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If the penguins are bounced in the first round again:

View Poll Results: If the pens are bounced in the first round again do you think Bylsma will be fired?!
Yes 52 60.47%
No 24 27.91%
He will get ONE more year... 10 11.63%
Voters: 86. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
09-12-2012, 09:21 AM
  #26
Ogrezilla
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I hope he's on a hot seat right now. I think Bylsma does a lot of good stuff, but the things he does poorly he does really poorly. If he doesn't show some willingness to adjust when things aren't working by mid-season I don't want to wait until we get knocked out in round 1 to get rid of him. It's a very fixable problem: don't be so damn stubborn. At the very least, if things go south (aka the defense is struggling even if we are still winning) I hope they bring in some assistants that might challenge his views. I get the feeling that they are all on the same page to a degree that is actually a problem because they will all overlook the same problem.

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Old
09-12-2012, 09:24 AM
  #27
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Count me in for wanting him fired.

When he won the Cup, he took over for Therrian's defensive minded team and opened things up gradually. No thier game has completely opened up and they dont play strong D!

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09-12-2012, 09:34 AM
  #28
Ogrezilla
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Originally Posted by SteelFish87 View Post
Count me in for wanting him fired.

When he won the Cup, he took over for Therrian's defensive minded team and opened things up gradually. No thier game has completely opened up and they dont play strong D!
we did play strong D a year ago though. So he can do it.

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09-12-2012, 09:36 AM
  #29
ObsessedCreative
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ogrezilla View Post
I hope he's on a hot seat right now. I think Bylsma does a lot of good stuff, but the things he does poorly he does really poorly. If he doesn't show some willingness to adjust when things aren't working by mid-season I don't want to wait until we get knocked out in round 1 to get rid of him. It's a very fixable problem: don't be so damn stubborn. At the very least, if things go south (aka the defense is struggling even if we are still winning) I hope they bring in some assistants that might challenge his views. I get the feeling that they are all on the same page to a degree that is actually a problem because they will all overlook the same problem.
I dislike and get the feeling that is the "good ole' boy country club" type of mentality again with the coaching staff DB getting to pick his entire unit etc. That has me very annoyed and scared for the future of this team and the results the past 3+ years.

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09-12-2012, 04:56 PM
  #30
Ugene Malkin
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Originally Posted by Ogrezilla View Post
we did play strong D a year ago though. So he can do it.

Of course when the top two players are out and you are forced into it.

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09-12-2012, 05:02 PM
  #31
Ogrezilla
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Originally Posted by Ugene Malkin View Post
Of course when the top two players are out and you are forced into it.
it shows he is capable of coaching a good defensive team. That's all I'm saying.

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09-12-2012, 07:44 PM
  #32
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Originally Posted by Chancellor Vitale View Post
Don't try to apply pure logic to coaching decisions. Plenty-a-coach who didn't deserve it, have been canned for less than what we're talking about. Ultimately it comes down to winning the big games no matter what and if we fail to do that in a big way 3 years in a row (4 really)... the only way I see Disco getting a pass is massive injury situations where everyone knows going in we're not going to win.
Im a extremely logical person though. lol Trust me, it causes me more harm than good in my day to day life. Haha

But I just view everything very logically and try to break it down.

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09-13-2012, 10:08 AM
  #33
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Shero has balls. He's shown it in trades, and with dealing with a prior coach. The Pens entire coaching situation got muddled up by winning the cup. Therrien obviously lost the room and the respect of the players. Shero cans him mid-season and is limited with how to replace him. Bylsma won the cup with Therrien's d-system in place, and a room full of players ready to play for the "good-cop."
Since then we have seen great play defensively for stretches, and offensively for stretches. We have also seen glaring weaknesses in his coaching as well. The most notable, and in my opinion the most important in a playoff series, is a lack of game-planning the opposition.
I'd be shocked if Shero doesn't can Bylsma if we bow out in the first round again.


Last edited by gopens66: 09-13-2012 at 10:56 AM.
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Old
09-13-2012, 01:01 PM
  #34
wgknestrick
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Originally Posted by ObsessedCreative View Post
Do you believe Dan Bylsma will be fired as the penguins head coach?

I know he is a well liked guy in the room and league wide, but HOPEFULLY this is the season where there are NO excuses (injuries etc.) as for why the team falls short and apart.

What do you think?!
So was Byslma playing goal or D on the PK? There are no available coaches better than Bylsma.

+
His offensive zone scheme/mantra makes total sense and guarantees him a successful team (assuming they are able to execute it). He wants his team to play a possession based game and this will keep them competitive.

+
We are all disappointed with the Pens over the past 4 years. Remember that there is only 1 team (out of 30) every year that isn't.

-
He seems unable to correctly gauge his current players to identify the productive ones vs the dead weight. IE Staal on #2 PP (shouldn't be on any PP), Crosby on #1 PP, playing Adams anytime, TK/Dupers getting such low minutes.

-
His game plans against a specific opponent seem suspect. He goes in with the general gameplan above and does not try to exploit any specific weaknesses.


Just look to WSH on what can go wrong by "mixing" things up a bit with the coaching staff. Byslma is still incredibly young and developing as a coach (just like players do). It would be foolish IMO to incorrectly identify him as the Pens "only" or "sole" problem. He doesn't play the games. Players do. Bylsma can only play the players he is given by Shero. Those players have been the ones losing year after year.

Start a thread about MAF getting canned and now you are on to something. The team has quit on him more than their coach IMO. Start a thread about waiving Craig Adams.

I look to all the good things the Pens did in the offseason:

Didn't resign Asham. Needs no explanation.

Traded Michalek (although for a bag of pucks). At least bag of pucks aren't a career -22. (Pens will not miss him at all). Martin certainly won't.

Got very good return for Staal (who was at his highest value this year, selling high).

I am sad they didn't sign Sully, but I can see why they didn't risk it. They lucked out on him this year and didn't think they could be lucky 2x.

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09-13-2012, 01:12 PM
  #35
spizzle420
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Aside from Playoff losses, he's still coached regular seasons like a boss... allowing Geno / Sid to beast.

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09-13-2012, 04:24 PM
  #36
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Therrien would have not allowed to happen to the team what happened in this years playoffs.

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Old
09-13-2012, 06:16 PM
  #37
ObsessedCreative
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Therrien would have not allowed to happen to the team what happened in this years playoffs.
I agree...

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Old
09-13-2012, 06:24 PM
  #38
Til the End of Time
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Originally Posted by spizzle420 View Post
Aside from Playoff losses, he's still coached regular seasons like a boss... allowing Geno / Sid to beast.
but really, who cares about regular season success? this team should be able to make the playoffs even with a dolt like edzo behind the bench. besides, its not like this team has been winning presidents trophys. theyve been good in the regular season and mediocre in the playoffs, and with this roster that is not acceptable.

if they lose again in the first round (barring horrific injuries), bylsma will definitely be gone.

its also nice to see people giving therrien the props he deserves. he was a huge part of the reason that the pens have that cup.

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Old
09-13-2012, 10:23 PM
  #39
#66
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Originally Posted by Til the End of Time View Post
but really, who cares about regular season success? this team should be able to make the playoffs even with a dolt like edzo behind the bench. besides, its not like this team has been winning presidents trophys. theyve been good in the regular season and mediocre in the playoffs, and with this roster that is not acceptable.

if they lose again in the first round (barring horrific injuries), bylsma will definitely be gone.

its also nice to see people giving therrien the props he deserves. he was a huge part of the reason that the pens have that cup.
I actually didn't like MT in WB but he was exactly what the Pens needed at that time. I also think that when his time was up it WAS time for him to go.

I actually like Disco a lot. I like the way he handles himself and the team but his brand of hockey is wearing thin and not working. Lavs has been picking it apart for the better part of two year without an adjustment from DB. IMO the great coaches adjust. We'll see what Disco Dan does this year. IMO he has a lot to prove.

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09-14-2012, 08:31 AM
  #40
cassius
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Originally Posted by Til the End of Time View Post
but really, who cares about regular season success? this team should be able to make the playoffs even with a dolt like edzo behind the bench. besides, its not like this team has been winning presidents trophys. theyve been good in the regular season and mediocre in the playoffs, and with this roster that is not acceptable.

if they lose again in the first round (barring horrific injuries), bylsma will definitely be gone.

its also nice to see people giving therrien the props he deserves. he was a huge part of the reason that the pens have that cup.
preach man... preach.

people judge bylsma through the lense of an average team in the NHL and that is the first mistake. when you have some of the riches that you have on this roster, you're expected to win the games that matter. plain and simple. if bylsma can't rally the troops and win a meaningful playoff series with the most talented roster in the league, then we need to move on and find someone who will.

bylsma seems like a good coach who everyone likes, but his game plans get consistently picked apart. his biggest flaw is his inability to adjust on the fly and adapt. we saw the effects of that first hand last season against the flyers. we definitely got outcoached.

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Old
09-14-2012, 09:24 AM
  #41
Ogrezilla
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preach man... preach.

people judge bylsma through the lense of an average team in the NHL and that is the first mistake. when you have some of the riches that you have on this roster, you're expected to win the games that matter. plain and simple. if bylsma can't rally the troops and win a meaningful playoff series with the most talented roster in the league, then we need to move on and find someone who will.

bylsma seems like a good coach who everyone likes, but his game plans get consistently picked apart. his biggest flaw is his inability to adjust on the fly and adapt. we saw the effects of that first hand last season against the flyers. we definitely got outcoached.
I just can't decide if it's him being plain stubborn because he thinks it will work, or if he really doesn't know how to do it. If it's the former, I hope he can fix it and become a great coach. If it's the latter, I hope he's out the door as soon as we find out. It's been a fatal flaw three years in a row now. The first time he gets to use the hot goalie excuse. The second time he gets to use the injury excuse. The third time he's all out of excuses. All three of those series should have been wins. Or in the case of Philly, at least not a complete and total embarrassment.


Last edited by Ogrezilla: 09-14-2012 at 09:40 AM.
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Old
09-14-2012, 09:38 AM
  #42
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Originally Posted by spizzle420 View Post
Aside from Playoff losses, he's still coached regular seasons like a boss... allowing Geno / Sid to beast.
Translation: If you ignore the only thing that matters, he's amazing!

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09-14-2012, 09:42 AM
  #43
Ogrezilla
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Translation: If you ignore the only thing that matters, he's amazing!
not to mention we haven't actually done great in the regular season. We should be able to win the division at some point. How different could last year's playoffs have gone if we won just one more game and had the 1 seed?

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09-14-2012, 09:56 AM
  #44
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My thinking is- who's the replacement.

Shero got pretty lucky when Bylsma's magic was an insta-hit in the spring of 2009- rmemeber at the time Bylsma was only in his first season as a head coach at any level.

If the Pens flame out again in 2012-13 and Shero fires Bylsma and replaces him with...John Hynes (he is well thought of by many in and out of the organization) then what happens if they flame out again in 2013-14?

If that happens, I'd think the temperature on Shero gets turned up big time.

So, that said, Shero/Bylsma seems to be a pretty good team and two guys definitely on the same page that work hand/glove. If the Pens did go down in Round 1 of the next playoffs, I'd probably put more an onus on the players and try to shake things up before I'd want the coach fired. But it of course depends on the mood of the team, how receptive the players are, any blunders Bylsma makes, etc.

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09-14-2012, 11:50 AM
  #45
wgknestrick
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My thinking is- who's the replacement.

Shero got pretty lucky when Bylsma's magic was an insta-hit in the spring of 2009- rmemeber at the time Bylsma was only in his first season as a head coach at any level.

If the Pens flame out again in 2012-13 and Shero fires Bylsma and replaces him with...John Hynes (he is well thought of by many in and out of the organization) then what happens if they flame out again in 2013-14?

If that happens, I'd think the temperature on Shero gets turned up big time.

So, that said, Shero/Bylsma seems to be a pretty good team and two guys definitely on the same page that work hand/glove. If the Pens did go down in Round 1 of the next playoffs, I'd probably put more an onus on the players and try to shake things up before I'd want the coach fired. But it of course depends on the mood of the team, how receptive the players are, any blunders Bylsma makes, etc.
Once again, Let's look at the facts:

-Pens get knocked out 3 straight years in the first round
-Pens generally out shoot their opponents in every series which should put them as favorites to win each series.

-MAF posts a combined SV% of .879% over those 3 playoff series. Do I even need to mention that is .031% below league average?

...And it's Byslma's fault that the Pens lost those series, despite not stepping out onto the ice once and playing in 1 of those games?


Am I missing something fellow PIT fans? I fail to see the logic, but I certainly see the elephant in the room that everyone wants to ignore.


Last edited by wgknestrick: 09-14-2012 at 11:55 AM.
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09-14-2012, 11:57 AM
  #46
Ogrezilla
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Originally Posted by wgknestrick View Post
Once again, Let's look at the facts:

-Pens get knocked out 3 straight years in the first round
-Pens generally out shoot their opponents in every series which should put them as favorites to win each series.

-MAF posts a combined SV% of .879% over those 3 playoff series. Do I even need to mention that is .031% below league average?

...And it's Byslma's fault that the Pens lost those series, despite not stepping out onto the ice once and playing in 1 of those games?


Am I missing something fellow PIT fans? I fail to see the logic, but I certainly see the elephant in the room that everyone wants to ignore.
the fault lies on a bunch of people. Bylsma is absolutely one of them. Fleury is absolutely another. I don't care what the numbers say, if you watched the montreal or the philly series there's no way you could think the defense looked good in either. And yes, we were absolutely out coached in all of them as well.

What's that? Stacking the top line and playing Crosby with Sully and Dupuis isn't working? Bah! Get to your game! What's that? The PK system we've been running all year isn't working? Keep doing it!

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09-14-2012, 12:00 PM
  #47
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not to mention we haven't actually done great in the regular season. We should be able to win the division at some point. How different could last year's playoffs have gone if we won just one more game and had the 1 seed?
So which teams have lost their #1 center for 99 games, and done as well as the Pen's have?

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09-14-2012, 12:02 PM
  #48
Ogrezilla
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So which teams have lost their #1 center for 99 games, and done as well as the Pen's have?
have we done well?

Also, Boston.

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09-14-2012, 12:07 PM
  #49
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The Blues are pretty close. They have just as many playoff series wins in the last three years and McDonald has missed 84 games in the same time.

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09-14-2012, 12:10 PM
  #50
cassius
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The Blues are pretty close. They have just as many playoff series wins in the last three years and McDonald has missed 84 games in the same time.
Yeah... but the Blues don't have the best 2 players in the world, or any players even in the top 25. They're a well coached team that actually plays above their potential/talent level. The opposite of the Pens imo.

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