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Old
09-09-2012, 04:07 AM
  #151
oilinblood
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WeridAl View Post
You would of notice Marincin at the WJC the last 2 years, just ask the American player whose head he took off 2 years ago. Marincin and Gernat were a force to be reckoned with at the last time WJC, they just played on a bad team, the same could be said about Musil.

You could say that the Pens D prospects are overrated because they played on stacked teams. Face it both teams have some very good D prospects and only time will tell which one will be better.
I dont see the Oilers trading, nor rushing, ANY of their prospects. Tambi has proven he is just not that kind of GM. When he was brough it to be GM he said he would model the Oilers after the Detroit Red Wings. The Detroit Red Wings were a team that hardly ever had a U20 player on their big squad. You develop players in the other leagues and NOT the NHL. NHL is not a training school.

We will not be trading for other prospects either unless they are stand outs that our scouts are in love with.

Seriously people on these boards really over value people that are judged to be "meh", "mediocre". he will be a greaqt 14th forward. he will be a terrific 8th dman with possible 3rd pair upside. mhmm. he will be one of those rare 7 minute a night guys who will be used once every 5 games and just warm a seat in the pressbox because he is just so great at being ordinary and not special. theres not 200 of those guys unemployed every year in hockey.

Klefbom i believe is legit. I know the THN reporters interviewed some scouts as to who was best "klefbom or Murray" when the oilers appeared to be taking Murray at #1. 7 out of 10 said Klefbom was the better prospect.

All i know is he is looking better than Larsson (comparing larssons draft year on-ice performance to klefboms on-ice performance and growth last year) in the non-offensive side of the game. If he got a bit meaner id love it.

And ofcourse Justin Schultz.

Other than those guys i dont care hw our d do. We will always have draft picks to pick our own. Or you go after the elite like the Rundblads Cowens, not lower tiers. wiat until lower tiers dont get re-signed due to contract cap etc. If it was up to me id put an iron curtain around my team and all its assets and only twice during the actual season would i come out and do any tinkering or statements. I wouldnt even talk to other teams. I just need to focus on my team and full commitment to getting them all in the best position possible.


Last edited by oilinblood: 09-09-2012 at 04:47 AM.
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Old
09-09-2012, 04:23 AM
  #152
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[QUOTE=Sutter16;54112819]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fictionzero View Post
As a Pittsburgh fan, Pens have to add... But to clarify with Oil fans Bortz has upside. Not top 3 upside, but he looks to be a solid 3rd pairing dman, with possible #4 potential... Maybe something like this...

To Edm:
Lovejoy
Bortuzzo
Kennedy

To Pens:
Paarjavi
3rd

Done where do I sign? I LOVE Paarjavi's potental playing with Sid/Geno and there's a logjam of great young talent coming up in Edmonton, mainly the Forwards. And they need D and bottom 6 help. Would be a very good trade.


This isnt bashing you or the pens. The following should just be known, obvious fact from Tambis 3 year tenure. 1. he doesnt like to trade unless he is looking for 1 of at most 3 specific players he wants, or2. he is trying to boot someone out of the system. he prefers having a draft pick rather than a mediocre talent. If your ceiling is "meh" "average", "might develop into someone you never notice"... than chances are Tambi would prefer nothing or a DP. If people are willing to send their players out...im thinking they arent very special anyways and theres not a whole lot left for improvement.

dont trouble yourself with the thoughts. The Oilers are unlikely trading partners with everyone in the league, not just the Pens. We will keep all of our own prospects. we picked them for reasons and there is no reason to rush them.

I think Tambi has proven he isnt a man to make many trades. If he isnt going after somebody specific than theres no chance of getting his interest.

If you had a prospect that was elite at something than maybe. We dont need Dmen in general. We need specifics - a RHD tough SOB top 4 now dman to play PK and take petrys place with smid in final minute shutdowns. anything else is just overkill and frankly should never cost you a top prospect. we dont need more prospects. We have our own home grown for that.

GMs dont just grab prospects either. they need to fill a need. he is a LHD slap shot pk, 3rd pair dman with high pain tolerance who blocks shots, great reach, lateral movement belw average, will not be offensive passer. specifics. if guys dont even have a known rep for being great in at least one area....there are hundreds of kids drafted and signed every year to replace them.

That all being said; i watched the playoffs and Magnus was by far our best playr on the ice. Made stuff happen every shift and his SEL defensive training is standout. I would have liked to see them try him at centre since he is so reliable. I hope they let him develop 2 years down there. It doesnt bother me one bit to keep him down there developing and getting prepared.


Last edited by oilinblood: 09-09-2012 at 04:34 AM.
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Old
09-09-2012, 04:26 AM
  #153
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Oilers' fans aren't seriously trying to convince people that their group of D prospects is better than Pittsburgh's, right...?

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09-09-2012, 04:31 AM
  #154
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LatvianTwist View Post
Oilers' fans aren't seriously trying to convince people that their group of D prospects is better than Pittsburgh's, right...?
I like what we have in J. Schultz and Klefbom, the rest of the guys IMO are not on that level.

The way that I see it is that we have potential future NHLers in Teubert, Musil, Marincin, Fedun, Gernat, and Laleggia if he has the core strength to play against bigger players. Add those guys to J. Schultz and Klefbom and we have a stocked cupboard on D. I haven't seen enough of Pitt's guys to compare, but I like what we have in the system and on the big club with guys like Petry and Smid going forward.

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09-09-2012, 04:34 AM
  #155
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oilinblood View Post



This isnt bashing you or the pens. The following should just be known, obvious fact from Tambis 3 year tenure. 1. he doesnt like to trade unless he is looking for 1 of at most 3 specific players he wants, or2. he is trying to boot someone out of the system. he prefers having a draft pick rather than a mediocre talent. If your ceiling is "meh" "average", "might develop into someone you never notice"... than chances are Tambi would prefer nothing or a DP. If people are willing to send their players out...im thinking they arent very special anyways and theres not a whole lot left for improvement.

dont trouble yourself with the thoughts. The Oilers are unlikely trading partners with everyone in the league, not just the Pens. We will keep all of our own prospects. we picked them for reasons and there is no reason to rush them.

I think Tambi has proven he isnt a man to make many trades. If he isnt going after somebody specific than theres no chance of getting his interest.

If you had a prospect that was elite at something than maybe. We dont need Dmen in general. We need specifics - a RHD tough SOB top 4 now dman to play PK and take petrys place with smid in final minute shutdowns. anything else is just overkill and frankly should never cost you a top prospect. we dont need more prospects. We have our own home grown for that.

GMs dont just grab prospects either. they need to fill a need. he is a LHD slap shot pk, 3rd pair dman with high pain tolerance who blocks shots, great reach, lateral movement belw average, will not be offensive passer. specifics. if guys dont even have a known rep for being great in at least one area....there are hundreds of kids drafted and signed every year to replace them.
There will come a point that that will change. As of right now we are seeing what we have in the system, but sooner or later we will see moves.

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Old
09-09-2012, 05:52 AM
  #156
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oilinblood View Post
I dont see the Oilers trading, nor rushing, ANY of their prospects. Tambi has proven he is just not that kind of GM. When he was brough it to be GM he said he would model the Oilers after the Detroit Red Wings. The Detroit Red Wings were a team that hardly ever had a U20 player on their big squad. You develop players in the other leagues and NOT the NHL. NHL is not a training school.

We will not be trading for other prospects either unless they are stand outs that our scouts are in love with.

Seriously people on these boards really over value people that are judged to be "meh", "mediocre". he will be a greaqt 14th forward. he will be a terrific 8th dman with possible 3rd pair upside. mhmm. he will be one of those rare 7 minute a night guys who will be used once every 5 games and just warm a seat in the pressbox because he is just so great at being ordinary and not special. theres not 200 of those guys unemployed every year in hockey.

Klefbom i believe is legit. I know the THN reporters interviewed some scouts as to who was best "klefbom or Murray" when the oilers appeared to be taking Murray at #1. 7 out of 10 said Klefbom was the better prospect.

All i know is he is looking better than Larsson (comparing larssons draft year on-ice performance to klefboms on-ice performance and growth last year) in the non-offensive side of the game. If he got a bit meaner id love it.

And ofcourse Justin Schultz.

Other than those guys i dont care hw our d do. We will always have draft picks to pick our own. Or you go after the elite like the Rundblads Cowens, not lower tiers. wiat until lower tiers dont get re-signed due to contract cap etc. If it was up to me id put an iron curtain around my team and all its assets and only twice during the actual season would i come out and do any tinkering or statements. I wouldnt even talk to other teams. I just need to focus on my team and full commitment to getting them all in the best position possible.
Where did I say anything about trading any of Edmontons D prospects

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bryanbryoil View Post
There will come a point that that will change. As of right now we are seeing what we have in the system, but sooner or later we will see moves.
That point is going to come in the next couple of years and will depend on how long to the Oilers figure to resign Smid for.

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Old
09-09-2012, 06:57 AM
  #157
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Originally Posted by eXile59 View Post
Musil yes, Marincin maybe once for the WJC. Hard to see them when they aren't often playing in the big games, against the best talent. I get that you watch a lot of juniors but that doesn't make you a scout. I mean you don't find it weird that in your opinion everyone of the Oilers D are underrated & the Pens D are overrated? Maybe a little subjective?
I never said that the Pens d was overrated on the whole. And you will never find anywhere where I would have ever suggested that I am a scout or even an expert on prospects. That said, personally I think your prospect pool on the back end is excellent. In particular, I would love to have guys like Pouliot and Maata in the Oilers system. Both have significant potential, but like all defensemen the big question is will they realise it.

What I did say was that Musil and Marincin are closer to players of this calibre than they are to someone like Bortuzzo. My opinion is based on having watched a fair bit of each player at roughly the same stage of their development. So specifically I would say that you have underrated Musil and Marincicn vs Bortuzzo.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zen Arcade View Post
I'm curious as to why you feel Marincin is close to Despres, especially in terms of potential and where they're both at in their development at this point. I'm not knocking Marincin, by the way, I'd just put him more with someone like Brian Dumoulin, if we're comparing Pens prospects. Not that that's a bad thing, Dumoulin is one of my favorite prospects.
I don't think that I actually compared Marincin specifically to Depres. And in any case, "close" is subjective. Despres is certainly the more polished player at this point with a better complete game. No question if I had to choose between the two I'd pick Depres. Marincin on the other hand is more of a wild card.

I would say that right now it looks like Marincin has better offensive tools. Both are excellent skaters. Despres' already filled out as well so he gets a big edge because of his size, and this really helps his overall game. For this reason alone he is much closer to being ready for the pros and the NHL in particular. Marincin is still a skinny kid but he has the frame to carry 220lbs. Supposedly the Oilers are now working hard with him on his strength and conditioning. Progress in this respect would certainly help him close the gap somewhat , because he was a little more naturally aggressive than Depres as a junior.

As far as a comparison with Brian Dumoulin, I have to confess that while I have read a fair bit on him, I would have only seen him a couple of games in the WJHC, and I did not follow him at all. Overall though from what I know of Dumoulin, I'd say that this sounds fairly reasonable.

Quote:
Originally Posted by LatvianTwist View Post
Oilers' fans aren't seriously trying to convince people that their group of D prospects is better than Pittsburgh's, right...?
I won't speak for all Oiler fans but I will say that that was not my intention. The issue that we are trying to address is the misconception that many on here have that the Oilers are desperate for defensemen no matter how good they might be.

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09-09-2012, 01:13 PM
  #158
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LatvianTwist View Post
Oilers' fans aren't seriously trying to convince people that their group of D prospects is better than Pittsburgh's, right...?
No if you actually read more then the last page. Oiler fans are trying to convince people they werent the worst defensive team in the league (22nd in GA) and don have zero help on the way like HF believes.

I dont get why the majority of HF are so shocked Oiler fans dont want to trade prospects or picks for 3rd pairing dmen.

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Old
09-09-2012, 01:45 PM
  #159
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No if you actually read more then the last page. Oiler fans are trying to convince people they werent the worst defensive team in the league (22nd in GA) and don have zero help on the way like HF believes.

I dont get why the majority of HF are so shocked Oiler fans dont want to trade prospects or picks for 3rd pairing dmen.
because some have an opinion on the Oil's D, but haven't bothered to look up the prospect depth chart or just plain don't want to admit the Oil actually have decent defensive prospects coming, and a fair amount of them will come at roughly the same time.

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09-09-2012, 01:56 PM
  #160
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It's time for this thread to die. The OP's proposal was goofy and now its just bickering about blueline pools.

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09-09-2012, 02:00 PM
  #161
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LatvianTwist View Post
Oilers' fans aren't seriously trying to convince people that their group of D prospects is better than Pittsburgh's, right...?
Do you have guys like Klefbom or j Schultz in your system?

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09-09-2012, 02:01 PM
  #162
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@RRP...doesn't every proposal in this forum end up in a bickering contest?

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09-09-2012, 02:08 PM
  #163
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Originally Posted by ManByng View Post
@RRP...doesn't every proposal in this forum end up in a bickering contest?
To an extent, but this one was DOA and the bickering is about something completely unrelated to the OP.

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09-09-2012, 02:23 PM
  #164
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Originally Posted by jumptheshark View Post
Do you have guys like Klefbom or j Schultz in your system?
Yes they do.

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09-09-2012, 02:24 PM
  #165
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Time to put this one to rest.

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