Trade Rumors and Free Agent TalkTrade rumors, transactions, and free agent talk. Rumors must contain the word RUMOR in post title. Proposals must contain the word PROPOSAL in post title.
I think Toronto makes out this deal quite badly as well. Upgraded goaltending but 3 more years of Keith Ballard's hideous contract. They would have the most expensive 3rd pairing in Ballard-Komisarek. Have fun with that one folks.
You dont know what you are talking about. Kulikov is a beast, outstanding young defenseman, one of the best in the league.
Ye.. NO!
Lol, he is not even a top 10 young dman, a top 30-40 dman <<< a top 5-10 goalie, go ahead and make a poll on who's the better player and Luongo will win in a landslide
Last edited by LeX4cavalier: 09-23-2012 at 01:57 PM.
Lol, he is not even close to being one of the best dmen in the league, Arguably a top 30-40 dman <<< arguably a top 5-10 goalie, go ahead and make a poll on who's the better player and Luongo will win in a landslidr
He did mention the word "young". I suppose it could be worded differently but I am pretty sure he means "one of the best young defenseman", in which case I agree with him.
With the way I've seen Panther fans talk about their prospects why dont you guys just list all your prospects as "untouchables".
Sure you are
Ugh, i really hate this mindset. Jesus christ, they don't want to trade their top prospects for a declining goalie on a bad contract... DEAL WITH IT. ****s sake. It has nothing to do with them overvaluing their own prospects.
And I really suggest you watch a Panthers game, because judging from your posts so far in this thread I highly doubt you've ever seen Kulikov play.
He did mention the word "young". I suppose it could be worded differently but I am pretty sure he means "one of the best young defenseman", in which case I agree with him.
I don't think he's even a top 10 young dman, I guess it depends on what you consider young.
Karlsson
Doughty
Pietrangelo
Mcdonagh
Subban
Myers
OEL
Shattenkirk
Bogosian
Del Zotto
Dmen around his age that are better imo
Lol, he is not even close to being one of the best dmen in the league, a top 30-40 dman <<< a top 5-10 goalie, go ahead and make a poll on who's the better player and Luongo will win in a landslidr
I don't think he's even a top 15 young dman, I guess it depends on what you consider young.
I tend to leave guys like Doughty and Pietrangelo out of such lists simply because they would already land on the "best defenseman" list no need to include them on another.
Who cares? You asked what Theo has done and I told you, he has some shiny hardware that Luongo will never get his hands on.
You realize those decade old accomplishments show no baring to how he currently is playing \ while the ones for Luongo that I've listed are within the past 2 years.
I see the kind I am dealing with... no point in wasting any more of my time.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Intense Rage
I tend to leave guys like Doughty and Pietrangelo out of such lists simply because they would already land on the "best defenseman" list no need to include them on another.
Aka to fit my argument better
Quote:
Originally Posted by Braden Carlzner
Ugh, i really hate this mindset. Jesus christ, they don't want to trade their top prospects for a declining goalie on a bad contract... DEAL WITH IT. ****s sake. It has nothing to do with them overvaluing their own prospects.
And I really suggest you watch a Panthers game, because judging from your posts so far in this thread I highly doubt you've ever seen Kulikov play.
Going off about a certain type mind set & then putting another one out there
Because I don't think Kulikov is the best player in a deal that involves Luongo that means you can question that?
I don't think he's even a top 10 young dman, I guess it depends on what you consider young.
Karlsson
Doughty
Pietrangelo
Mcdonagh
Subban
Myers
OEL
Shattenkirk
Bogosian
Del Zotto
Dmen around his age that are better imo
Every player you mentioned other than OEL is atleast one year older than him, If Kulikov had played as many games as Del Zotto he would have had 37 points to Del Zotto's 41 and is a year younger.
Florida give up the most but they get the BEST player in the deal.
Toronto gets value for simply helping to be third man in to get deal done.
Vancouver does not get the bounty they are hoping for but get enough key pieces to help them become potential Cup contenders.
Thoughts?? Be gentle now.
Florida gets hosed in #3, No chance do they give up that package for Luongo.
So my question is... just what is the Panthers' willingness to pay for Luongo?
I'd assume the Canucks choice (possibly Theo's choice) of Clemmensen/Theodore would be on the starting point... but what's the best asset that the Panthers would include along with him?
Obviously Huberdeau isn't on the table.... but where is the breaking point? Is it Bjugstad? the first? Howden? Petrovic? Matheson? At what price would you be willing to let him go elsewhere?
Does the phrase "just kicking the tires", mean anything to you? That's all Florida was doing. I think the fact that Luongo, who has no say in what the Panthers are doing with their franchise, said that he wanted to play for Florida lead to all this trade speculation.
Oh have you now? Like how Edmonton has "worked hard" to acquire their 3 1st overalls? The only thing that was worked hard in sucking to get high draft picks is an already small fan base's loyalty.
Depends... are you talking down one player to make your point? Isn't a GM's job to make a competitive team? A Team that wins more games then it loses? Does Luongo on the Panthers make them more or less competitive? Does he give them better or worse chances to win games?
I understand that you may not want Luongo but if you don't want to read all this & are feeling bothered why not just leave the thread? You don't have to be here, especially now that you know what the topic will revolve around.
How many years ago was that? How many teams ago was that? Is Theodore still anywhere near that level?
The Luongo now is a lot closer the the Luongo of 2006 then the Theodore of now is to the Hart/Vezina Winning Theodore of a DECADE ago. And if you noticed my list of accomplishments are all within the past 2 years.
You do know that you can draft well without accumulating top 5 picks right? Neither Petrovic, Shore, Kulikov, Bjugstad, Howden or Grimaldi are top draft choices.
EDM is the latest team rumoured to have put down an offer for Lu. I think we've exhausted the proposals with TO and FLA anyway. Maybe EDM factors in somehow?
The givens here are that FLA doesn't need Lu, TO does but does not want to give up enough, and EDM is the latest rumoured. There's also that "mystery team" Botchford keeps referencing...? Might be best to discuss the latter two options rather than keep beating the dead horse (FLA/TOR).
Err.......no. The chances of that being true are somewhere between zero and none.
Every player you mentioned other than OEL is atleast one year older than him, If Kulikov had played as many games as Del Zotto he would have had 37 points to Del Zotto's 41 and is a year younger.
He said Kulikov was one of the best young dmen in the nhl, all the dmen I listed are young
You realize those decade old accomplishments show no baring to how he currently is playing \ while the ones for Luongo that I've listed are within the past 2 years.
I see the kind I am dealing with... no point in wasting any more of my time.
Aka to fit my argument better
So what exactly? Did I say Theo was a better goalie? Nope, you asked what Theo had done and I mentioned his Vezina and Hart. So what if those achievements are old, I consider them worth mentioning. Just because he is no longer the same player anymore does not make his achievements meaningless.
You do know that you can draft well without accumulating top 5 picks right? Neither Petrovic, Shore, Kulikov, Bjugstad, Howden or Grimaldi are top draft choices.
I didn't know that! Thanks for the heads up
The comparison was only in how the team "worked hard" aka consistently losing hockey games to get those players, not in the skill level, draft class ...etc
Quote:
Originally Posted by Intense Rage
So what exactly? Did I say Theo was a better goalie? Nope, you asked what Theo had done and I mentioned his Vezina and Hart. So what if those achievements are old, I consider them worth mentioning. Just because he is no longer the same player anymore does not make his achievements meaningless.
They do deserve a mention & aren't meaningless but they don't hold any merit when deciding who is the better of the 2 goalies right now... do they?
The comparison was only in how the team "worked hard" aka consistently losing hockey games to get those players, not in the skill level, draft class ...etc
Well their scouting staff did work hard to accumulate top prospects, but they did so without their top picks as well. I don't see why it's so hard to say that the Panthers worked hard for their prospects. They are rebuilding through the draft and this isn't an easy task. You can draft poorly, despite having top picks or you can draft exceptional players, despite finishing with lower picks.
The comparison was only in how the team "worked hard" aka consistently losing hockey games to get those players, not in the skill level, draft class ...etc
Maybe the poster considers it to be hardwork to be patient, scout well and develop one's own prospects. I mean surely it takes more than "consistently losing games" to build a prospect pool otherwise a team like Columbus would be successful at it as well.
And here, another Canucks fan creates yet another trade proposal in which Vancouver comes out the undisputed winner in a Luongo deal. Others have already said it, but I'll echo them anyway: this proposal is absurd.
What's absurd is people thinking Luongo has very low value.
__________________
I told ya so. I was right all along!
With the way I've seen Panther fans talk about their prospects why dont you guys just list all your prospects as "untouchables".
Sure you are
This argument always tickles me. If the Panthers fans are "over valuing" their prospects so much, why do you guys keep trying to get your hands on them so bad?
