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Gillis: Potential Return For Luongo May Not Improve Canucks **Mod Warning #86**

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Old
09-14-2012, 10:18 AM
  #351
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Originally Posted by KingJet View Post
Don't expect a Luongo trade by the 16th, and it will probably be Markstrom to Toronto.

Markstrom for MacArthur, 3rd and Percy

Luongo for Matthias, MacArthur and 1st 2013
Yeah, I don't think so chief. Both trades horrible for Florida.

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09-14-2012, 10:21 AM
  #352
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I'm not reading through 15 pages of the back and forth ******** thats bound to be enclosed within, but am i really the only one he realizes that these comments don't mean a whole lot?

He said the trade probably won't improve the Canucks. Which is true. We're not going to get a first line player, or even an immediately impacting second line player probably, which leaves prospects and third-liners or defensemen.

Most teams, don't have enough good d-men to give up a top-4+prospect to Luongo, hence we mostly hear about the third liners and/or prospects.

Now, in what world, is gaining 1/2 prospects and a player like Scotty Upshall making our team better off than having the security of two world class goaltenders on your roster. The knowledge that if one falters, the other is right there to pick up the slack and vise versa.

I don't see it. Gillis is just saying what all of us knew already. The Canucks won't be better off after trading Luongo, you rarely are after trading a franchise player. We'll just be...different.

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09-14-2012, 10:22 AM
  #353
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If Doan signs with Vancouver, I could see Luongo getting traded with less than what Gillis was hoping for a return.

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09-14-2012, 10:23 AM
  #354
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Originally Posted by Northern Dancer View Post
Why in the world wouldn't Vancouver take a 7th round pick for him instead of getting nothing and having to spend 40 million on a buy-out. Shake your head !!!
$27,046,667 spread over 18 years (1,502,592.61/yr). Give your head a shake.

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09-14-2012, 10:23 AM
  #355
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Originally Posted by Pantherfan12 View Post
I am not sure where you got your information from,but you're incorrect. Vokoun was offered $6.5mil from Fla, but he was waiting on COL. COL ended up signing J.S.Gigerre, and trading for Varlimov and Tallon decided not to wait for Vokoun and signed Theodore. Vokoun took the $ from Washington because he now found himself without a team to play on, and no other teams looking for a goaltender. Theodore signed here because he had personally stated that he loves Fla, always wanted to be a Panther and that his family lives here. He said he wants to retire a Panther as well.

When it comes to a Luongo trade (if it happens and if we have a season) I expect to see something like Theo or Clemmer, Upshall, Ellerby, a lower tier prospect and maybe a draft pick for Luongo. I don't see Jovo going anywhere because he is older and I think he has a NTC. I doubt he'll want to waive it to go BACK to Van, I think he wants to retire a Panther. Same can be said about Theo realistically, so my theory is that Clemmer gets shipped to Van.(just signed a new contract, and can be a cheap and decent backup to Schneider)
So essentially you'd like to give up a whole bunch of junk your team no longer needs.

Upshall, Ellerby, a low-tier prospect or draft pick in no way makes up for the talent discrepancy between Luongo and Scott ****ing Clemmenson. Try again.

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09-14-2012, 10:33 AM
  #356
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JackJ View Post
$27,046,667 spread over 18 years (1,502,592.61/yr). Give your head a shake.
That is great math, my guess was wrong but you still don't address the point. Why would Vancouver pay out 27 odd million when they could easily off him for a 7th round pick?

PS You referred to an amnesty buy-out, it would be cash up front.

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Old
09-14-2012, 10:33 AM
  #357
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Could luongo have handled this situation any better?.

One of the most classiest reactions I have seen in a long long time, especially considering the huge drama of this offseason.

He handled it well, said literally all the right things, never bashed the org, never "demanded" a trade, came to vancouver and will be skating with the team with no animosity.

Other players around the league need to look at how luongo has handled this entire thing, remarkable stuff.

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09-14-2012, 10:41 AM
  #358
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Originally Posted by palindrom View Post
Or one less goal every 5-6 games they play, or one less goal in a 5-6 games playoff.
1 goal every 6 games is 13.5 goals over the season.
1 goal every 5 games is 16.2 goals over the season.

How much extra do you pay for a winger who scores 15 more goals over a season?

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09-14-2012, 10:44 AM
  #359
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My opinion of Lu has gone up dramatically with the way he has handled himself. A+

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Old
09-14-2012, 10:51 AM
  #360
Reign Nateo
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Originally Posted by TheMicrowave View Post
If Doan signs with Vancouver, I could see Luongo getting traded with less than what Gillis was hoping for a return.
What was Gillis hoping for? Did he tell you? Please, enlighten us.

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09-14-2012, 10:52 AM
  #361
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Originally Posted by TheMicrowave View Post
If Doan signs with Vancouver, I could see Luongo getting traded with less than what Gillis was hoping for a return.
Or maybe it would change his teams needs?

Instead of looking to acquire a top-6 forward he may be more inclined to take a futures package

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09-14-2012, 10:52 AM
  #362
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Yeah, if they get Doan, I think Luongo gets dumped for a 3rd, maybe less.

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09-14-2012, 10:56 AM
  #363
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheMicrowave View Post
If Doan signs with Vancouver, I could see Luongo getting traded with less than what Gillis was hoping for a return.
He's still most likely staying with Phoenix.

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09-14-2012, 11:00 AM
  #364
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Originally Posted by coldsteelonice84 View Post
Yeah, if they get Doan, I think Luongo gets dumped for a 3rd, maybe less.
So if the Canucks get Doan, you're saying Lu has less trade value than a guy like Alex Sulzer? In what world does Sulzer garner a better return than Luongo?

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09-14-2012, 11:00 AM
  #365
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Originally Posted by Lucbourdon View Post
Could luongo have handled this situation any better?.

One of the most classiest reactions I have seen in a long long time, especially considering the huge drama of this offseason.

He handled it well, said literally all the right things, never bashed the org, never "demanded" a trade, came to vancouver and will be skating with the team with no animosity.

Other players around the league need to look at how luongo has handled this entire thing, remarkable stuff.
Lol. What has he done to garner such praise. He's been sitting back and waiting patiently. What else would you expect of him?

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09-14-2012, 11:05 AM
  #366
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Originally Posted by Samzilla View Post
So if the Canucks get Doan, you're saying Lu has less trade value than a guy like Alex Sulzer? In what world does Sulzer garner a better return than Luongo?
A cap world.

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Old
09-14-2012, 11:06 AM
  #367
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Originally Posted by coldsteelonice84 View Post
A cap world.
A rich team. With nothing but time on their side.

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09-14-2012, 11:08 AM
  #368
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Originally Posted by F A N View Post
For historical reference's sake, what was Kyle Wellwood's production after his first 2-3 seasons equivalent to? Has Kyle Wellwood produced at the pace of those typically drafted in the top 10?
That might carry more merit if you weren't talking teenager versus man.

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Old
09-14-2012, 11:10 AM
  #369
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Originally Posted by deckercky View Post
1 goal every 6 games is 13.5 goals over the season.
1 goal every 5 games is 16.2 goals over the season.

How much extra do you pay for a winger who scores 15 more goals over a season?
You wrongly assumed in your math that the starting goalie will play all the 82 games.

I based it on 50-60 games per season. Having Theodore or Luongo as a starter should not really have any effect on the number of goals allowed by the backup in the 15-30 games per season he will usually play. So 1 goal per 5-6 game will mean around 10 goals per season, not 13-16.

Unfortunately there is no easy way to calculate the positive impact of a forward/defenseman in term of goal for/against over a season. If a winger score 15 goals, it doesnt mean he did a + 15 goals differences in the season over another winger who scored 0 goal. +/- is not reliable too for this purpose. There is many way a player can contribute to a goal. And a player can also be responsible for a goal against.

One way to calculate it could be the +/- performance of a team when he is in the lineup vs when he is not, but it would be hard to obtain a sample big enough.


Last edited by palindrom: 09-14-2012 at 11:24 AM.
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Old
09-14-2012, 11:10 AM
  #370
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Originally Posted by Schneiderman View Post
Lol. What has he done to garner such praise. He's been sitting back and waiting patiently. What else would you expect of him?
What exactly COULD Luongo do that would garner praise from you?

Short of stopping 9/11, not much, in my opinion.

Through all the speculation, he's never ripped on the team, the process, his team-mates, Schneider, Gillis. He's not being a drama queen and saying he'll hold out unless he's traded. He's been unbelievably supportive of Schneider the entire summer.

You're right, he deserves to be slagged and ripped on as per usual.

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Old
09-14-2012, 11:14 AM
  #371
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Originally Posted by Reign Nateo View Post
A rich team. With nothing but time on their side.
... And $5 mil in LTIR cap overage until Kesler comes back (December, earliest)... Perhaps longer, LTIR injuries willing... Can weather the storm... The Canucks have been building rosters greater than the salary cap suggests for 2 years... by including LTIR likelihood into their calculations... Hasn't been an issue yet.

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09-14-2012, 11:23 AM
  #372
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What Gillis said is being taken out of context and blown out of proportion. The Canucks aren't getting a better player than Roberto Luongo in a deal, that isn't news.

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Old
09-14-2012, 11:24 AM
  #373
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Komisarek was an all-star.

That's all I'm saying...

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09-14-2012, 11:27 AM
  #374
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Originally Posted by coldsteelonice84 View Post
Yeah, if they get Doan, I think Luongo gets dumped for a 3rd, maybe less.
They'll dump other players for less than move Luongo for a 3rd. Get real.

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Old
09-14-2012, 11:28 AM
  #375
Reign Nateo
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... And $5 mil in LTIR cap overage until Kesler comes back (December, earliest)... Perhaps longer, LTIR injuries willing... Can weather the storm... The Canucks have been building rosters greater than the salary cap suggests for 2 years... by including LTIR likelihood into their calculations... Hasn't been an issue yet.
Exactly. Also helps when the owner is among the team's biggest fans...

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