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AAA 2012 Draft

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Old
11-09-2012, 05:01 PM
  #351
seventieslord
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We're going to go ahead and select our #4 defenseman. An all-around defenseman, he will patrol the 2nd pairing with Doug Lidster.

Mark Hardy

Hardy, who plays the physical game Lidster doesn't, makes an appropriate partner for him. This pair of 900 game, 22 minute players are expected to man the 2nd ES pairing, 2nd PP unit and 2nd PK unit.


from last year:
---------------------



The Swiss-born Hardy is mostly known as a King and a Ranger. History has almost forgotten this 915-game player as he's yet another defenseman whose career started between 1977 and 1984 who had over 350 points.

With a career average of 22.50 minutes per game, Hardy was far from nondescript. He's one of the highest-scoring defenseman left out there, partially due to compiling, partially due to a strong peak: Hardy scored 30 points six times, 40 points three times, and had a career high of 53 points in the 1985 season, peaking at 17th & 20th in the league among defensemen.

With that kind of offensive peak, he's far from an offensive star, but it shows he knew how to work the puck. He was not known as a shutdown guy, but certainly not a liability. He was not a huge bodychecker but he was rugged and solid. In short: He did everything well, nothing elite. Which probably helps to explain why he's still available - he doesn't perfectly fill any particular "role", but why penalize him for being too much of an all-around guy? There's a bit of Pavel Kubina in his resume. he was just a well-balanced, NHL-level minute muncher for 15 years.

Having been on the ice for 37% of his team's PPGF, and 44% of PPGA, Hardy qualifies as a special teams beast.

Hardy's last full season was 1993. At age 33, there were just 37 players in the league that old, as longevity had not become en vogue quite yet. Playing to that age was clearly something only the better players could do, as 34 of those 37 players have been drafted. The other 3 were Hardy, late blooming plugger Pat Conacher, and a career 19-minute D-man.

Hardy's career path is fairly impressive in terms of where he ranked on the depth chart and who he played behind:

1981: 3rd on LA behind Murphy and Korab
1982: 1st on LA (Murphy, Korab, Turnbull)
1983: 1st on LA (Murphy, Korab, Lewis) - 13th in the NHL in TOI
1984: 1st on LA (Engblom, McEwen) - 5th in the NHL in TOI
1985: 1st on LA (Engblom, Galley, ********)
1986: 1st on LA (Engblom, ********, Galley) - 11th in the NHL in TOI
1987: 1st on LA (********, Duchesne, Galley)

1988: 2nd on LA behind Duchesne
1989: 5th on NYR
1990: 3rd on NYR behind Leetch & Patrick
1991: 5th on NYR
1992: 5th on NYR
1993: 5th on LA in finals run

Although LA averaged just 66 points from 1982-1987, Hardy was their #1 defenseman the whole time. That's pretty impressive.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Complete Handbook Of Pro Hockey 1983
has made consistent improvement in first three seasons... team's most consistent backliner... upped point total to 45 and played sound defensive hockey... stong skater with good speed...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Complete Handbook Of Pro Hockey 1985
strong skater, good puckhandler who has developed into competent big-league backliner... excellent shot from the point... has improved consierably defensively in past few seasons...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Complete Handbook Of Pro Hockey 1986
rugged defenseman who dishes out jolting bodychecks to opposing forwards.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockey Scouting Report 1986-87
Hardy is a strong skater, well balanced and equipped with a good burst of speed... fairly agile when carrying the puck,,, makes a good point man on the PP... his shot is low and hard and is excellent for tip-ins or deflections... Mark has improved his defense, playing his position better and taking less chances... he forces the play wide by using his defensive angles and no longer wanders from his position, and is more prudent in his rushes and his pinching... adept at moving the puck from his end quickly and has developed the poise to make the right pass, not just a fast one... plays a physical game whenever possible and will dish out checks whenever he can... he has good strength along the boards and corners, and can take his man out and hold him out... fairly effective in front of the net, but that area is not really his game. He is best at hitting and gaining the puck, and then moving it, not continually battling with the oppositon.... a consistent force on the backline, and has tuned up his defense, though he is still an offensive-minded defenseman... a solid two-way defenseman.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pro Set 1990-91
Injuries to ankle, foot, knee and ribs cut into Mark's 1989-90 season, but he came back strong this season. Mark is outstanding at blocking shots, hitting, and playing positional defense, and was sorely missed last season.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockey Scouting Report 1991-92
Three assets make Hardy valuable: he can skate, he has experience and he has a good handle on the game... he may have lost some speed, but he is very smooth on his feet... his role has changed over the years... mostly a finesse player, but does not shy away from physical confrontations. He goes to the corner, he battles in front of the net. His fighting days are over, but he plays the body and plays an efficient physical game... he is not done yet. He can still help a team.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pinnacle 1991-92
Mark was playing the best hockey of his career during the first half of 1991-92... a solid defender who enjoys taking the body...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Score 1992-93
Mark was leading the Rangers with a +22 when he suffered a separated shoulder midway through 1991-92. It was a tough break for the steady defender, who was playing the best hockey of his career... a good positional player, Mark is a willing shot blocker.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pinnacle 1992-93
Mark's an experienced defenseman who always works hard for his goaltender. He's very efficient in blocking shots, clearing men from the crease or dumping the puck out of the zone.


Last edited by seventieslord: 11-24-2012 at 02:09 AM.
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Old
11-09-2012, 05:16 PM
  #352
Dreakmur
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I think you're under-selling his physical game a little bit. He didn't throw his weight around a ton, but he did lay some nasty one out there, including one of the best of all time....

BOOOM!!!

As a fighter, he wasn't a heavyweight, but he was never affraid to go with them. Marty McSorely, Wendel Clark, Clark Gillis, Chris Nilan, Shane Churla, and a few other mosters were among his dance partners.

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11-09-2012, 05:25 PM
  #353
tony d
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St.John's uses it's next pick to select Left Winger Rick Dudley



Though Dudley was a guy who did more in the WHA than he did in the NHL, he was still someone that played a very determined game. He'll slide in on my 2nd line with Malecek and Glover.

Next has been pmed.

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Old
11-09-2012, 05:38 PM
  #354
seventieslord
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dreakmur View Post
I think you're under-selling his physical game a little bit. He didn't throw his weight around a ton, but he did lay some nasty one out there, including one of the best of all time....

BOOOM!!!

As a fighter, he wasn't a heavyweight, but he was never affraid to go with them. Marty McSorely, Wendel Clark, Clark Gillis, Chris Nilan, Shane Churla, and a few other mosters were among his dance partners.
You're probably right; this line:

Quote:
He was not a huge bodychecker but he was rugged and solid
is an undersell.

Now here's an oversell: I think he might be the best Swiss blueliner of all-time

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11-09-2012, 05:42 PM
  #355
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I'll take C Christian Ruuttu

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11-10-2012, 08:48 AM
  #356
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I'm up now that chaos has been skipped. I'll pick shortly.

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11-10-2012, 08:53 AM
  #357
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Dmitri Mironov, D


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11-10-2012, 09:43 AM
  #358
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Velociraptor View Post
Dmitri Mironov, D

I'm glad I decided not to hope for him to fall to the next round. Good pick!

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11-10-2012, 10:58 AM
  #359
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121 Mike Farkas - Buffalo Mugwumps - Ron Murphy, W
122 BudsBuster - Birmingham Barracudas - Daymond Langkow, C
123 tarheelhockey - Macon Whoopee - Donald Audette, RW
124 jkrx & Hobnobs - Sheffield Steelers - Jim Fox, RW
125 Hedberg - Fort Saskatchewan Traders - James Neal, LW
126 seventieslord & Dreakmur - Regina Pat Canadians - Mark Hardy, D
127 tony d - St. John's Monsters - Rick Dudley, LW
128 Bring Back Scuderi - Pittsburgh Professionals - Christian Ruuttu, C/LW
129 chaosrevolver - Belleville Bulls - SKIPPED
130 Velociraptor - Utah Grizzlies - Dmitri Mironov, D
131 Johnny Engine - St. John's Ice Caps - ON THE CLOCK UNTIL 1:53PM EST
132 BillyShoe1721 - EHC Eisbären Berlin -

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11-10-2012, 12:15 PM
  #360
seventieslord
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BillyShoe1721 View Post
121 Mike Farkas - Buffalo Mugwumps - Ron Murphy, W
122 BudsBuster - Birmingham Barracudas - Daymond Langkow, C
123 tarheelhockey - Macon Whoopee - Donald Audette, RW
124 jkrx & Hobnobs - Sheffield Steelers - Jim Fox, RW
125 Hedberg - Fort Saskatchewan Traders - James Neal, LW
126 seventieslord & Dreakmur - Regina Pat Canadians - Mark Hardy, D
127 tony d - St. John's Monsters - Rick Dudley, LW
128 Bring Back Scuderi - Pittsburgh Professionals - Christian Ruuttu, C/LW
129 chaosrevolver - Belleville Bulls - SKIPPED
130 Velociraptor - Utah Grizzlies - Dmitri Mironov, D
131 Johnny Engine - St. John's Ice Caps - ON THE CLOCK UNTIL 1:53PM EST
132 BillyShoe1721 - EHC Eisbären Berlin -
chaos was skipped at 10:42 PM.
Raptor was skipped at 2:42 AM. (made up his pick later)
Johnny engine was skipped at 6:42 AM.
You were skipped at 10:42, EST.
Johnny Engine is auto skipped.
Raptor is back up.

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11-10-2012, 02:54 PM
  #361
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We'll grab center Greg Malone and versatile forward Dan Cleary. Raptor is still up I guess.

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11-10-2012, 05:22 PM
  #362
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Eric Daze, LW


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11-10-2012, 05:56 PM
  #363
Rob Scuderi
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LW Bep Guidolin

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11-10-2012, 10:27 PM
  #364
tony d
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St.John's Monsters start off their checking 3rd line with the selection of centre Laurie Boschman



A strong 2-way player Boschman will provide a good defensive game for my lineup but also chip in on offense (He had 577 points in 1009 career games).

Next has been pmed.

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11-10-2012, 10:56 PM
  #365
seventieslord
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tony d View Post
St.John's Monsters start off their checking 3rd line with the selection of centre Laurie Boschman



A strong 2-way player Boschman will provide a good defensive game for my lineup but also chip in on offense (He had 577 points in 1009 career games).

Next has been pmed.
We weren't going to take him on this pick, but we wanted him to play on our 4th line. I was just showing dreakmur today some of the stuff I had on him:

Quote:
aggressive, abrasive, not particularly fast but adequate scorer, hard-nosed, strong defensively, hard working... strong scorer with bellicose approach... forceful, aggressive game and is willing to fight... rival players regard him as a fierce competitor... plays effectively as center with or without the puck... feisty... scourge of goaltenders he pesters and bumps... critics say he overhandles the puck... makes his best plays in heavy traffic...

that's all from the early-mid 80s in the zander hollander reports. This is from the late 80s, and too much to type out:

https://dl.dropbox.com/u/28241305/Boschman.zip

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11-10-2012, 11:31 PM
  #366
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We're going to take a player with an unfair stigma attached, the result of coming to Toronto with high expectations attached and disappointing us badly. But there is a lot to like:

- easily the best sustained offensive upside of post-expansion wingers remaining: Seven seasons with 56-73 points between 1992 and 1999
- good defensively
- good size, adequate physically
- can play all three forward positions
- incredible career adjusted +/- of +191

Dimitri Khristich, F



We aren't sure exactly what to do with him yet, but he was too good to pass up. He can be the defensive conscience RW on our 2nd line, he can be the guy who adds some offensive punch to our 3rd line from either wing, or he can be the 4th line center between a couple of bruisers.

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11-11-2012, 02:06 AM
  #367
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seventieslord View Post
We're going to take a player with an unfair stigma attached, the result of coming to Toronto with high expectations attached and disappointing us badly. But there is a lot to like:

- easily the best sustained offensive upside of post-expansion wingers remaining: Seven seasons with 56-73 points between 1992 and 1999
- good defensively
- good size, adequate physically
- can play all three forward positions
- incredible career adjusted +/- of +191

Dimitri Khristich, F



We aren't sure exactly what to do with him yet, but he was too good to pass up. He can be the defensive conscience RW on our 2nd line, he can be the guy who adds some offensive punch to our 3rd line from either wing, or he can be the 4th line center between a couple of bruisers.
I'm not at all buying Khristich as being able to serve as the defensive conscious on a line with Prospal and Bullard and believe that line will be close to adequate defensively. If he's on the 3rd line, he'll be elite offensively among 3rd liners, but a defensive conscious in the top 6? I don't see it.

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11-11-2012, 02:39 AM
  #368
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BillyShoe1721 View Post
I'm not at all buying Khristich as being able to serve as the defensive conscious on a line with Prospal and Bullard and believe that line will be close to adequate defensively. If he's on the 3rd line, he'll be elite offensively among 3rd liners, but a defensive conscious in the top 6? I don't see it.
Why can't a well known good 2-way player act as a defensive consience?

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11-11-2012, 09:53 AM
  #369
seventieslord
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BillyShoe1721 View Post
I'm not at all buying Khristich as being able to serve as the defensive conscious on a line with Prospal and Bullard and believe that line will be close to adequate defensively. If he's on the 3rd line, he'll be elite offensively among 3rd liners, but a defensive conscious in the top 6? I don't see it.
Would it be rude of me to say "look at what happened the last time you questioned me"?

seriously. Khristich is very good defensively for a scoring line; I would put him in the top-10 in this draft. Only Murray Balfour, Mike Murphy, Johnny Sheppard, Walt McKechnie, Ron Schock, Mac Colville, and Doug Brown are definitely better, and then a few guys like McEachern, Raleigh, Eklund, Ron Murphy, Pominville, Herbert Russell, Daymond Langkow, and Freddy Modin are in the same relative class, but I'd put most of them behind Khristich considering every scouting report ever says he is good defensively, right from the start of his career to the end.

I know it must be hard to believe that the guy who rose to the top of the pack of offensive players wasn't a Petr Nedved or Josef Stumpel-type one-dimensional player, but that's exactly what happened.

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11-11-2012, 09:59 AM
  #370
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BillyShoe1721 View Post
I'm not at all buying Khristich as being able to serve as the defensive conscious on a line with Prospal and Bullard and believe that line will be close to adequate defensively. If he's on the 3rd line, he'll be elite offensively among 3rd liners, but a defensive conscious in the top 6? I don't see it.
I think the biggest issue with a Prospal-Bullard-Khristich line would be that they would avoid corners like the plague. Bullard was decently tough, but he was also known as selfish and the read I got was that he was a guy who would fight to get goals in tight but not necessarily do much battling in corners - something of a much lesser Ciccarelli.

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11-11-2012, 10:04 AM
  #371
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seventieslord View Post
Would it be rude of me to say "look at what happened the last time you questioned me"?

seriously. Khristich is very good defensively for a scoring line; I would put him in the top-10 in this draft. Only Murray Balfour, Mike Murphy, Johnny Sheppard, Walt McKechnie, Ron Schock, Mac Colville, and Doug Brown are definitely better, and then a few guys like McEachern, Raleigh, Eklund, Ron Murphy, Pominville, Herbert Russell, Daymond Langkow, and Freddy Modin are in the same relative class, but I'd put most of them behind Khristich considering every scouting report ever says he is good defensively, right from the start of his career to the end.

I know it must be hard to believe that the guy who rose to the top of the pack of offensive players wasn't a Petr Nedved or Josef Stumpel-type one-dimensional player, but that's exactly what happened.
When was the last time I questioned you? I don't remember. From the research I've done on Khristich, nothing much comes up in terms of his defensive play. I very well could be wrong, but I didn't find much. Personally, I'd rather have a guy that was better defensively, but worse offensively next to Prospal and Bullard, but as you said earlier, RW is a very thin position at this point.

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11-11-2012, 12:10 PM
  #372
seventieslord
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheDevilMadeMe View Post
I think the biggest issue with a Prospal-Bullard-Khristich line would be that they would avoid corners like the plague. Bullard was decently tough, but he was also known as selfish and the read I got was that he was a guy who would fight to get goals in tight but not necessarily do much battling in corners - something of a much lesser Ciccarelli.
Bullard was hit and miss in that regard. When I have time to post full scouting reports, I will.

Also, selfish may not be the word for Bullard. I get that he was a goal scoring center who wasn't great defensively (and I realize those are selfish tendencies), but I've read he was a very likeable and coachable player.

Prospal and Khristich both dig. Khristich in particular was very good at protecting the puck.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BillyShoe1721 View Post
When was the last time I questioned you? I don't remember. From the research I've done on Khristich, nothing much comes up in terms of his defensive play. I very well could be wrong, but I didn't find much. Personally, I'd rather have a guy that was better defensively, but worse offensively next to Prospal and Bullard, but as you said earlier, RW is a very thin position at this point.
I was referring to just a few days ago when we picked Greg Adams.

The problem with the next statement is that no one available who is even close to Khristich offensively is any good defensively, and anyone who is any good defensively is not remotely close to him offensively. No player is 100% ideal and that includes Khristich, but I think he was the best possible option and should have been taken a long time ago as a prime scorer in this draft, not as a guy who we all hum and haw about whether he's good enough defensively to be a complementary player.


Last edited by seventieslord: 11-11-2012 at 12:28 PM.
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11-11-2012, 12:40 PM
  #373
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I guess im on the clock, select RW, Bill Hicke

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11-11-2012, 12:48 PM
  #374
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Fort Saskatchewan selects C Billy Harris


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11-11-2012, 01:20 PM
  #375
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheDevilMadeMe View Post
I think the biggest issue with a Prospal-Bullard-Khristich line would be that they would avoid corners like the plague. Bullard was decently tough, but he was also known as selfish and the read I got was that he was a guy who would fight to get goals in tight but not necessarily do much battling in corners - something of a much lesser Ciccarelli.
Both Prospal and Khristich were willing battlers. Neither is going to get confused with Bert Olmstead, but they are certainly not going to avoid the corners.

Here are their bios:
http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/sh...81&postcount=5
http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/sh...9&postcount=20

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