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So who is bummed about the lockout?

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Old
10-19-2012, 04:21 PM
  #976
Big C
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What am I gonna do about this semesters finals? I was totally gonna blame hockey and lack of sleep if they didnt turn out like I wanted. Still got NFL though..

Anyway, I was really stoked about getting this season started. Always been a neutral hockeyfan from Europe, but after visiting Minnesota and my family over there this summer I finally had a team to follow.

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10-19-2012, 05:28 PM
  #977
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It just doesn't seem likely--at all--next season will play out like nothing ever happened where revenue streams are involved. And I don't think there is any rational reason to believe they'll increase.

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10-19-2012, 05:38 PM
  #978
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If you listen to Fehr's rhetoric about negotiations being give and take you can see what is being offered by the players: They will have a potential reduction in their share in exchange for salary certainty. Every PA proposal has essentially de-linked the player's share from actual revenue and eliminated the escrow. The NHL will not accept the elimination of escrow and linkage. This is why it took them 10 minutes to say "NO" The PA could go on and on about "but if revenues grow by x% you'll be better off". If the owners give the players salary certainty they lose their own profit certainty, because if revenue growth is stagnant suddenly they are paying players way too much. When Bettman talks about "speaking the same language" this is what he is talking about.

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10-19-2012, 06:52 PM
  #979
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wueste View Post
If you listen to Fehr's rhetoric about negotiations being give and take you can see what is being offered by the players: They will have a potential reduction in their share in exchange for salary certainty. Every PA proposal has essentially de-linked the player's share from actual revenue and eliminated the escrow. The NHL will not accept the elimination of escrow and linkage. This is why it took them 10 minutes to say "NO" The PA could go on and on about "but if revenues grow by x% you'll be better off". If the owners give the players salary certainty they lose their own profit certainty, because if revenue growth is stagnant suddenly they are paying players way too much. When Bettman talks about "speaking the same language" this is what he is talking about.
Exactly. The league has made it perfectly clear that de-linkage is a non-starter. The same is true about proposals under 6 years in length. So far the PA has only ever brought proposals that de-link salary from revenue and are under 6 years in length. It's almost as if they have no intention of actually negotiating with the league.

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10-19-2012, 07:56 PM
  #980
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Not too upset. Not as upset as some of the loons over on the NHL board area where they are positively irate at the players. At the end of the day, NCAA (WCHA) stick has never been of terribly poor quality and we always get to see our local boys on our five WCHA teams. A number of them are NHL bound as well.

Outside of that, we can't get USHL games televised here; no AHL that I know of, outside of NHL network occasionally. Maybe FSN, if they are smart, will show some Aeros games. That would be nice.

However, ESPN has grabbed 12 KHL games and It is very good quality. I saw the Dynamo game with both Chara and Ovechkin (two of the best players on the planet, no doubt) and it was very good.

But I want to stress that while I love the Wild, I don't begrudge the players (PA) for negotiating hard; nor am I going to go off on some rabid tangent blasting the players union.

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10-19-2012, 08:00 PM
  #981
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Duluth has televised USHL games (at least they were advertising them as being broadcast the last time I visited my parents).

But if you're commenting on that KHL game being "very good" I hope you only saw the second period. The first and third were awful.

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10-19-2012, 08:07 PM
  #982
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Originally Posted by squidz View Post
Duluth has televised USHL games (at least they were advertising them as being broadcast the last time I visited my parents).

But if you're commenting on that KHL game being "very good" I hope you only saw the second period. The first and third were awful.
I only actually saw most of the second and I think some of the first. Then I had to split for work.

I enjoyed what I saw. Whenever you put guys like Chara and Ovy out teams there is going to be some action.

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10-19-2012, 11:41 PM
  #983
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this ****ing sucks.

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Old
10-20-2012, 12:59 AM
  #984
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Joke is on the NHL and the players. I didn't want to go to any games till November anyway.

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10-20-2012, 01:07 AM
  #985
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Joke is on the NHL and the players. I didn't want to go to any games till November anyway.
That's actually been discussed as being part of the league's strategy (and even from a meta standpoint in the NHLPA's strategy). The NHL is a strongly gate driven league, so they're very aware of deep attendance stats. Attendance at non-season opener games in October and November have the lowest attendance amongst all games in the season. It's even lower than March/April games for teams that are out of the playoff hunt.

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10-20-2012, 01:15 AM
  #986
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Helps me focus on school... *sigh*

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10-20-2012, 01:18 AM
  #987
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To be honest, I actually like going to the games in October. There's something in the air....it's a new season.....everybody is excited.....the changing of the season.....walking outside with your jersey on and not needing a jacket.....what's not to love?!

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10-20-2012, 01:22 AM
  #988
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Originally Posted by NHL1674 View Post
To be honest, I actually like going to the games in October. There's something in the air....it's a new season.....everybody is excited.....the changing of the season.....walking outside with your jersey on and not needing a jacket.....what's not to love?!
I love hockey any time, but unfortunately, for most of the league, people don't care about NHL in late October/early November. It's en vogue for the first couple home games, but then nobody cares until January.

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10-20-2012, 01:43 PM
  #989
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Fehr's new letter to players.

It contains the details of that "third proposal" and Daly is right, that proposal is an utter disaster and possibly the worst deal the players have offered up yet. Basically, after exempting some $600MM from the equation and inflating HRR projections in each year by 5% more than is reasonable, the deal still never reaches the 50% figure that the PA has repeatedly claimed it does.

Furthermore, judging from all the extra complexity and extremely poor explanation of the proposal to the players, it seems the intent of the PA is to try convince players that the deals they're offering are far better for the league than reality would have. There doesn't seem to be any desire from the PA for their members to even understand the proposals they're offering.

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10-20-2012, 03:58 PM
  #990
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Terrible. I think the PA needs to get on the same page as everyone.

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Old
10-21-2012, 02:05 PM
  #991
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Well, one positive thing compared to recent years. I'm not nearly as tired that I used to be

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Old
10-21-2012, 03:14 PM
  #992
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i dunno how to post twitter stuff, but

Allan Walsh ‏@walsha

NHL players have accepted 50/50, just honor the current contracts signed by owners (and Bettman) and we can play hockey now.

I think we kinda already knew this, but yeah. Not official or anything


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Old
10-21-2012, 03:17 PM
  #993
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Nothing new to see.

Also, that's Allan Walsh.

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10-21-2012, 03:38 PM
  #994
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NHL believes deal to end lockout is ‘on the table’

Legit article.

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Old
10-21-2012, 03:54 PM
  #995
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we will see this week about it

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Old
10-21-2012, 03:59 PM
  #996
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Aside from secondary concessions the owners have asked for, the main issue the players are going to have with that "framework" is the provision in the make-whole section where the previous year's make-whole payment cuts into the players' share the next year. Ultimately it is still artificially cutting agreed upon contracts by using the escrow.

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10-21-2012, 04:02 PM
  #997
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wueste View Post
Aside from secondary concessions the owners have asked for, the main issue the players are going to have with that "framework" is the provision in the make-whole section where the previous year's make-whole payment cuts into the players' share the next year. Ultimately it is still artificially cutting agreed upon contracts by using the escrow.
To quote something from this article in response:

Quote:
The players don't like the "make whole" provision, because it comes out of their future share. It's players paying players, not owners paying players. Well, they could have proposed that it come out of the owners' share instead. They didn't. The players could have negotiated descending percentages of HRR – going from, say, 54 down to 50 – which would still increase their pay in the long run based on their projections, which are more optimistic than the league's. They didn't. They could have tweaked the rest of the owners' proposal. They didn't.

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Old
10-21-2012, 04:09 PM
  #998
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Yeah, its like if somebody gave you a donut but said the baker doesn't wash his hands: you'll never get past that possible negative to be reasonable enough to just enjoy the donut

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10-21-2012, 04:16 PM
  #999
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Actually I had a thought about, instead of "make-whole" payments as the NHL suggests, the amount required to move the salaries to 50% instead be held in a pension that would be paid over 10 years upon the player's retirement (with perhaps a 5% annual growth). This would spread the costs out over a long period of time (as much as 30 years for a few players) and you could justify not being accounted as players salary since it isn't salary anymore.

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10-21-2012, 04:22 PM
  #1000
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I'm getting vibes that this week will be CRUCIAL if a deal is to get done between the NHL and NHLPA

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