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Old
12-08-2012, 10:52 AM
  #951
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Originally Posted by Sideline View Post
A player is AHL eligible after 4 years of junior or when he turns 20 in the same calendar year as the seasons begins. Joe Morrow doesn't turn 20 until tomorrow, but because he turns 20 before January 1st he's AHL eligible to start this season. Maatta only has this season and next where he cannot play in the AHL.
Okay thanks for clearing that up. We won't put either on the team as long as Niskanen and Orpik are still here, it's that simple. It's hard to tell what the Pens would do, because they will have a bunch of D wanting to play in the AHL next year with not enough spots (Ruopp, Harrington, Dumoulin, Morrow and D'Agostino will be vying for spots, and we already have a bunch of D that will be stuck in the AHL because there isn't the space on the NHL roster). I'd trade Lovejoy for a pick, package Strait with a pick to get either a decent forward prospect or another winger and work from there.

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12-08-2012, 10:55 AM
  #952
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On the subject of London defencemen was anyone else excited to see Penguins 2013 first rounder Nikita Zadorov?
Pens will trade up to get him. I'm positive on that. He will probably be going at around the 22nd pick or so, and that is usually where the Pens are. If he is still on the board when they pick, he will 100% be a Penguin.

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12-08-2012, 10:57 AM
  #953
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Originally Posted by penguins2946 View Post
Okay thanks for clearing that up. We won't put either on the team as long as Niskanen and Orpik are still here, it's that simple. It's hard to tell what the Pens would do, because they will have a bunch of D wanting to play in the AHL next year with not enough spots (Ruopp, Harrington, Dumoulin, Morrow and D'Agostino will be vying for spots, and we already have a bunch of D that will be stuck in the AHL because there isn't the space on the NHL roster). I'd trade Lovejoy for a pick, package Strait with a pick to get either a decent forward prospect or another winger and work from there.
I agree that Lovejoy needs to go, and you want preferably Strait or Bortuzzo traded for a winger to free up roster space.

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12-08-2012, 11:16 AM
  #954
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Originally Posted by Mr Jiggyfly View Post
If Harrington was two inches and ten lbs heavier, I suspect he would be lauded as a can't miss, top tier blueline prospect.

Like the announcers said last night, he gets the puck and things slow down. He has remarkable poise and endless patience.
Absolutely. The thing is, he's not even small...6'2", 205 is right in line with any number of great defensive defensemen in the NHL.

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Games like the one last night make me question if I'm being too pessimistic projecting Harrington as a #4 at best. He consistently shuts down the best players in junior. He's not just the guy his coach throws out to match up he completely neutralizes guys like Strome and Yakupov on a regular basis.
Yep. I mean, there's a good case for him being the best junior-aged blueliner in his own end. I'm not sure why projections for him are generally a #4 in a best-case scenario.

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Originally Posted by Sideline View Post
On the subject of London defencemen was anyone else excited to see Penguins 2013 first rounder Nikita Zadorov?
The only way it's not happening is if we somehow get a lotto pick and take Jones instead. Even then, I'm sure we'll do everything we can to trade up and get both.

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12-08-2012, 11:20 AM
  #955
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Originally Posted by Gallatin View Post
I agree that Lovejoy needs to go, and you want preferably Strait or Bortuzzo traded for a winger to free up roster space.
I can't tell who is better between the 2. I think they should trade Strait since he is a year older. The simple solution would be to trade both, but the Pens won't do that. I'd trade all 3, call up Reese and have the pairs be:

Martin-Letang
Orpik-Despres
Niskanen-Engelland
Reese

That would make Harrington, Morrow, Ruopp, Dumoulin, Samuelsson and D'Agostino the top-6 on the AHL team (that is, if we sign D'Agostino).

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12-08-2012, 12:13 PM
  #956
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The issue with drafting Zadorov is that we would be trading Despres after we would be drafting him. Pens right now have 6 potential top-3 D (Dumoulin and Harrington will be bumped up from 7.0 to 7.5), and if we would draft Zadorov, that's 7. And that isn't even mentioning Letang. So that's 7 players fighting over 5 spots, while all 7 should be top-3 somewhere. I would want to keep the London boys if we draft Zadorov and trade the Winterhawk boys IMO. We don't need 3 heavily-offensive guys on 1 team, 4 if you count Despres and 5 if you count Dumoulin.

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12-08-2012, 12:26 PM
  #957
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Nice escalation of events leading up to Pouliot getting fed bodyshots:



Good on him for protecting his goalie at least.

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12-08-2012, 01:00 PM
  #958
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sideline View Post
Games like the one last night make me question if I'm being too pessimistic projecting Harrington as a #4 at best. He consistently shuts down the best players in junior. He's not just the guy his coach throws out to match up he completely neutralizes guys like Strome and Yakupov on a regular basis.
This is why it irks me so much when I read crap on the prospects board, especially the Team Canada WJC threads, with people questioning Harrington's addition to Team Canada. They look at his stats and compare him to other players with better numbers, overlooking the fact that's not his game. All he does, and does well, is shut down the other team's best players.

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Originally Posted by Rowdy Roddy Peeper View Post
Absolutely. The thing is, he's not even small...6'2", 205 is right in line with any number of great defensive defensemen in the NHL.
Where did you get those measurements? The OHL site lists him as 6'1, and most sites generally list him either as 6'0 or 6'1.

But in general, I agree that he's not really small or anything. Guys like Ryan Suter, Drew Doughty, etc. are all around that height, and I don't think they've ever been seen as too small or anything.

Quote:
The only way it's not happening is if we somehow get a lotto pick and take Jones instead. Even then, I'm sure we'll do everything we can to trade up and get both.
Seth Jones is the one guy who I'd actually be stoked about the Pens following their BDA (best defenseman available) approach.

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12-08-2012, 01:22 PM
  #959
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I was watching the London game last night. One thing that the announcers said about Harrington's play was that "Harrington might have a dozen saves tonight. He's so good defensively"

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12-08-2012, 01:56 PM
  #960
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Originally Posted by LetsGoPens70 View Post
I was watching the London game last night. One thing that the announcers said about Harrington's play was that "Harrington might have a dozen saves tonight. He's so good defensively"
Fleury will love him

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12-08-2012, 02:00 PM
  #961
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The London game is re-playing on the NHL Network right now.

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Old
12-08-2012, 04:08 PM
  #962
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Originally Posted by Burgs View Post
Nice escalation of events leading up to Pouliot getting fed bodyshots:



Good on him for protecting his goalie at least.
That was a pretty dick move by the goalie.

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Old
12-08-2012, 05:24 PM
  #963
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I'm on the fence about Zadorov. He is the replacement for Orpik that we need, without a doubt. Except bigger. He would be on the top pair along Letang for a long time. However, the issue with that is that we would need to trade ANOTHER D prospect, and that isn't even including whenever we have to trade our 1st D prospect. There's nothing I'd love more than a top-4 of:

Letang-Zadorov
Maatta-Harrington

but there's also the issue of where do Morrow, Pouliot, Despres, Dumoulin or Ruopp fit in? We have too many prospects than we know what to do with. What I personally would do is trade Morrow and Pouliot for a top-tier winger (we could get 1 with those 2, both are extremely highly-rated prospects). We still would have Maatta, Despres, Dumoulin and Letang to carry the offense on those pairs, but that would still leave Despres and Dumoulin on the 3rd pair, which they shouldn't be. Too much is better than not enough, but both are bad.

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12-08-2012, 05:45 PM
  #964
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Quote:
Originally Posted by penguins2946 View Post
I'm on the fence about Zadorov. He is the replacement for Orpik that we need, without a doubt. Except bigger. He would be on the top pair along Letang for a long time. However, the issue with that is that we would need to trade ANOTHER D prospect, and that isn't even including whenever we have to trade our 1st D prospect. There's nothing I'd love more than a top-4 of:

Letang-Zadorov
Maatta-Harrington

but there's also the issue of where do Morrow, Pouliot, Despres, Dumoulin or Ruopp fit in? We have too many prospects than we know what to do with. What I personally would do is trade Morrow and Pouliot for a top-tier winger (we could get 1 with those 2, both are extremely highly-rated prospects). We still would have Maatta, Despres, Dumoulin and Letang to carry the offense on those pairs, but that would still leave Despres and Dumoulin on the 3rd pair, which they shouldn't be. Too much is better than not enough, but both are bad.
I thought you wanted to trade Letang...
Dumoulin will not be an offensive catalyst at the NHL level.
Why do you want to trade the "Winterhawk" boys now vs any of the others?
Are you keeping Maatta in the lineup just because he's a Knight like Harrington and Zadorov?




As for Zadorov, I hate to say it, but being from London, it would not surprise me in the least if the Pens draft him if he is available at their pick. Not that thats a bad thing, but it won't please the need more wingerz contingent on here.

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Old
12-08-2012, 06:19 PM
  #965
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Quote:
Originally Posted by #1GuinFan View Post
I thought you wanted to trade Letang...
Dumoulin will not be an offensive catalyst at the NHL level.
Why do you want to trade the "Winterhawk" boys now vs any of the others?
Are you keeping Maatta in the lineup just because he's a Knight like Harrington and Zadorov?




As for Zadorov, I hate to say it, but being from London, it would not surprise me in the least if the Pens draft him if he is available at their pick. Not that thats a bad thing, but it won't please the need more wingerz contingent on here.
Dumoulin should be a solid, 30 point scorer at the NHL level. Maatta is an extremely good defenseman, I like him much more than Pouliot and about the same as Morrow. I said we should trade Morrow and Pouliot because they would get us the highest return. I've said this before, I'm not a fan of the Pouliot pick last year. I really didn't and still don't have any interest in him. Personally, if we had to, I'd pick Dumoulin and Pouliot to trade. Despres will be a better Dumoulin in all parts of the game, and Pouliot will probably be another Goligoski, which we don't need. We also have to think that not all of the D will ever become as good as their potential, but I feel like Maatta, Harrington and Despres are a lot safer than Pouliot.

As I was typing this, Morrow broke his scoreless streak.

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12-08-2012, 06:25 PM
  #966
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I don't see any reason to be dealing blue line prospects anytime soon. Sure, we have like 10 guys that project to be real good NHLers, but they won't all pan out. Hell, less than half might.

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12-08-2012, 06:25 PM
  #967
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Sean Maguire expected to start for BU today vs Maine. Game on CBS Sports Network.

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12-08-2012, 06:31 PM
  #968
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Originally Posted by Jacob View Post
I don't see any reason to be dealing blue line prospects anytime soon. Sure, we have like 10 guys that project to be real good NHLers, but they won't all pan out. Hell, less than half might.
I'm not buying into the Dumoulin bandwagon. Yeah, he may become another Niskanen (decent 5th D), but I don't think he will be much more. He essentially changed teams, but kept the same system. If he would be like Morrow and come into a completely different system, I'd change my mind. Once Morrow gets the hang of WBS system, he will be a monster

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12-08-2012, 06:35 PM
  #969
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okay.

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12-08-2012, 06:39 PM
  #970
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Originally Posted by penguins2946 View Post
I'm not buying into the Dumoulin bandwagon. Yeah, he may become another Niskanen (decent 5th D), but I don't think he will be much more. He essentially changed teams, but kept the same system. If he would be like Morrow and come into a completely different system, I'd change my mind. Once Morrow gets the hang of WBS system, he will be a monster
Uh, what? You're not buying into a player who has shown excellent development since college just because he moved from one system to another that is similar? He still made the jump to the pros. That's the lamest reason to write someone off. Dumoulin has arguably been WBS most consistent defender this year.

I'm a huge BC fan and it's unlikely he turns into a offensive juggernaut in the NHL, but to write him off is stupid. He has #3 potential and with his physical and mental skill sets he's almost guaranteed to reach his potential.

Sorry, but some of these posts from you

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12-08-2012, 06:43 PM
  #971
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Uh, what? You're not buying into a player who has shown excellent development since college just because he moved from one system to another that is similar? He still made the jump to the pros. That's the lamest reason to write someone off. Dumoulin has arguably been WBS most consistent defender this year.

I'm a huge BC fan and it's unlikely he turns into a offensive juggernaut in the NHL, but to write him off is stupid. He has #3 potential and with his physical and mental skill sets he's almost guaranteed to reach his potential.

Sorry, but some of these posts from you
Maybe I'm just trying to rationalize why Morrow is doing badly. I think I'm just disappointed with him, so I'm trying to make an excuse to convince myself that Dumoulin is doing better because the system is more familiar, not because he is better. I was so hopeful about Morrow after last season's preseason in Pittsburgh and his season in the WHL, but he has been just bad this year.

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12-08-2012, 06:49 PM
  #972
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Originally Posted by penguins2946 View Post
Maybe I'm just trying to rationalize why Morrow is doing badly. I think I'm just disappointed with him, so I'm trying to make an excuse to convince myself that Dumoulin is doing better because the system is more familiar, not because he is better. I was so hopeful about Morrow after last season's preseason in Pittsburgh and his season in the WHL, but he has been just bad this year.
I don't get why you'd need to rationalize Morrow's struggle to adjust by putting down Dumoulin.

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12-08-2012, 06:50 PM
  #973
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Maybe I'm just trying to rationalize why Morrow is doing badly. I think I'm just disappointed with him, so I'm trying to make an excuse to convince myself that Dumoulin is doing better because the system is more familiar, not because he is better. I was so hopeful about Morrow after last season's preseason in Pittsburgh and his season in the WHL, but he has been just bad this year.
Understandable, but I wouldn't look too much into Morrow's troubles for that very reason. I think college prepares you more for the pros mentally IMHO. Sure the systems in Portland and WBS are 180 in comparison, but I think it's more of the "pro life" that Morrow is struggling with. Pure speculation.

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12-08-2012, 06:55 PM
  #974
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Understandable, but I wouldn't look too much into Morrow's troubles for that very reason. I think college prepares you more for the pros mentally IMHO. Sure the systems in Portland and WBS are 180 in comparison, but I think it's more of the "pro life" that Morrow is struggling with. Pure speculation.
I hope that's the case. Shero doesn't really draft busts, and when he does, he gets rid of them while they still have value. Hopefully that trend will continue.

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12-08-2012, 06:59 PM
  #975
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I don't get why you'd need to rationalize Morrow's struggle to adjust by putting down Dumoulin.
Dumoulin is doing extremely well right now. Morrow isn't. Dumoulin came from a similar system. Morrow didn't. I'd much rather think that Morrow is only struggling due to a transitional issue than Dumoulin being better than him. Well, to be fair, Despres was bad for most of the season, and is only now playing well (4 G, 1 A in last 6 games), so maybe we shouldn't look into the AHL much for how a player is doing. Schultz has more points than Eberle, but Eberle is a ton better than he is.

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