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Justin Schultz

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Old
12-20-2012, 02:40 PM
  #626
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Originally Posted by Hardyvan123 View Post
Wow am I ever dumb for not taking Latin in high school.

The only constant is that the same guys over hype all Oiler prospects just because they are Oilers property.

Sometimes it's better not to have a dog in the race and to try and use reason and scouting skills instead of wishing what a player might become.
If you ignore all of the Oiler fans and look at scouting reports, you'll come to the same conclusion. All 5 of the Oilers young guys are projected to be studs. Some already are studs at the NHL level.

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12-20-2012, 02:59 PM
  #627
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An article on Schultz at NHL.com, a worthwhile read for Schultz fans and those that would like to learn more about the player. http://www.nhl.com/ice/news.htm?id=6...id=DL|NHL|home

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12-20-2012, 03:03 PM
  #628
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Originally Posted by Hardyvan123 View Post
Wow am I ever dumb for not taking Latin in high school.

The only constant is that the same guys over hype all Oiler prospects just because they are Oilers property.

Sometimes it's better not to have a dog in the race and to try and use reason and scouting skills instead of wishing what a player might become.
Oh good lord.

How does this relate to Schultz and Eberle in any way whatsoever which is who the discussion in this thread was all about? Yeah, Oiler fans are the only ones hyping Schultz and Eberle.
I'm sure that Schultz and Eberle wouldn't be hyped if they were on another team, they are just hyped because they are Oilers and only by Oiler fans, am i right?

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12-20-2012, 03:26 PM
  #629
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Originally Posted by 5RingsAndABeer View Post
If you ignore all of the Oiler fans and look at scouting reports, you'll come to the same conclusion. All 5 of the Oilers young guys are projected to be studs. Some already are studs at the NHL level.
Well we have the 3 guys that were rated by most to be the top player in their draft at the time of their draft and to this point that hasn't been proven wrong albeit it's still early in their careers. Then we have Eberle who is the farthest ahead in his development and arguably has the best hands of the group. Then lastly Schultz who has a ton of skill and who reads the play exceptionally well in the O zone. I don't care if people want to accept it or not, we have 5 future potential allstar caliber players that will lace 'em up for us the next time that the NHL starts up as long as the league isn't blown up.

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12-20-2012, 03:28 PM
  #630
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Originally Posted by Bryanbryoil View Post
Well we have the 3 guys that were rated by most to be the top player in their draft at the time of their draft and to this point that hasn't been proven wrong albeit it's still early in their careers. Then we have Eberle who is the farthest ahead in his development and arguably has the best hands of the group. Then lastly Schultz who has a ton of skill and who reads the play exceptionally well in the O zone. I don't care if people want to accept it or not, we have 5 future potential allstar caliber players that will lace 'em up for us the next time that the NHL starts up as long as the league isn't blown up.
Yup, if you can keep your team together, it's going to be a beast. Just make sure Taylor Hall learns how to keep his damn head up. I'm very excited to see your team play even if it is at the expense of them exposing the Canucks for what they really are.

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12-20-2012, 03:35 PM
  #631
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Yup, if you can keep your team together, it's going to be a beast. Just make sure Taylor Hall learns how to keep his damn head up. I'm very excited to see your team play even if it is at the expense of them exposing the Canucks for what they really are.
We won't be really challenging your team for at least another year or two IMO. They should still be among the best in the NHL whenever hockey starts up. I guess one good thing about the lockout is that Kesler has more time to heal and doesn't feel rushed to get back. If he can revert back to his form from a couple of years ago your team could be in cup contention again IMO.

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12-20-2012, 05:00 PM
  #632
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Originally Posted by Bryanbryoil View Post
We won't be really challenging your team for at least another year or two IMO. They should still be among the best in the NHL whenever hockey starts up. I guess one good thing about the lockout is that Kesler has more time to heal and doesn't feel rushed to get back. If he can revert back to his form from a couple of years ago your team could be in cup contention again IMO.

id say it will be three years at least until the oilers can best the canucks i dont think they need kesler to revert back to be in cup contention their pretty stacked now and at least for a few years they should be in the top 5 favourites for a couple years.

back on topic schultz is looking sick this year a ton of potential the only already drafted offensive d id take over him is hamilton right now

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12-20-2012, 07:34 PM
  #633
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Originally Posted by Bryanbryoil View Post
Scouting skills? By all means tell me your credentials. Craig Button compared Schultz to Doughty (FTR I am not, Doughty is much thicker, stronger, plays more physical, has a better onetimer, etc.) but that is the caliber of player that he thought that Schultz could be. I am no scout, however when a defenseman passes the puck as well or better than a NHL forward on his team that led his team in scoring last year who also happened to have 42 assists last year, and he also has a wrist shot that rivals that same player if not exceeds it in terms of velocity while also being a superior skater, having similar vision, and reads the play in the O zone exceptionally well, I think that we have a special player on our hands. But since you are the scout and the voice of reason tell me what I should think.
Man I knew that phrase would just be the focal point but here goes.

I'm not a scout but scouts aren't attached to players and sometimes like to go see players without a list of names-numbers to see who actually stands out as they makes notes...ect.

I like to look for as much information as possible about players, especially those that I have not seen and am critical in the source, ie is it a fan spouting 10-12 shooting % in the NHL or talking about elite NHL skills right now or is it a more objective view of the player, therefore more probable conclusions.

We don't know what type of player Schultz will exactly turn out to be in the NHL yet, especially on the defensive side.

On offense we can make some reasonable projections and ranges but seriously talk of 10-12% shooting and elite (which is top 3,5 or 10 at the most otherwise elite loses it's meaning NHL skills) based on a terrific yet unsustainable start is on the outside edge of his range of outcomes.

If he had only 15 points and was shooting 5% at this point my NHL projections and expectations wouldn't change.


People are forgetting the environment here as well. Schultz is an 08 draft and is in his 1st pro season he has something to prove/might be more advanced/more motivated ect than RNH who is an 11 draft and just going through the motions here.

I haven't seen every shift of these 2 guys this year but I will go out on a limb and say that RNH is hands down going to be the better play maker of the two, which is of course subjective passing from the D position is quite different than from the center position for anyone who has played both positions can tell you that.

People can make all sort of expectations and desires known about their favorite prospects but they should also keep it within reason and when stats, real NHL stats are provided, they should sit back and at least think about how fanatic they are being IMO.

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12-20-2012, 07:39 PM
  #634
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Originally Posted by Bryanbryoil View Post
Well we have the 3 guys that were rated by most to be the top player in their draft at the time of their draft and to this point that hasn't been proven wrong albeit it's still early in their careers. Then we have Eberle who is the farthest ahead in his development and arguably has the best hands of the group. Then lastly Schultz who has a ton of skill and who reads the play exceptionally well in the O zone. I don't care if people want to accept it or not, we have 5 future potential allstar caliber players that will lace 'em up for us the next time that the NHL starts up as long as the league isn't blown up.
Well if you mean post season all stars there are 10 spots every year.

I'll say the group of 5 gets less than 5 of those spots over their careers. You want the over?

If you mean making the all star game then that's more reasonable IMO.

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12-20-2012, 07:50 PM
  #635
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Originally Posted by Hardyvan123 View Post
Man I knew that phrase would just be the focal point but here goes.

I'm not a scout but scouts aren't attached to players and sometimes like to go see players without a list of names-numbers to see who actually stands out as they makes notes...ect.

I like to look for as much information as possible about players, especially those that I have not seen and am critical in the source, ie is it a fan spouting 10-12 shooting % in the NHL or talking about elite NHL skills right now or is it a more objective view of the player, therefore more probable conclusions.

We don't know what type of player Schultz will exactly turn out to be in the NHL yet, especially on the defensive side.

On offense we can make some reasonable projections and ranges but seriously talk of 10-12% shooting and elite (which is top 3,5 or 10 at the most otherwise elite loses it's meaning NHL skills) based on a terrific yet unsustainable start is on the outside edge of his range of outcomes.

If he had only 15 points and was shooting 5% at this point my NHL projections and expectations wouldn't change.


People are forgetting the environment here as well. Schultz is an 08 draft and is in his 1st pro season he has something to prove/might be more advanced/more motivated ect than RNH who is an 11 draft and just going through the motions here.

I haven't seen every shift of these 2 guys this year but I will go out on a limb and say that RNH is hands down going to be the better play maker of the two, which is of course subjective passing from the D position is quite different than from the center position for anyone who has played both positions can tell you that.

People can make all sort of expectations and desires known about their favorite prospects but they should also keep it within reason and when stats, real NHL stats are provided, they should sit back and at least think about how fanatic they are being IMO.
Any particular reason why you are trying so hard to discount Schultz? Or is it because he just happens to be a) an Oilers prospect b) living up to hype [at least in the AHL] and c) you're a Nucks fan?

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12-20-2012, 08:00 PM
  #636
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its obviously because hes a canucks fan lol

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12-20-2012, 08:41 PM
  #637
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hardyvan123 View Post
Man I knew that phrase would just be the focal point but here goes.

I'm not a scout but scouts aren't attached to players and sometimes like to go see players without a list of names-numbers to see who actually stands out as they makes notes...ect.

I like to look for as much information as possible about players, especially those that I have not seen and am critical in the source, ie is it a fan spouting 10-12 shooting % in the NHL or talking about elite NHL skills right now or is it a more objective view of the player, therefore more probable conclusions.

We don't know what type of player Schultz will exactly turn out to be in the NHL yet, especially on the defensive side.

On offense we can make some reasonable projections and ranges but seriously talk of 10-12% shooting and elite (which is top 3,5 or 10 at the most otherwise elite loses it's meaning NHL skills) based on a terrific yet unsustainable start is on the outside edge of his range of outcomes.

If he had only 15 points and was shooting 5% at this point my NHL projections and expectations wouldn't change.


People are forgetting the environment here as well. Schultz is an 08 draft and is in his 1st pro season he has something to prove/might be more advanced/more motivated ect than RNH who is an 11 draft and just going through the motions here.

I haven't seen every shift of these 2 guys this year but I will go out on a limb and say that RNH is hands down going to be the better play maker of the two, which is of course subjective passing from the D position is quite different than from the center position for anyone who has played both positions can tell you that.

People can make all sort of expectations and desires known about their favorite prospects but they should also keep it within reason and when stats, real NHL stats are provided, they should sit back and at least think about how fanatic they are being IMO.
I don't know what else to tell you, he has an elite wrist shot in terms of velocity and accuracy for a d-man. He reads the play in the O zone in an elite way and knows exactly when to jump in or jump back. He has an elite ability to get the puck through to the net. These are his elite traits, Then you have many other parts of his game that are just exceptional, they include his skating, passing, and vision. Also I'm not sure why you are throwing RNH into this? RNH is the best passer on the team period. You are acting as if 22 year old d-men usually step in and make this kind of an impact. The league is better than usual, there are many NHL caliber players in the AHL right now both defensively and offensively as well as goaltenders. No matter how you slice it Schultz has been exceptional, sustainable or not, how often do you see defensemen leading their league in scoring more than 1/3 of the way into a season? How about how often do you see a defenseman 4th in league goals more than 1/3 of the way through the season? If people cannot realize this player for what he is then again they are trying to over analyze things and waiting for the other shoe to drop. To that I say keep on waiting and scratching your head while he continues to rack up the points.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hardyvan123 View Post
Well if you mean post season all stars there are 10 spots every year.

I'll say the group of 5 gets less than 5 of those spots over their careers. You want the over?

If you mean making the all star game then that's more reasonable IMO.
Did I say postseason allstars? Last I checked the only postseason award worth a damn is the Conn Smythe or hoisting the cup. Are you saying that Eberle, Hall, RNH, Yakupov, and Schultz combined will play in less than 5 regular season allstar games?

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Originally Posted by Rhino Rilley View Post
id say it will be three years at least until the oilers can best the canucks i dont think they need kesler to revert back to be in cup contention their pretty stacked now and at least for a few years they should be in the top 5 favourites for a couple years.

back on topic schultz is looking sick this year a ton of potential the only already drafted offensive d id take over him is hamilton right now
I'm not 100% sure that the Canucks will remain an elite team that long if Kesler doesn't bounce back. That said the very well could be better than the Oilers for the next 3 years. That'll depend on a number of factors.

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12-20-2012, 09:33 PM
  #638
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its obviously because hes a canucks fan lol
'twas an honest question actually. That poster seemed so determined to make Schultz look "meh" in his discussions...like he's nothing special.

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12-20-2012, 10:42 PM
  #639
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Any particular reason why you are trying so hard to discount Schultz? Or is it because he just happens to be a) an Oilers prospect b) living up to hype [at least in the AHL] and c) you're a Nucks fan?
A) I don't have a problem with any team or their prospects
B) he is off to an exceptional start in exceptional circumstances, its the inference of immediate NHL success and the terms elite and shooting % of 10-12% that doesn't correlate to what actually has happened in the NHL post lockout. It's possible but it's also extremely unlikely as well.
C) I live in Vancouver and am a fan of hockey 1st, used to be a die hard Canucks fan as a kid but always appreciated good play and players and still do, if anything I'm anti fanatic (and there are plenty of those guys in Van as well).

All of my posts have been in direct response to some outrageous claims, well at least IMO.

How am I discounting Schultz anyways did you actually read my posts or is it an automatic discount that I don't believe that he is NHL elite right now?

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Originally Posted by Bryanbryoil View Post
I don't know what else to tell you, he has an elite wrist shot in terms of velocity and accuracy for a d-man. He reads the play in the O zone in an elite way and knows exactly when to jump in or jump back. He has an elite ability to get the puck through to the net. These are his elite traits, Then you have many other parts of his game that are just exceptional, they include his skating, passing, and vision. Also I'm not sure why you are throwing RNH into this? RNH is the best passer on the team period. You are acting as if 22 year old d-men usually step in and make this kind of an impact. The league is better than usual, there are many NHL caliber players in the AHL right now both defensively and offensively as well as goaltenders. No matter how you slice it Schultz has been exceptional, sustainable or not, how often do you see defensemen leading their league in scoring more than 1/3 of the way into a season? How about how often do you see a defenseman 4th in league goals more than 1/3 of the way through the season? If people cannot realize this player for what he is then again they are trying to over analyze things and waiting for the other shoe to drop. To that I say keep on waiting and scratching your head while he continues to rack up the points.
The word elite keeps getting thrown out, exactly how exclusive is that term to you or is it just a description of elite for AHL? Lots of guys look elite in lower elvels but only a few pull it off in the NHL.

The AHL is indeed very different this year and it's not like playing with RNH, Hall and Eberle is going to hurt Schultz in the offensive zone is it? those guys would not be playing in the AHL and if Schultz was, which would be unlikely IMO as he is NHL ready, he wouldn't be on the pace he is at right now IMO.

Quote:
Did I say postseason allstars? Last I checked the only postseason award worth a damn is the Conn Smythe or hoisting the cup. Are you saying that Eberle, Hall, RNH, Yakupov, and Schultz combined will play in less than 5 regular season allstar games?
You said all stars which usually refers to the post season types, that why I asked. Elite players make all star teams, good to excellent make all star games huge difference that why it's good to note the difference.

Sure they will make more than 5 combined. Not sure what that tells us though, take any team that picks 1st 3 years in a row and those guys should make 5 all star teams in their careers IMO.


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'twas an honest question actually. That poster seemed so determined to make Schultz look "meh" in his discussions...like he's nothing special.
See this is what I don't get. Nowhere did I say that he is going to be a 4th or 5th Dman in the NHL.

It's not a "either you buy my hype or you are saying he is meh type" of equation here.

The hype is just that and way overboard by several posters here.

If not buying the hype or drinking the koo-laid is downplaying Schultz then guilty but then you aren't taking the discussion seriously then either it's more of an argument you would find 2 7th graders having.

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12-20-2012, 11:29 PM
  #640
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Has a defenseman ever led the AHL in points before? If he does something never done before, I'd say that's pretty special. He may not get there, but he's got a good chance to break all the defenseman point records as a first year pro.

It's tough not to be pretty excited about his future.

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12-20-2012, 11:48 PM
  #641
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I don't think it's been done before. Off the top of my head, I know Andy Delmore had 70 something points in 60 some odd games about 6 years ago. The next highest I can think off right away is Johnny Boychuk, who had 20 goals and 65 points a few years ago for Providence. I'm pretty sure both won the Eddie Shore award in those seasons.

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12-21-2012, 12:08 AM
  #642
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Can't say enough how jealous I am at edmonton for picking this guy up. I'm excited to see what he can do at the NHL level.

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12-21-2012, 11:39 AM
  #643
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I don't think it's been done before. Off the top of my head, I know Andy Delmore had 70 something points in 60 some odd games about 6 years ago. The next highest I can think off right away is Johnny Boychuk, who had 20 goals and 65 points a few years ago for Providence. I'm pretty sure both won the Eddie Shore award in those seasons.
Chris Snell had 96 pts in 76 games in 1993-1994, but that was only good for 9th in the league.

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12-22-2012, 01:23 PM
  #644
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With roughly 45% of his points coming on the pop he should fit right in on edm

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12-22-2012, 02:06 PM
  #645
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With roughly 45% of his points coming on the pop he should fit right in on edm
Here are the percentages of pp points of some of the top dmen in the NHL:
Cambell 58%
Suter 57%
Phaneuf 51%
Lidstrom 50%
Timonen 49%
Streit 49%
Pietrangelo 48%
Weber was 47%
Edler 46%
------------------------------------
Letang 38%
Doughty 36%
Karlsson 36%
Chara 35%
Boyle 35%
Keith 34%
Yandle 26%

Looks like he would fit right in with a lot of teams.

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12-22-2012, 03:02 PM
  #646
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Here are the percentages of pp points of some of the top dmen in the NHL:
Cambell 58%
Suter 57%
Phaneuf 51%
Lidstrom 50%
Timonen 49%
Streit 49%
Pietrangelo 48%
Weber was 47%
Edler 46%
------------------------------------
Letang 38%
Doughty 36%
Karlsson 36%
Chara 35%
Boyle 35%
Keith 34%
Yandle 26%

Looks like he would fit right in with a lot of teams.
Just meant because edm has a good pp.

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12-22-2012, 04:35 PM
  #647
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Just meant because edm has a good pp.
I honestly thought that you were stirring the pot with that comment at first, that said he is a dynamic PP player on a team with 4 other dynamic PP players. We run our top PP unit with only 1 defenseman so that means that we could potentially see a top PP unit of Schultz, Eberle, Hall, Yakupov, and RNH. At least 4 of them will be on the top unit.

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12-22-2012, 04:47 PM
  #648
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Originally Posted by VeddarRants View Post
Off the top of my head, I know Any Elmore had 70 something points in 60 some odd games
You must be new here, bro. Fixed.

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12-22-2012, 07:24 PM
  #649
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Just an update, 5 minutes into tonight's game. Schultz has his 15th goal of the season (3rd highest) and 39th point (tied for first overall with Eberle) in his 28th game played.

Edit: got his 2nd goal of the first as I was posting this. 16 goals and 40 points.

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12-23-2012, 02:52 AM
  #650
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Just an update, 5 minutes into tonight's game. Schultz has his 15th goal of the season (3rd highest) and 39th point (tied for first overall with Eberle) in his 28th game played.

Edit: got his 2nd goal of the first as I was posting this. 16 goals and 40 points.
4 goals from tying the AHL rookie record by a defenseman.

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