HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Atlantic Division > Boston Bruins
Notices

Bruins sign Seguin to six-year contract extension

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
09-11-2012, 01:14 PM
  #101
bostonphoenix
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 1,250
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tim Vezina Thomas View Post
Lol what? Gotta disagree with you on this. But your general premise is correct, worse players should make less money...which is why Lucic should make more than Marchand.
I think that Marchand will be the more valuable player.

My fascination with Lucic has vanished. This is a player who does not show up for long periods of time. He ia not the player he once was. I see him regressing. A bulk of his points came in garbage games where we win 10-0 or other nonsense. He is not a every day player. I dont think he's worth close to the money you want to give him.

I believe that seguin is the better player today.

bostonphoenix is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
09-11-2012, 01:16 PM
  #102
dtam83
Registered User
 
dtam83's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Boston
Country: United States
Posts: 1,401
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crossfire View Post
Alexandra Raisman ‏@Aly_Raisman
@tylerseguin92 congrats! I'll definitely be watching this season! Good luck with everything

she wants the d
they are so going to date each other...

dtam83 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
09-11-2012, 01:17 PM
  #103
KnightofBoston
MVP
 
KnightofBoston's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Amherst, Ma
Country: United States
Posts: 12,224
vCash: 500
I think we'll see a different Lucic this year, especially in the post season.

That said I don't think he'll get more than 5, 4.75 is fair

KnightofBoston is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
09-11-2012, 01:19 PM
  #104
Res Nullius
Registered User
 
Res Nullius's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Massachusetts
Country: United States
Posts: 655
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by bp13 View Post
He's slightly better, IMO. Mostly because of the element of size/toughness he adds.

So if Marchand got $4.75m, I'd put Lucic at $5.25. And i think both are slightly overpaid at those numbers, but it's PC after all. And they're not dramatic overpayments by any stretch.

Whammer's point is the best one to me though...hunger is an issue. I suspect Seguin's got the talent to carry him, but guys like Marchand and Lucic need to bring consistent efforts. this has always been an issue with Lucic, which might be a reason to hold off on signing him long term for as long as possible.
This is how I feel about it as well. And that's not to say that I believe Lucic and Marchmont are completely products of their environment, I just don't think that either one of them has the individual skillset to be consistent like a Seguin-type player. The way they valued Marchand inflates Looch's already inflated value, plus he's an obvious fan-favorite and at this point pretty much the primary face of the organization, next to a few other guys. I just think that these contracts are valuing these guys at their absolute ceilings potential-wise, and in the case of Looch and March, that isn't something I expect to see every season, at least in terms of offensive production. To deny that the tangible stats shouldn't play a deciding role is unfounded, imo.

Res Nullius is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
09-11-2012, 01:24 PM
  #105
Tim Vezina Thomas
Dougie Time
 
Tim Vezina Thomas's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 6,745
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by bp13 View Post
He's slightly better, IMO. Mostly because of the element of size/toughness he adds.

So if Marchand got $4.75m, I'd put Lucic at $5.25. And i think both are slightly overpaid at those numbers, but it's PC after all. And they're not dramatic overpayments by any stretch.


Whammer's point is the best one to me though...hunger is an issue. I suspect Seguin's got the talent to carry him, but guys like Marchand and Lucic need to bring consistent efforts. this has always been an issue with Lucic, which might be a reason to hold off on signing him long term for as long as possible.
Agreed. Not saying Lucic is more talented, but what Lucic brings is IMO more important and unique than what Marchand brings. And yes I think thats a slight overpayment for both, but Chia always pays his players...and I think this will be no different.

I really don't see it being under 5.25...and think it will reach 5.5 potentially.

Tim Vezina Thomas is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
09-11-2012, 01:27 PM
  #106
Bruins4Lifer
HFBoards Sponsor
 
Bruins4Lifer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Regina, SK
Country: Canada
Posts: 7,917
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tim Vezina Thomas View Post
I never ever said he deserves to get the same raise, the "raise" Lucic was going to get according to the poster was around 700k, which would add up to the exact same amount Marchand got. I was more thinking a 1.25-1.5 mil raise...people took my point too literally, which was my fault I worded it poorly. All i meant was, Lucic isnt going to take the same amount as Marchand because hes proven more, and he shouldnt take such a pedestrian raise if Marchand got that much and did less than him. Had nothing to do with each players respective "raises."
Alright, but it's really hard to take what you said in bold after you previously said this:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tim Vezina Thomas
So Marchand gets a 2 mill raise, Seguin gets a two mill raise, and Lucic (the most proven out of all of them) gets a 750k raise?

__________________

Bruins4Lifer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
09-11-2012, 01:30 PM
  #107
EverettMike
Registered User
 
EverettMike's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Everett, MA
Country: United States
Posts: 17,914
vCash: 500
BING-****ing BONG!

Chiarelli is mother-****ing killing it right now.

Best GM in the league? Peter King says Definitely-ish!

EverettMike is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
09-11-2012, 01:32 PM
  #108
CHegs1349
Registered User
 
CHegs1349's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Cape Cod, MA
Country: United States
Posts: 1,707
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by LancelotLink View Post
The what?
She wants Seguin to continue to improve upon his d game, obviously...

CHegs1349 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
09-11-2012, 01:32 PM
  #109
Tim Vezina Thomas
Dougie Time
 
Tim Vezina Thomas's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 6,745
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by ddacey View Post
I think that Marchand will be the more valuable player.

My fascination with Lucic has vanished. This is a player who does not show up for long periods of time. He ia not the player he once was. I see him regressing. A bulk of his points came in garbage games where we win 10-0 or other nonsense. He is not a every day player. I dont think he's worth close to the money you want to give him.

I believe that seguin is the better player today.
I think Seguin is better, more valuable and has more potential than Lucic does today...evidenced by him making more money.

Also, Lucic isn't an everyday player? Do you mean 1st line player? Or not an NHL player......?

Tim Vezina Thomas is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
09-11-2012, 01:38 PM
  #110
DKH
Registered User
 
DKH's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 25,866
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to DKH
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crossfire View Post
Alexandra Raisman ‏@Aly_Raisman
@tylerseguin92 congrats! I'll definitely be watching this season! Good luck with everything

she wants the d
I enjoyed the special they had on her and her family- seems like a great kid. I like her brother though- kid has to be a Bruins fan

DKH is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
09-11-2012, 01:39 PM
  #111
DKH
Registered User
 
DKH's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 25,866
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to DKH
Quote:
Originally Posted by dtam83 View Post
they are so going to date each other...
she should stick with the kid who took her to the prom- seemed like a good kid and no mispelled tattoo's that I know of

DKH is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
09-11-2012, 01:40 PM
  #112
Artemis
Took the red pill
 
Artemis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Mount Olympus
Country: United States
Posts: 16,516
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by ddacey View Post
I think that Marchand will be the more valuable player.

My fascination with Lucic has vanished. This is a player who does not show up for long periods of time. He ia not the player he once was. I see him regressing. A bulk of his points came in garbage games where we win 10-0 or other nonsense. He is not a every day player. I dont think he's worth close to the money you want to give him.

I believe that seguin is the better player today.
You believe the sole worth of Lucic is in the points he scores?

I don't know whether to or to

Artemis is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
09-11-2012, 01:40 PM
  #113
McKuato
Registered User
 
McKuato's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Lowell, Ma
Country: United States
Posts: 2,029
vCash: 500
Seguin has been proven to make any line he plays on better.
Every line he got moved to, all of a sudden he had chemistry with Lucic, then he had checmistry with Bergeron, he has chemistry with anyone you put him with because he is a great player.

Marchand is clutch and actually under utilized, he and the team would benefit from more PP time and shoot outs.

Looch used to bring the fear of God to defenders and make them not want to go get the puck when they know he's coming.
I really miss that guy.
The question becomes why has he changed?
Injuries - presently having them or fear of them because of how he played/fought?
The League - fear of constant suspentions and repeat offender status?
Coaching/Management - Telling him to calm down fearing both A and B above?
D - All of the above

I think the B's have enough depth or will shortly to set Locch from Stun to Kill again and reap maximum benefit when he's playing and get by when he isn't.
What he's worth? I don't envy Chia trying to determine that.

McKuato is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
09-11-2012, 01:41 PM
  #114
bostonphoenix
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 1,250
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tim Vezina Thomas View Post
I think Seguin is better, more valuable and has more potential than Lucic does today...evidenced by him making more money.

Also, Lucic isn't an everyday player? Do you mean 1st line player? Or not an NHL player......?
I mean he does not show up to play every day. He disappears far too frequently. He only produces in garbage games.

In my opinion the bergeron Marchand seguin line took over as the "first line" midseason.

I dramatize but he very clearly belongs in the NHL or a premier hockey league. I do not think he is the player you think he is. But he is better than what I make him out to be.

bostonphoenix is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
09-11-2012, 01:43 PM
  #115
Tim Vezina Thomas
Dougie Time
 
Tim Vezina Thomas's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 6,745
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bruins4Lifer View Post
Alright, but it's really hard to take what you said in bold after you previously said this:
I get it, thanks.

Lucic' raise should be more than 700k if said 700k would only bring him to Marchands salary...is what I mean. Makes no sense for Lucic to make the same as Marchand, which is why he needs a bigger raise than 700k if Marchand got a 2mill raise.

Tim Vezina Thomas is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
09-11-2012, 01:47 PM
  #116
Res Nullius
Registered User
 
Res Nullius's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Massachusetts
Country: United States
Posts: 655
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by ddacey View Post
I mean he does not show up to play every day. He disappears far too frequently. He only produces in garbage games.

In my opinion the bergeron Marchand seguin line took over as the "first line" midseason.

I dramatize but he very clearly belongs in the NHL or a premier hockey league. I do not think he is the player you think he is. But he is better than what I make him out to be.
This is sort of based upon last season alone though, and you can't base the value of a player off of a single season. I think his projected value is too high as well, and yeah last season he went from 7 GW to 1, and then topped that off with a poor showing against the Caps. I don't think that's a reflection of the type of player he is, though. Plus he can be a tremendous physical presence even when he isn't chipping in offensively in those big game situations.

Res Nullius is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
09-11-2012, 01:47 PM
  #117
Tim Vezina Thomas
Dougie Time
 
Tim Vezina Thomas's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 6,745
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by ddacey View Post
I mean he does not show up to play every day. He disappears far too frequently. He only produces in garbage games.

In my opinion the bergeron Marchand seguin line took over as the "first line" midseason.

I dramatize but he very clearly belongs in the NHL or a premier hockey league. I do not think he is the player you think he is. But he is better than what I make him out to be.
Ok fair enough, wasn't sure if you meant not an NHL player lol

I value his toughness and scoring ability relative to that toughness more than anything. How many players have the ability to put up 30 goals and 100 PIMs?

Tim Vezina Thomas is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
09-11-2012, 02:01 PM
  #118
bostonphoenix
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 1,250
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Artemis View Post
You believe the sole worth of Lucic is in the points he scores?

I don't know whether to or to
I don't believe any player can or should be summed up entirely by his point production, though production has to be included in a player's worth.

I believe for simplicity sake you can look at a player by his tangibles (production) and his intangibles (character on and off the ice, etc...).

In this thread, maybe not even that many posts before your comment I had posted that yes, I certainly see that Lucic brings something extra. The poster who I had responded to called this Lucic's "intimidation", so I will as well.

Lucic brings "intimidation" to the game, but not to the same degree as he once did. There was a dramatic drop off of this this past season. I believe Lucic is trying to make himself into something that he is not, a pure production player. He needs to return to his roots, he will have the most value as that player.

Lucic had a forgetable season last year, I imagine this season will be as well.

If I can only take one of the players, I take Marchand over Lucic.

bostonphoenix is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
09-11-2012, 02:01 PM
  #119
Dellstrom
The new age
 
Dellstrom's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Boston
Country: United States
Posts: 16,221
vCash: 250
Romney or Obama? I'm voting Chiarelli.

Dellstrom is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
09-11-2012, 02:05 PM
  #120
Bill Ladd
Hockey's Future Staff
 
Bill Ladd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Wellesley, MA
Country: United States
Posts: 15,013
vCash: 500
Nice to have it done. Market was set by Hall and Skinner so this was probably an easy negotiation.

Lucic is going to be a tough one IMO. He could ask for $6 if he wanted and what are you going to say? No? He's irreplaceable.

__________________
Bill Ladd is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
09-11-2012, 02:07 PM
  #121
Artemis
Took the red pill
 
Artemis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Mount Olympus
Country: United States
Posts: 16,516
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Ladd View Post
Nice to have it done. Market was set by Hall and Skinner so this was probably an easy negotiation.

Lucic is going to be a tough one IMO. He could ask for $6 if he wanted and what are you going to say? No? He's irreplaceable.
Truth. Any other GM would kill to add Lucic to his team. Just hope he's reasonable (FWIW, I think he will be).

Artemis is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
09-11-2012, 02:10 PM
  #122
MarshmontMcSlewfoot
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,277
vCash: 500
Good deal. Good number.

Well done both parties.

MarshmontMcSlewfoot is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
09-11-2012, 02:20 PM
  #123
Bruins4Lifer
HFBoards Sponsor
 
Bruins4Lifer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Regina, SK
Country: Canada
Posts: 7,917
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Ladd View Post
Lucic is going to be a tough one IMO. He could ask for $6 if he wanted and what are you going to say? No? He's irreplaceable.
I think what he's brought in the playoffs the last 2 years is replaceable. I don't like the idea of giving an inconsistent player like Lucic $5.5+M at all.

Bruins4Lifer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
09-11-2012, 02:33 PM
  #124
ksp1957
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: South Shore
Posts: 16,354
vCash: 191
Send a message via AIM to ksp1957
Glad it's done and he's in place for a while. It's no exaggeration that he's one of the cornerstones of this franchise.

ksp1957 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
09-11-2012, 02:34 PM
  #125
EverettMike
Registered User
 
EverettMike's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Everett, MA
Country: United States
Posts: 17,914
vCash: 500
People that don't want Lucic on their NHL team make my head want to asplode.

STOP RUINING THE GREATNESS OF THIS SIGNING!

EverettMike is online now   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:20 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.