HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > General Hockey Discussion > The History of Hockey
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
The History of Hockey Relive great moments in hockey history and discuss how the game has changed over time.

Penguins and Oilers: Oilers comeback on NHL.COM!!!

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
02-01-2005, 01:15 AM
  #1
soulok*
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 188
vCash: 500
Penguins and Oilers: Oilers comeback on NHL.COM!!!

I was actually getting scared that the PENGUINS of all teams would knock of the 84 Oilers in a series. How the ******* do these guys run in their simulation. How the ******* would the 93 Penguins actually win a real series against the 84 Oilers. The 93 pens were good. but CMON!!!! NHL.com need to make their simulations run with a little more authenticity. 93 Penguins in the finals of Greatest team of all time competition??? thats pathetic. Forget the upsets. Not only that people are actually voting Penguins? LOL must be a lot of penguin fans that surf NHL.com. www.PittsburghPenguins.com actually has a part of there site dedicated to this matter. NO wonder! I could understand the Islanders giving the Oilers all they can handle or maybe even the Boston Bruins of the early 70's but the Penguins??? they actually have a chance to win the series. I urge you HF Members go and vote for the Oilers because if they lose to the Penguins then my grandma must be 30 ... i must be a world class mathmatician and NHL.COM REALLY IS PITTSBURGHPENGUINS.COM

soulok* is offline  
Old
02-01-2005, 01:32 AM
  #2
Grave77digger
Registered User
 
Grave77digger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 2,559
vCash: 500
Dont be a hater, the 93 Penguins where a better team than the one that won back to back cups. Not to mention the were coached by Scotty Bowman.

Quote:
Mario Lemieux scored 160 points in 60 games -- an average of 2.6 points per game. Kevin Stevens, Rick Tocchet and Ron Francis all scored 100 points or more and Jaromir Jagr ended with 94.
No one in there right mind can deny the offensive power of the Penguins.


Last edited by Grave77digger: 02-01-2005 at 01:39 AM.
Grave77digger is offline  
Old
02-01-2005, 01:39 AM
  #3
Hockey Outsider
Registered User
 
Hockey Outsider's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,388
vCash: 500
I believe the NHL uses www.whatifsports.com to simulate their games, so neither the NHL nors it fans have any say in the results.

The '84 Oilers and and '93 Pens were both great teams and in a seven game series, upsets can happen. Bill James has a formula for predicting a matchup between two teams based on their win percentages. Using some basic statistics we can see how the two teams are expected to perform over a seven-game series.

Probability of '84 Oilers winning a 7 game series: 59.6%
Probability of '93 Penguins winning a 7 game series: 40.4%

Oilers in 4: 8.8%
Oilers in 5: 16.0%
Oilers in 6: 18.2%
Oilers in 7: 16.6%
Pens in 7: 13.9%
Pens in 6: 12.8%
Pens in 5: 9.4%
Pens in 4: 4.3%

So the Oilers were a better team, no question, but seeing the Pens win wouldn't be all that surpring. 40% is quite a large chance of an upset, as far as sports goes.

Hockey Outsider is offline  
Old
02-01-2005, 01:55 AM
  #4
mudcrutch79
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: The Big Smoke
Posts: 3,903
vCash: 500
Two comments. One, the James method isn't applicable when comparing teams from different seasons. Two, Gretzky has yet to see a minute of PP time in this series. Anyone else think that whatifsports.com is a joke?

mudcrutch79 is offline  
Old
02-01-2005, 04:05 AM
  #5
clefty
What?
 
clefty's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Country: Fujairah
Posts: 15,394
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by soulok
I was actually getting scared that the PENGUINS of all teams would knock of the 84 Oilers in a series. How the ******* do these guys run in their simulation. How the ******* would the 93 Penguins actually win a real series against the 84 Oilers. The 93 pens were good. but CMON!!!! NHL.com need to make their simulations run with a little more authenticity. 93 Penguins in the finals of Greatest team of all time competition??? thats pathetic. Forget the upsets. Not only that people are actually voting Penguins? LOL must be a lot of penguin fans that surf NHL.com. www.PittsburghPenguins.com actually has a part of there site dedicated to this matter. NO wonder! I could understand the Islanders giving the Oilers all they can handle or maybe even the Boston Bruins of the early 70's but the Penguins??? they actually have a chance to win the series. I urge you HF Members go and vote for the Oilers because if they lose to the Penguins then my grandma must be 30 ... i must be a world class mathmatician and NHL.COM REALLY IS PITTSBURGHPENGUINS.COM
No need to bash the Penguins team or their website just because of a simulator. The '92-'93 Penguins were an awesome, awesome team.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mudcrutch79
Two comments. One, the James method isn't applicable when comparing teams from different seasons. Two, Gretzky has yet to see a minute of PP time in this series. Anyone else think that whatifsports.com is a joke?
You know, its just for fun. Don't take it so seriously.

clefty is offline  
Old
02-01-2005, 04:57 AM
  #6
soulok*
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 188
vCash: 500
Thats true upsets do happen.The Oilers are obviously the superior team But this is for the Greatest Team. 93 Penguins id say crack the top 10 but not the top 2. Thats just wrong.

I aint hating. You can't deny the offensive power of the Penguins. Penguins are good i said it in my above statement so by calling me a hater doesnt make any sense. Don't get me started in an all out offensive game the 93 Penguins. As good as they were they wouldnt be able to outgun the 84 Oilers. A primed Gretzky...Messier?..Coffey?...Kurri? .. Anderson?? Tikkanen? the list goes on .. superior offensive firepower belonged to the Oilers.

soulok* is offline  
Old
02-01-2005, 06:03 AM
  #7
Boilers*
 
Boilers*'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 5,165
vCash: 500
Gretzky only on the ice for 24 min heh, pretty far fetched.

Boilers* is offline  
Old
02-01-2005, 07:05 AM
  #8
Classic Devil
Global Moderator
Spirit of 1988
 
Classic Devil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Columbus, Ohio
Country: United States
Posts: 33,765
vCash: 500
Awards:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bloodsport
Gretzky only on the ice for 24 min heh, pretty far fetched.
The 00' Devils lost their series because Krzysztof Oliwa got powerplay time.

Classic Devil is offline  
Old
02-01-2005, 08:10 AM
  #9
Chili
Registered User
 
Chili's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: la Belle Province
Country: Antarctica
Posts: 1,954
vCash: 500
The 93 Pens won 17 games in a row (and tied their last game) going into the playoffs. The win streak is the all time record. Think of all the dynasties over the years but that Pens team holds that record. They may have peaked a little early though and lost to the Isles in a huge upset but they were still a heckuva team.

Chili is offline  
Old
02-01-2005, 08:48 PM
  #10
Egghammer
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: London, ON
Country: Canada
Posts: 218
vCash: 500
Using What If Sports, I'm running a simulated pool. There are 30 owners for each franchise. Each owner gave me the year they wanted to use for that franchise and I simluate the games on the day that the NHL season should be playing. I update the scoring leaders and goalie leaders every couple of weeks and have links to all the boxscores, pretty interesting, their are some surprises (Wild and Ducks doing really well), some people picked the wrong year but for the most part it's great checking the box scores every day

Egghammer is offline  
Old
02-01-2005, 09:18 PM
  #11
Luigi Lemieux
Registered User
 
Luigi Lemieux's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Country: United States
Posts: 13,228
vCash: 500
even though they didn't win the cup that year, the '93 pens could hold their own against any hockey team, ever.

Luigi Lemieux is offline  
Old
02-01-2005, 09:29 PM
  #12
soulok*
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 188
vCash: 500
this is not about they can hold their own. its about 71% voting pittsburgh and 28% edmonton??? WTF? are these guys on crack? thats too much of a voting discrepency to think this series is not fixed. the Penguins in 93 were obviously a great team. But 84 Oilers were better. Thats just the plain facts.

soulok* is offline  
Old
02-01-2005, 09:34 PM
  #13
se7en*
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Edmonton
Posts: 3,737
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by soulok
this is not about they can hold their own. its about 71% voting pittsburgh and 28% edmonton??? WTF? are these guys on crack? thats too much of a voting discrepency to think this series is not fixed. the Penguins in 93 were obviously a great team. But 84 Oilers were better. Thats just the plain facts.
I think this is a case of a Pens fan spending hours and hours voting. Worry not. Flames fans tried to hijack the poll too, but the Oilers still won. The voting has no bearing on the actual results.

se7en* is offline  
Old
02-01-2005, 09:48 PM
  #14
BlindWillyMcHurt
Registered User
 
BlindWillyMcHurt's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 7,835
vCash: 500
Heh. I think a few people may be taking this a weee bit too seriously.

BlindWillyMcHurt is offline  
Old
02-01-2005, 09:59 PM
  #15
Verbal Kint*
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: The Bunny Vatican
Country: Canada
Posts: 20,132
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by BlindWillyMcHurt
Heh. I think a few people may be taking this a weee bit too seriously.
You don't say...

Verbal Kint* is offline  
Old
02-01-2005, 10:01 PM
  #16
BlindWillyMcHurt
Registered User
 
BlindWillyMcHurt's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 7,835
vCash: 500
Yeah, I know I'm going out on a limb, but I'll stand by my statement.

BlindWillyMcHurt is offline  
Old
02-01-2005, 10:35 PM
  #17
Luigi Lemieux
Registered User
 
Luigi Lemieux's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Country: United States
Posts: 13,228
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by soulok
this is not about they can hold their own. its about 71% voting pittsburgh and 28% edmonton??? WTF? are these guys on crack? thats too much of a voting discrepency to think this series is not fixed. the Penguins in 93 were obviously a great team. But 84 Oilers were better. Thats just the plain facts.
i think that's just because most internet going hockey fans tend to be younger, and probably remember the '93 pens much better and probably haven't even seen the '84 oilers play.

Luigi Lemieux is offline  
Old
02-01-2005, 10:39 PM
  #18
reckoning
Registered User
 
reckoning's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Country: Canada
Posts: 5,392
vCash: 500
It`s ironic that Pittsburgh`s two best teams(`93 and`96) didn`t win the Cup.Especially `93,they won 56 games that year,and were getting better towards the end of the season.I don`t know why they lost that year,it could`ve been overconfidence after breezing through the first round,plus Barrasso totally stunk in the Islander series.Sad part is,that year would`ve been the best chance to see Lemieux vs. Gretzky in the Stanley Cup Final.

reckoning is offline  
Old
02-01-2005, 10:43 PM
  #19
Luigi Lemieux
Registered User
 
Luigi Lemieux's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Country: United States
Posts: 13,228
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by reckoning
It`s ironic that Pittsburgh`s two best teams(`93 and`96) didn`t win the Cup.Especially `93,they won 56 games that year,and were getting better towards the end of the season.I don`t know why they lost that year,it could`ve been overconfidence after breezing through the first round,plus Barrasso totally stunk in the Islander series.Sad part is,that year would`ve been the best chance to see Lemieux vs. Gretzky in the Stanley Cup Final.
the '96 team probably had the best powerplay, but was still well behind the '91 and '92 teams. it was a disappointing loss to the panthers, but i dont think that pens team could beat the avs that year anyway. it would have been really entertaining and a lot close than the panthers/avs series, but the pens probably would have lost in 6 or 7 anyway. a look at that team's defense and you know they were pretenders, not contenders.

Luigi Lemieux is offline  
Old
02-01-2005, 10:58 PM
  #20
clefty
What?
 
clefty's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Country: Fujairah
Posts: 15,394
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hootchie Cootchie
I think this is a case of a Pens fan spending hours and hours voting. Worry not. Flames fans tried to hijack the poll too, but the Oilers still won. The voting has no bearing on the actual results.
That poll has been running since the beginning of this series, and at one point the Penguins were up 3-1. Obviously a lot of people saw the Penguins one game from winning and voted for them. I think this makes a lot more sense.

Quote:
Originally Posted by reckoning
It`s ironic that Pittsburgh`s two best teams(`93 and`96) didn`t win the Cup.Especially `93,they won 56 games that year,and were getting better towards the end of the season.I don`t know why they lost that year,it could`ve been overconfidence after breezing through the first round,plus Barrasso totally stunk in the Islander series.Sad part is,that year would`ve been the best chance to see Lemieux vs. Gretzky in the Stanley Cup Final.
Best team during the regular season, well I guess so, but the '92 Penguins in particular were unstoppable during the playoffs. Match up the '92-'93 Penguins vs the '92 playoffs Penguins, and I take the '92 Penguins to win. Guess its easy to say when that team won the cup, but they were just so dominant.

The '96 team doesn't stack up, IMO. Didn't have the defense. Looking back, I don't think they would stood a chance against Colorado that year even if they did get past Florida.

clefty is offline  
Old
02-02-2005, 12:52 PM
  #21
Coffey77
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Posts: 3,340
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flame_Star_Devil
The 00' Devils lost their series because Krzysztof Oliwa got powerplay time.
IMO, playing time is totally unrealistic.

For the 95-96 Wings Grimson averages 22 minutes a game (including 3 minutes of PP and PK time). I like Stu but he'd be lucky to get 5 minutes in a game. PLus not all the best players are dressed. Scrubs are sometimes used.

Coffey77 is offline  
Old
02-02-2005, 01:37 PM
  #22
Jacob
Registered User
 
Jacob's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Country: United States
Posts: 26,415
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by soulok
this is not about they can hold their own. its about 71% voting pittsburgh and 28% edmonton??? WTF? are these guys on crack? thats too much of a voting discrepency to think this series is not fixed. the Penguins in 93 were obviously a great team. But 84 Oilers were better. Thats just the plain facts.
Why do people on these forums have such a hard time differing fact from opinion?

Jacob is offline  
Old
02-02-2005, 07:10 PM
  #23
soulok*
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 188
vCash: 500
Oilers win. Like I had a doubt all along

soulok* is offline  
Old
02-02-2005, 07:50 PM
  #24
CRUNK JUICE
Registered User
 
CRUNK JUICE's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Austin, TX
Country: United States
Posts: 1,139
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to CRUNK JUICE
Quote:
Originally Posted by reckoning
It`s ironic that Pittsburgh`s two best teams(`93 and`96) didn`t win the Cup.Especially `93,they won 56 games that year,and were getting better towards the end of the season.I don`t know why they lost that year,it could`ve been overconfidence after breezing through the first round,plus Barrasso totally stunk in the Islander series.Sad part is,that year would`ve been the best chance to see Lemieux vs. Gretzky in the Stanley Cup Final.
I remember hearing Ray Ferrarro say something to the extent of "we (the Isles) came to play, and the Pens were already thinking about the details of their flight to Montreal."

I think overconfidence played more than a small part in that upset (plus the Isles were playing lights out). You'd think Scotty Bowman would've smacked some sense into them.

CRUNK JUICE is offline  
Old
02-02-2005, 08:28 PM
  #25
NYIsles1*
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 9,539
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vicious Vic
I remember hearing Ray Ferrarro say something to the extent of "we (the Isles) came to play, and the Pens were already thinking about the details of their flight to Montreal."

I think overconfidence played more than a small part in that upset (plus the Isles were playing lights out). You'd think Scotty Bowman would've smacked some sense into them.
Isles were just better and beat them at what they did best, they had a 7-5 win where both teams just kept trading goals. Arbour outcoached Bowman in that series.

Isles did not even have Pierre Turgeon. Game seven Pilon hit Stevens and he was out before he hit the ice. Kasparaitis was hitting Lemieux every chance he could.

Pittsburgh was down 3-1 late in game seven before tying it in the final minute.

NYIsles1* is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 01:48 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.