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Burnside: why aren't owners standing up for their fans?

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Old
10-11-2012, 11:20 AM
  #1
LadyStanley
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Burnside: why aren't owners standing up for their fans?

http://espn.go.com/nhl/story/_/id/84...ns-their-teams

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Has it always been thus or is this ignorance of public sentiment buzzing around the owners' ears like an annoying gnat something particular to this current lockout, the third of commissioner Gary Bettman's tenure?

What is strange about the owners acting the part of the Peanuts gang is that it belies the humanity of the men and women who actually own these teams.
...
In general, fans and, for the most part, the media, remain perplexed as to how two sides with so much at stake and with so much going for them could allow this [lockout, silence] to happen.

Certainly the players are not immune from blame in this dispute. They received too much of a share of league revenues -- 57 percent -- last time, and need to move closer to a 50-50 split. Although the owners have at least moved off their opening position, no matter how odious it was to the players, the players have been reluctant to take a leadership role in getting a deal done. As the first games of the regular season were going by the boards, deputy commissioner Bill Daly was beseeching the players to come up with another proposal in the hopes of moving the process forward.

Still, the relationship between fans and players will always be different than the relationship between fans and owners. Players are more transient but owners and fans are like neighbors who have to get along if the relationship is going to flourish.

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10-11-2012, 11:37 AM
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middletoe
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What is the incentive for owners to stand up for their fans?

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10-11-2012, 11:37 AM
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Qurpiz
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To the owners, fans are just customers, not someone they need to take care of

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10-11-2012, 11:39 AM
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CerebralGenesis
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Why are owners expected to take care of the fan? It implies they think something bad will happen from their current course of action.

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10-11-2012, 11:45 AM
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pepty
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The owners are standing up for their fans.

They are tyring to get a CBA agreement that will keep the team in thier city long term and allow them to compete,.

.

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10-11-2012, 11:46 AM
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Julius Caesar Milan
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The owners think at this point that they can lockout the players whenever they want and fans will just keep coming back.
It is time for a fan strike

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10-11-2012, 11:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Qurpiz View Post
To the owners, fans are just customers, not someone they need to take care of
Ridiculous comment, the owners make their money off the fans, pissing them off is counterproductive, if you want to be accurate the players aren't doing anything for the fans, they get 57% of the revenue as is without assuming any financial risk, whereas the owners put up hundreds of millions of dollars in the pursuit of profit.

I honestly believe it should be 50/50

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10-11-2012, 12:02 PM
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Turbofan
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Mark Chipman and David Thomson can do no wrong by me. They managed to get hockey back in Winnipeg after a lot of hard work and financial risk to themselves. I'm on the owner's side on this.

This is all unfortunate...but after all is done, if the owners 'win' and making money from owning a NHL franchise becomes less of a coin-toss, that means it will be more likely Winnipeg and other small markets will retain their teams, or flourish. Heck bring on Hamilton and Quebec City.

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10-11-2012, 12:09 PM
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As far as the owners are concerned the players are cattle and the fans are sheep.

Little Bo Bettman said it himself... once the lockout is over he expects all of us to flock back to the game.

BAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!

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10-11-2012, 12:15 PM
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The owners care more about taking an excessive amount of money from that fans pockets. The NHL's ridiculous ticket prices are evidence of that.

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10-11-2012, 12:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Hell Zeon View Post
The owners care more about taking an excessive amount of money from that fans pockets. The NHL's ridiculous ticket prices are evidence of that.
It sucks but the NHL is a gate-revenue driven league. With the way salaries and costs are now if the ticket prices were lower 25 out of 30 teams would probably be posting negative operating incomes, instead of 18-ish out of 30.

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10-11-2012, 12:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hell Zeon View Post
The owners care more about taking an excessive amount of money from that fans pockets. The NHL's ridiculous ticket prices are evidence of that.
So anything you personally don't feel like paying is 'ridiculous'?

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10-11-2012, 12:32 PM
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middletoe
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Originally Posted by Wings View Post
It sucks but the NHL is a gate-revenue driven league. With the way salaries and costs are now if the ticket prices were lower 25 out of 30 teams would probably be posting negative operating incomes, instead of 18-ish out of 30.
Are you taking into account that cheaper tickets would mean lower salaries since they are linked?

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10-11-2012, 12:39 PM
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Originally Posted by middletoe View Post
Are you taking into account that cheaper tickets would mean lower salaries since they are linked?
That's what I was sort of getting at, yes. Tickets are high because costs are high. Reduce costs of operating the team (the largest being player salaries) then perhaps ticket prices would at least settle down.

Some people think that owners, because of their fabulous wealth, are being 'greedy' by possibly wanting to make a profit or at the very least, not lose money, by owning a hockey team.

I think that's rubbish. Their overall wealth shouldn't be concern here. Most of these guys are billionaires, but not because they own a hockey team. They are billionaires in spite of it.

Here in Winnipeg we pay an average of $82 per Jets game. That is big money. We grind our teeth about, but most of us understand why. We willingly pay it because we are NHL starved and wanted a team back. But we also know that running an NHL franchise is damn expensive, and no one wants to own and operate a team unless there is a reasonable chance of profit. And in this small market, that's where the price points landed after all the number crunching was done. Billionaire or no, we can't expect these guys to run a team for us fans for free, or at an operating loss of millions per year, for the long-term.

Looking way back at when we lost the Jets in 96, I was anti-owner back then, but now I can see how it was inevitable.

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10-11-2012, 12:42 PM
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Clearly, neither side cares about the fans, only money. Let alone the workers who rely on this sport for a living. Those are the people I'm concerned about. I can live without hockey.

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10-11-2012, 12:45 PM
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What exactly do you want the owners to say that hasn't been said already? The owners are doing the smart thing and keeping their mouths shut. Even if they were to say something, it doesn't matter what they say, as soon as they speak a single word, fans and media will jump all over them like they have with the PA. The owners recognize this and have wisely chosen to keep their mouths shut. I have no problem with this.

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10-11-2012, 12:48 PM
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Clearly, neither side cares about the fans, only money. Let alone the workers who rely on this sport for a living. Those are the people I'm concerned about. I can live without hockey.
The fans have no voice now. But as soon as play resumes, our voice will be the only one that matters. I just hope fans don't flock back to the game like they did last time. Voting with our wallets will finally allow our voice to be heard.

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10-11-2012, 12:53 PM
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All these pro-owner posters are going to be here swallowing the owners' BS 7 years from now when the owners cry that they need the players to accept 33 percent revenues if they're going to keep their team in Kansas and Houston
And the pro-player posters have to come up with better reasons to hate the owners just out of spite, because they are 'the employer', or 'rich and greedy' or 'the man' or whatever.

There are compelling reasons why, as a fan, I would want to see the owners win this battle. Because I think it makes for a more stable and healthy league. Because it increases the chances that my franchise will stay in my city. There are no reasons as compelling for me to want to players to win. I'd like to hear yours? How an NHLPA victory makes this a better league for the fans long-term, because I can't think of a single one.

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10-11-2012, 12:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hell Zeon View Post
The owners care more about taking an excessive amount of money from that fans pockets. The NHL's ridiculous ticket prices are evidence of that.
Teams charge what fans will pay. You can thank Stubhub and Ticketexchange for that. By having a record of second market prices teams in all sports know what the most fans will pay for tickets. Why pay a scalper tons of money when the team is willing to cut out the middle man?

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10-11-2012, 01:03 PM
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middletoe
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wings View Post
That's what I was sort of getting at, yes. Tickets are high because costs are high. Reduce costs of operating the team (the largest being player salaries) then perhaps ticket prices would at least settle down.

Some people think that owners, because of their fabulous wealth, are being 'greedy' by possibly wanting to make a profit or at the very least, not lose money, by owning a hockey team.

I think that's rubbish. Their overall wealth shouldn't be concern here. Most of these guys are billionaires, but not because they own a hockey team. They are billionaires in spite of it.

Here in Winnipeg we pay an average of $82 per Jets game. That is big money. We grind our teeth about, but most of us understand why. We willingly pay it because we are NHL starved and wanted a team back. But we also know that running an NHL franchise is damn expensive, and no one wants to own and operate a team unless there is a reasonable chance of profit. And in this small market, that's where the price points landed after all the number crunching was done. Billionaire or no, we can't expect these guys to run a team for us fans for free, or at an operating loss of millions per year, for the long-term.

Looking way back at when we lost the Jets in 96, I was anti-owner back then, but now I can see how it was inevitable.
I don't disagree with your logic here. The only problem I have with this is that I have to assume the owners and Bettman are being truthful, as well as being fully forthcoming (not sure of the right words here) with their claims. Given their history, even recent history, I just can't do that without feeling foolish.

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10-11-2012, 01:04 PM
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TheDoctor10
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The obvious 'the owners have a gag order imposed by Bettman' has not been brought up. Also, the owners trust Gary. Read "The Instigator". He's earned it.

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10-11-2012, 01:11 PM
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middletoe
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wings View Post
And the pro-player posters have to come up with better reasons to hate the owners just out of spite, because they are 'the employer', or 'rich and greedy' or 'the man' or whatever.

There are compelling reasons why, as a fan, I would want to see the owners win this battle. Because I think it makes for a more stable and healthy league. Because it increases the chances that my franchise will stay in my city. There are no reasons as compelling for me to want to players to win. I'd like to hear yours? How an NHLPA victory makes this a better league for the fans long-term, because I can't think of a single one.
When you say a stable and healthy league are you talking about both the finances and on ice product, or just the finances? Cuz, if you're talking about both, I'm gonna ask you if you saw the second half of last season.

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10-11-2012, 01:15 PM
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Originally Posted by middletoe View Post
When you say a stable and healthy league are you talking about both the finances and on ice product, or just the finances? Cuz, if you're talking about both, I'm gonna ask you if you saw the second half of last season.
A CBA has NOTHING to do with the on-ice product.

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10-11-2012, 01:18 PM
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You won't get it; just more about how much at-will employees who are treated better (even excluding salaries) than 99.99% of the workforce in North America DESERVE more.
It's frustrating because I have yet to hear a really good reason why the players should be making more than the owners. They are paid VERY well for what they do.

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Old
10-11-2012, 01:19 PM
  #25
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Someone please correct me if I'm wrong but aren't the owners not standing up for the fans because Bettman has put a gag order on them and they will be fined for talking about the lockout. I know that happened to Jim Devellano for his negative comments about the players, however would an owner be fined for standing up for the fans?

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