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All Purpose Luongo Trade Discussion (New news) MOD WARNING IN OP

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Old
10-18-2012, 01:33 PM
  #301
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Originally Posted by GoLeafsGo96 View Post
It isn't fair value for Luongo. But you have to be reasonable to understand that Luongo doesn't provide that much at this point. The team is coming off of a bottom five finish, and not looking like they can contend for 4+ years.
Things can turn around pretty quickly in this league, especially when you're getting great goaltending. LA went from running joke to cup champs in the same season.

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10-18-2012, 01:34 PM
  #302
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Without trying to sound like a dick, I don't remember anything positive from Mats Sundin or worthy from his tenure in Vancouver. All I remember is him dicking around Vancouver until December/January, eating up 5 million in cap and being "generous" by leaving a million behind so the team could improve the team. Then getting injured in the first round in game 2?

So I don't remember any positive there. Can you elaborate what you meant so I can understand and respond better. Thanks
I'm assuming he means his influence on the Sedins, Kesler, and our other top players alike.


Last edited by piqued: 10-18-2012 at 02:12 PM.
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10-18-2012, 01:35 PM
  #303
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Without trying to sound like a dick, I don't remember anything positive from Mats Sundin or worthy from his tenure in Vancouver. All I remember is him dicking around Vancouver until December/January, eating up 5 million in cap and being "generous" by leaving a million behind so the team could improve the team. Then getting injured in the first round in game 2?

So I don't remember any positive there. Can you elaborate what you meant so I can understand and respond better. Thanks
He played an integral role in mentoring both Kesler and the Sedins. They have all cited his brief tenure there as a critical time in their development as players and leaders, and sure enough they have the hardware to prove the results.

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10-18-2012, 01:35 PM
  #304
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Just because you don't know anything about Jesse Blacker doesn't mean he's crumbs.

Educate yourself.

You'd be getting a potential 2nd pairing guy with very good upside.
Hah! Don't be such a know it all.

I know Blacker, and I don't discount him. It's just that you're offering three big 'ifs' (yes MacA included, don't think he'd fit in our system at all) for a sure thing (say what you will, he's a starter and a known quantity).

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10-18-2012, 01:37 PM
  #305
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Originally Posted by Scurr View Post
Things can turn around pretty quickly in this league, especially when you're getting great goaltending. LA went from running joke to cup champs in the same season.
er not really. Comparing the Kings that won the SC to the current Maple Leafs is like comparing the Batman series with Transformers. Just because both were hilariously bad at points doesn't mean that Batman didn't start trending massively upwards after a while whereas Transformers got rid of Megan Fo

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10-18-2012, 01:37 PM
  #306
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Things can turn around pretty quickly in this league, especially when you're getting great goaltending. LA went from running joke to cup champs in the same season.
I agree with you when you say goaltending can do a lot. I just don't see it with this team. We don't have the high level talent that SC winners of the past have had.

LA on paper is much better. They played awful, but when you have a true #1 Goalie, a true #1 D, and 3 #1 C's... You're in much better state than the Leafs, who have likely none whatsoever. (Not going to argue about Dion being a number 1, because this is not the place)

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10-18-2012, 01:37 PM
  #307
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Originally Posted by bikesbikesbikes View Post
Hah! Don't be such a know it all.

I know Blacker, and I don't discount him. It's just that you're offering three big 'ifs' (yes MacA included, don't think he'd fit in our system at all) for a sure thing (say what you will, he's a starter and a known quantity).
Luongo is FAR from a sure-thing come playoff time, I'd rather throw Reimer to the wolves and keep the assets.

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10-18-2012, 01:38 PM
  #308
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Originally Posted by stryfe604 View Post
Without trying to sound like a dick, I don't remember anything positive from Mats Sundin or worthy from his tenure in Vancouver. All I remember is him dicking around Vancouver until December/January, eating up 5 million in cap and being "generous" by leaving a million behind so the team could improve the team. Then getting injured in the first round in game 2?

So I don't remember any positive there. Can you elaborate what you meant so I can understand and respond better. Thanks
The twins and Kesler give him a lot of credit for helping them become elite players.

Having a guy like Lu in Edmonton to set the standard for work ethic and professionalism for the young guys could help them along. Taking the steps from skilled young player to superstar isn't as easy as people make it out to be.

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10-18-2012, 01:39 PM
  #309
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He played an integral role in mentoring both Kesler and the Sedins. They have all cited his brief tenure there as a critical time in their development as players and leaders, and sure enough they have the hardware to prove the results.
Seriously who believes those interviews where the guys basically give canned answers to make management look as good as possible? That's like believing Roenick's main problem in LA really was his skate sharpener. Come on, use a little critical thinking

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10-18-2012, 01:40 PM
  #310
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Originally Posted by neksys View Post
He played an integral role in mentoring both Kesler and the Sedins. They have all cited his brief tenure there as a critical time in their development as players and leaders, and sure enough they have the hardware to prove the results.
Ah, Did not know that. Thanks. But there is a clear difference between Sundin and Lou, Sundin signed for one year near the end of his career and Lou is signed for another 10 in the middle of his.


Last edited by piqued: 10-18-2012 at 02:14 PM. Reason: disclosure
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10-18-2012, 01:40 PM
  #311
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Originally Posted by GoLeafsGo96 View Post
I don't think Burke is as impatient as many would think. He was never adamant in selling the farm to make the playoffs. He won't be now. He won't get shafted. There is no way he deals Gardiner/Reilly/1st/Other core.

Kadri? Possibly. I don't think its impossible, but I don't think its very likely. Luongo likely won't be a Leaf because of these reasons, but that's just the way it is.
I agree, I have stated that very clearly in my previous posts. The point I have been making is that Burke will not get Luongo for cap dumps and scraps.
I don't think Connolly, Komisarek, Reimer, Lombardi, Franson will be of any interest whatsoever. MacArthur is a decent player but don't see what he would bring to the Canucks which they don't have already.
Luongo would cost the LEAFS tangible assets but highly unlikely Gardiner, Kessel, Reilly, Lupul, 1st would be included.

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10-18-2012, 01:41 PM
  #312
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Seriously who believes those interviews where the guys basically give canned answers to make management look as good as possible? That's like believing Roenick's main problem in LA really was his skate sharpener. Come on, use a little critical thinking
There's also the small case of the significant change in production from all 3 players after Kesler has left.

But no, continue to use all that 'critical thinking' of yours.

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10-18-2012, 01:41 PM
  #313
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These threads are hilarious.

Leafs Fan: "Luongo is worthless, look at that contract!"

Canucks Fan: "He's not going to finish it and his cap hit is barely in the top 10."

Leafs Fan: "There is no gaurantee he retires, too risky, no value."

*Details of potential new CBA come out...

Canucks Fan: "Guess Luongo's value went up. Canucks on the hook for the cap hit should he retire."

Leafs fan: "How does that matter? He's going to retire anyway. Still no value."

And around and around again! Not signalling out Leafs fans and some Canucks fans need to look at things a little more rationally (looking at you Y2K), but there have been some amazing feats in contradiction and hyperbole in these threads.

Can't wait till he's dealt. Should be about 60 more threads after that...

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10-18-2012, 01:41 PM
  #314
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What about Edmonton as a destination for Luongo. It makes a whole lot of sense to me.

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10-18-2012, 01:42 PM
  #315
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Originally Posted by porknbeans1000 View Post
Would Canucks consider taking Komisarek? it's well known that they need a gritty crease clearing defenseman.

I also think that Toronto fans should not take Lupul off the table. Yes he was a staple for them last year but that is a trade that could be a win-win for both teams.
Never. Komisarek having a NMC and two years remaining makes it a non-starter. We have no way of relieving that cap hit going into the subsequent season. If you want to toss in any other cap dump, provided the offer is reasonable, then by all means. None of us are against a cap dump, just one that won't hinder us.

If Lupul is realistically on the table. Make it him and Lombardi for all I care. Alas, I doubt Toronto is dealing Lupul.

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10-18-2012, 01:42 PM
  #316
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Originally Posted by YouCantYandleThis View Post
There's also the small case of the significant change in production from all 3 players after Kesler has left.

But no, continue to use all that 'critical thinking' of yours.
There are these things called coincidences. Canucks turned into a regular season powerhouse around the time they were good enough to make their big pitch for a guy who was to push them over the edge

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10-18-2012, 01:42 PM
  #317
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Luongo is FAR from a sure-thing come playoff time, I'd rather throw Reimer to the wolves and keep the assets.
Non playoff jokes aside, I agree, I think the Leafs are better than they appear, and they're better off hanging on to what they have. I'm actually a low level Leafs fan (don't tell anyone!!).

I'd prefer a trade with Edmonton, Chicago, Florida or Columbus.

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10-18-2012, 01:43 PM
  #318
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There are these things called coincidences. Canucks turned into a regular season powerhouse around the time they were good enough to make their big pitch for a guy who was to push them over the edge
You just contradicted your 'critical thinking' ideas entirely. Assuming coincidences is a fantastic way to win a debate, but it means absolutely nothing factually.

I'm using something called logic. You're using faulty assumptions.

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10-18-2012, 01:44 PM
  #319
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What about Edmonton as a destination for Luongo. It makes a whole lot of sense to me.
If Jersey wasn't in the red (hehe pun intended) and Broduer did retire, IMO the best destination for Lou.

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10-18-2012, 01:45 PM
  #320
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The argument many people, myself included, were making before the NHL proposal was that a new CBA could reduce the value of Luongo significantly, not that it had already. As it turned out, the proposal didn't impact Luongo's value in a trade like many thought it would and just because it didn't decrease his value, doesn't mean it increased.

The only thing the uncertainty of a new CBA impacted was the volume and seriousness of the trade talks. I think most people would have predicted that no trade would be made until the new CBA was agreed on, and I'm sure most GMs who are interested in Luongo were also waiting out the new CBA before trading for a 10 year commitment to a 33 year old goalie.

In terms of contract length, the issue was never with if he retired early, it was "What if Luongo keeps playing after his assumed 'retirement date'?" The team that trades for him in any scenario, now or before, would never have paid for him if he retired early. The only issue I see people having is what if he keeps playing, and becomes a shell of his former self in his later years while still at 5.333 a year. In that case, nothing has changed and that risk still remains for some people.
I think we may be getting hung up on semantics. This summer GM's were unwilling to trade significant assets for Luongo because they thought there was a risk that the new CBA would negatively affect his contract. With that risk apparently removed his value should be higher now than this summer. That is what I mean by his value has increased. I'm not implying that his contract and age have suddenly changed.

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10-18-2012, 01:45 PM
  #321
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As a Canucks fan, I honestly would not mind if the NHL's rule was accepted regarding a team being on the hook for a life time contact if the player retires.

As others have said, if this were to happen, Luongo's value will sky rocket. Other teams would be getting an elite goalie with several elite years left, who in 4-5 would retire at which point Vancouver would be on the hook for the Cap. It would hurt us down the road, but it would bring us a damn good asset back in a trade and potentially allow us to win the cup.

If this happens you'll immediatly see 5 or 6 other teams in the mix, and Luongo's value goes from Bjugstad or Colborne + a 1st to a package with all those guys combined.

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10-18-2012, 01:47 PM
  #322
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er not really. Comparing the Kings that won the SC to the current Maple Leafs is like comparing the Batman series with Transformers. Just because both were hilariously bad at points doesn't mean that Batman didn't start trending massively upwards after a while whereas Transformers got rid of Megan Fo
Ummmm....what? Are you Batman or a transformer?

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10-18-2012, 01:47 PM
  #323
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I still see a Leafs - Canucks trade on the horizon, despite us not being great trade partners. And I think Colborne is the centrepiece. Mike Gillis has had a thing for big, skilled forwards ever since Boston clobbered us in the finals.

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10-18-2012, 01:47 PM
  #324
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Originally Posted by Mika Zibanejad View Post
Just because you don't know anything about Jesse Blacker doesn't mean he's crumbs.

Educate yourself.

You'd be getting a potential 2nd pairing guy with very good upside.
Blacker is, at best, a second pairing defenseman. And frankly, that is being generous. The probability of him reaching that status is unlikely. With our defense being among the youngest in the league. We hadn't a need to be concerned with prospect depth in that area. Meanwhile, MacArthur is an inferior Higgins and your second would be close to our own.

In short, you saying we should be thrilled with your trash is akin to saying Toronto should be thrilled giving up Gradiner for Luongo. You would be horrified by that return, yes? Well, why then should we be "thrilled" by your ripping us off?

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10-18-2012, 01:49 PM
  #325
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Colborne may be big, but he's about as gritty as a wet napkin. No sand in that kid. Big-time pass.

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