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Colaiacovo: Wings Make Offer

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Old
08-24-2012, 10:44 AM
  #26
dubey
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Originally Posted by blasted_Sabre View Post
So you think Ian White really is a top pairing defenseman?

Top pairing based on moustache alone

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08-24-2012, 10:48 AM
  #27
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Every intuition i have points to McCabe,Tucker and Sundin as the ring leaders of this whole blue and white country club atmosphere.
I'm sure glad they rooted out that problem.

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08-24-2012, 10:50 AM
  #28
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Originally Posted by Faltorvo View Post
Every intuition i have points to McCabe,Tucker and Sundin as the ring leaders of this whole blue and white country club atmosphere.
The fact that trading all those players actually made the team significantly worse only proves the the media generated "country club atmosphere" was a joke. We traded away a lot of serviceable hockey players because of that crappy attitude and it only helped solidify our plummeting position in the standings.

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08-24-2012, 11:16 AM
  #29
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Originally Posted by hockeyfanz View Post
Are the Detroit Management staff 100% in their player assessments? I like the Dmen you listed. Even as Leafs...were decent NHLers. Gustavsson has proven nothing. Carlo and Ian both played well on every NHL team they played on. Gustavsson has yet to prove he is anything more than a backup goalie..which is what he will continue to fight for in Detroit.
No one is 100%. I'm willing to bet that regardless, you'll find they put them in positions to succeed (just like a Larry Murphy). I already know they are decent players. Many around here like to "poo poo" everything we produce.

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08-24-2012, 11:17 AM
  #30
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Originally Posted by Faltorvo View Post
Honestly, my gut tells me Fletch had strict orders from ownership, to ship em all out.

The frozen 5 , first time in NHL history 5 players on the same team at the same time refused to waive NTC. Can't imaging how furious this made ownership , the plebes dare tell the King to eat cake.

The inmates had taken over the asylum, there was something seriously, seriously wrong in that dressing room.

Every intuition i have points to McCabe,Tucker and Sundin as the ring leaders of this whole blue and white country club atmosphere.
Yup, the most skilled, hardest working, and purest heart and soul guys on the team were the problem. No doubt about it. Idiots left everything on the ice, what bums.

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08-24-2012, 11:40 AM
  #31
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My opinion is that he was listening to Wilson. Wilson was also used in the Finger transaction. From the get go, Wilson had this team headed where he left it.
At the time of the trade 20 games into the NHL season, under Wilson coaching Steen had 2 goals and 2 assists (on pace for an 8 goal 8 assist season), while Colaiacovo had only 1 assist and was a healthy scratch for 10 of the 20 games. Combined the two players had 5 points at the 1/4 mark of the season.

Under Wilson, Steen's role was marginalized, and it was clear Colaiacovo was reduced to a bit player splitting time in the pressbox and line-up.. This is case of depreciable assets in progress having little to no value and declining fast thanks to Ron Wilson.

Wilson even took a shot a Carlo on his way out.

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After the practice, Leafs coach Ron Wilson said he didn't think the injury was serious, but also took the time to rip into Colaiacovo, showing no sympathy for him on this injury, or others past.

"The thing with Carlo," said Wilson, "...and I tell him every day: you're not in very good shape and it's your fault. And it leads to all the other issues you had in the past."

"Carlo has a fat foot injury" ..

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08-24-2012, 11:46 AM
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fat foot

lol

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08-24-2012, 11:47 AM
  #33
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Originally Posted by Mess View Post
At the time of the trade 20 games into the NHL season, under Wilson coaching Steen had 2 goals and 2 assists (on pace for an 8 goal 8 assist season), while Colaiacovo had only 1 assist and was a healthy scratch for 10 of the 20 games. Combined the two players had 5 points at the 1/4 mark of the season.

Under Wilson, Steen's role was marginalized, and it was clear Colaiacovo was reduced to a bit player splitting time in the pressbox and line-up.. This is case of depreciable assets in progress having little to no value and declining fast thanks to Ron Wilson.

Wilson even took a shot a Carlo on his way out.
A veteran GM should know not to ship out young guys who have played better who are at their worst without getting actual value back.

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08-24-2012, 12:09 PM
  #34
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A veteran GM should know not to ship out young guys who have played better who are at their worst without getting actual value back.
Ron Wilson was just hired and wasn't going anywhere at the time, so the only option was to deal the players that didn't fit the coach.

Lee Stempniak was 25 years old at the time of the trade and had already had a 27-25-52 point NHL season under his belt (at age 23). So its not like there was potential here. Alex Steen now age 27 has yet to surpass that Stempniak career best total in any NHL season to date.

Stempniak after being traded out of Toronto and away from Ron Wilson much like Steen previously, he went on to score 14 goals and 18 points in 18 games for Phoenix, while leading them to a playoff spot in the process.

Factor out the common denominator from Alex, Carlo and Lee and you're left with rotten Ronnie as the culprit as to why this is being discussed and where it went wrong. Similarly how other young players like Luke Schenn now who fell victim to a bad coach and it cost them their Leafs future.

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08-24-2012, 12:12 PM
  #35
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Originally Posted by Stephen View Post
A veteran GM should know not to ship out young guys who have played better who are at their worst without getting actual value back.
How do you do that when your coach isn't playing these young guys and is making it clear that he never will play these young guys?

I hated that deal, too. But Fletcher's hands were tied by Wilson. He must have figured this was a good deal given both Steen and Cola weren't playing, and that their value would only go down as the season progressed.

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08-24-2012, 12:17 PM
  #36
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Carlo Colaicovo is a UFA presently, so there is nothing preventing Toronto from signing him and bringing him back.

If it was a mistake to trade him, then here is the perfect opportunity to undo that.

What are we waiting for, unless of course he wouldn't be an upgrade on what we have now?

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08-24-2012, 12:28 PM
  #37
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Originally Posted by blasted_Sabre View Post
The honeymoon with White is over now that Lidstrom is gone. Dont get me wrong, I like Ian, but Lidstrom made him something hes not.
?

White wasn't any different in detroit than he was anywhere else.

08/09 (24): 71gms, 10gls, 26pts, 110ht, 114bk, 6.2CorRel, 0.411RelQoC, 22:51 (82gms, 12gls, 30pts, 127ht, 132bk) - TOR
09/10 (25): 83gms, 13gls, 38pts, 54ht, 137blk, 4.8CorRel, 0.884RelQoC, 22:47 (82gms, 13gls, 38pts, 53ht, 136blk) - TOR/CAL
10/11 (26): 78gms, 4gls, 26pts, 59ht, 144blk, 0.4CorRel, -0.086RelQoC, 20:00 (82gms, 4gls, 27pts, 62ht, 151blk) - CAL/CAR/SJS
11/12 (27): 77gms, 7gls, 32pts, 49ht, 93blk, 5.7CorRel, 0.944RelQoC, 22:59 (82gms, 8gls, 34pts, 52ht, 99blk) - DET

Little bit of a down year in 10/11, probably mostly due to switching between three teams, but otherwise White is what he is - a quality #2/#3 two-way defenseman. Even in his "down year" in 10/11 he played like a solid top-4 defenseman.

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Old
08-24-2012, 12:57 PM
  #38
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Originally Posted by Mess View Post
Carlo Colaicovo is a UFA presently, so there is nothing preventing Toronto from signing him and bringing him back.

If it was a mistake to trade him, then here is the perfect opportunity to undo that.

What are we waiting for, unless of course he wouldn't be an upgrade on what we have now?
The mistake wasn't necessarily in trading them but in what they were traded for.

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Old
08-24-2012, 01:08 PM
  #39
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Originally Posted by Mess View Post
Carlo Colaicovo is a UFA presently, so there is nothing preventing Toronto from signing him and bringing him back.

If it was a mistake to trade him, then here is the perfect opportunity to undo that.

What are we waiting for, unless of course he wouldn't be an upgrade on what we have now?
Wouldn't he have to want to sign in Toronto?

Stempniak: Games: 517 Points: 275 -22
Steen: Games: 497 Points: 276 +13

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08-24-2012, 01:20 PM
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Originally Posted by ACC1224 View Post
The mistake wasn't necessarily in trading them but in what they were traded for.
At the time, Steen has not done anything since his solid rookie season and Colaiacovo was just an injury prone average d-man. I was fine with the trade at the time because I felt we were not losing players that had a chance to be significant contributors. Are you saying that the Steen+Cola package could have gotten something better? I don't think so.

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08-24-2012, 01:24 PM
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Originally Posted by Suntouchable13 View Post
At the time, Steen has not done anything since his solid rookie season and Colaiacovo was just an injury prone average d-man. I was fine with the trade at the time because I felt we were not losing players that had a chance to be significant contributors. Are you saying that the Steen+Cola package could have gotten something better? I don't think so.
Yes, they could have got something better. Stempniak is Stajan playing wing.

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08-24-2012, 01:32 PM
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Originally Posted by Suntouchable13 View Post
At the time, Steen has not done anything since his solid rookie season and Colaiacovo was just an injury prone average d-man. I was fine with the trade at the time because I felt we were not losing players that had a chance to be significant contributors. Are you saying that the Steen+Cola package could have gotten something better? I don't think so.
Obviously they could have gotten something better, they couldn't have gotten much worse of a return.

I don't see why they HAD to be moved in the 1st place.

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08-24-2012, 01:37 PM
  #43
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Originally Posted by ACC1224 View Post
Obviously they could have gotten something better, they couldn't have gotten much worse of a return.

I don't see why they HAD to be moved in the 1st place.
Nobody did. Seemed like Fletcher felt he was getting a steal, but it certainly didn't work out that way.

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08-24-2012, 06:41 PM
  #44
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Originally Posted by eyeball11 View Post
No doubt he helped but I think the point is that a team most on these boards treat like gods seems to like our guys.
speaks to the point i'm always making about the leafs' prospects. we've always had good prospects. the current group really isn't any special or new.

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08-24-2012, 06:47 PM
  #45
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I still do not understand the Stempniak for Steen and Calaicovo deal. What was Flecther thinking.
At the time Lee had close to 30 goals that season for the Blues. We had no one close to that. Guy just never panned out here like a lot of deals we've done it the past. But I agree one of the worst trades ever in Leaf history. So far the worst:

1. Rask for Raycroft
2. Stempniak for Steen and Colaiacovo
3. Courtnall for Kordic

there are more but these are some of the worst ones.......

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Old
08-24-2012, 07:25 PM
  #46
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Originally Posted by blasted_Sabre View Post
The honeymoon with White is over now that Lidstrom is gone. Dont get me wrong, I like Ian, but Lidstrom made him something hes not.
Agreed. He's a good player and a good soldier. The real hunt for the next defensive beast for the wings begins. Will it be Kronwall? We have yet to see.

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08-24-2012, 08:30 PM
  #47
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Originally Posted by PasDaSquini View Post
I still do not understand the Stempniak for Steen and Calaicovo deal. What was Flecther thinking.
The amount of damage that he did in such a short amount of time is unbelievable. Steen and Cola for Stempniak. 7th overall and 2nd rounder for Luke Schenn. Signing of Jeff Finger. Tucker buy out. Not getting a Sundin trade done.

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08-24-2012, 08:39 PM
  #48
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I will spare the board a new poll, but:

Who's is more of a risk of getting injured and missing significant games:

Connelly
Carlo

??

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08-24-2012, 08:52 PM
  #49
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Originally Posted by ForSpareParts View Post
I will spare the board a new poll, but:

Who's is more of a risk of getting injured and missing significant games:

Connelly
Carlo

??
Carlo averages about 65 games a year as he played 63, 67, 65 & 64 games in the past 4 seasons for St. Louis after being traded.

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Old
08-24-2012, 09:42 PM
  #50
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The amount of damage that he did in such a short amount of time is unbelievable. Steen and Cola for Stempniak. 7th overall and 2nd rounder for Luke Schenn. Signing of Jeff Finger. Tucker buy out. Not getting a Sundin trade done.
Don't forget McCabe and a 4th for MVR, Holleweg and Mayers for picks he acquired at the dealine. He also signed Nik Hagman.

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