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When will this lockout end? (all lockout talk here)

View Poll Results: When will the lockout end?
Sometime between Oct-nov 49 18.08%
Sometime between Dec-jan 90 33.21%
Season canceled 132 48.71%
Voters: 271. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
10-22-2012, 10:22 PM
  #551
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Originally Posted by worraps View Post
Jaromir Jagr the most rational NHL player of the bunch. Who would have thought it?
It's completely logical that he'd be one of the few to understand business. This is a guy who's been criticized for skipping out on practices to watch the stock ticker on CNBC.

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10-23-2012, 12:09 AM
  #552
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I want to see the two sides meet again before thursday and try to work this out i really do still think there is a deal to be made
Frankly I'll be pretty pissed if they don't

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10-23-2012, 02:02 PM
  #553
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Hypothetically speaking, Daryl Sutter is GM still. Would he be able to talk to his nephews/son?

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10-23-2012, 03:01 PM
  #554
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I hope the league does itself a favor and has the next CBA expire June 30th so the players won't have to be upset at the thought of a rollback on a contract they just signed. (Rightfully so I might add).

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10-23-2012, 03:03 PM
  #555
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I hope the league does itself a favor and has the next CBA expire June 30th so the players won't have to be upset at the thought of a rollback on a contract they just signed. (Rightfully so I might add).
Curious why they don't do that. Always thought it was stupid to negotiate a contract especially when you don't know what the CBA is going to hold in a few months.

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10-23-2012, 03:05 PM
  #556
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Originally Posted by joestevens29 View Post
Hypothetically speaking, Daryl Sutter is GM still. Would he be able to talk to his nephews/son?
Of course. Just not about the CBA.

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10-23-2012, 03:10 PM
  #557
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Curious why they don't do that. Always thought it was stupid to negotiate a contract especially when you don't know what the CBA is going to hold in a few months.
I thought it was quite odd of the players as well. There seemed to be a lot of signings right up until the lock out as well. I thought they would have waited just in case there was a roll back.

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10-23-2012, 03:18 PM
  #558
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I thought it was quite odd of the players as well. There seemed to be a lot of signings right up until the lock out as well. I thought they would have waited just in case there was a roll back.
I don't know who thought what, but I'm getting the impression that the players must've been told something about the union fighting long and hard against rollbacks.

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10-23-2012, 03:38 PM
  #559
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Originally Posted by OilDrop37 View Post
I hope the league does itself a favor and has the next CBA expire June 30th so the players won't have to be upset at the thought of a rollback on a contract they just signed. (Rightfully so I might add).
This makes way too much sense. I can't think of reasons not to do this.

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10-23-2012, 03:40 PM
  #560
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This makes way too much sense. I can't think of reasons not to do this.
Probably something based on money is my guess. If it's July 1st you can sell it to people a lot easier than what you would have if free agency was tomorrow and training camp was in 2 days.

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10-23-2012, 04:25 PM
  #561
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This makes way too much sense. I can't think of reasons not to do this.
Because it makes too much sense?

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10-23-2012, 04:51 PM
  #562
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It does make sense.

But the players had months warning that the NHL was going after salary rollbacks, the media was speculating on that type of stuff as early as Jan/Feb.

The players knew full well what was coming, as another widely speculated thing that the NHL would go after was longterm, front loaded contracts - something the free agents this past offseason were scrambling to get. NHL owners were happy to hand them out as they knew there was a chance they could pay out less in a rollback, and the players were happy to sign them since they knew it was their last shot at cap-circumvention type deals and of the NHLPA's plan to protect existing contracts at all costs.

And the obvious result - An immediate reduction vs contract preservation stalemate.

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10-24-2012, 08:02 PM
  #563
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It sounds to me like the NHL only wants to meet to discuss the proposal they made the NHL also insists that an 82 game schedule can only happened if a deal is done by tomorrow which is obviously not happening however the nhlpa thinks that there may be a week of flexibility there it's disappointing how negotiations have stalled like this after it seemed like they moved closer to achieving a deal last week

At this point hopes for an 82 game season are dead and negotiations have reach a stalemate

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10-24-2012, 08:48 PM
  #564
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Owners have never been worried about an 82 game season. If anything, that was a "good faith" gesture to entice the players into getting all of their pay checks.

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10-24-2012, 09:33 PM
  #565
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oilbleeder View Post
@TEAM1040: RT @louisjean_tva: #NHL GM's'were afforded a 48 hour window this weekend to discuss league proposal with players. (1/2)

@TEAM1040: RT @louisjean_tva: Bill Daly says : "Permitted to answer player questions about the proposal we tabled last week"


At what point do we start talking about cancelling a full season? I'm guessing February correct?
The talking heads will tell you a lot of things, the GMS will say a lot of things and the NHLPA will mumble a few things.

IF there is no deal by midnight and Jan1st--there will be no season. There will be alot of Dominoes that start to fall if there is no CBA in place by then, with arenas, player contracts, and lots of business side details that with no deal in place as of Jan 1st teams start taking hits. Most of larger contracts had clauses in them covering a lost season--that says a lot right there, but a lot of smaller contracts do not have that clause and I know a few arenas that teams do not own will have the right to sell NHL dates unless the NHL team that uses that arena pays for the losses the arenas are suffering. I was watching bloomberg business last week on line and it briefly covered the nhl because so many of the arenas belong to companies that trade on the stock market and they mentioned that after the first of the new some of the arenas will be released to sell dates to concert promoters and other events--unless the NHL and the team involves pays the full arena costs and this includes off ice costs as well.

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10-24-2012, 09:33 PM
  #566
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I am flabbergasted by these childish behaviors on both sides.

This lockout is literally driving me nuts. I might have to check into a mental hospital if this continues any longer.

Still, back of my head, I still believe there will be a season, albeit an abbreviated one starting in mid-December.

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10-24-2012, 09:35 PM
  #567
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Owners have never been worried about an 82 game season. If anything, that was a "good faith" gesture to entice the players into getting all of their pay checks.
If my math was correct and I think it was. We needed a CBA in place my october 20th at the latest to get a full 82 game season in. Depending on who you talk to it will either take 2 or 4 weeks for the NHL to get back up and running once the CBA is in place

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10-24-2012, 09:48 PM
  #568
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Well. I think it is safe to say that the league takes the back-pay they have generously offered, for games missed, off the table, after the deadline tomorrow. That is what? Roughly 20 out of 185 days of salary. About the same amount they will lose over bickering between 57% and 50%.

Correct me if I am wrong, but the NHL make whole provision is for the 12/13 and 13/14 season. Why any player with a contract less than two years would turn this down is mind-boggling.

If we take the NHL's projected growth rate of 5% a year, and the proposed salary cap for 12/13 at $60 million, the players are back up to their coveted $70 million cap in 3 seasons.

The cut in salary for players with less than two years on their contract left is minimal. Why run the risk of making the pain worse?

The players position no longer seems sensible from a risk management perspective. All this talk about limited earnings potential because of a short career, and yet they seem completely willing to throw away a season. It just blows my mind.

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10-24-2012, 11:33 PM
  #569
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Originally Posted by jumptheshark View Post
If my math was correct and I think it was. We needed a CBA in place my october 20th at the latest to get a full 82 game season in. Depending on who you talk to it will either take 2 or 4 weeks for the NHL to get back up and running once the CBA is in place
Your math and information is incorrect - GB stated that in order to achieve the November 2 based on an agreement prior to October 25 there would only be a one week training camp followed by a compressed schedule to allow the 82 games.

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10-24-2012, 11:41 PM
  #570
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On behalf of paying fans I would vomit if they still tried to cram 82 games into a schedule shortened by well over a month in what is normally a 6mth schedule.

Lets not insult the paying fan here. 82 games crammed into less than 5mths would offer a deplorable level of play, maybe 1 game in a handful where both clubs actually simultaneously showed up, and a plethora of virtually unwatchable contests by players not in condition, that started a season without an adequate TC and with no preseason and no physical or mental preparation.
With resultant injuries being a virtual guarantee.

But as per usual the paying fan would be expected to pay full fare for this veritable smorgasboard of nightly going through the motions.

Unbelievable contempt the NHL and NHLPA have for its fans if they ever agreed to an announcement on an 82 game at this point.

The earliest possible start time would be mid November.

What? Would they play every night until Xmas. Doubleheaders?

Ever think you're being conned?


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10-24-2012, 11:43 PM
  #571
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Originally Posted by Lobotomizer View Post
Your math and information is incorrect - GB stated that in order to achieve the November 2 based on an agreement prior to October 25 there would only be a one week training camp followed by a compressed schedule to allow the 82 games.
The same GB previously stated it would take at least 2 weeks to get everything organized, players back with their clubs and complete a 1week TC. To suggest that they could do all that in one week is ambitious to say the least.

How about fictitious.

Schedules in every rink in the league need to be revamped and not all that easy considering multiple bookings would already complicate any rescheduling effort and also accomodating the preffered days of the week that many markets have for home dates.

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10-24-2012, 11:56 PM
  #572
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Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
The same GB previously stated it would take at least 2 weeks to get everything organized, players back with their clubs and complete a 1week TC. To suggest that they could do all that in one week is ambitious to say the least.

How about fictitious.

Schedules in every rink in the league need to be revamped and not all that easy considering multiple bookings would already complicate any rescheduling effort and also accomodating the preffered days of the week that many markets have for home dates.
Your right...the NHL has done nothing to prepare for the possibility of a compressed schedule. The owners just sit around twiddling their thumbs waiting for someone to tell them the lockout is over..."We needed to figure out how to accomodate changes in dates? No one told us that as owners we needed to be proactive in the process of rescheduling new dates. Dammit, GB, you screwed us".

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10-25-2012, 12:08 AM
  #573
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Originally Posted by Lobotomizer View Post
Your right...the NHL has done nothing to prepare for the possibility of a compressed schedule. The owners just sit around twiddling their thumbs waiting for someone to tell them the lockout is over..."We needed to figure out how to accomodate changes in dates? No one told us that as owners we needed to be proactive in the process of rescheduling new dates. Dammit, GB, you screwed us".
The NHL petitioned it's teams for any open dates at their local arenas prior to it's proposal. As crews are accustomed to flooding a rink, pulling it down for a concert, and then flooding a rink again over the course of two days, I'd say it's probably not impossible to put that aspect together.

As for getting their players back, the second they signed a deal all of the players playing elsewhere would be immediately expected to leave their teams and fly back. It'd take a few days at the most. This is a league where a player can be traded and play for his new team within hours of being dealt.

Also, the notion that a compressed schedule wouldn't work is a being fed by some misinformation. The compressed schedule as proposed by the NHL would see the season extended to the end of April, and one game added every 5 weeks. It wouldn't quantifiably damage the quality of play, save for more potential for injury for those who haven't played or practiced in the last couple months - which is something that's unavoidable without a three week training camp/preseason.

I mean, we're obviously past the point where an 82 game schedule is going to occur, but I don't see much reason to doubt the feasibility of the owners original plan.

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10-25-2012, 12:08 AM
  #574
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Originally Posted by Lobotomizer View Post
Your right...the NHL has done nothing to prepare for the possibility of a compressed schedule. The owners just sit around twiddling their thumbs waiting for someone to tell them the lockout is over..."We needed to figure out how to accomodate changes in dates? No one told us that as owners we needed to be proactive in the process of rescheduling new dates. Dammit, GB, you screwed us".
Theres no chance in hell most arenas would say no to scheduling other dates to fill empty slots at this point. The only dates placemarked would be the formerly agreed dates. Why on Earth would most arenas hold extra dates free on the offchance that theres an NHL season?

The likelihood is the NHL can't even talk about rescheduling unless the labor impasse is officially over.

My concern isn't with the NHL "Twiddling around" its the avarice to still expect a full meal 82 game schedule.

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10-25-2012, 12:14 AM
  #575
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The NHL petitioned it's teams for any open dates at their local arenas prior to it's proposal. As crews are accustomed to flooding a rink, pulling it down for a concert, and then flooding a rink again over the course of two days, I'd say it's probably not impossible to put that aspect together.

As for getting their players back, the second they signed a deal all of the players playing elsewhere would be immediately expected to leave their teams and fly back. It'd take a few days at the most. This is a league where a player can be traded and play for his new team within hours of being dealt.

Also, the notion that a compressed schedule wouldn't work is a being fed by some misinformation. The compressed schedule as proposed by the NHL would see the season extended to the end of April, and one game added every 5 weeks. It wouldn't quantifiably damage the quality of play, save for more potential for injury for those who haven't played or practiced in the last couple months - which is no less avoidable by a ~60 game season.

I mean, we're obviously past the point where an 82 game schedule is going to occur, but I don't see much reason to doubt the feasibility of the owners original plan.
No preseason, no prep, a pretend TC which basically consists of physicals, some conditioning training, then throwing some pucks around for a few practices is not going to result in the same level of play.

Plus starting the Playoffs in May is a complete ****ing joke in Canada. I think I might be enjoying the sun outside instead sitting around watching game every night. What do they expect to play to July?

Stanley Cup game seven on Canada Day? This is a joke right?

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