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2012-13 Lockout Discussion Part V: The "Back to square one" Edition

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Old
10-23-2012, 09:16 AM
  #326
True Blue
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Originally Posted by DutchShamrock View Post
I'm not a proponent of that, but that's a viable option. Pulling the cap off the table will get one, maybe*two owners listening.* It addresses problems better than a new percentage will.
That may be. But it is a tactic. The cap is something that the owners do not want in play at all.

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10-23-2012, 10:04 AM
  #327
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Luxury tax. Pit the top and bottom teams against the middle. Turn the fighting on to the owners. That's how you subsidize the Phoenix's. Let them sit back and suck at a minimum cost. Fund your team on luxury tax money.

I'm not a proponent of that, but that's a viable option. Pulling the cap off the table will get one, maybe*two owners listening.* It addresses problems better than a new percentage will.
In theory, I agree.

However, given the history of how the cap came to be, I dont think any side is really interested in fighting these old battles again. If theres a move to scrap the cap, you can kiss the season goodbye, IMO

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10-23-2012, 10:22 AM
  #328
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The NHL allowed GMs to answer questions from their players regarding the NHL proposal. Was that really a good idea? From: @ChrisBottaNHL
Sent: Oct 23, 2012 11:19a

NHLPA could declare GMs speaking with lockout-out NHL players last weekend as "unfair labor practice." See my notes from this am.

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10-23-2012, 10:25 AM
  #329
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Ovechkin's latest rant was in Russian with a translator so I don't think it's just his broken English that makes him sound spoiled.

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10-23-2012, 10:26 AM
  #330
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The Fehr brothers love those unfair labor practice issues. Watch the NHL gave Fehr leverage. You had Jimmy Ds comments about the unwritten rule regarding the group II offer sheets. Now its the NHL allowing teams to speak with players during a lockout regarding management's proposal.

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10-23-2012, 10:28 AM
  #331
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From: @kevin_mcgran
Sent: Oct 23, 2012 10:59a

TheStar: NHL lockout: Gary Bettman allowed GMs, owners to talk to players about latest offer.http://t.co/NyNVtkpR

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10-23-2012, 10:31 AM
  #332
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Fehr hired the former head of the NLRB division based in the city as a PA lawyer. I think his name is Zavello. Fehr files an unfair labor practice with the NLRB. The NHL really needs that headache.

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10-23-2012, 10:35 AM
  #333
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From: @reporterchris
Sent: Oct 23, 2012 11:33a

NHLPA questions league's decision to speak with players about latest offer: http://t.co/HsuQiSvC

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10-23-2012, 10:37 AM
  #334
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From: @ChrisBottaNHL
Sent: Oct 23, 2012 11:35a

. @cotsonika All NHLPA needs is for one player to tell them that a GM or owner went off script. This could be fascinating.

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10-23-2012, 10:38 AM
  #335
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Quote:
Nick Cotsonika ‏@cotsonika
In short, in NHL's view, it allowed owners, GMs to respond to players' questions about its proposal -- nothing else.
Quote:
Chris Botta ‏@ChrisBottaNHL
@cotsonika All NHLPA needs is for one player to tell them that a GM or owner went off script. This could be fascinating.
Hope Sather/Dolan made a boo boo to break the stalemate

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10-23-2012, 10:39 AM
  #336
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
In theory, I agree.

However, given the history of how the cap came to be, I dont think any side is really interested in fighting these old battles again. If theres a move to scrap the cap, you can kiss the season goodbye, IMO
That sting of conversation was if the league cancelled the season. Then cap conversations are opened, not vice versa.


Just another misstep by Bettman. He sees a short term benefit but misses a big problem down the line. Labour law should be basic for these guys.

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10-23-2012, 10:40 AM
  #337
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Naughty!

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Old
10-23-2012, 10:42 AM
  #338
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Part of me wants a quick(by these guys standard) agreement to play at least a 70 game season. The other part wants Fehr to file a NLRB complaint and for the NHL to found guilty or whatever the proper term is. Smack Bettman and Jacobs right where it hurts-$$$$$ Enough with the stupid lockouts.

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10-23-2012, 10:44 AM
  #339
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Once that happens, there is a pretty good chance that Fehr throws the cap back on the table.
Yeah, the players don't need paycheques anyways.


Last edited by Brian Boyle: 10-23-2012 at 11:00 AM.
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10-23-2012, 10:46 AM
  #340
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Originally Posted by RangerBoy View Post
Part of me wants a quick(by these guys standard) agreement to play at least a 70 game season. The other part wants Fehr to file a NLRB complaint and for the NHL to found guilty or whatever the proper term is. Smack Bettman and Jacobs right where it hurts-$$$$$ Enough with the stupid lockouts.
Could filing with the NLRB lead to the end of the lockout?

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Old
10-23-2012, 11:02 AM
  #341
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Here is what the NHL sent to its teams last week:

Quote:
We understand that some of you are being contacted by one or more of your Players and that your inability to respond substantively is creating some awkwardness in your relationships.

Accordingly, and only between now and 11:59 pm (local time) on Friday night (10/19), the NHL By-Law 17.17 prohibition will not be applied to conversations that result from you being contacted by your Players -- PROVIDED, THAT ANY SUCH CONVERSATIONS ARE STRICTLY IN ACCORDANCE WITH THE RESTRICTIONS SET FORTH IN THIS MEMORANDUM. A failure to follow these rules can both set us back in our effort to resolve this work stoppage and cause serious legal problems and will be deemed a violation of NHL By-Law 17.17 (subject to appropriate penalties).

Therefore, please read these rules carefully and be certain that you adhere to them without exception. They have been designed in light of the fact that the NHLPA is, in fact and in law, the sole collective bargaining representative of the Players and that any effort to motivate the Players must be to have them act through their union, not instead of or in opposition to it.

As a matter of labor law you are permitted to express the views and opinions of the Club and the League concerning the proposal currently on the table.

YOU MAY NOT: "Negotiate" with a Player. This means you may not explore alternatives or variations to the proposals on the table from either side because that would be prohibited "direct dealing". You may not ask "What do you want?" or "What do the Players want?" or "What should the League propose?" If a Player tells you that he or others are trying to find a different approach, he should be told that all ideas and suggestions should be presented to the Union and not directly to you or anyone else in the League except through the Union. You may not ask him what he or others have in mind.

If he volunteers what he has in mind you should not respond positively or negatively or ask any questions but instead refer him to the NHLPA. Likewise, you may not suggest hypothetical proposals that the League might make in the future or that the League might entertain from the Union.
Pretty stupid of the ranchers thinking that the cattle would understand the concepts of domesticating mammals


Last edited by BBKers: 10-23-2012 at 11:22 AM.
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10-23-2012, 11:29 AM
  #342
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http://thestar.blogs.com/thespin/201...her-stuff.html

"The bile directed towards Gary Bettman is ridiculous and misplaced. But I will say this. His number one priority every season should be to get the season started on time, every time. He has failed. And while working with that dysfunctional players union must be next to impossible, resorting to the lockout time after time shows a lack of creativity in problem-solving by a commish who should have other answers by now."

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10-23-2012, 11:32 AM
  #343
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Quote:
Originally Posted by turcotte8 View Post
"The bile directed towards Gary Bettman is ridiculous and misplaced. But I will say this. His number one priority every season should be to get the season started on time, every time. He has failed. And while working with that dysfunctional players union must be next to impossible, resorting to the lockout time after time shows a lack of creativity in problem-solving by a commish who should have other answers by now."
Gary Bettman:
- Great for Owners
- Bad for Players
- Terrible for Fans

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10-23-2012, 11:32 AM
  #344
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Originally Posted by BBKers View Post
Here is what the NHL sent to its teams last week:



Pretty stupid of the ranchers thinking that the cattle would understand the concepts of domesticating mammals
Oh so now the players are dogs. It never ends around here.


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Old
10-23-2012, 11:33 AM
  #345
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Quote:
Originally Posted by turcotte8 View Post
http://thestar.blogs.com/thespin/201...her-stuff.html

"The bile directed towards Gary Bettman is ridiculous and misplaced. But I will say this. His number one priority every season should be to get the season started on time, every time. He has failed. And while working with that dysfunctional players union must be next to impossible, resorting to the lockout time after time shows a lack of creativity in problem-solving by a commish who should have other answers by now."
What other avenue does he have? What would a more creative problem solver do?

Also, they did play the 1993-94 season without a CBA, but that didn't lead to a deal during the season.

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10-23-2012, 11:35 AM
  #346
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Under no circumstance do you want players asking the owners questions.

once they've seen paris how are you going to keep them down on the farm?

All info should be filtered through the union.

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Old
10-23-2012, 11:36 AM
  #347
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From: @cotsonika
Sent: Oct 23, 2012 12:27p

Apparently the NHL has backed off some of the HRR clarification requests, so there's a teeny, tiny bit of progress.

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On Twitter: http://twitter.com/cotsonika/status/260779389258711040

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10-23-2012, 11:42 AM
  #348
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So, maybe they are making progress?

Quote:
Sam Carchidi ‏@BroadStBull
Deputy commish Bill Daly says the #NHL has not ruled out the use of a mediator in negotiations, but "not likely" for this week. #NHLPA

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Old
10-23-2012, 11:46 AM
  #349
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DutchShamrock View Post
Oh so now the players are dogs. It never ends around here.

Pink Floyd should reunite (replace Syd with Brian Wilson and Rick Wright with Rick Wakeman) and make a new album entitled "Animals 2".
  • Cows
  • Chickens
  • Chucacabras
  • Cowboys at the rink (parts 1 & 2)

There ya go

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10-23-2012, 11:47 AM
  #350
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Yeah, the players don't need paycheques anyways.
Not the point. Yes, it is billionaires vs. millionaires, but the NHL owners also need the cash flows.

Players are so fed up with Bettman, so indigant at the owners and still smarting from the last lockout, that they will do everything that Fehr says, when he says. IMO, Fehr has carte blance here. So, if Bettman is stupid enough to cancel a season, then my guess is that the cap is thrown back into the equation.

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