Wilson immediately targeted as soft/lazy) was the 7th Dman, and had 1 pt in 10 games at the time.

We did have the depth to make this type of deal at the time (2 for 1) just the parts traded and acquired were not the best choices.

Steen is/was the type of player Wilson should have been molding into our long term capable 2-way centre.

Writing was on the wall for Cola though, after Wilson singled him out.

Stempniak is what he is, he's got to be with paired with good/great players if he's going to be effective, which we did not have enough of at the time he was here.

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08-24-2012, 10:50 AM
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The best thing now for Detroit would be to trade for a Bouwmeester type. Cola is good, but they need defensive help more than offenssive.

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08-24-2012, 10:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PasDaSquini View Post
I still do not understand the Stempniak for Steen and Calaicovo deal. What was Flecther thinking.
My opinion is that he was listening to Wilson. Wilson was also used in the Finger transaction. From the get go, Wilson had this team headed where he left it.

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08-24-2012, 10:56 AM
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Originally Posted by Faltorvo View Post
Honestly, my gut tells me Fletch had strict orders from ownership, to ship em all out.

The frozen 5 , first time in NHL history 5 players on the same team at the same time refused to waive NTC. Can't imaging how furious this made ownership , the plebes dare tell the King to eat cake.

The inmates had taken over the asylum, there was something seriously, seriously wrong in that dressing room.

Every intuition i have points to McCabe,Tucker and Sundin as the ring leaders of this whole blue and white country club atmosphere.
Good thing they cleared them out, it has been smooth sailing ever since.

Yashin situation, just in reverse. Management wanted to dishonour their agreements.

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08-24-2012, 10:56 AM
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Originally Posted by hockeyfanz View Post
Ummm.....yeah...sure.
So you think Ian White really is a top pairing defenseman?


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08-24-2012, 10:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PasDaSquini View Post
I still do not understand the Stempniak for Steen and Calaicovo deal. What was Flecther thinking.
Stempniak scored 27 goals 2 years prior to the deal, and was having a down year by those standards.

Steen had a mere 4 pts in 20 games, and Cola was broken most of his time here. I think the old man thought it was a perfect buy low opportunity.

While it wasn't done on the correct player, sometimes these things work (Dion), sometimes they don't.

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08-24-2012, 11:00 AM
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Stempniak is what he is, he's got to be with paired with good/great players if he's going to be effective, which we did not have enough of at the time he was here.
Stempniak had one great run in Phoenix since his 27 goal season 5 years ago, but other than that he's just not a top player, and was never worth what the Leafs paid for him.

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08-24-2012, 11:02 AM
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Originally Posted by PasDaSquini View Post
I still do not understand the Stempniak for Steen and Calaicovo deal. What was Flecther thinking.
Fletchers thinking days were over. He had clearly lost it this time around.

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08-24-2012, 11:05 AM
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Originally Posted by hockeyfanz View Post
Ummm.....yeah...sure.
Do you not agree? Or do you really believe that Ian White is a top pairing defenseman?

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08-24-2012, 11:07 AM
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Stempniak had one great run in Phoenix since his 27 goal season 5 years ago, but other than that he's just not a top player, and was never worth what the Leafs paid for him.
Did not really say or think he was, just meant he can be the third wheel paired with two good/great players and be effective, aside from that he's pretty well useless.

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