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Jets STHs and a lockout: Reading the TPA

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08-17-2012, 05:56 PM
  #1
mzappa
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Jets STHs and a lockout: Reading the TPA

Since there were a few posts regarding what happens to Season Ticket Holder (STH) accounts and ticket fees already paid in the event of a lockout, here are the relevant clauses from the Ticket Purchase Agreement (TPA) from TNSE.


(This is a 4-year P3/4/5 TPA)
----
1. Term. The term of this Agreement shall be four (4) years commencing on July 1, 2012 and concluding on June 30, 2016. The Term shall be reasonably and appropriately adjusted by the Team in the event of suspension of games (due to NHL work stoppage or otherwise)...

5. Payment. b) All sales are final. Ticket payments are non-refundable.
----

That's it.

Looks like TNSE is covered, as they can keep the term limit to the maximum and do not need to refund your money. Its pretty straight-forward that your money is held in your Jets account.

Similar to the TicketExchange program, where any STH seat you sell during the season is not directly paid out to you, but applied to your TNSE account.

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08-17-2012, 10:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mzappa View Post
Since there were a few posts regarding what happens to Season Ticket Holder (STH) accounts and ticket fees already paid in the event of a lockout, here are the relevant clauses from the Ticket Purchase Agreement (TPA) from TNSE.


(This is a 4-year P3/4/5 TPA)
----
1. Term. The term of this Agreement shall be four (4) years commencing on July 1, 2012 and concluding on June 30, 2016. The Term shall be reasonably and appropriately adjusted by the Team in the event of suspension of games (due to NHL work stoppage or otherwise)...

5. Payment. b) All sales are final. Ticket payments are non-refundable.
----

That's it.

Looks like TNSE is covered, as they can keep the term limit to the maximum and do not need to refund your money. Its pretty straight-forward that your money is held in your Jets account.

Similar to the TicketExchange program, where any STH seat you sell during the season is not directly paid out to you, but applied to your TNSE account.
Personally this is a non issue for me. I will hold on to my Season tickets to the day I die and then they will go to my son. I have already paid for next year. They can hold on to it and apply it to my tickets proportionally whenever the season starts.

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08-18-2012, 08:10 AM
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Not an issue for me either, but some people would prefer to use the thousands of $$$ held by TNSE for other items like food, mortgage or travel while they wait for hockey to come back!

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08-18-2012, 11:23 AM
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I'm paid up... don't care when they start playing... well yeah I do and wish they would not have any stoppage but at least everything is ready when the puck finally drops!

I sold a few tickets on seat exchange last season and when it came time to renew for this season, I had some issues getting the credit (it was never showing up on my invoices). All it took was a phone call and I got to the root of the issue. Turned out my rep wasn't sure if they would apply the credit or issue a cheque. Common sense prevailed and they put the credit against my account.

The one question I am wondering about is the controlled costs that being a STH provides. If there is no season this year at all and end up with year two being the 2013-14 season, does that mean our pre-paid tickets for this year cover the STH cost for that season? Or can they increase the price again another ~3%? It's not a huge increase but when you are talking about people sitting on $10,000+ in ticket costs, that 3% could be $300+ which is enough for a jersey.

I suppose I could look at my TPA but I'm renovating my office and everything is boxed up for now. (I need to finish this reno this weekend... time to get to work I suppose. )

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08-18-2012, 01:04 PM
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Good question.

The TPA states they can "appropriately" adjust the term in case of work stoppage; so we'll conclude a missed year would be added to the current STH term.

TPA also states they can increase prices to a maximum of 3% each year, but how a "lost" season would fit into this clause, I do not know...

I for one hope they do not raise ticket prices another 3%, whether there is a season or not. Especially if there is no season, you could expect a bit of public discontent.

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08-18-2012, 01:35 PM
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Here's a question not answered anywhere for those taking advantage of monthly payments: say we lose the equivalent of 3 monthly payments worth of hockey. Are we always going to be 3 payments ahead? Or will we not have to pay in April, may and June in 2013 (the first 3 payments of the 2013/14 season)?

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08-28-2012, 12:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jetbruin View Post
Here's a question not answered anywhere for those taking advantage of monthly payments: say we lose the equivalent of 3 monthly payments worth of hockey. Are we always going to be 3 payments ahead? Or will we not have to pay in April, may and June in 2013 (the first 3 payments of the 2013/14 season)?


I'm curious about this as well...

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08-28-2012, 12:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jetbruin View Post
Here's a question not answered anywhere for those taking advantage of monthly payments: say we lose the equivalent of 3 monthly payments worth of hockey. Are we always going to be 3 payments ahead? Or will we not have to pay in April, may and June in 2013 (the first 3 payments of the 2013/14 season)?
My guess is they'll apply whatever overpayment you have this year and minus from next year's invoice. So your monthly payments next year will be a lot less. Just a guess...

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08-28-2012, 01:22 PM
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Payments will continue as per the agreement (whether the season is shortened or cancelled all together).

At the end of the season and payments are finalized, a credit will be applied to the following season/playoffs.

As for the application of the credit in the following year (I had some credits from Seat Exchange this past season) they apply the credit to your first payment and if there's still a credit they apply that to the second payment etc etc until your credit is used up.

Make sense? Hope this settles the questions on the payments for season tickets.

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08-31-2012, 03:05 PM
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Bump, since the below explanation is what will happen now with your season tickets because of no hockey for the foreseeable future.....


Quote:
Originally Posted by KingSalamon View Post
Payments will continue as per the agreement (whether the season is shortened or cancelled all together).

At the end of the season and payments are finalized, a credit will be applied to the following season/playoffs.

As for the application of the credit in the following year (I had some credits from Seat Exchange this past season) they apply the credit to your first payment and if there's still a credit they apply that to the second payment etc etc until your credit is used up.

Make sense? Hope this settles the questions on the payments for season tickets.

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09-01-2012, 08:01 AM
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Yup and I wonder what the tickets were going to look like this season... I suppose they can use the template for when they actually print tickets for this/next season.

I'm just happy knowing when hockey does start that I have nothing left owing for the season as I'm all paid up. Every game missed will add to potential playoff credits too!

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09-01-2012, 08:45 PM
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Ducks season ticket holder's getting 5% annual interest on their tickets.

I assume an incentive to keep season ticket holders around.

Cannot see the Jets wanting/needing/willing to do this.

http://ducks.ocregister.com/2012/08/...ockout/112838/

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09-01-2012, 09:31 PM
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Why would anyone willingly let the team keep their money if there's no hockey? They sold you a product and then locked out their players (note: their workers didn't stage a strike) preventing them from providing the product as promised. And some people are so irrationally happy to have hockey back that they're OK with the team keeping thousands of dollars interest free? That's insane. The day a game is cancelled, every ticket holder should be phoning TNSE asking for a refund.

As for the TSA, yes, it is pretty vague in its wording. Good customer service would be letting the client decide if a missed season should be considered part of the term, but why offer good customer service when you have a full waiting list?

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09-01-2012, 10:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by arbf412 View Post
Why would anyone willingly let the team keep their money if there's no hockey? They sold you a product and then locked out their players (note: their workers didn't stage a strike) preventing them from providing the product as promised. And some people are so irrationally happy to have hockey back that they're OK with the team keeping thousands of dollars interest free? That's insane. The day a game is cancelled, every ticket holder should be phoning TNSE asking for a refund.

As for the TSA, yes, it is pretty vague in its wording. Good customer service would be letting the client decide if a missed season should be considered part of the term, but why offer good customer service when you have a full waiting list?
The bottom line is, no one forced anyone to enter into the TSA. If you didn't like the terms, you were free not to obtain season's tickets. There are others who don't mind those parameters.

Trying to refund money per game etc etc becomes a bit of an administrative nightmare and pretty unnecessary considering people have entered into multiyear agreements with True North.

The only thing I would concur with you about is that TNSE should be offering customers a fair bank rate of interest for money they are holding for games not played.

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09-02-2012, 07:11 AM
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http://sports.espn.go.com/new-york/n...ory?id=6225642

This is customer service, and the Giants have a waiting list for tickets, so nothing was forcing them to do this.

If you believe in karma, perhaps this explains why they won the Super Bowl!

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09-02-2012, 07:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by arbf412 View Post
http://sports.espn.go.com/new-york/n...ory?id=6225642

This is customer service, and the Giants have a waiting list for tickets, so nothing was forcing them to do this.

If you believe in karma, perhaps this explains why they won the Super Bowl!
To be fair, the NHL is a gate-driven league in terms of revenue - the NFL has a HUGE TV contract to offset losses at the gate. Very good customer service by the Giants, nevertheless.

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09-02-2012, 07:25 AM
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I don't see why it should matter, in this case, if 100% of their revenue comes from the gate. We're talking about them canceling the games! This is like pre-paying for a tee time at a golf course, showing up to find out you can't play because they decided to redo all the greens, and being told you can't get your money back but you should come back when the course reopens.

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09-02-2012, 08:07 PM
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Well they've pretty much got me hostage to whatever terms they want to throw my way. It's not like I'm ever going to throw my tickets back and say I don't want them anymore.

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09-03-2012, 08:37 AM
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We'll probably be paying a little more for the hypothetical 3% increase next year.

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09-03-2012, 08:40 AM
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For those who want interest... what are you losing really... $5-$30? depending on your #games... it's not worth losing sleep over or thinking about.

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09-03-2012, 09:12 AM
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For those who want interest... what are you losing really... $5-$30? depending on your #games... it's not worth losing sleep over or thinking about.

Agree it's a few bucks.......I guess that may be a big deal to some but for me I can't bother to care for such a small amount of $$$$...It is like those people on TV who have a stroke yelling at the parking authority for giving them $20 tickets

I will sneak a flash into 1 game next year and not buy my typical 3 or 4 rum and cokes at the game and I will call it even with TN

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09-03-2012, 11:20 AM
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Anyone know anything about an update to that save the date email STH's received in February (I think?) and then said that the revised date was to be in fall.

I'm guessing this is on hold/cancelled due to the CBA issues. Was this supposed to be a special STH event or something held by TNSE? I've read how they did something for the Moose STH's and was wondering if this would be similar?

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09-04-2012, 05:33 PM
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Not sure what "save the date" email you are talking about.
There was the playoff ticket selection in February, and some fan appreciation emails in March/April but nothing I can remember about last season except the confirmation of the TPA dates for those who transferred seats.

Quote:
Originally Posted by KingSalamon View Post
Anyone know anything about an update to that save the date email STH's received in February (I think?) and then said that the revised date was to be in fall.

I'm guessing this is on hold/cancelled due to the CBA issues. Was this supposed to be a special STH event or something held by TNSE? I've read how they did something for the Moose STH's and was wondering if this would be similar?

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09-05-2012, 09:30 AM
  #24
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There was an email sent to me from TNSE (like all their other emails). It said March or April 17 was a 'Save the Date' notice. It was received in the middle of winter last season... I think Jan but could have been Feb. Then there was another email stating that it was sent in error and that it would be for the fall I thought.

I'd have to see if I kept the emails but I think they were deleted a while ago. My guess is that if there was no pending lockout we would have received this email.

Did any other STH receive this email from TNSE at the beginning of the year?

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09-05-2012, 09:52 AM
  #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KingSalamon View Post
There was an email sent to me from TNSE (like all their other emails). It said March or April 17 was a 'Save the Date' notice. It was received in the middle of winter last season... I think Jan but could have been Feb. Then there was another email stating that it was sent in error and that it would be for the fall I thought.

I'd have to see if I kept the emails but I think they were deleted a while ago. My guess is that if there was no pending lockout we would have received this email.

Did any other STH receive this email from TNSE at the beginning of the year?
I managed to find the e-mail you are referring to. It was a save the date for the 2012 Winnipeg Jets True North Foundation Gala Dinner. They originally sent one out saying it would be March 2012 and then sent a correction that it would be in September but they never sent a follow up with any specifics. It was sent January 23, 2012.

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