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10-31-2012, 12:52 AM
  #376
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Originally Posted by me2 View Post
Penguins IMHO. The finished as well as any team and nearly won east and the PT without Crosby for 75% of it. They romp home with the East and the PT with Crosby for a whole season.



Their system were similar enough and cancelled out any systems advantage and the Hitchcock effect got taken out out the equation. It came down to which team had more talent and the Blues got exposed.
You think Kessel can score PPG in playoffs against the Penguins? I agree.

Yeah, LA had much more top-6 talent than the Kings which came in handy. I was mainly referring to the season series between the two which LA unsurprisingly dominated.

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10-31-2012, 12:59 AM
  #377
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Originally Posted by Sam Slick View Post
Hey Bleach....Playoff scoring is up .3 goals per game this year over any season in the past 10 years.

Its not a huge increase, but its an increase none the less. So, teams are in fact, scoring more in the playoffs. So that kinda puts a damper on your obstruction theory. But, I will say this, I will agree with you on that point when certain teams are playing a trap system other teams are playing an obstruction system. In Basketball they call it a pick.

I don't imagine the scoring rate would change all the much, it would just mean the different style is favoured. For example, if cycle teams have the advantage, they score and the skill teams score less. In a more free flowing environment, the skill teams score more and the cycle teams less. In the end, it should balance out though.


The real problem comes in when the skill teams morph into adopting a "slower" style. Then the game just slowly devolves the more emphasis placed on obstruction and slowing the play down.

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10-31-2012, 01:05 AM
  #378
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Gillis has said he prefers the offensive system, and he believes the league prefers an offensive system. I prefer a high-octane offensive system as well. We have Kassian, Booth, Burrows, Kesler, Hansen, etc playing physically, adding a pure ppg skill player with no losses off our roster isn't going to harm us in any way, shape, or form. Obviously I'd prefer a player like Perry, but Kessel is still elite offensive talent.

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10-31-2012, 10:51 AM
  #379
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Originally Posted by Vankiller Whale View Post
Gillis has said he prefers the offensive system, and he believes the league prefers an offensive system. I prefer a high-octane offensive system as well. We have Kassian, Booth, Burrows, Kesler, Hansen, etc playing physically, adding a pure ppg skill player with no losses off our roster isn't going to harm us in any way, shape, or form. Obviously I'd prefer a player like Perry, but Kessel is still elite offensive talent.


Adding a pure skill player at the expense of Schneider is a no go. Only the latter will carry his effectiveness over to the post-season in this environment.


Kessel's contract also means he's not here for long.


Focusing on offense is great. Doing it at the expense of better goaltending is not.

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10-31-2012, 12:22 PM
  #380
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Originally Posted by Vankiller Whale View Post
Gillis has said he prefers the offensive system, and he believes the league prefers an offensive system. I prefer a high-octane offensive system as well. We have Kassian, Booth, Burrows, Kesler, Hansen, etc playing physically, adding a pure ppg skill player with no losses off our roster isn't going to harm us in any way, shape, or form. Obviously I'd prefer a player like Perry, but Kessel is still elite offensive talent.
I agree the team needs a sniper, but I don't have confidence that Kessel would do as well in the Western Conference. He would get shut down just like the Sedins. We need a more rugged player, like a Bobby Ryan, Perry, Hartnel or James Neal type (Not that those players would be available).

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10-31-2012, 12:52 PM
  #381
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I do not think it's realistic to think we can build a second line good enough to take the number 1 pair away from the twins. IMO we need to figure out a way for them to beat that matchup.
seems to me that during the 2011 playoffs, Kesler's line took the #1 pair away from the twins.

Not just in the Nashville series either.

Game 7 against Chicago, Keith and Seabrook took as many or more shifts against Kesler and Burrows as they did against the Twins.

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10-31-2012, 01:03 PM
  #382
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Originally Posted by arsmaster View Post
seems to me that during the 2011 playoffs, Kesler's line took the #1 pair away from the twins.
Where are you getting that from?

Weber/Suter, Keith/Seabrook play about 5 minutes more at even strength per game than Daniel and Henrik, so they're going to take shifts against other lines. I'd be surprised if it was true that they played more against Kes than Hank, that's not how I remember it.

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10-31-2012, 01:08 PM
  #383
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Phew. I am glad Sorcratic told you the stuff you did about that list he gave and you believed him.

Last year Kulemin scored 7 goals in 70 games. Thats about a 10 goal pace on 82 games. The year before last he scored 30. Why the drop you ask? Simple, Kulemin had 2 very close friends die in that plane crash. We in Leaf land all know that. If you check his stats, he has improved every year that he has been in the league. And he is a top 6 rugged forward that is amazing defensively. And by the way, you don't have one player that can compete with his speed. He beat Kessel in the fastest skater comp.

Tyler Biggs has top 9 potential, and he is big and mean.

The first most want is in a deep draft. Everyone knows this....including Burke.

Who knows about the second.

That is a major overpayment from Burke nothing close will be offered to that. Do some homework people.

So I am glad you do not want this deal. It aint happening anyway.
Give me a break about this plane crash BS, Malkin had friends in the crash, Gaborik's best friend is Demitra.

Malkin tore the league apart, and Gaborik scored 40+ goals.

Im pretty sure Jannik Hansen is a cheaper more industrious version of Kulemin.

Kulemin doesn't bump anyone in Vancouver's top 6.
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Thats simple. With Kessel in your lineup the referee goes to the net....to fish the puck out. Kessel is going to be a 50 goal scorer.

But lets take care of one thing right away. Kessel is the leafs best player. He is not going to be offered up in any trade you have to offer us.

Kessel will never be a canuck. Hope and dream all you want.
Ahh...Phil Kessel the 50 goal scorer whose never scored 40....makes me laugh everytime.
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Originally Posted by Sam Slick View Post
Hi Bleach. Normally I like your posts but this one is filled with holes my friend. First, Loungo is 33. I hardly see that as in his prime and I believe there is risk to that fat a$$ed contract.

We drafted 5th overall because Wilson lost the room. Everyone knows that.

But the biggest hole you are totally wrong about is Kessel and the playoffs. He is not the kind to get cancelled out. In 15 playoff games with the Bruins, Kessel has 9 goals and 15 points. And that was as a 20 year old coming off of battling cancer. Kessel thrives in the playoffs.
Oh the 15 game sample...in which he was a healthy scratch during those series'.

Drafted 5th cause Wilson lost the room? Seriously, the same room he had earned an extension in 2 months prior to his firing? LOL.

One more question - What age is considered a goalies prime? 25? 28? 30?

I\d say it's probably a range between 30-35...but that doesn't fit with the Luongo is no good, but we want him for nothing that's been going on for 6 months on these boards for Leaf fans.

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10-31-2012, 01:13 PM
  #384
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Originally Posted by Scurr View Post
Where are you getting that from?

Weber/Suter, Keith/Seabrook play about 5 minutes more at even strength per game than Daniel and Henrik, so they're going to take shifts against other lines. I'd be surprised if it was true that they played more against Kes than Hank, that's not how I remember it.
My eyes!

Burrows opening goal in game 7 against the Hawks, Kesler blows by Keith like he is standing still to set up Burr for the opening goal.

If you can't remember Weber matching against Kesler, I don't know what to say....the Sedin's were horrendous in the Nashville series, and even the Preds knew it...they tried to slow Kesler with Suter and Weber and even that didn't help.

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10-31-2012, 01:17 PM
  #385
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Originally Posted by arsmaster View Post
My eyes!

Burrows opening goal in game 7 against the Hawks, Kesler blows by Keith like he is standing still to set up Burr for the opening goal.

If you can't remember Weber matching against Kesler, I don't know what to say....the Sedin's were horrendous in the Nashville series, and even the Preds knew it...they tried to slow Kesler with Suter and Weber and even that didn't help.
Like I said, the defensemen play more so they're going to see another line. Hopefully someone can dig up the stats so we can see whose eyes are better

http://www.behindthenet.ca/nhl_time_...4+45+46+47+48#

You were right about Chicago, they used Campbell and Hjalmarsson with Bollands line.

Suter and Weber played a significant amount against Kesler but more so against the twins. Hard to say if they got away from the matchup or we did.

I don't think that really effects my point though, status quo hasn't been working for the twins. We need to find a way to help them to produce consistently, Kesler drawing attention hasn't done the trick.


Last edited by Scurr: 10-31-2012 at 01:45 PM.
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10-31-2012, 02:47 PM
  #386
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Originally Posted by Bleach Clean View Post
I don't imagine the scoring rate would change all the much, it would just mean the different style is favoured. For example, if cycle teams have the advantage, they score and the skill teams score less. In a more free flowing environment, the skill teams score more and the cycle teams less. In the end, it should balance out though.


The real problem comes in when the skill teams morph into adopting a "slower" style. Then the game just slowly devolves the more emphasis placed on obstruction and slowing the play down.
Sometimes when I read this I think that you are saying there are teams that don't cycle. In actuallity, all teams have a 2 or 3 man forward rotation cycle. Everyone of them.

Cycling is basic hockey that you learn at the peewee level. Its a strategy, not a tactic. Some teams do it slightly different than other teams, but ALL teams have a cycle in place.

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10-31-2012, 02:51 PM
  #387
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Originally Posted by Sam Slick View Post
Sometimes when I read this I think that you are saying there are teams that don't cycle. In actuallity, all teams have a 2 or 3 man forward rotation cycle. Everyone of them.

Cycling is basic hockey that you learn at the peewee level. Its a strategy, not a tactic. Some teams do it slightly different than other teams, but ALL teams have a cycle in place.
All teams go on offence too, are they all considered offensive teams?

All teams play some defence, are they all considered defensive teams?

Usually a teams bread and butter is used to define them. Some teams are built to grind it out on the cycle, others are built to attack with speed. It doesn't mean you don't do the other.

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10-31-2012, 03:00 PM
  #388
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Like I said, the defensemen play more so they're going to see another line. Hopefully someone can dig up the stats so we can see whose eyes are better

http://www.behindthenet.ca/nhl_time_...4+45+46+47+48#

You were right about Chicago, they used Campbell and Hjalmarsson with Bollands line.

Suter and Weber played a significant amount against Kesler but more so against the twins. Hard to say if they got away from the matchup or we did.

I don't think that really effects my point though, status quo hasn't been working for the twins. We need to find a way to help them to produce consistently, Kesler drawing attention hasn't done the trick.
Key word is consistently.

Kesler has been able to draw attention from the Twins, but its not always enough. Especially when all our lines are losing their matchup.

In the Nashville series (which isn't a great indicator because Kesler was beasting) the Preds did abandon their matching against the Twins. IIRC they even split the Suter/Weber pairing to try and negate Kesler's effectiveness (even Weber couldn't slow the beast that series).

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10-31-2012, 03:13 PM
  #389
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Key word is consistently.

Kesler has been able to draw attention from the Twins, but its not always enough. Especially when all our lines are losing their matchup.

In the Nashville series (which isn't a great indicator because Kesler was beasting) the Preds did abandon their matching against the Twins. IIRC they even split the Suter/Weber pairing to try and negate Kesler's effectiveness (even Weber couldn't slow the beast that series).
I was wrong about them always drawing the top defensive pair but it actually helps make my original point, the twins and Burrows together in the playoffs has not been the same as the regular season. Even when they don't draw the top pair they've struggled to score consistently.

Sammy was a nice alternative because he could score from the high slot when the Sedins drew all the attention down low. I can't get away from how good a fit Kassian could be.


Last edited by Scurr: 10-31-2012 at 04:18 PM.
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10-31-2012, 03:14 PM
  #390
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Give me a break about this plane crash BS, Malkin had friends in the crash, Gaborik's best friend is Demitra.

Malkin tore the league apart, and Gaborik scored 40+ goals.

Im pretty sure Jannik Hansen is a cheaper more industrious version of Kulemin.

Kulemin doesn't bump anyone in Vancouver's top 6.

Ahh...Phil Kessel the 50 goal scorer whose never scored 40....makes me laugh everytime.

Oh the 15 game sample...in which he was a healthy scratch during those series'.

Drafted 5th cause Wilson lost the room? Seriously, the same room he had earned an extension in 2 months prior to his firing? LOL.

One more question - What age is considered a goalies prime? 25? 28? 30?

I\d say it's probably a range between 30-35...but that doesn't fit with the Luongo is no good, but we want him for nothing that's been going on for 6 months on these boards for Leaf fans.
Ok. I will answer in the order in which you have posted.

-Everyone deals with tragedy in different ways. And, did you just compare Kulemin to Gaborik and Malkin? I like Kulemin, but that is just silly.

-Kulemin would infact bump a top 6 player in Vancouver. This is going to come down to you liking your guys over us liking Kulemin. But in hockey terms, Position for position, he might not. Speed wise, i'd put Kulemin up against anyone you have and put good money on him.

-Kessel has scored 11, 19, 36, 30, 32, then 37. He is getting better each year. Do you not think he will hit 50? He scored 82 points this year and now he is a PPG player. let me guess, you will come back with "yea, but he only did it once". Its not like Kessel is 40 and has 20 seasons under his belt. He is still a kid at 25. His next 5 years will be very exciting to watch. And the fact you don't want a guy like that tells me something about your hockey IQ.

-His PPG 15 playoff stat is a PPG stat no matter how you slice it.

-And Wilson did in fact lose the room. This happens you know. Wilson was voted as the coach players least liked to play for. That article came out one week before the colapse. In mid Feb we were in 6th place and the entire year we were there with the best of them. But any loss and Wilson constantly threw the players under the bus calling them out and embarrassing them in the media.
You made my point about him being fired. He lost the room, thats why he was fired.....only 2 months after being extended.

-IMO, a goalie is in his prime between 28 and 32. Thats my opinion.

-As for your Lou comment. I want Lou. There is not a doubt he would help us get into the playoffs. But, I dont want to morgage the future on him. I'd rather take the chance on Reimer and Scrivens if thats the case. They will improve. They are also kids learning. Kessel going to the Canucks is laughable. But I am not willing to give up Reilly, Gardiner, FInn or our first for Lou. We have an issue with Center right now so its not like you will Get Grabovski either. Lups you can have. I think he is done with his career year. Kadri you can have, Bozak i'd rather keep, but you can have if it is a deal breaker. I know MG is high on him....or just hgh. Kessel will not go anywhere and either will Phaneuf. You can have just about anyone on the Marlies except for Colborne and Gards. Colborne is a big strapping center with upside so I cant see Burke moving him.

We will see who is right and who is wrong here. If Lou comes to T.O, i have a feeling many of you will be disappointed.

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10-31-2012, 03:33 PM
  #391
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Ok. I will answer in the order in which you have posted.

-Everyone deals with tragedy in different ways. And, did you just compare Kulemin to Gaborik and Malkin? I like Kulemin, but that is just silly.

-Kulemin would infact bump a top 6 player in Vancouver. This is going to come down to you liking your guys over us liking Kulemin. But in hockey terms, Position for position, he might not. Speed wise, i'd put Kulemin up against anyone you have and put good money on him.

-Kessel has scored 11, 19, 36, 30, 32, then 37. He is getting better each year. Do you not think he will hit 50? He scored 82 points this year and now he is a PPG player. let me guess, you will come back with "yea, but he only did it once". Its not like Kessel is 40 and has 20 seasons under his belt. He is still a kid at 25. His next 5 years will be very exciting to watch. And the fact you don't want a guy like that tells me something about your hockey IQ.

-His PPG 15 playoff stat is a PPG stat no matter how you slice it.

-And Wilson did in fact lose the room. This happens you know. Wilson was voted as the coach players least liked to play for. That article came out one week before the colapse. In mid Feb we were in 6th place and the entire year we were there with the best of them. But any loss and Wilson constantly threw the players under the bus calling them out and embarrassing them in the media.
You made my point about him being fired. He lost the room, thats why he was fired.....only 2 months after being extended.

-IMO, a goalie is in his prime between 28 and 32. Thats my opinion.

-As for your Lou comment. I want Lou. There is not a doubt he would help us get into the playoffs. But, I dont want to morgage the future on him. I'd rather take the chance on Reimer and Scrivens if thats the case. They will improve. They are also kids learning. Kessel going to the Canucks is laughable. But I am not willing to give up Reilly, Gardiner, FInn or our first for Lou. We have an issue with Center right now so its not like you will Get Grabovski either. Lups you can have. I think he is done with his career year. Kadri you can have, Bozak i'd rather keep, but you can have if it is a deal breaker. I know MG is high on him....or just hgh. Kessel will not go anywhere and either will Phaneuf. You can have just about anyone on the Marlies except for Colborne and Gards. Colborne is a big strapping center with upside so I cant see Burke moving him.

We will see who is right and who is wrong here. If Lou comes to T.O, i have a feeling many of you will be disappointed.
-So Kulemin's insane shooting percentage of 2010-2011 dipping below his career average probably isn't a fair assessment. The fair assessment is probably to take the average of the bad year and the astronomically good year. What do you get? His average 15-20 goals in mean nothing games.

I didn't compare Kulemin to Malkin and Gaborik in terms of playing, just saying its a piss poor excuse to scoring 7 goals, and then have you try and sell him like he is a perrenial 30 goal scorer.

-Kessel has NEVER scored 40 goals in the NHL. Yet leaf fans continue to label him as a 50 goal scorer. I'm not doubting his skill, or his ability to score. I just find it incredibly humourous to continually hear him called "50 goal scorer".

-Kessel is PPG in the playoffs, never said he wasn't....but you're acting like he is Joe Sakic or Wayne Gretzky....I didn't ever say I didn't like him or didn't want him on my team (dont really), just that his 'clutch' ability has a pretty small sample...one that includes healthy scratches.

-Classic, I love blaming the coach. I also love the 'hanging with the best of them' that is laughable. Quiting on a coach speaks poorly of your entire organization and players. The same coach that had them in 6th and hanging with the best of them was the one who is also to blame for them continually being ****** under Carlyle?

Face facts your goalies are your problem not your coach.

And you are right, Canucks fans will be disapointed when Luongo is traded. Quite clearly he'll be the best piece involved in any trade, and will help that team make the playoffs. i'd be even more upset if it was the Leafs....you guys don't deserve a player like Lu.

Frankly, I can't see anything Toronto has that they'd be willing to move that would make me trade Luongo there.

Grabovski, Gardiner, Kessel, Rielly, and your 1st are the only valuable pieces...everything else is a reclamation project. I'm not of the opinion that trading proven elite players for reclamation projects is a good thing.

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10-31-2012, 03:51 PM
  #392
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-So Kulemin's insane shooting percentage of 2010-2011 dipping below his career average probably isn't a fair assessment. The fair assessment is probably to take the average of the bad year and the astronomically good year. What do you get? His average 15-20 goals in mean nothing games.

I didn't compare Kulemin to Malkin and Gaborik in terms of playing, just saying its a piss poor excuse to scoring 7 goals, and then have you try and sell him like he is a perrenial 30 goal scorer.

-Kessel has NEVER scored 40 goals in the NHL. Yet leaf fans continue to label him as a 50 goal scorer. I'm not doubting his skill, or his ability to score. I just find it incredibly humourous to continually hear him called "50 goal scorer".

-Kessel is PPG in the playoffs, never said he wasn't....but you're acting like he is Joe Sakic or Wayne Gretzky....I didn't ever say I didn't like him or didn't want him on my team (dont really), just that his 'clutch' ability has a pretty small sample...one that includes healthy scratches.

-Classic, I love blaming the coach. I also love the 'hanging with the best of them' that is laughable. Quiting on a coach speaks poorly of your entire organization and players. The same coach that had them in 6th and hanging with the best of them was the one who is also to blame for them continually being ****** under Carlyle?

Face facts your goalies are your problem not your coach.

And you are right, Canucks fans will be disapointed when Luongo is traded. Quite clearly he'll be the best piece involved in any trade, and will help that team make the playoffs. i'd be even more upset if it was the Leafs....you guys don't deserve a player like Lu.

Frankly, I can't see anything Toronto has that they'd be willing to move that would make me trade Luongo there.

Grabovski, Gardiner, Kessel, Rielly, and your 1st are the only valuable pieces...everything else is a reclamation project. I'm not of the opinion that trading proven elite players for reclamation projects is a good thing.
Ok, here we go again.

-so any goal a player gets in the regular season is considered a "Mean nothing" game?

-Not once did I say Kulemin was a perrenial goal scorer. You just spun that. So I will make you a deal....we play nice and not spin things and put words in the other posters mouths.....deal?

-You shouldn't lump me in with traditional leaf fans. I have coahced for 22 years at all level including university and junior. Go to my profile and have a look. I also played 8 games of soccer with team Canada in 1990. I have never called Kessel a "50 goal scorer". Not once. I said IMO, Kessel will score 50. Thats not the same thing. So, again, please don't put words in my mouth. I know he has yet to score 40. I believe that his next 82 game schedule, he will score between 44 and 48 goals. The fifty the next year. I think he will peak at about 55 to 57 goals and I think he will do it 3 or 4 times in his career. With the new obstruction rules coming down, he will have more free rein. I think you would agree that if Kessel has more freedom out there, he will make people pay. You did not answer my question. Do you not think Kessel can score 50?

-And Blaming the coach is something I don't normally agree with....unless it was in fact the coach. In this Case, it was Wilson. Everyone knows that....or why did burke fire his best friend? As for what you said about them doing so well, it is often about players doing well inspite of their coach. That 80's oilers team would have won with or without Sather. Any team will play well until they get sick and tired of their Coach at them all the time.

-And yes, Goalies were ALSO the problem. But Wilson did not had a D system in place, nor did he have a PK system in place. He also let the team get out of shape. so all this factors into the slide....if you speak with common sense.

-How are most of our prospects reclamation projects? How on earth does that work? By the way, we have a very good bunch of prospects that went to the Calder cup final last year....unless you think that was a fluke too?

-So out of our whole organization, you cannot put together about 3 or 4 players you would take that did not include the very small list I mentioned?

Gyspers, Holzer, Ashton, Fraser, etc plus we have a bunch in the minors. You have a very good 33 year old goalie with a crap contract.

come on dude.

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10-31-2012, 03:57 PM
  #393
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By the way, we have a very good bunch of prospects that went to the Calder cup final last year....unless you think that was a fluke too?
An AHL club winning the Calder Cup isn't necessarily indictative of a strong prospect cupboard (which the Leafs may or may not have - I don't follow the team or the Marlies that closely enough to render an opinion one way or another).

We had a AHL club reach the finals a few years ago largely only because of the goaltending (Schneider) & a "hired gun" (Jason Krog - fringe NHLer but allstar AHLer).

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10-31-2012, 04:09 PM
  #394
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An AHL club winning the Calder Cup isn't necessarily indictative of a strong prospect cupboard (which the Leafs may or may not have - I don't follow the team or the Marlies that closely enough to render an opinion one way or another).

We had a AHL club reach the finals a few years ago largely only because of the goaltending (Schneider) & a "hired gun" (Jason Krog - fringe NHLer but allstar AHLer).
I guess you will have to take my word for it.....

We do have great prospects. We have not been this excited about a leaf team in decades.

Our goalies did well last year, but the marlies played as a team. Eakins is an NHL ready coach. Many of us fans wanted him over Carlyle.

The problem with all this either way is timing. I really don't think MG wants to keep Lou and I don't think Lou wants to stay.

I also think Burke wants a goalie, but is stubborn enough to go with what we have. If Reimer returns to his rookie form, then we will be happy. It is my opinion Burke should be going after a big proven center first.

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10-31-2012, 04:15 PM
  #395
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I guess you will have to take my word for it.....

We do have great prospects. We have not been this excited about a leaf team in decades.

Our goalies did well last year, but the marlies played as a team. Eakins is an NHL ready coach. Many of us fans wanted him over Carlyle.
Well the only Marlie I'm familiar with is the dude that Don Cherry seem to always pimping on H.N.I.C....




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10-31-2012, 04:20 PM
  #396
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Arnaster, just a note on Kessel then we can be done with it. He has scored 99 goals in the last 3 years without a center. When Kessel was 21 he scored 36 with a good center. He scored 37 last year without a center. Bozak was the center on the first line. Eveyrone, and I mean everyone agrees Bozak is a third line center.

Kessel will score 50 no problem when the leafs land a proven center.

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10-31-2012, 04:21 PM
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Well the only Marlie I'm familiar with is the dude that Don Cherry seem to always pimping on H.N.I.C....



lmao.....


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10-31-2012, 04:23 PM
  #398
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lmao.....

Crap because of my infrractions, I cant edit.

Just so you know why I think that is funny is because Caputi has long since been traded.

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10-31-2012, 04:30 PM
  #399
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Arnaster, just a note on Kessel then we can be done with it. He has scored 99 goals in the last 3 years without a center. When Kessel was 21 he scored 36 with a good center. He scored 37 last year without a center. Bozak was the center on the first line. Eveyrone, and I mean everyone agrees Bozak is a third line center.

Kessel will score 50 no problem when the leafs land a proven center.
Kessel is a good goal scorer...one of the best.

Still hasn't cracked 40. That's the part I find funny, typical Leaf fans call him a 50 goal scorer all the time. He hasn't reached those totals, so he cannot be called one.

This is a tired argument and really has nothing to do with Luongo, but I will reiterate.

Toronto has very few pieces I'd move Luongo for (even if he has a 'crap' contract, one so crappy the league has outlawed anymore like it, because its such a bad thing for the team, you know to have a goalie count for less on the cap than his peers...what is Luongo now the 10th highest cap hit for a goalie?).

In all honesty, I hope you guys stick with Reimer.

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10-31-2012, 04:37 PM
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Crap because of my infrractions, I cant edit.

Just so you know why I think that is funny is because Caputi has long since been traded.
I was referring to Zigomanis (might be just me but I recall Cherry ranting about the Leafs not bringing him up from the Marlies constantly).

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