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10-14-2012, 10:56 AM
  #76
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Originally Posted by RogerRoeper View Post
Well Burke was a GM in Hartford as well and didn't do much at all.
True, but Burke was a GM in Vancouver and Anaheim since then and has brought long term talent and stability to one franchise and won a stanley cup in the other.

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10-14-2012, 11:06 AM
  #77
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Originally Posted by Dark Knight View Post
He's a GM who has failed to adapt to the constantly changing nature of the game from a business point of view. That's my only beef with him.

Other than that, I think he's done an above average job in drafting and practising patience on players who are on the cusp of graduating to the NHL.

He's let goal-tending be his Achilles Heel once again similar to his time in Vancouver.

He's made large statements and has been unable to back the up.

I don't personally like him too much. I think all his great moves have come as a result of being BFF with the Anaheim GM. I don't particularly like to give GM the credit of drafting players because they're not scouting director.

Burke might deserve an extension because its better to see this whole thing through rather than make a change now and alter our philosophies once again. He has performed poorly here though and deserves a pay-cut (he's one of the most expensive GM's in the league). If he is able to get an extension on the same dollar amount he makes right now, despite these years of utter failure, I'd consider him the smartest man in the world.
I agree with most of that. I think he is an ego-tistical blow hard. His mouth gets him in trouble, but I would not want to play poker against the guy.

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10-14-2012, 11:07 AM
  #78
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One year deal max.
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Originally Posted by birddog View Post
He refused to fire his BF and gave him a one year extension.
When Wilson was re-signed the Leafs, they were 6th in the conference and 6 points behind Philly for 4th, he had a right to show confidence, but when the team starting faltering he did his job and fired him.

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He mis-assessed this team and traded 2 first round picks that would have helped bring this team back some respectability.
How would Seguin help us right now? im not going to start with Hamilton or Knight, but really how would Seguin help right now? He would not have went out and made the Phaneuf deal or the Lupul deal. We would more than likely be in the same spot but with Seguin to look forward to. I would much rather have Kessel and everyone else than Seguin and who he would have brought in. I dont agree with moving the picks but he brought in an elite young sniper.

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He has not solved the goaltending issue.
Ok, maybe Reimer and Scrivens arn`t the best but who would he have been able to bring in. Lets go and trade a huge package for an aging 10 year contract in Luongo?or maybe trade the farm for John Bernier and hope he is better than Reimer? exactly, the grass is always greener to some people

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He has not solved the toughness issue.
Umm, the Leafs had 35 fights last year, from 12 players. They arn`t a team that just gets pushed around. they arn`t the toughest team, i know but what should he have done different? Acqurie Parros,Boll,Dustin Brown,Mike Richards and play Orr,Rosehill and Brown? He has always stated he wants a top 6-bottom 6 but in the new NHL its top 9 bottom 3. How many fights do Kunitz,Dupis,Letang,Neal and Malkin have a year for the pens? or Datsyuk,Zetterberg,Franzen have for the wings?

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In fact this is one of the softest and weakest goaltending tandems in the league.
Its the system that Wilson wanted them to play. it was outdated and left to many holes in our line-up. How many goals against where they were the D was out of position or we had Komisarek trying first passes across the ice? Burke and Wilson didnt see eye-to-eye in what team they wanted and system.

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He has not brought in a number one center. Essential when matching up against other teams top lines.
Same, as goaltending. Stats wise, Grabo is a number 1 center as he is in the top 30 centers in the league. It is also pretty difficult to acquire a top center. We have the second best thing with decent centre depth. Atleast Burke is willing to try, Connolly was good in Buffalo, Lombardi if he could return to form was #1(i hope if we lose a season we re-sign him 1 year deal cheap. A full off-season may help him return), he brought in Bozak, who 20 other teams wanted, brought in Colbourne who Boston really liked and expected to be a number 1, Drafted a natural Centre in Kadri. you can`t say he hasnt tried, id rather have a gm willing to take risks than sit back and to save his job.

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The PK has been the worst in the league or close to it.
Again, Wilson system was horrible, he asked them to play a really bad style of PK, one where they sat back and let everything happen and you can`t play that way, not Burkes fault.

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Their record has been in the bottom 5 of the league since his tenure began.
Look at the work he had to do, we have one of the youngest teams, once they come together with age you will see them get better.

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They have failed to make the playoffs since the lockout and during his tenure.
this point i will give you

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He has drafted ZERO players that are currently regulars on the rosters. Kadri could be the first but the AHL coach he just extended is busy throwing his top prospect under the bus.
Players take time to develop, since when is 3 season enough. Kadri takes time to with his style to play.

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Bottom line Burke has accomplished NOTHING except pissing off the media, fans and making Toronto one of the least desirable destinations in the NHL for UFAs.
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Pity the fools that think he should get a multi-year deal. Keep drinking the kool-aid.
im not saying he should be signed that long but a 1 year deal maybe 2 if we show improvement i would not be against

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10-14-2012, 11:12 AM
  #79
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Thanks

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Originally Posted by eyeball11 View Post
Pet peeve: this is not a word.
Seen it twice in this thread already.

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10-14-2012, 11:14 AM
  #80
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Originally Posted by Predaleafs View Post
So then lets fire him, and hire who?.


All you can say is that he overpaid for some guys, but that is what UFA is like. If Burke didnt bring in any of those guys you would be complaining he didnt make a move. Grabo is our second best forward and is not even in the top 50 skaters for caphits yet he is somehow overpaid.

See, go back 4 years and you were probably the same guy complaining the Toskala was overpaid,Stajan needed to go and Why would they sign Blake. no body can ever win to people like you.

I dont have any optimism, the team is bad and i know it, but would you rather sit at home and watch your favorite team lose just for better draft position because i dont. What does that teach our young guys, if we arent good, do work hard at it?

There is a reason the marlies got to the Calder Cup Final. Players like Kadri, Colbourne, Ashton, D`Amigo, Scrivens, Gardiner(for the playoffs) and Frattin. Burke brought in all these guys except Frattin yet he failed?

See the problem is blind optimism as you said. it is constant negativity from people like youself, who unless the leafs win the cup will never be happy.

I understand our team failed and im not saying re-sign him right now but im also not saying that he did a bad job. He hasn`t succeed as playoffs is a sign of success, but to say he did nothing is wrong.
Booyah!! Nicely said.

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10-14-2012, 11:27 AM
  #81
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With what he inherited 6-8 years to build a contender was realistic. He has done the job so far and feel we are a year or two from really making some noise again. I would extend him 2 years max though.

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10-14-2012, 11:27 AM
  #82
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Originally Posted by Predaleafs View Post
When Wilson was re-signed the Leafs, they were 6th in the conference and 6 points behind Philly for 4th, he had a right to show confidence, but when the team starting faltering he did his job and fired him.



How would Seguin help us right now? im not going to start with Hamilton or Knight, but really how would Seguin help right now? He would not have went out and made the Phaneuf deal or the Lupul deal. We would more than likely be in the same spot but with Seguin to look forward to. I would much rather have Kessel and everyone else than Seguin and who he would have brought in. I dont agree with moving the picks but he brought in an elite young sniper.



Ok, maybe Reimer and Scrivens arn`t the best but who would he have been able to bring in. Lets go and trade a huge package for an aging 10 year contract in Luongo?or maybe trade the farm for John Bernier and hope he is better than Reimer? exactly, the grass is always greener to some people



Umm, the Leafs had 35 fights last year, from 12 players. They arn`t a team that just gets pushed around. they arn`t the toughest team, i know but what should he have done different? Acqurie Parros,Boll,Dustin Brown,Mike Richards and play Orr,Rosehill and Brown? He has always stated he wants a top 6-bottom 6 but in the new NHL its top 9 bottom 3. How many fights do Kunitz,Dupis,Letang,Neal and Malkin have a year for the pens? or Datsyuk,Zetterberg,Franzen have for the wings?



Its the system that Wilson wanted them to play. it was outdated and left to many holes in our line-up. How many goals against where they were the D was out of position or we had Komisarek trying first passes across the ice? Burke and Wilson didnt see eye-to-eye in what team they wanted and system.



Same, as goaltending. Stats wise, Grabo is a number 1 center as he is in the top 30 centers in the league. It is also pretty difficult to acquire a top center. We have the second best thing with decent centre depth. Atleast Burke is willing to try, Connolly was good in Buffalo, Lombardi if he could return to form was #1(i hope if we lose a season we re-sign him 1 year deal cheap. A full off-season may help him return), he brought in Bozak, who 20 other teams wanted, brought in Colbourne who Boston really liked and expected to be a number 1, Drafted a natural Centre in Kadri. you can`t say he hasnt tried, id rather have a gm willing to take risks than sit back and to save his job.



Again, Wilson system was horrible, he asked them to play a really bad style of PK, one where they sat back and let everything happen and you can`t play that way, not Burkes fault.



Look at the work he had to do, we have one of the youngest teams, once they come together with age you will see them get better.



this point i will give you



Players take time to develop, since when is 3 season enough. Kadri takes time to with his style to play.





im not saying he should be signed that long but a 1 year deal maybe 2 if we show improvement i would not be against
Best post of the year. Covered everything. Thank you good sir.....a beer is needed now.

cheers.....

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10-14-2012, 11:47 AM
  #83
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Originally Posted by RogerRoeper View Post
I agree that if people want Burke gone, show us who can do a better job?.
Define doing a better job?

In the Burke era in TO only Edmonton, Columbus and NYI have produced less wins/points combined, so that places the Leafs as the 4th worst team record on performance when evaluating the situation.

Could another GM improve on those results, and would that then be considered going a better job?

Had MLSE extended JFJ instead of firing him, should we have expected results lower than what happen as a result of change?

PS. It would be hard to imagine any qualified GM accomplishing even less in the form of actual tangible results, no matter who that was. Particularly considering a team spending to the cap ceiling and deploying the largest management staff team in the NHL to provide assistance.

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10-14-2012, 12:06 PM
  #84
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Originally Posted by ForSpareParts View Post
every team has assistants that i'm sure would love a crack at being the head GM of a NHL team.



so in short 30 NHL teams have their assistants who are sound / qualified people to manage a team.
So you want to hire someone who has no GM experience?

I don't think that's a good idea in this market.

Quote:
also:



John Davidson
Pierre Gauthier
Joe Nieuwendyk (there's nothing stopping us from attracting current GM's)
Dave Poulin (hire from within)
hundreds of ex NHLers. both Garth Snow and Joe Nieuwendyk were players not too long ago
Jacques Martin is experienced enough to be a GM
Ian Laperriere (Flyers)
Jason Karmanos (Carolina)
Ron Francis (Carolina)

do i need to go on?
Yeah, I think you do. Jacques Martin?? ugh.

I see one name you gave there that seems a solid candidate to replace Burke's experience, and Davidson is strongly rumoured to be taking over the Jackets so you can probably scratch him off the list.

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10-14-2012, 12:07 PM
  #85
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Originally Posted by Mess View Post
Define doing a better job?

In the Burke era in TO only Edmonton, Columbus and NYI have produced less wins/points combined, so that places the Leafs as the 4th worst team record on performance when evaluating the situation.

Could another GM improve on those results, and would that then be considered going a better job?

Had MLSE extended JFJ instead of firing him, should we have expected results lower than what happen as a result of change?

PS. It would be hard to imagine any qualified GM accomplishing even less in the form of actual tangible results, no matter who that was. Particularly considering a team spending to the cap ceiling and deploying the largest management staff team in the NHL to provide assistance.
yeah, that's great...except the goal isn't "do better than a lottery team", it's "bring a Stanley Cup to Toronto".

That narrows the field considerably. Or at least it should.

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10-14-2012, 12:08 PM
  #86
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If he gets the team into the playoffs you consider an extension.

Based on results he hasn't earned anything else.

Rebuilding the cupboard is minimum results while ending up in the lottery every year, and in the top 5 in 2 of the last 3 seasons. (Them there are tanking efforts)

Minimum results do not warrant extensions.

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10-14-2012, 12:09 PM
  #87
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Originally Posted by Mess View Post
Define doing a better job?

In the Burke era in TO only Edmonton, Columbus and NYI have produced less wins/points combined, so that places the Leafs as the 4th worst team record on performance when evaluating the situation.

Could another GM improve on those results, and would that then be considered going a better job?

Had MLSE extended JFJ instead of firing him, should we have expected results lower than what happen as a result of change?

PS. It would be hard to imagine any qualified GM accomplishing even less in the form of actual tangible results, no matter who that was. Particularly considering a team spending to the cap ceiling and deploying the largest management staff team in the NHL to provide assistance.

Agreed...I don't like him at all...surprise surprise. But I do respect his ability to market himself. He is somewhat of a magician really. I mean look at how much support he gets from the fanbase despite his laughable results. He took over a lousy hockey team and the current Leafs roster is also a lousy hockey team. Probably a .500 team, IMO. I'm really unsure what he has done that makes him special here. Guys like Kadri, Reilly and JVR (via Schenn) and Kessel (via Seguin/Hamilton/Knight) are really only products of being such a lousy hockey team....other than those gems what has he brought? Really. It probably amounts to Jake Gardiner and Jofferey Lupul. The rest are just regular shmucks or guys who were already in the system (Reimer, Grabovski, Kulemin, Gunnarsson etc).....so whats all the hype with this guy? The prospect pool? Also mostly being what it is due to being a terrible NHL team for the most part. And also remains to be seen if it is anything special anyways.

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10-14-2012, 12:15 PM
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Originally Posted by Volcanologist View Post
yeah, that's great...except the goal isn't "do better than a lottery team", it's "bring a Stanley Cup to Toronto".

That narrows the field considerably. Or at least it should.
There are several 1 Cup wonders out there, but that doesn't mean they are the only ones to target. Anaheim hired a Cupless GM a few years ago, and that worked out for a short while.

Kings are for sale, maybe their new owner would want to change up management.

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10-14-2012, 12:16 PM
  #89
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Originally Posted by Predaleafs View Post
So then lets fire him, and hire who?.


All you can say is that he overpaid for some guys, but that is what UFA is like. If Burke didnt bring in any of those guys you would be complaining he didnt make a move. Grabo is our second best forward and is not even in the top 50 skaters for caphits yet he is somehow overpaid.

See, go back 4 years and you were probably the same guy complaining the Toskala was overpaid,Stajan needed to go and Why would they sign Blake. no body can ever win to people like you.

I dont have any optimism, the team is bad and i know it, but would you rather sit at home and watch your favorite team lose just for better draft position because i dont. What does that teach our young guys, if we arent good, do work hard at it?

There is a reason the marlies got to the Calder Cup Final. Players like Kadri, Colbourne, Ashton, D`Amigo, Scrivens, Gardiner(for the playoffs) and Frattin. Burke brought in all these guys except Frattin yet he failed?

See the problem is blind optimism as you said. it is constant negativity from people like youself, who unless the leafs win the cup will never be happy.

I understand our team failed and im not saying re-sign him right now but im also not saying that he did a bad job. He hasn`t succeed as playoffs is a sign of success, but to say he did nothing is wrong.
Grabovski is the 38th highest paid forward in the nhl. He produced the 88th most points among forwards in the nhl last season. Kessel however is the opposite but obviously signed earlier. I'm just showing your skewing the facts a little with you Grabo statement.

Would he be wrong saying that Toskala was overpaid? That they shouldn't have signed Blake? Or that Stajan should be traded? I don't see how any of those statements would be considered wrong.

Your statements just contradict themselves. You go on to ask if he'd rather watch his team play for draft picks or a playoff position? All he's been able to do is watch his team play for draft picks when he was told he'd be watching his team play for the playoffs.

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10-14-2012, 12:18 PM
  #90
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You make a lot of good points. But lets face facts here. Do you not remember what this team looked like when he got here? We had zero depth at any position. There was NO elite talent. We had 5 contracts that were considered unmovable. Our team was 3rd oldest in the NHL. The Marlies were bottom dwellers.

Burkes biggest mistakes were Wilson and Gustavson. Gus is not a terrible goalie, but look at what Burke went through to get him. He flew overseas twice to coax him here. Wilson was just a terrible coach that came here with a winning record. But I think everyone on these boards conceded that he go most of his wins because of the bonus of coaching star and elite talent. The teams he coached were going to win games anyway irregardless of who was behind the bench.

Bottom 10, 4 years in a row? Ok. But we got some decent pics from that. The Phaneuf ****** was one of the biggest steal deals ever. And, no one can really complain about the Kessel deal. At the time if you remember, the leafs had a typical leaf collapse at xmas time and another in February. Everyone including burke thought we would be in the playoff hunt....but our tending rested on the shoulders of .....ok I don't want to start making people puke here so turn away if your squeemish......Vesa Toskala. Cue the "death march" music.

And, even with last years 17 game collapse when we were in the playoff hunt, we still finished ahead of last years point totals. 4 players had career years. The Marlies are playing like a well oiled machine.

Burke inherited a garage full of old rusty ford tempo parts. He has replaced all those with Ferrari parts. We just need that 12 cylinder engine, put this thing together and we will have a kick ass sports car for years to come. And, if something breaks, there is another part on the shelf that will fit right in.

Burke overcame his ego long enough to rid us of Wilson, arguably one of the worst coaches in Leaf history. He was voted by the players in a secret ballot of Worst coach to play for.

Give him the time he needs to see this thing through. He was 40 players away from total organization wipe out 3.5 years ago. Now we are just 2 pieces away from success. We all know what they are but lets all sing together.....a 1a center and a 1a tender.

Its easy for all us old guys to see it though....we all remember paper bag day at the old gardens. You young guys that went through the last seven years with limited success dont have a clue what we went through in the Harold Ballard years. Now that was frushtrating.
Once again, complete urban legend that no one saw that this team would be as bad as it was post Kessel trade.

I love how you can say on one hand, BB came here and this team was old,no depth,(no tending, should be added to that list), nothing in the marlies to help and no elite players. Back to back 7th last place finishes i might add.

And yet you state no one could have seen the next season coming.

just WOW.


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10-14-2012, 12:26 PM
  #91
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Thats his biggest mistake. His BF or should I say GF? But he finally got rid of him and brought in a very good coach.
Waiting as long as he did only damaged the state of this team even further. There's even more work to do for the new coaching staff.

I'm not a Burke hater. I believe he should be extended -- but one year max -- and the pressure should be kept high. He should be forced to manage under a microscope of scrutiny and deliver results. He's earned that over the last 4 years.

He's damaged this organization. Sure there are some pieces in in place to right the wrongs but it's still no sure thing he will. If at the end of next year he doesn't show some serious progress I'd easily move on and find a GM that can bring results and restore some glory to this franchise.

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10-14-2012, 12:32 PM
  #92
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Waiting as long as he did only damaged the state of this team even further. There's even more work to do for the new coaching staff.

I'm not a Burke hater. I believe he should be extended -- but one year max -- and the pressure should be kept high. He should be forced to manage under a microscope of scrutiny and deliver results. He's earned that over the last 4 years.

He's damaged this organization. Sure there are some pieces in in place to right the wrongs but it's still no sure thing he will. If at the end of next year he doesn't show some serious progress I'd easily move on and find a GM that can bring results and restore some glory to this franchise.
Burke was signed to a 6 year contract in 2008.

There is no need to extend him at all, he's still under contract.

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10-14-2012, 12:37 PM
  #93
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not fools, just smart people who see he is almost there and has done a very good job considering what he had to work with

As for Eakins throwing Kadri under the bus, that was clearly Kadri's doing. He came into camp out of shape because he was stuffing his face with doughnuts and cheese burgers all summer. Eakins is an amazing coach.
Keep drinking the kool-aid. For every Kadri teams like Colorado have Landeskog, Duschense etc.

The Leafs don't own the best talent pool in the NHL or the best prospect pool.

Leafs needed a center -- well LA acquired 2 -- while holding onto Kopitar, Brown, Doughty, Quick etc.

You just can't logically say that this team is poised to overtake teams like LA, Pittsburg, Boston, Philly, NYR, Edmonton. The top 4 on that list have better teams now and better young stars. You can add more teams to that list. St. Louis is another. Colorado has some great young pieces. I simply can't agree that Burke is poised to overtake any of them. Even if Kadri, Reilly, Biggs and the rest of the third liners all pan out.

The prospect pool is deep with third liners. There is no number one center, no star goaltender. All your logic is based on the fact that Burke will somehow trade for a Luongo and sign a Getzlaf and Perry. But he hasn't done this and it can't be factored into "he's doing a great job -- we only need a number one center."

Thirty teams in the NHL are a number one center, top shutdown defenseman and atar goalie away from contending. The fact Leaf fans use this as the basis "we are close to turning it around" is the same silly false hope they have been displaying for the last 45 years.

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10-14-2012, 12:37 PM
  #94
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Originally Posted by Predaleafs View Post
When Wilson was re-signed the Leafs, they were 6th in the conference and 6 points behind Philly for 4th, he had a right to show confidence, but when the team starting faltering he did his job and fired him.



How would Seguin help us right now? im not going to start with Hamilton or Knight, but really how would Seguin help right now? He would not have went out and made the Phaneuf deal or the Lupul deal. We would more than likely be in the same spot but with Seguin to look forward to. I would much rather have Kessel and everyone else than Seguin and who he would have brought in. I dont agree with moving the picks but he brought in an elite young sniper.



Ok, maybe Reimer and Scrivens arn`t the best but who would he have been able to bring in. Lets go and trade a huge package for an aging 10 year contract in Luongo?or maybe trade the farm for John Bernier and hope he is better than Reimer? exactly, the grass is always greener to some people



Umm, the Leafs had 35 fights last year, from 12 players. They arn`t a team that just gets pushed around. they arn`t the toughest team, i know but what should he have done different? Acqurie Parros,Boll,Dustin Brown,Mike Richards and play Orr,Rosehill and Brown? He has always stated he wants a top 6-bottom 6 but in the new NHL its top 9 bottom 3. How many fights do Kunitz,Dupis,Letang,Neal and Malkin have a year for the pens? or Datsyuk,Zetterberg,Franzen have for the wings?



Its the system that Wilson wanted them to play. it was outdated and left to many holes in our line-up. How many goals against where they were the D was out of position or we had Komisarek trying first passes across the ice? Burke and Wilson didnt see eye-to-eye in what team they wanted and system.



Same, as goaltending. Stats wise, Grabo is a number 1 center as he is in the top 30 centers in the league. It is also pretty difficult to acquire a top center. We have the second best thing with decent centre depth. Atleast Burke is willing to try, Connolly was good in Buffalo, Lombardi if he could return to form was #1(i hope if we lose a season we re-sign him 1 year deal cheap. A full off-season may help him return), he brought in Bozak, who 20 other teams wanted, brought in Colbourne who Boston really liked and expected to be a number 1, Drafted a natural Centre in Kadri. you can`t say he hasnt tried, id rather have a gm willing to take risks than sit back and to save his job.



Again, Wilson system was horrible, he asked them to play a really bad style of PK, one where they sat back and let everything happen and you can`t play that way, not Burkes fault.



Look at the work he had to do, we have one of the youngest teams, once they come together with age you will see them get better.



this point i will give you



Players take time to develop, since when is 3 season enough. Kadri takes time to with his style to play.





im not saying he should be signed that long but a 1 year deal maybe 2 if we show improvement i would not be against
It would be better to have Seguin right now seeing he is the same skill level and 4 years younger and might be able to play C. Nice side step on Hamilton, yes please, lets ignore the top ranked D prospect in hockey, because it helps me make my point?.

How sickening does it get, when one has to try to defend a deal by stating the Dion/Gards trades would not of happened if we did not do the Kessel deal, thats just pathetic.

Thats like me saying if we had not done the Kessel deal, Parise,Schultz and Suter would have signed here.

In net Kari Lehtonen perhaps? I heard on the grape vine that he was traded not long ago.

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10-14-2012, 12:39 PM
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Waiting as long as he did only damaged the state of this team even further. There's even more work to do for the new coaching staff.

I'm not a Burke hater. I believe he should be extended -- but one year max -- and the pressure should be kept high. He should be forced to manage under a microscope of scrutiny and deliver results. He's earned that over the last 4 years.


He's damaged this organization. Sure there are some pieces in in place to right the wrongs but it's still no sure thing he will. If at the end of next year he doesn't show some serious progress I'd easily move on and find a GM that can bring results and restore some glory to this franchise.
I agree to the bolded part bird dog, but I dont think he damaged the organization. You simply cant sink a ship that is already at the bottom of the ocean.

If you go back and check all my posts and threads, I was one of the guys predicting lottery the last few years with the exception of one post. My ex wife got into my pc and wigged out. hehe

This year, I can see it coming together. We are not great yet, but we are greater than other teams in our conference. If burke fulfills his promise of obtaining a 1a center and tender. We are in.

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10-14-2012, 12:44 PM
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no because he doesn't deserve it.

approaching 5 years on the job and we don't have a number one centre or a number one goalie and half of leaf nation wants to tank.

He traded a number 1 centre in Tyler Seguin, I no we traded the pick not Seguin, but he never had the pick lottery protected and that is a huge mistake. If we were trading lottery picks I would want a 1st line centre...

His strategy was build from the net out - oh really? 5 years no number 1 goalie. JOKE.

Wasted time on free wallets Bozak/ Gustavsson - really Burke? Not bad ideas as it COULD have worked. But it didn't. So again, BIG mistake.

Overpaid for Komisarek. The majority of leaf nation were against this.

Our roster is very complete, but the two most important positions are your goalie and your number 1 centre role... now I do think we can be competitive without a number 1 centre but not without a number one goalie.... He hasn't gotten this done so... bye.

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10-14-2012, 12:45 PM
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I agree to the bolded part bird dog, but I dont think he damaged the organization. You simply cant sink a ship that is already at the bottom of the ocean.

If you go back and check all my posts and threads, I was one of the guys predicting lottery the last few years with the exception of one post. My ex wife got into my pc and wigged out. hehe

This year, I can see it coming together. We are not great yet, but we are greater than other teams in our conference. If burke fulfills his promise of obtaining a 1a center and tender. We are in.
So if this team is yet another disaster this year do you just make more excuses and give him a free pass?

Will there ever be a point when he has to deliver?

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10-14-2012, 12:48 PM
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Keep drinking the kool-aid. For every Kadri teams like Colorado have Landeskog, Duschense etc.

The Leafs don't own the best talent pool in the NHL or the best prospect pool.

Leafs needed a center -- well LA acquired 2 -- while holding onto Kopitar, Brown, Doughty, Quick etc.

You just can't logically say that this team is poised to overtake teams like LA, Pittsburg, Boston, Philly, NYR, Edmonton. The top 4 on that list have better teams now and better young stars. You can add more teams to that list. St. Louis is another. Colorado has some great young pieces. I simply can't agree that Burke is poised to overtake any of them. Even if Kadri, Reilly, Biggs and the rest of the third liners all pan out.

The prospect pool is deep with third liners. There is no number one center, no star goaltender. All your logic is based on the fact that Burke will somehow trade for a Luongo and sign a Getzlaf and Perry. But he hasn't done this and it can't be factored into "he's doing a great job -- we only need a number one center."

Thirty teams in the NHL are a number one center, top shutdown defenseman and atar goalie away from contending. The fact Leaf fans use this as the basis "we are close to turning it around" is the same silly false hope they have been displaying for the last 45 years.
I am not drinking koolaide....its a Keiths red. I never said we were going to overtake any of those teams you listed, but we are better than the ones around us like Florida, Buffalo,Tampa, Winnepeg,islanders, montreal and new Jersey.

I also never said anything about signing Louongo or Getzlaf or Perry. Are you sure you are commenting on the right post?

As for not signing the guys we need as a 1a and a tender. Rome wasnt built in a day. Burke has made mistakes, we all know that, but guess what? Other gms arent perfect either.

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10-14-2012, 12:51 PM
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your way of thinking is wrong. you look at the past four years and say what has he done, forgetting what he started with.

Yes we have failed as anything outside of post season is a fail, but you can`t expect him to build a cup contender in 3 years with what he started with.
What??? He started with a team that missed the playoffs by a game. So what has he done with that start? Four years on we are in the lottery basement vying for the top draft pick. Get a grip on reality.

The man has not demonstrated any sort of competence at the NHL level in Toronto. Assembling the kind of team that his buddy Ronnie wanted, which was the polar opposite of what Brian bragged he would build, has put us back at square one of rebuilding for another four years. This illustrates as much as anything why Brian's contract should not be renewed.

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10-14-2012, 12:51 PM
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no because he doesn't deserve it.

approaching 5 years on the job and we don't have a number one centre or a number one goalie and half of leaf nation wants to tank.

He traded a number 1 centre in Tyler Seguin, I no we traded the pick not Seguin, but he never had the pick lottery protected and that is a huge mistake. If we were trading lottery picks I would want a 1st line centre...

His strategy was build from the net out - oh really? 5 years no number 1 goalie. JOKE.

Wasted time on free wallets Bozak/ Gustavsson - really Burke? Not bad ideas as it COULD have worked. But it didn't. So again, BIG mistake.

Overpaid for Komisarek. The majority of leaf nation were against this.

Our roster is very complete, but the two most important positions are your goalie and your number 1 centre role... now I do think we can be competitive without a number 1 centre but not without a number one goalie.... He hasn't gotten this done so... bye.
I agree with that and good point.

I am hoping you stop saying the number "5" though because it makes it seem worse than it is. Its 4. If we have hockey, I think we will quickly see a deal done. I am sure he was working on this and I think he probably has something in place now. Just an opinion though.

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