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Ownership Cluster**** Thread: NHL and GJ, Put Up or Shut Up!

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11-07-2012, 10:16 AM
  #251
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To me it's simple - the deal is signed, sealed and delivered before the newly elected people are sworn in or the team folds/moves.

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11-07-2012, 10:26 AM
  #252
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To me it's simple - the deal is signed, sealed and delivered before the newly elected people are sworn in or the team folds/moves.
Agreed. A vote should take place on the 27th (focus on the "should" part). I would expect details about the meeting with Jamison to leak out today but who knows.

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11-07-2012, 11:18 AM
  #253
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To me it's simple - the deal is signed, sealed and delivered before the newly elected people are sworn in or the team folds/moves.
Once again, we don't know for sure if Greg Jamison has the money or not.

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11-07-2012, 11:38 AM
  #254
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To me it's simple - the deal is signed, sealed and delivered before the newly elected people are sworn in or the team folds/moves.
Not possible. Even if they vote next week, there will be a referendum. A referendum that will almost certainly succeed and force the matter to ballot. Zero percent chance they close before the new council is sworn in. At least as I understand it.

Anyone feel differently?

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11-07-2012, 11:44 AM
  #255
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Not possible. Even if they vote next week, there will be a referendum. A referendum that will almost certainly succeed and force the matter to ballot. Zero percent chance they close before the new council is sworn in. At least as I understand it.

Anyone feel differently?
Wasn't said that once the lease was signed and sealed that it can no way be challened let alone be discharged in bankruptcy?

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11-07-2012, 11:49 AM
  #256
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The deal can't be signed/sealed if there is a referendum on the agreement vote, though. Right? And there absolutely will be. Why wouldn't there be?

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11-07-2012, 12:00 PM
  #257
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Regardless of what happens govenment wise we still don't know if Jamison if for real or not.

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11-07-2012, 01:08 PM
  #258
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Regardless of what happens govenment wise we still don't know if Jamison if for real or not.
I suppose my real concern is that it may not matter if he's for real, or not.

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11-07-2012, 01:56 PM
  #259
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I though it was already established that Jaimeson has the funds. It is not the fault of Jaimeson that it was election time for Glendale council, and not his fault that the NHL is in a labour dispute. All of a sudden it's all about the credibility of Jaimeson. Why?? It's a wonder that he has hung in there with all the issues that are beyond his control that he has had to deal with.
The new mayor needs to give his head a shake - is Jaimeson for real? - for god's sake is Glendale for real??
I don't expect any voting on the Jaimeson deal until the new council takes over. No way the council members on the way out would do anything further on the Coyotes issue and undermine the new council taking over.
It's a good thing Jaimeson hasn't bailed and become negative like most of the posters have.

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11-07-2012, 01:58 PM
  #260
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I though it was already established that Jaimeson has the funds.
Even if that was true at one time, that could have changed since this has been dragging on.

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11-07-2012, 02:35 PM
  #261
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Even if that was true at one time, that could have changed since this has been dragging on.
If he doen't have the funds now, why would he still be hanging in there with all the challenges he has faced? He would have walked by now, no?.

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11-07-2012, 02:58 PM
  #262
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I have always went with the belief of yes "he" doesn’t have the money. The money is based on rates of returns that include Glendale's payments (without them, Jamison's investors are out). The rumored Jim Treliving's offer/deal included a payment plan. The current lease includes $72 million in payments over the first five years. I have a feeling that Jamison has $100 million in an account ready to pay the NHL; the rest could be promised to the NHL (close to the $170 M purchase price).

Now can the Mayor keep the vote off the agenda until the new council is put into place (which would occur in January I believe)? Possibly. I also wonder if the new council members say they are against the deal but when they look into it, they could change their mind. I am also curious about if this “Monarch Group” is put into place (cue a Venture Bros. reference), if any of the "no" votes against the Coyotes somehow get on their payroll?

The story is the same but the players are new.

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11-07-2012, 03:01 PM
  #263
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There would not need to be a referendum on the council vote if it can be passed under the "emergency" clause. To get that thru it would probably have to be voted on before the new council members take their seat.

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11-07-2012, 03:08 PM
  #264
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The deal can't be signed/sealed if there is a referendum on the agreement vote, though. Right? And there absolutely will be. Why wouldn't there be?
There wasn't one last time. Why are you under the impression that there will be now? There was a referendum on the sales tax hike, maybe that's what you are thinking of. Old fart at the library didn't get enough signatures. I doubt he will get that many again.

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11-07-2012, 03:27 PM
  #265
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I am just guessing here but now that the general election has finished and using the total votes cast in Glendale's Mayor Race, over 39,133 votes were cast. So before, “Team Library” needed over 1,800 valid signatures. This time if they do that, they would need over 3,913 valid signatures (10% of total votes and would need to collect more since signatures are thrown out during review).

I could be wrong in my guesses here but if they couldn’t get 1,800 before then I don’t think they could hit the new target. And if I am wrong in using this election's numbers and it’s somehow the primary's numbers from August, then the total votes cast for the Mayor's race was 18,138; so back to the 1,800 figure.

I am all sorts of confused but I don’t see the Jones/Cobb team pulling off that victory. But you never know and a new group could show up. Cobb has lost in his efforts to fight the Coyotes and to run for Congress so if he continues to fight, then more power to him.

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11-07-2012, 03:44 PM
  #266
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If he doen't have the funds now, why would he still be hanging in there with all the challenges he has faced? He would have walked by now, no?.
Because it's not really hurting him in any way to hold out for potential opportunity if it all goes well.

I'm just arguing the point I really have no idea if he has the money or not or how the lockout will affect the close. But I don't think we can safely say he has the money given how much this situation changes. I think it was TT who said last week, every time one hurdle is hoped over 3 more pop up.

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11-07-2012, 06:33 PM
  #267
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Originally Posted by naurutger View Post
I am just guessing here but now that the general election has finished and using the total votes cast in Glendale's Mayor Race, over 39,133 votes were cast. So before, “Team Library” needed over 1,800 valid signatures. This time if they do that, they would need over 3,913 valid signatures (10% of total votes and would need to collect more since signatures are thrown out during review).

I could be wrong in my guesses here but if they couldn’t get 1,800 before then I don’t think they could hit the new target. And if I am wrong in using this election's numbers and it’s somehow the primary's numbers from August, then the total votes cast for the Mayor's race was 18,138; so back to the 1,800 figure.

I am all sorts of confused but I don’t see the Jones/Cobb team pulling off that victory. But you never know and a new group could show up. Cobb has lost in his efforts to fight the Coyotes and to run for Congress so if he continues to fight, then more power to him.
No need to be successful - just need to delay the process long enough.

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11-07-2012, 06:40 PM
  #268
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Originally Posted by naurutger View Post
I am just guessing here but now that the general election has finished and using the total votes cast in Glendale's Mayor Race, over 39,133 votes were cast. So before, “Team Library” needed over 1,800 valid signatures. This time if they do that, they would need over 3,913 valid signatures (10% of total votes and would need to collect more since signatures are thrown out during review).

I could be wrong in my guesses here but if they couldn’t get 1,800 before then I don’t think they could hit the new target. And if I am wrong in using this election's numbers and it’s somehow the primary's numbers from August, then the total votes cast for the Mayor's race was 18,138; so back to the 1,800 figure.

I am all sorts of confused but I don’t see the Jones/Cobb team pulling off that victory. But you never know and a new group could show up. Cobb has lost in his efforts to fight the Coyotes and to run for Congress so if he continues to fight, then more power to him.
I'm not sure it'd be based on the Mayoral election prior to the Mayor being sworn in. I would suspect the number would be based on Scruggs' election.

I could certainly be wrong.

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11-07-2012, 06:42 PM
  #269
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No need to be successful - just need to delay the process long enough.
They have 30 days from the council vote. Some doubt that a "lame duck" council would try to push through some enormous piece of buzzer beating legislation. I don't doubt it at all. Is it the most ethical thing to do? Probably not, but I doubt it matters much.

I really just can't believe that it's come to this. Look at where we are, right now. It's like the June vote and subsequent referendum attempt NEVER EVEN HAPPENED. All of it, every bit, was just a colossal waste of time. It's lunacy.

At this point, I would not hold it against any of the three parties involved if they simply said thanks but not thanks and walked away.

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11-07-2012, 08:41 PM
  #270
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If Glendale pulls the plug is there any way the Jamieson or someone else could buy the team and put it in an arena closer to Phoenix?

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11-07-2012, 09:37 PM
  #271
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Not possible. Even if they vote next week, there will be a referendum. A referendum that will almost certainly succeed and force the matter to ballot. Zero percent chance they close before the new council is sworn in. At least as I understand it.

Anyone feel differently?
Yup. I think when voters overwhelmingly reject you by a 2-1 margin, they consider the matter settled.

Someone trying another petition drive after a beating like last night might as well just call COG residents uninformed morons for voting the way they did.

I think the referendum hurdle has been cleared.

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11-07-2012, 10:02 PM
  #272
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There wasn't one last time. Why are you under the impression that there will be now? There was a referendum on the sales tax hike, maybe that's what you are thinking of. Old fart at the library didn't get enough signatures. I doubt he will get that many again.
There were two referendum efforts. One for the sales tax increase and one for the arena management/lease agreement. Unless, my memory has completely failed me. As i remember it the tax increase earned enough signatures to become proposition 457 while the AMF/lease matter failed to gain enough signatures to go to the ballot.

As far as gaining enough signatures, I assume the opposition has learned a whole lot of lessons. It is also much cooler outside. Also, the far right has every reason to he especially energized at the moment. I assume they will easily be able to eclipse their previous number, especially if GWI legitimately gets their backs for real this time.

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11-07-2012, 10:11 PM
  #273
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Yup. I think when voters overwhelmingly reject you by a 2-1 margin, they consider the matter settled.

Someone trying another petition drive after a beating like last night might as well just call COG residents uninformed morons for voting the way they did.

I think the referendum hurdle has been cleared.
Fair enough. Still, am I wrong to assume that most folks voted on 457 without any thought of the Phoenix Coyotes? I didn't see the wording on the ballot, but I'm guessing it didn't reference a hockey team?

I'd honestly prefer to find these answers on Google and not come off as a total moron, but I'm not finding them. I've got to ask.

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11-07-2012, 11:14 PM
  #274
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Fair enough. Still, am I wrong to assume that most folks voted on 457 without any thought of the Phoenix Coyotes? I didn't see the wording on the ballot, but I'm guessing it didn't reference a hockey team?

I'd honestly prefer to find these answers on Google and not come off as a total moron, but I'm not finding them. I've got to ask.
I found the wording of the petition and our suspicions were correct as the wording is extremely confusing, even to people familiar with the situation.

Proposition 457, Proposed Amendment to the Glendale City Charter by initiative petition:

Amends the Charter to provide that Council shall have the power to levy a transaction privilege tax (sales tax) provided that no such tax shall be levied at a rate in excess of the rates specified, unless such rate is first approved by a majority of the qualified electors.

• A “YES” vote shall have the effect of amending the Charter.

• A “NO” vote shall have the effect of not amending the Charter that currently provides that Council shall have the power to levy a transaction privilege tax (sales tax) subject to approval by a majority of the qualified electors.

I just hope the old geezers are going to need 3,900+ signatures this time around, since they could barely even crack 1000 in July.

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11-08-2012, 01:14 AM
  #275
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If Glendale pulls the plug is there any way the Jamieson or someone else could buy the team and put it in an arena closer to Phoenix?
Definitely....at least a 50% chance....but it would take 2 weeks..


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