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"Burke will not go into season with current line-up"

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Old
09-23-2012, 07:41 PM
  #276
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Disgruntled Observer View Post

I'm not going to completely generalize... but people critical of Burke are probably more intelligent than those supportive of him.
Not to generalize but there is usually an exception to every rule.

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09-23-2012, 08:07 PM
  #277
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Originally Posted by jmart21 View Post
Yes, but that's the cost when you are acquiring a 21 year old 36g scorer.
He paid more than an offersheet required.

He said worst case scenario it could be Seguin.

He accomplished the worst he said was possible.

He overpaid.

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09-23-2012, 08:18 PM
  #278
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CrazeeEddie View Post
Overpaid implies he could have acquired him cheaper. He couldn't have.
How do we know?

He might have landed him with an offersheet.

We'll never know, and saying the Bruins could have matched doesn't prove they would have matched.

Certainly, offersheets seldom work out, but as I said I would have been fine with not landing him if the Bruins matched. I would have just accepted it.

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09-23-2012, 08:30 PM
  #279
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ULF_55 View Post
How do we know?

He might have landed him with an offersheet.

We'll never know, and saying the Bruins could have matched doesn't prove they would have matched.

Certainly, offersheets seldom work out, but as I said I would have been fine with not landing him if the Bruins matched. I would have just accepted it.
How often do teams not match it?

Burke played the odds.

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09-23-2012, 08:33 PM
  #280
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ULF_55 View Post
How do we know?

He might have landed him with an offersheet.

We'll never know, and saying the Bruins could have matched doesn't prove they would have matched.

Certainly, offersheets seldom work out, but as I said I would have been fine with not landing him if the Bruins matched. I would have just accepted it.
No. Thats the thing - You wouldn't. You and many other posters would still be complaining about it, no matter which way the season played out.

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09-23-2012, 08:35 PM
  #281
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ULF_55 View Post
How do we know?

He might have landed him with an offersheet.

We'll never know, and saying the Bruins could have matched doesn't prove they would have matched.

Certainly, offersheets seldom work out, but as I said I would have been fine with not landing him if the Bruins matched. I would have just accepted it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by CrazeeEddie View Post
Overpaid implies he could have acquired him cheaper. He couldn't have.
Chiarelli was prepared to take Kaberle and Leafs 1st (Kadri), but Burke nixed the deal.

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09-23-2012, 08:35 PM
  #282
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CrazeeEddie View Post
Overpaid implies he could have acquired him cheaper. He couldn't have.
Offer sheet was cheaper. The Kaberle deal that fell through was also cheaper.

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09-23-2012, 08:40 PM
  #283
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mess View Post
Chiarelli was prepared to take Kaberle and Leafs 1st (Kadri), but Burke nixed the deal.
Except that deal would have cost us Kadri, Kaberle, Liles, Colborne and Biggs in hindsight.

This deal was still cheaper.

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09-23-2012, 08:43 PM
  #284
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CrazeeEddie View Post
Except that deal would have cost us Kadri, Kaberle, Liles, Colborne and Biggs in hindsight.

This deal was still cheaper.
What happened to the other assets the Bruins got?

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09-23-2012, 08:43 PM
  #285
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My opinion on Burke is mixed:

I like the trades he has make in the sense of how little he was able to give up to acquire players, I really think the guy is a crafty GM and very creative too. Another thing I'm imprssed with about him is that he hasn't handed out any long term "handcuffing" type contracts, he's been really flexible with that.

However, Burke has built this team all wrong: Our top 6 while skilled is small, soft, and flat out brutal to average in their own end! Pretty much all teams know that the best way to shut down the Leafs is stand them up in the NZ or crunch them along the wall, either option results in the Leafs being forced to play defence, something they aren't good at leaving them hemmed in their own end for long stretches and a lot of goals against going in. Our blueline outside of the top 3 (Phaneuf/Gunnarsson
/Gardiner) is brutal defensively, which is ironic because the best defensive players should be on the blueline. Another issue I have with Burke is he has been here 4 years and all he has to show for in prospect forwards is 1 top 6 guy (Kadri), and 1 borderline top 6 guy (Colborne), sorry but that is just pitiful work done there.

IMO if you look at all the teams that have gone on to win the cup or even just go deep in the playoffs is goaltending, team defense, forwards who are a mix of skill/size/toughness. Burke has failed to bring in a #1, the only potential one we have is Riemer and he was not a Burke draft pick, the rest while have potential are unproven.

Burke has had 4 seasons to improve this team but he hasn't, we were a lottery team when the season before he arrived and we finished last season as a current one. At the end of the day Burke simply hasn't gottent the job done, it's nothing personal against the guy but he needs to go.

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09-23-2012, 08:44 PM
  #286
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ULF_55 View Post
Yes, like if JFj should have been allowed his rebuild. He wasn't and hindsight proves he was right.
Fully agree. I think JFJ would have done a great job. I think that's why I prefer Burke. He's going to do it his way no matter what.

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09-23-2012, 08:46 PM
  #287
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CrazeeEddie View Post
Fully agree. I think JFJ would have done a great job. I think that's why I prefer Burke. He's going to do it his way no matter what.
I liked JFJ as well, he was never given a fair shake here IMO! He was new on the scene and MLSE had him by the balls, it was their way or he lost his job, sadly he had to carry out what his bosses wanted.

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09-23-2012, 08:46 PM
  #288
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Originally Posted by ULF_55 View Post
Yes, like if JFj should have been allowed his rebuild. He wasn't and hindsight proves he was right.
Hindsight proves that the path we took has proven to be very difficult. It hasn't proven one god dayum thing about the other path.

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Old
09-23-2012, 08:50 PM
  #289
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kingstonian84 View Post
My opinion on Burke is mixed:

I like the trades he has make in the sense of how little he was able to give up to acquire players, I really think the guy is a crafty GM and very creative too. Another thing I'm imprssed with about him is that he hasn't handed out any long term "handcuffing" type contracts, he's been really flexible with that.

However, Burke has built this team all wrong: Our top 6 while skilled is small, soft, and flat out brutal to average in their own end! Pretty much all teams know that the best way to shut down the Leafs is stand them up in the NZ or crunch them along the wall, either option results in the Leafs being forced to play defence, something they aren't good at leaving them hemmed in their own end for long stretches and a lot of goals against going in. Our blueline outside of the top 3 (Phaneuf/Gunnarsson
/Gardiner) is brutal defensively, which is ironic because the best defensive players should be on the blueline. Another issue I have with Burke is he has been here 4 years and all he has to show for in prospect forwards is 1 top 6 guy (Kadri), and 1 borderline top 6 guy (Colborne), sorry but that is just pitiful work done there.

IMO if you look at all the teams that have gone on to win the cup or even just go deep in the playoffs is goaltending, team defense, forwards who are a mix of skill/size/toughness. Burke has failed to bring in a #1, the only potential one we have is Riemer and he was not a Burke draft pick, the rest while have potential are unproven.

Burke has had 4 seasons to improve this team but he hasn't, we were a lottery team when the season before he arrived and we finished last season as a current one. At the end of the day Burke simply hasn't gottent the job done, it's nothing personal against the guy but he needs to go.
And a 24 year old ppg player. And who brought in Phaneuf and Gardiner again?

What did you honestly expect in three and a half years? It will come. It may not even be Burke who finishes the job , but whoever comes in next will have plenty to play with thanks to him.

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09-23-2012, 08:52 PM
  #290
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And a 24 year old ppg player. And who brought in Phaneuf and Gardiner again?

What did you honestly expect in three and a half years?

Yes, he brought in those guys and I like that he brought them in. However it still doesn't negate the fact Burke has built this team as a very small/non physical team and one who is awful in their own end, like I said IMO he has built this team the wrong way.

What do I expect in the 4 seasons he's been here? I firmly expected his team to get INTO the playoffs last year instead they became a lottery one.

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09-23-2012, 08:55 PM
  #291
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kingstonian84 View Post
I liked JFJ as well, he was never given a fair shake here IMO! He was new on the scene and MLSE had him by the balls, it was their way or he lost his job, sadly he had to carry out what his bosses wanted.
And now some here would have us do this all over again. Others would have us follow the Oilers example, who after three years of low picks (more if you discount their miracle run) have accomplished what? That's right, first overall pick again.

Things haven't gone as planned, but they are not the complete disaster some make it seem.

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09-23-2012, 08:55 PM
  #292
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Originally Posted by ULF_55 View Post
Maybe you would be saying Seguin was a bust, but that doesn't mean all Leafs' fans would. I would not doubt people are underrating Seguin now, but 67 points as a 20 year old is pretty good no?
He did that as a Leaf? That's impressive.

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09-23-2012, 08:57 PM
  #293
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Eh, I don't like the Oilers plan, where has it really gotten them?

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09-23-2012, 08:57 PM
  #294
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kingstonian84 View Post
And a 24 year old ppg player. And who brought in Phaneuf and Gardiner again?

What did you honestly expect in three and a half years?

Yes, he brought in those guys and I like that he brought them in. However it still doesn't negate the fact Burke has built this team as a very small/non physical team and one who is awful in their own end, like I said IMO he has built this team the wrong way.

What do I expect in the 4 seasons he's been here? I firmly expected his team to get INTO the playoffs last year instead they became a lottery one.
So did he, I bet. I'm not one to say I told you so, but I told you so. I didn't expect it last year, I do this season. Assuming there is one. I was impressed that he didn't sell the farm at the deadline to sneak us in.

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09-23-2012, 11:45 PM
  #295
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CrazeeEddie View Post
They were slotted to draft 7th and 7th. Even had they dropped to 5th, I'd still do it.

Of course I'd still do it the way it is.
Is that why they call u crazeeEddie?

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09-23-2012, 11:46 PM
  #296
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[QUOTE=CrazeeEddie;54544991]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kingstonian84 View Post

They weren't a lottery team. Their only lottery pick came by trade.
Read the post again..... please and thank you crazeeeddie...

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09-24-2012, 12:07 AM
  #297
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kingstonian84 View Post
...also he's not very good positonally either.
really? i figure all those times he finished up plays beside the net would make him knowledgeable on where to be as a goal scorer

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09-24-2012, 06:28 AM
  #298
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Has Berger ever ever broken a trade?

There are very very few reporters that I trust at all when it comes to rumours, Berger is not one of them. Especially since he no longer works at the Fan590, and because his relationship with the Leafs soured towards the end. So who exactly is gonna talk to the guy? And he didnt exactly have far reaching influence and strong contacts throughout the league.

I see this as just a pile of crap. Like and Ek rumour. If ANY trade happens, Berger will take credit for it. If no trades happen, he'll just say Ek's typical line about how he just reports what he hears, trades fall apart last second, etc

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09-24-2012, 06:41 AM
  #299
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Has Berger ever ever broken a trade?

There are very very few reporters that I trust at all when it comes to rumours, Berger is not one of them. Especially since he no longer works at the Fan590, and because his relationship with the Leafs soured towards the end. So who exactly is gonna talk to the guy? And he didnt exactly have far reaching influence and strong contacts throughout the league.

I see this as just a pile of crap. Like and Ek rumour. If ANY trade happens, Berger will take credit for it. If no trades happen, he'll just say Ek's typical line about how he just reports what he hears, trades fall apart last second, etc
well, the article says other organizations besides the leafs gave him the info. regardless, hes still a beat writer for the national post and still has contacts throughout the league

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09-24-2012, 07:01 AM
  #300
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well, the article says other organizations besides the leafs gave him the info. regardless, hes still a beat writer for the national post and still has contacts throughout the league
Absolutely, although it may just be Berger speaking common sense.

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