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2012-2013 Prospect Talk PART IV

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Old
10-08-2012, 08:45 AM
  #151
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I'm not sure how many of you have actually watched Strome play live or on TV
I get the impression that everyone here thinks he is somewhat of a goal score but he is a playmaker somewhat like Adam Oates.

To put up points he is going to need a sniper otherwise he will not have as many points as people think

Quite honestly I am not sure how he's going to do at the NHL level he is not very fast so it will be interesting if he even Pans out

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10-08-2012, 09:12 AM
  #152
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Originally Posted by Chapin Landvogt View Post
Agreed, although I do feel the first 7-10 picks are generally THE closest thing to surefire future NHLers that you can get out of this crapshoot (like, no duh.:-)), and we've had a lot of those in recent years.
True. Hopefully(barring a full-season lockout) we won't be picking in that range for a long, long time.

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Originally Posted by Chapin Landvogt View Post
I honestly don't know how Snow would proceed with picks around spots 15-20. I hope we find out by no sooner than the next draft AFTER a season of play. None of this percentage ball draft crap that allows some team like Pittsburgh, Philly or LA get a top 3 pick.
Good point, haven't really thought of that either. I'd assume at this point, with all the talent we've stocked in our system, Snow would just go for the home-run in rounds 1 and 2. We have a ton of guys who look like they will be serviceable NHLers at the very least, so I wouldn't mind going after the boom-or-bust type guys early on in the draft. Honestly though, I'd be happier if the pick was traded at the deadline for some playoff push help.

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Originally Posted by Chapin Landvogt View Post
Agreed, whereas I think it's gonna be a long time coming before we get any real indication of that ceiling.
I wouldn't be so sure. Granted I'm probably one of Bailey's biggest supporters here, but I think we'll start seeing some quality results sooner rather than later. I love the chemistry he shows with Okposo, and depending on how quickly one of Strome or Nelson develop and start centering that line, I think they have a shot at being a dangerous unit. Once that happens, who knows how good this team can be?

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Originally Posted by Chapin Landvogt View Post
Nino can still be a goodin'. One is right to question his choice though. As a youngin', he had just arrived on the scene with less than a PPG average in Portland and had one really terrific game at the WJC. That kind of put him on the map. For my money, not only was Fowler the clearcut choice based on his natural skillset, but also on BOATLOADS of achievements. He had won it all in the CHL and at the WJC. He had been touted for years. Put him aside, I would have also gone with either Granlund or Skinner. What Granlund did in the SM-Liiga was downright Koivian. Skinner didn't exactly JUST arrive on the scene his draft year, but did - like Nino - move up the rankings considerably. Unlike Nino, he had truly outstanding numbers and a MEGA-playoffs. He looked like a winner with a true nose for the net to me, even at that time.
I dunno, outside of Fowler I still think I wanted Nino here more than Granlund, Skinner or whoever else was available. Obviously Skinner has proven me wrong, but at the time I thought he was too small to really be an effective top-6 player. I did like Granlund, but I've been pretty horrible with projecting the success of Finns in the past. Everyone that I thought would be an NHL scorer has ended up as a decent 3rd liner or worse. Maybe just ignorance on my part, but either way, between the two I would have absolutely taken Nino.

As I said though, I still have big expectations for Nino. I like the physical game that he brings, and think that is something this team needs more of going forward. Physical, relentless forchecking forwards in front of smart, sound puck-moving defensemen. A team that just wears out the opposition, forcing them to play most of the game in their own zone. Depending on how Okposo bounces back now that he has a full year of play and is completely healthy, we might not be far off.

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No it wasn't. Nor would I say it was. I have however been arguing for some time now that the players who have been looked at as top draftpick contenders for years in advance of their draft often get overscrutinized and surpassed a bit by pieces that, for 3 or 4 months, become shinier. It happens just about every year now.

Duchene almost surpassed Tavares. Fowler fell. Couturier fell. Look where Forsberg and Grigorenko went this past summer.

Although not alone, we have been guilty of also letting such pieces pass us by, with only Tavares being the exception.

I liked Strome a lot as a pick and was into his possibilities. My rational side however never failed in saying that Couturier was the NO-BRAINER as the sixth pick. Still, going into the draft, I'd have been shocked to see our Isles take him. Just didn't seem like the Snow type.
I agree. It's actually kind of sad. The best players spend so much time at the top that people start going out of their way to find any weakness, and then completely exaggerate it no matter how microscopic it may be. Thankfully Snow didn't buy into that with Tavares.

That said, part of me still thinks that if Strome was destined to be this teams 2nd line center, we would have just went with Couturier. If you look up 2nd-line center in the dictionary you will probably see a picture of Couturier. The fact that Strome was the pick instead just leads me to believe he was drafted to play with Tavares. If not, I really just can't see the sense in passing on SC. Not unless they just fell head over heels in love with this kid. That or again, they just want to make sure Tavares is happy.

Time will tell, I guess.

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Originally Posted by Chapin Landvogt View Post
Fair enough, although I want Strome to be a scorer and solely a scorer when he gets here. Truth be told, aside from the last 20 games of the season, when Okposo and Bailey suddenly came to life again, we were a one-trick pony and that HAS TO CHANGE. Strome is the most likely internal candidate to bring that change. I want to be convinced of that now.
I agree, and I'm sure it will change. Even though our UFA and trade activity has been pretty non-existent, there is still help on the way. Strome, Nelson, Nino, Kabanov, Persson. The development of Bailey, Okposo, Cizikas, Ullstrom, Martin and even Tavares. Grabner finding that happy medium between last year's numbers and his numbers from 2 seasons ago. Our blue-line improving, which will mean less time in our own zone and more time in the offensive zone, which will hopefully mean more goals for and less goals against.

Bottom line, I have confidence in this team scoring goals going forward. I'm more concerned with how our defense will look once Visnovsky and possibly Streit walk at the end of the year, and how Poulin and Nilsson, our goaltending of the future develop.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chapin Landvogt View Post
As we all are... Aside from 2010, where we nonetheless got Nino, Nelson and Kabanov, I am very happy with the later rounds of our drafts. Just wish the first two rounds had been more impactful to date, but good things are always worth waiting for.
Agreed.

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Old
10-08-2012, 09:13 AM
  #153
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All I wanted to know. And I disagree. You're asking this kid to put up JT numbers and he just doesn't possess that talent, not many do.

Further, if you look at his numbers objectively last season, he actually improved quite a bit. I do agree though, that numbers aren't the end all be all.... Rob Schremp is all that needs to be said on that front.
Fair enough. I guess I expect him to deliver in the manner a purely offensive-oriented kid without great physical ability is supposed to produce in order to verify his draft position ahead of more highly touted players. It's actually less of a comment against him, and more of one against the team for selecting him at 6 ahead of at least one more much more proven quantity.

Actually, the whole talk got started with me simply stating that I felt the 8 points in 6 games (now 10 in 7) was a bit on the disappointing side. Then I went on a rant of sorts.:-)

Truth be told though, I simply ultimately worry that Strome will be nothing more than a Sam Gagner, and this irks me. We need more than that. It irks me most especially because I know we could have had a Couturier - and that we could have used this type of profile as a rangy, #2 center who is ample on the PP and may even have some quite high-end scoring promise.

But I'll digress at this point... Here's hoping Strome's humble 4th year scoring can be attributed to primarily a less than stellar supporting cast, although top offensive players tend to become better goal-scorers when the surrounding cast leaves things to be desired.

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10-08-2012, 09:44 AM
  #154
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Originally Posted by Chapin Landvogt View Post
Fair enough. I guess I expect him to deliver in the manner a purely offensive-oriented kid without great physical ability is supposed to produce in order to verify his draft position ahead of more highly touted players. It's actually less of a comment against him, and more of one against the team for selecting him at 6 ahead of at least one more much more proven quantity.

.
The Isles will have told Strome what they think his weaknesses are, what they want him to improve on.

From articles we know that Strome has been trying to improve his physical play, working out in the Dungeon.

From the article below, we also know that Strome focused last season on improving defensively. It makes sense that he's continuing to work on the weakest parts of his game, even if that means sacrificing some scoring.

http://www.hockeyprospectus.com/arti...din&mode=login
Strome is able to quarterback a power play from the half walls and will be the kind of player that the Islanders look to be a starting point of offense and someone to control the play. Strome's offensive skills were never a concern, but this year he really addressed his off-puck play, showing much better defensive play, and more willingness to dig out pucks in defensive-end board battles and to pressure opponents on the forecheck. His acceleration is solid, too.

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10-08-2012, 12:47 PM
  #155
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Originally Posted by CREW99AW View Post
The Isles will have told Strome what they think his weaknesses are, what they want him to improve on.

From articles we know that Strome has been trying to improve his physical play, working out in the Dungeon.

From the article below, we also know that Strome focused last season on improving defensively. It makes sense that he's continuing to work on the weakest parts of his game, even if that means sacrificing some scoring.

http://www.hockeyprospectus.com/arti...din&mode=login
Strome is able to quarterback a power play from the half walls and will be the kind of player that the Islanders look to be a starting point of offense and someone to control the play. Strome's offensive skills were never a concern, but this year he really addressed his off-puck play, showing much better defensive play, and more willingness to dig out pucks in defensive-end board battles and to pressure opponents on the forecheck. His acceleration is solid, too.
Glad to see that he understands hockey is more than just lighting up the lamp!

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10-08-2012, 06:58 PM
  #156
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Top Corner View Post
I'm not sure how many of you have actually watched Strome play live or on TV
I get the impression that everyone here thinks he is somewhat of a goal score but he is a playmaker somewhat like Adam Oates.

To put up points he is going to need a sniper otherwise he will not have as many points as people think

Quite honestly I am not sure how he's going to do at the NHL level he is not very fast so it will be interesting if he even Pans out




Not comparing him too JT but this sounds awfully similar too what they were saying about Johnny when he was coming out of juniors

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10-08-2012, 07:19 PM
  #157
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[/B]


Not comparing him too JT but this sounds awfully similar too what they were saying about Johnny when he was coming out of juniors
When Tavares was drafted they said he needed legit NHL wingers, not necessarily a sniper. He came out of juniors as a goal scorer phenomenon. Now he's more of a playmaker.

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10-09-2012, 08:43 AM
  #158
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Originally Posted by SLAPSHOT723 View Post
When Tavares was drafted they said he needed legit NHL wingers, not necessarily a sniper. He came out of juniors as a goal scorer phenomenon. Now he's more of a playmaker.
I think this is the most encouraging thing about Tavares. The fact that he was a goal-scoring machine in Juniors. Now that we know he can skate in this league and make plays, I really wouldn't be surprised to see his goal totals begin to rise.

I could see him having a few 40-60-100 seasons... maybe one or two even better seasons.

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10-09-2012, 08:52 AM
  #159
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Yeah..if Tavares had complimenting linemates..I think he could very well hit 120. You stick talent with talent and I don't mean guys who have potential...stick two solid stars on each wing...he could easily be top 3 if not top scorer in the league.

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10-11-2012, 06:35 AM
  #160
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Tuesday
Peterborough 3, Niagara 1-Strome, Graham, -1 each, Theoret scratched.

Wednesday
Val d' Or 7, Cape Breton 2-Leduc, -2
Edmonton 4, Medicine Hat 2-Reinhart, 1 goal.
Spokane 6, Kelowna 4-Kichton, 2 assists.

Friday Night College Hockey on NBC Sports Network, 7 PM.
Notre Dame (Anders Lee, Robbie Russo), vs Maine.


Last edited by Degeneration Rex: 10-11-2012 at 07:10 AM.
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10-11-2012, 11:32 AM
  #161
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Originally Posted by Degeneration Rex View Post
Tuesday
Peterborough 3, Niagara 1-Strome, Graham, -1 each, Theoret scratched.

Wednesday
Val d' Or 7, Cape Breton 2-Leduc, -2
Edmonton 4, Medicine Hat 2-Reinhart, 1 goal.
Spokane 6, Kelowna 4-Kichton, 2 assists.

Friday Night College Hockey on NBC Sports Network, 7 PM.
Notre Dame (Anders Lee, Robbie Russo), vs Maine.
Degen Rex, you are definitely THE MAN, thanks for all of the updates, as well as the heads up on Notre Dame vs Maine on Friday night, Thanks again, and you definitely get my vote for poster of the year (so far).

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10-11-2012, 12:23 PM
  #162
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Degen Rex, you are definitely THE MAN, thanks for all of the updates, as well as the heads up on Notre Dame vs Maine on Friday night, Thanks again, and you definitely get my vote for poster of the year (so far).
Thanks Scott, without the NHL I'm listening to plenty of junior games
on the internet while I grade my students papers.

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10-11-2012, 01:29 PM
  #163
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Degen Rex, you are definitely THE MAN, thanks for all of the updates, as well as the heads up on Notre Dame vs Maine on Friday night, Thanks again, and you definitely get my vote for poster of the year (so far).
Agreed, thanks for the updates DRex. Keep up the good work.

Do we have even have a poster of the year award?

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10-11-2012, 01:42 PM
  #164
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Agreed, thanks for the updates DRex. Keep up the good work.

Do we have even have a poster of the year award?
I think we used to do awards here back when Killer Carlson was mod. Not sure if they still do it. If so I must have missed it.

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10-11-2012, 09:23 PM
  #165
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Thursday

Ottawa 4, Niagara 3-Theoret, 1 goal, Strome, Graham 1 assist each.

Friday Night on NHL Network, 10 PM
WHL-Calgary vs Edmonton (Reinhart).

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10-12-2012, 05:30 AM
  #166
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Originally Posted by Degeneration Rex View Post
Thursday

Ottawa 4, Niagara 3-Theoret, 1 goal, Strome, Graham 1 assist each.

Friday Night on NHL Network, 10 PM
WHL-Calgary vs Edmonton (Reinhart).
Holy moly, a hockey double header, get to see Lee and Russo for ND at 7 and Reinhart for the Oil Kings at 10 !

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10-12-2012, 06:40 AM
  #167
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Holy moly, a hockey double header, get to see Lee and Russo for ND at 7 and Reinhart for the Oil Kings at 10 !
Last night when I forward to Friday,the program list was the junior game, Calgary,
Edmonton at 10 PM. This morning I forward the program list NHL Network listed the
million repeat of the 2011 Winter Classic and the junior game would be aired as a
delayed broadcast at 1 AM Saturday morning. Sorry about this, got excited that
we would get a live junior game and now the listing is different.

Just saw that NHL Network is playing Islanders 1980,81 and 82 Cup clinchers
starting at 8 AM this morning.


Last edited by Degeneration Rex: 10-12-2012 at 07:08 AM.
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Old
10-12-2012, 06:59 AM
  #168
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EUROPE:
- John Tavares has 2-3-5, 2 PM and a -1 in 3 games for SC Bern
- Mark Streit has 2-4-6, 6 PM and a +2 in 6 games for SC Bern
- Michael Grabner has 1-1-2, 0 PM and a +1 in 1 game for Villacher SV
- Frans Nielsen has 0-4-4, 2 PM and a +3 in 4 games for Lukko Rauma

- Mikko Koskinen is 6-3-1 with a .905 save percentage and 2.18 GAA in 10 games for KaiPa.
- Jesse Joensuu has 6-3-9, 10 PM and a +2 in 8 games for Ässät Pori.
- Ville Pokka has 0-2-2, 2 PM and a +3 in 6 games for Karpat.
- Kirill Petrov has 4-2-6, 14 PM and a +7 in 14 games for Kazan AK.
- Rhett Rakhshani has 3-5-8, 6 PM and a +2 in 11 games for HV71.
- Mark Katic has 0-3-3, 12 PM and a +3 in 9 games for the Eisbären Berlin.
- Justin Dibenedetto has 5-9-14, 4 PM and a -2 in 10 games for Salzburg EC.

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10-12-2012, 07:15 AM
  #169
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Notes:
- After 7 pts in 7 games for Rakhshani, he has only 1 assist in the last four games. Recently, a teammate of his laid prone on the ice for 20 minutes after a routine battle in the corner in which his helmeted head hit the plexiglass, but otherwise didn't suffer any inordinate damage or awkwardness. He was removed on a stretcher and the teams and refs decided to simply cancel the game. The score was 1-1 in the third. No word on what the league plans to do.
- Koskinen has won two in a row.
- Tavares went 2-1-3 in his last game.
- Streit got a pretty assist on goal where he did a spinarama on the blueline. However, the opponent who thought he was diving into a shot that never came slid into Streit awkwardly and he's not been the same since.

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10-12-2012, 12:43 PM
  #170
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Originally Posted by Degeneration Rex View Post
Last night when I forward to Friday,the program list was the junior game, Calgary,
Edmonton at 10 PM. This morning I forward the program list NHL Network listed the
million repeat of the 2011 Winter Classic and the junior game would be aired as a
delayed broadcast at 1 AM Saturday morning. Sorry about this, got excited that
we would get a live junior game and now the listing is different.

Just saw that NHL Network is playing Islanders 1980,81 and 82 Cup clinchersstarting at 8 AM this morning.
Either way Degen Rex, a good night/morning for hockey, probably will DVR the delayed broadcast of the junior game, and watch it tomorrow.

As far as the highlighted part, I wish I had called in sick from work, lol. Though I do have those games as part of the Islander's 10 best games DVD.

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10-12-2012, 01:03 PM
  #171
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Either way Degen Rex, a good night/morning for hockey, probably will DVR the delayed broadcast of the junior game, and watch it tomorrow.

As far as the highlighted part, I wish I had called in sick from work, lol. Though I do have those games as part of the Islander's 10 best games DVD.
On Saturday they are replaying the Calgary-Edmonton game at 7 AM and 7:30 PM.
After the Notre Dame-Maine game NBC Sports Network has another college game,
Army vs Nebraska-Omaha.

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10-12-2012, 01:05 PM
  #172
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Originally Posted by Chapin Landvogt View Post
EUROPE:
- John Tavares has 2-3-5, 2 PM and a -1 in 3 games for SC Bern
- Mark Streit has 2-4-6, 6 PM and a +2 in 6 games for SC Bern
- Michael Grabner has 1-1-2, 0 PM and a +1 in 1 game for Villacher SV
- Frans Nielsen has 0-4-4, 2 PM and a +3 in 4 games for Lukko Rauma

- Mikko Koskinen is 6-3-1 with a .905 save percentage and 2.18 GAA in 10 games for KaiPa.
- Jesse Joensuu has 6-3-9, 10 PM and a +2 in 8 games for Ässät Pori.
- Ville Pokka has 0-2-2, 2 PM and a +3 in 6 games for Karpat.
- Kirill Petrov has 4-2-6, 14 PM and a +7 in 14 games for Kazan AK.- Rhett Rakhshani has 3-5-8, 6 PM and a +2 in 11 games for HV71.
- Mark Katic has 0-3-3, 12 PM and a +3 in 9 games for the Eisbären Berlin.
- Justin Dibenedetto has 5-9-14, 4 PM and a -2 in 10 games for Salzburg EC.
Is it me, or does it look like Petrov really isn't a top notch prospect. Hell, Tarasenko & Kuznetsov both averaged almost a point a game as 20 year old's in the same league. If Petrov is a really good prospect, he should really be dominating more as a 22 year old. He's only averaging 0.43 pts per game as a 22 year old. After a breakout season of sorts last season, he seems to have regressed. I know there is more to hockey than points, BUT, Younger players are dominating more than him.

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10-12-2012, 01:26 PM
  #173
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Friday

Finland-Karpat 4, HIFK 1-Ville Pokka, 1 goal, + 1.


Last edited by Degeneration Rex: 10-12-2012 at 01:38 PM.
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10-12-2012, 01:30 PM
  #174
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Is it me, or does it look like Petrov really isn't a top notch prospect. Hell, Tarasenko & Kuznetsov both averaged almost a point a game as 20 year old's in the same league. If Petrov is a really good prospect, he should really be dominating more as a 22 year old. He's only averaging 0.43 pts per game as a 22 year old. After a breakout season of sorts last season, he seems to have regressed. I know there is more to hockey than points, BUT, Younger players are dominating more than him.

I've seen some Ak Bars games and he looked solid. He was playing second line minutes (with russian NT player Alexei Tereschenko) and also appeared on both special teams (his most recent goal was a shorty). However it looked to me, that he isn't really developing offensively. He likes to use his body and maybe smaller rink would suit his style better. He is pretty reliable on his own end and is featuring on the first penalty kill unit.

By the way, Ville Pokka scored his first SM-Liiga goal today...

And according to Rangers twitter, tonight Sound Tigers game will be streamed free :

Quote:
Tonight's @ctwhale game will be streamed live on blueshirtsunited.com at 7:30pm ET.

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10-12-2012, 02:16 PM
  #175
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Originally Posted by kuwo View Post
I've seen some Ak Bars games and he looked solid. He was playing second line minutes (with russian NT player Alexei Tereschenko) and also appeared on both special teams (his most recent goal was a shorty). However it looked to me, that he isn't really developing offensively. He likes to use his body and maybe smaller rink would suit his style better. He is pretty reliable on his own end and is featuring on the first penalty kill unit.

By the way, Ville Pokka scored his first SM-Liiga goal today...

And according to Rangers twitter, tonight Sound Tigers game will be streamed free :
Pokka has already tied last season's point total (3), in only 7 games. Last year he had 3 points in 35 games. I believe one of his weak points, scouting wise, was his offense, nice to see him working on that.

Also, hockey overload tonight ! Sports overload really. I'll have the ND game on my TV to watch Lee and Russo, the Yankee's game on my iPhone, and Sound Tigers streaming on my laptop or tablet.

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