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Old
03-30-2013, 08:13 PM
  #951
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Do we have a scout in Quebec?

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03-30-2013, 09:12 PM
  #952
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I see Darryl Young at three times for the player ! Big d-man could be drafted in 7 !

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03-31-2013, 12:17 AM
  #953
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Originally Posted by Vankiller Whale View Post
I'm still leanung towards taking Subban with our 2nd, assuming it's in the bottom 5.

I might be stat watching a bit on him, but seeing as his greatest deficiency was his defensive game, and he's umproved his +/- from -22 last year to +22 this year, I can only take that as a marked improvement. Not to mention a goal and +4 in 3 playoff games as well.

If we are going the high-risk, high-reward route(which generally I endorse), I would take him over Kujawinski.

Also, what does anyone know about Tyler Hill? All I know is he has sky high potential, but what are some of his flaws/etc that might hold him back?
Is Subban a puck moving type? I think our system is lacking guys who have high offensive potential on D. Corrado, Price, Mcnally all seem like more of the all around types.

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03-31-2013, 10:34 AM
  #954
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Who's the player you're thinking of?
Guy from prepschool write me in private !

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03-31-2013, 11:05 AM
  #955
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Originally Posted by Derp Kassian View Post
Is Subban a puck moving type? I think our system is lacking guys who have high offensive potential on D. Corrado, Price, Mcnally all seem like more of the all around types.
Yes.

I'd be ecstatic if we got him in the 2nd. His height doesnt bother me at all, he's almost like a Ryan Ellis type but with much more grit. PK has said that he thinks Jordan will be better than him one day, but I highly doubt that. Another positive is he's a right handed shot so if we drafted him we would essentially be set on the right side for the next decade with Tanev, Corrado and Subban.

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03-31-2013, 11:12 AM
  #956
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Canít believe folks are still entertaining D men in the early going. We're flirting with bottom 1/3 in league scoring. Sedins & Burrows will be 34 next season and our only other legitimate top 6 forward is injury prone. We've D men signed in perpetuity up the wazoo.

Our needs couldnít be more clear. If I were MG, absent an epic slide, I wouldnít so much as glance at a D man in rounds 1 & 2 for the next 2-3 years.

It maybe time for a dose of KISS or moneyball--when looking for a hitter why not draft a guy that is a proven hitter.

About this Rychel guy, I may be wrong, but other than Shinkaruk no other draft eligible player in CHL has scored more goals (86 to 81) in the last 2 years of regular season play. This year only Petan had more goals among OHL and WHLers. The guy has his shortcomings to be sure, but shot and ability to get into scoring position isn't among them.

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03-31-2013, 11:15 AM
  #957
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Originally Posted by Trelane View Post
Can’t believe folks are still entertaining D men in the early going. We're flirting with bottom 1/3 in league scoring. Sedins & Burrows will be 34 next season and our only other legitimate top 6 forward is injury prone. We've D men signed in perpetuity up the wazoo.

Our needs couldn’t be more clear. If I were MG, absent an epic slide, I wouldn’t so much as glance at a D man in rounds 1 & 2 for the next 2-3 years.

It maybe time for a dose of KISS or moneyball--when looking for a hitter why not draft a guy that is a proven hitter.

About this Rychel guy, I may be wrong, but other than Shinkaruk no other draft eligible player in CHL has scored more goals (86 to 81) in the last 2 years of regular season play. This year only Petan had more goals among OHL and WHLers. The guy has his shortcomings to be sure, but shot and ability to get into scoring position isn't among them.
How will drafting a player in late June help our scoring problems now?
Most players take multiple years to develop to play in the NHL, so we shouldn't be drafting now based on our current scoring problems.

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Old
03-31-2013, 11:21 AM
  #958
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Originally Posted by Trelane View Post
Can’t believe folks are still entertaining D men in the early going. We're flirting with bottom 1/3 in league scoring. Sedins & Burrows will be 34 next season and our only other legitimate top 6 forward is injury prone. We've D men signed in perpetuity up the wazoo.

Our needs couldn’t be more clear. If I were MG, absent an epic slide, I wouldn’t so much as glance at a D man in rounds 1 & 2 for the next 2-3 years.

It maybe time for a dose of KISS or moneyball--when looking for a hitter why not draft a guy that is a proven hitter.

About this Rychel guy, I may be wrong, but other than Shinkaruk no other draft eligible player in CHL has scored more goals (86 to 81) in the last 2 years of regular season play. This year only Petan had more goals among OHL and WHLers. The guy has his shortcomings to be sure, but shot and ability to get into scoring position isn't among them.
Whats wrong with looking at a defenceman like Subban in the 2nd round? The best part about Subban is his offensive game. An offensive minded powerplay quarterback is exactly what this team needs.

With that being said, I agree with you about our need for some highly skilled top 6 prospects. A player Im keeping my eye on is Valentin Zykov. He's a Russian with tons of skill and already has a NHL frame (6'1 215lbs at age 17). He's known as arguably the best player in the QMJHL from the hashmarks down and for having a relentless motor. In his 1st season in North America he scored 40 goals and had 75pts in 67 games. He's projected to go in the late 1st and if he's still around at our pick, we have to take a look at him IMO.

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03-31-2013, 11:36 AM
  #959
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Originally Posted by Love View Post
Whats wrong with looking at a defenceman like Subban in the 2nd round? The best part about Subban is his offensive game. An offensive minded powerplay quarterback is exactly what this team needs.

With that being said, I agree with you about our need for some highly skilled top 6 prospects. A player Im keeping my eye on is Valentin Zykov. He's a Russian with tons of skill and already has a NHL frame (6'1 215lbs at age 17). He's known as arguably the best player in the QMJHL from the hashmarks down and for having a relentless motor. In his 1st season in North America he scored 40 goals and had 75pts in 67 games. He's projected to go in the late 1st and if he's still around at our pick, we have to take a look at him IMO.
I like Zykov too, there are a number of players that I like in the 1st round, but to be honest I wouldn't be too disappointed if we moved our 1st+ for a 1st line forward unless someone crazy falls, like Nichushkin, Ristolainen, Zadorov, or Lazar.

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03-31-2013, 11:57 AM
  #960
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Originally Posted by Nuckles37 View Post
How will drafting a player in late June help our scoring problems now?
Most players take multiple years to develop to play in the NHL, so we shouldn't be drafting now based on our current scoring problems.
Of course. It's not the now that I'm worried about, it's the 2-3 years down the road that has me terrified. NOBODY gives away young/promising top 6 forwards absent heavy payment. We're talking Schneider or Edler category, and frankly I don't think MG has the stones to move either.

Between Jansen, Kassian and Schroeder I think we can count our blessings if one develops into a legit top 6 and one more keeps a place in top 9. Even so, their pedigree doesn't suggest that they'll be better than similarly situated players on other teams. We need to hit a couple homers with our picks in the worst way.

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03-31-2013, 12:10 PM
  #961
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Of course. It's not the now that I'm worried about, it's the 2-3 years down the road that has me terrified. NOBODY gives away young/promising top 6 forwards absent heavy payment. We're talking Schneider or Edler category, and frankly I don't think MG has the stones to move either.

Between Jansen, Kassian and Schroeder I think we can count our blessings if one develops into a legit top 6 and one more keeps a place in top 9. Even so, their pedigree doesn't suggest that they'll be better than similarly situated players on other teams. We need to hit a couple homers with our picks in the worst way.
There's nothing wrong with drafting a d-man in the first 2 rounds.
D-men can take 5+ years before becoming NHL ready, so by that time Hamhuis, Bieksa, and Garrison could be gone.

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03-31-2013, 12:20 PM
  #962
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Originally Posted by Love View Post
Whats wrong with looking at a defenceman like Subban in the 2nd round? The best part about Subban is his offensive game. An offensive minded powerplay quarterback is exactly what this team needs.

With that being said, I agree with you about our need for some highly skilled top 6 prospects. A player Im keeping my eye on is Valentin Zykov. He's a Russian with tons of skill and already has a NHL frame (6'1 215lbs at age 17). He's known as arguably the best player in the QMJHL from the hashmarks down and for having a relentless motor. In his 1st season in North America he scored 40 goals and had 75pts in 67 games. He's projected to go in the late 1st and if he's still around at our pick, we have to take a look at him IMO.
It's one thing to draft a 5'9 forward but it's a whole other animal to take a D man that size. We had one here recently that was the best player in Finland but only managed to play a handful of games for us. Don't see it with our management still having 2011 Bruin nightmares.

I like Zykov but MG has yet to draft, sign or trade for a Russian. I don't actually have a preference but it would be a nice change if a year from now we wouldn't have to fret about whether our 19 year-old CHLers can reach the modest totals of 30 goals or 60 points.

The percentages of successful top 9/6 players are considerably better for rounds 1 & 2, becoming almost negligible after 3. Hence the importance of getting forwards in those rounds. That said I know full well that Nucks will take their BPA no matter the position.

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03-31-2013, 12:33 PM
  #963
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Originally Posted by Nuckles37 View Post
There's nothing wrong with drafting a d-man in the first 2 rounds.
D-men can take 5+ years before becoming NHL ready, so by that time Hamhuis, Bieksa, and Garrison could be gone.
I like getting them in rounds 3 and later or inking previously unsigned FA a la Tanev, Bieksa, Garrison, Edler, etc.
Better still to maintain a decent team that homeboys will flock to once they become UFAs and have years of experience behind them, with other teams having to suffer with their teething problems.

Concerning the purely defensive aspect of the game, D men are best in their late 20s to early 30s. Goal scoring on the other hand is a young man's art. The Sedins were an aberration.

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03-31-2013, 07:10 PM
  #964
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I'm pretty sure we'll be taking a forward in the 1st round if it's BPA, but not because of our current scoring problems.

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03-31-2013, 07:14 PM
  #965
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Guy from prepschool write me in private !
I appreciate you bringing something new to this thread, but what is the point of bringing something up then not providing any substance?

It's the Internet dude.

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03-31-2013, 07:24 PM
  #966
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I like getting them in rounds 3 and later or inking previously unsigned FA a la Tanev, Bieksa, Garrison, Edler, etc.
Better still to maintain a decent team that homeboys will flock to once they become UFAs and have years of experience behind them, with other teams having to suffer with their teething problems.

Concerning the purely defensive aspect of the game, D men are best in their late 20s to early 30s. Goal scoring on the other hand is a young man's art. The Sedins were an aberration.

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03-31-2013, 08:05 PM
  #967
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I appreciate you bringing something new to this thread, but what is the point of bringing something up then not providing any substance?

It's the Internet dude.

Yes i know but i prefer to stay low profile !

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03-31-2013, 08:05 PM
  #968
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I want to see offensive players. I'm OK with a PP dman in the second, that is still an offensive boost. For forwards I'd like to offensive centre first, then offensive winger if no centre available, then if neither of those 2-way centre.

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03-31-2013, 08:09 PM
  #969
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Yes i know but i prefer to stay low profile !
Do you really think you've uncovered some gem that nobody else knows about? And scouts will see it on HFBoards and flock to draft the guy?

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04-01-2013, 05:23 AM
  #970
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There's nothing wrong with drafting a d-man in the first 2 rounds.
D-men can take 5+ years before becoming NHL ready, so by that time Hamhuis, Bieksa, and Garrison could be gone.

To add to this, it is case by case specific. In this draft for instance, if Hagg is there when we pick, barring any other great fallers, I would take him. My opinion of his has gone up after recent viewings.

After seeing a good cross-section of most prospective 1st rounders now, I've got a better idea now of how the draft should unfold. Lazar won't make it to 20+. Horvat might be late teens/high 20s. Domi should be gone by the early 20s. Klimchuk, De La Rose, Rychel, etc... should be there. There will be a good selection available.

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04-01-2013, 08:39 AM
  #971
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I'm so sick of not having skilled forward prospects to look forward to watching. I have no desire for the Canucks to follow the Nashville plan, way too boring. Lets have a bounty of scoring for a change. If they don't pick a forward the D man better be a star.

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04-01-2013, 01:44 PM
  #972
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I like getting them in rounds 3 and later or inking previously unsigned FA a la Tanev, Bieksa, Garrison, Edler, etc. Better still to maintain a decent team that homeboys will flock to once they become UFAs and have years of experience behind them, with other teams having to suffer with their teething problems.

Concerning the purely defensive aspect of the game, D men are best in their late 20s to early 30s. Goal scoring on the other hand is a young man's art. The Sedins were an aberration.

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This really isn't confusing.

Presently 4 of our top 5 D men were something other than 1st or 2nd rounders. Going back we had Ehrhoff, Salo and Mitchell drafted by others in the 4th, 9th and 8th respectively. Point being you can happily construct a competitive D corps not utilizing any early picks. Try doing the reverse--ice a contending team with top 6 forwards made up of just one 1st or 2nd rounder or none at all. Unless you’re Detroit and coasting on the laurels of miracle Swedish and Russian picks it can’t be done.

Admittedly, the 2nd round is something of a sweet spot for getting good D men, so normally I don’t mind it, but we need drastic measures now to stave off that Nashville territory for wretched forward production.

About that other paragraph: Sedins becoming PPG at 25, nearly doubling their production from earlier, and taking another leap at 30 and getting Art Ross is very odd. Doug Gilmour is the only rough comparison that comes to mind. Point here is that goal scoring peaks at 25-26 and teams know what they have in a player before that and won’t part with the good ones.

D men enter the league later, take longer to develop (defensively, since it is all about experience) and good ones can be had as FAs or teams just giving up on them, and they can actually maintain their level of play. Conversely, getting high end forwards via FA is a bad bet moneypuck wise since their production won’t stay the same, let along show improvement, for contract duration.

Minny will be a good example of this in years to come. Parise, whatever his current heroics, won’t maintain his effectiveness nearly as long as Suter. Lesson for us? When Sedins call it quits pray that MG doesn’t park that 12 million on some forward(s) has been(s). Recall the names out there that could have been Nucks if Sedins hadn't re signed 5 years ago. Catastrophic.


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04-01-2013, 01:55 PM
  #973
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This really isn't confusing.

Presently 4 of our top 5 D men were something other than 1st or 2nd rounders. Going back we had Ehrhoff, Salo and Mitchell drafted by others in the 4th, 9th and 8th respectively. Point being you can happily construct a competitive D corps not utilizing any early picks. Try doing the reverse--ice a contending team with top 6 forwards made up of just one 1st or 2nd rounder or none at all. Unless youíre Detroit and coasting on the laurels of miracle Swedish and Russian picks it canít be done.

Admittedly, the 2nd round is something of a sweet spot for getting good D men, so normally I donít mind it, but we need drastic measures now to stave off that Nashville territory for wretched forward production.
You'll have to excuse my reading comprehension, I first read that as you claiming all those d-men were undrafted free agents.

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Old
04-02-2013, 10:32 AM
  #974
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Do you really think you've uncovered some gem that nobody else knows about? And scouts will see it on HFBoards and flock to draft the guy?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cBDikiR5qVs

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Old
04-02-2013, 05:56 PM
  #975
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3:45 second of him playing ok positional hockey and dumping the puck in? Is there something I was missing here, he got beat and hook/held a lot of his assignments

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