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NHL Draft - Prospects Discuss hockey prospects from all over the world and the NHL Draft.

LW Anthony Mantha - Val d'Or, QMJHL (2013, 20th overall, Detroit)

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Old
11-03-2013, 10:13 PM
  #451
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Originally Posted by Ohashi_Jouzu View Post
Keeping with a Red Wings theme, it's kind of like looking at Franzen vs Datsyuk/Zetterberg at the surface level. Franzen is huge, very fast for his size, and scores as many (if not more) goals as Dats/Zetts, certainly uses his size to his advantage much more than either of them. But... you wouldn't give up either of them 1 for 1 to get Franzen because of how their skills contribute to a 200 ft possession/transition game, AND that dynamic offense, and skills that require little time/space to make things happen.

Now I'm certainly not attributing Selke-type defense to Drouin, nor am I calling him an accomplished centre yet, for that matter. But if we're talking about projections, and since we're directly referring to the draft I guess we are, then that's the kind of thing that you have to consider in today's game.
Drouin hardly even plays defence lol

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11-04-2013, 08:11 AM
  #452
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Originally Posted by Ohashi_Jouzu View Post
Keeping with a Red Wings theme, it's kind of like looking at Franzen vs Datsyuk/Zetterberg at the surface level. Franzen is huge, very fast for his size, and scores as many (if not more) goals as Dats/Zetts, certainly uses his size to his advantage much more than either of them. But... you wouldn't give up either of them 1 for 1 to get Franzen because of how their skills contribute to a 200 ft possession/transition game, AND that dynamic offense, and skills that require little time/space to make things happen.

Now I'm certainly not attributing Selke-type defense to Drouin, nor am I calling him an accomplished centre yet, for that matter. But if we're talking about projections, and since we're directly referring to the draft I guess we are, then that's the kind of thing that you have to consider in today's game.
I'm assuming you're bringing that comparison in the sense that Drouin is Datsyuk/Zetterberg and Mantha is Franzen? Well, Franzen is not a better offensive player than Dats/Zet. Mantha's offense this year has been better than Drouin and on a worse team.

Once again I'm not saying he's a better prospect, but I don't think the gap is that big. It would have been interesting to see where Mantha would have went last year in the draft had he played for a team like Halifax for example. It would have been easily top-10 imo.

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11-04-2013, 09:42 AM
  #453
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Originally Posted by Birko19 View Post
I'm assuming you're bringing that comparison in the sense that Drouin is Datsyuk/Zetterberg and Mantha is Franzen? Well, Franzen is not a better offensive player than Dats/Zet. Mantha's offense this year has been better than Drouin and on a worse team.

Once again I'm not saying he's a better prospect, but I don't think the gap is that big. It would have been interesting to see where Mantha would have went last year in the draft had he played for a team like Halifax for example. It would have been easily top-10 imo.
I'd say Mantha isn't a "better" offensive player than Drouin, but he sure finishes plays and is productive in the offensive zone. Point continues to be, you fit guys like Franzen and Mantha around the guys who are going to get the puck the 100+ feet to the offensive zone driving the transition, and get pucks to them no matter where they are - not the other way around, usually.

Drouin has more in the way of Datsyuk/Zetterberg-like stick/puck/skating skills than Mantha, I think that much is abundantly clear, despite Mantha possessing impressive speed and a great shot, himself. Still remains to be see whether Mantha turns out to be the Franzen beside a Datsyuk, or the Ovechkin beside a Backstrom, but anywhere in that range makes for a good return on a 20th overall pick, for sure.

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11-04-2013, 10:56 AM
  #454
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I think in the end he turns out to be a top 10 player out of the draft, but it's way early to definitively make that call.

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11-04-2013, 08:37 PM
  #455
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Mantha is a monster this season, but people comparing him to Drouin forget that Mantha is playing his fourth season in the Q and that he was born one day late from being eligible to the 2012 draft. Mantha had 89 points in his third season(1.33 ppg pace), while Drouin has 23 points in 12 games(1.92 ppg pace).

I can't wait to watch Mantha in Ahl next season, especially to see how he handles the physicality.

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11-04-2013, 09:05 PM
  #456
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Originally Posted by c3z4r View Post
Mantha is a monster this season, but people comparing him to Drouin forget that Mantha is playing his fourth season in the Q and that he was born one day late from being eligible to the 2012 draft. Mantha had 89 points in his third season(1.33 ppg pace), while Drouin has 23 points in 12 games(1.92 ppg pace).

I can't wait to watch Mantha in Ahl next season, especially to see how he handles the physicality.
Surely you can't count the 2 games that Mantha played as a 15 years old as an extra year of experience. Mantha is 6 months older than Drouin. Sorry but I don't but those arguments.

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11-04-2013, 09:56 PM
  #457
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Originally Posted by c3z4r View Post
Mantha is a monster this season, but people comparing him to Drouin forget that Mantha is playing his fourth season in the Q and that he was born one day late from being eligible to the 2012 draft. Mantha had 89 points in his third season(1.33 ppg pace), while Drouin has 23 points in 12 games(1.92 ppg pace).

I can't wait to watch Mantha in Ahl next season, especially to see how he handles the physicality.
You also really can't compare last year's ppg since Drouin played on one of the best teams in chl history while mantha basically plays by himself in val d'or

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11-04-2013, 10:43 PM
  #458
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I've seen Mantha play and I see him ending up as a player similar to JVR. Both players use their size to their advantage, but don't play a physical game.

I see Mantha as a 30-30 type player, which certainly isn't bad, but I dont see him being much more. From what I've seen of him he knows that he's bigger than most players in the Q, and he makes power moves to protect the puck from players who simply aren't big enough to get the puck from him. He won't be able to do that so easily in the NHL.

I think next year in the AHL will give us a much better idea of what to expect from him. For now, I'm thoroughly enjoying his time in the Q.

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11-04-2013, 11:42 PM
  #459
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I like Mantha a lot. I think comparisons to guys like JVR and Neal are good ones, he has that size, power, skating, skill, shot and goal scoring instincts that make for very effective NHL wingers. He will score plenty at the NHL level, I feel pretty confident saying that.

However, I have to disagree with those saying they'd take him over Drouin. Even if everything pans out perfectly I can't see Mantha being much better than JVR or Neal. I'd say his upside is a really effective "complementary star," a 1st liner but not a guy who carries your offence. Drouin, though, has hands and hockey sense that are truly, truly special. I could honestly see him becoming a Patrick Kane level player, who I have way ahead of guys like Neal and JVR. Mantha is a man amongst boys right now, but in the long run I think Drouin's hands and hockey IQ are more likely to turn him into a big time star than Mantha's physical tools.

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Old
11-05-2013, 07:36 AM
  #460
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Originally Posted by Brandel View Post
You also really can't compare last year's ppg since Drouin played on one of the best teams in chl history while mantha basically plays by himself in val d'or
Drouin's p/g actually went up while MacKinnon was injured...for the record.

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11-05-2013, 08:36 AM
  #461
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Originally Posted by Cujomi View Post
Drouin's p/g actually went up while MacKinnon was injured...for the record.
i know, but i said team, not mackinnon

the entire roster was stacked last year

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11-05-2013, 05:53 PM
  #462
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Originally Posted by Petes2424 View Post
Mantha is the type of player who has no business playing in the CHL anymore. I said it before the draft and I'll say it again. He was one of 3-5 guys who are only going to really grow as a player playing at the NHL level. His pure skill, power, etc, cannot grow playing against lower competition where guys like Domi and Drouin can grow, get stronger, etc.
I think this highlights some of the flaws in the current development system of Major Junior and Minor Pro leagues. If a player has outgrown the CHL, it's just silly that they cannot get an exemption to go to the AHL if they're not 20 yet.

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11-05-2013, 06:03 PM
  #463
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I think this highlights some of the flaws in the current development system of Major Junior and Minor Pro leagues. If a player has outgrown the CHL, it's just silly that they cannot get an exemption to go to the AHL if they're not 20 yet.
Considering 18/19 year olds that are "good enough" are allowed to play at the NHL level, it doesn't make much sense to keep the same aged players out of the AHL if junior is deemed "no challenge" for them. Having said that, I think it does help teams be very careful about which 18/19 year old kids they push into the NHL arena, and prevent them from simply turning the AHL into an NHL team-funded development program for 18/19 year olds.

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11-06-2013, 09:04 PM
  #464
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Another 2a tonight. He has only played 3 games this year (/18) where he hasn't gotten at least 2 points.


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11-06-2013, 09:45 PM
  #465
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Originally Posted by Brandel View Post
Another 2a tonight. He has only played 3 games this year (/18) where he hasn't gotten at least 2 points.
The knock on him was consistency/compete level but honestly even if he isnt going to be a big tough forechecker, he is the definition of consistent this year

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11-06-2013, 09:48 PM
  #466
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Another 2a tonight. He has only played 3 games this year (/18) where he hasn't gotten at least 2 points.

It also shows he's slowly coming back to earth. Basically 3 PPG in September, 2.5 PPG in October and 2PPG in November so far.

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11-07-2013, 08:59 AM
  #467
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It also shows he's slowly coming back to earth. Basically 3 PPG in September, 2.5 PPG in October and 2PPG in November so far.
And this is why everyone should have a class in stats.

The sample sizes in September and November are both too small to make any claims that his ppg is dropping. If this were three equal sample sizes, sure you could make this claim, but with 10 of 18 games being on one month and one sample being only 3 there isn't much you can pull out of this.

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11-07-2013, 09:19 AM
  #468
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And this is why everyone should have a class in stats.

The sample sizes in September and November are both too small to make any claims that his ppg is dropping. If this were three equal sample sizes, sure you could make this claim, but with 10 of 18 games being on one month and one sample being only 3 there isn't much you can pull out of this.
Sample size and stats have nothing to do with this. We aren't looking at a sample of his season, we are looking at his * entire* season. It makes no more sense to say his PPG was 3 in the first place, considering that is based on a minuscule number of games (10) as well. Trying to project a players season based on any small stretch of games is likely to produce inaccurate results most of the time

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11-09-2013, 01:39 PM
  #469
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I've been trying to find a player with similar size and skill that Mantha projects out to have? If he develops to reach his full potential will he be similar to Ryan Getzlav but a winger? I've never seen the kid play, so honestly I have no basis for that except his size and production. If he ends up 6'5 230 then he's a really interesting piece. I know Getzlav didn't score a lot in the CHL, but he's in the relm of that size.

Does anyone have a projection to who his game is compatible with if he he reaches full potential and if he flops?

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11-09-2013, 01:46 PM
  #470
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Originally Posted by Shaman464 View Post
And this is why everyone should have a class in stats.

The sample sizes in September and November are both too small to make any claims that his ppg is dropping. If this were three equal sample sizes, sure you could make this claim, but with 10 of 18 games being on one month and one sample being only 3 there isn't much you can pull out of this.
The irony...

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11-09-2013, 02:02 PM
  #471
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I've been trying to find a player with similar size and skill that Mantha projects out to have? If he develops to reach his full potential will he be similar to Ryan Getzlav but a winger? I've never seen the kid play, so honestly I have no basis for that except his size and production. If he ends up 6'5 230 then he's a really interesting piece. I know Getzlav didn't score a lot in the CHL, but he's in the relm of that size.

Does anyone have a projection to who his game is compatible with if he he reaches full potential and if he flops?
I did not know that Getzlaf became Russian.

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11-09-2013, 02:07 PM
  #472
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I did not know that Getzlaf became Russian.
Edit: derp


Last edited by SimplySolace: 11-10-2013 at 06:22 PM.
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11-09-2013, 02:35 PM
  #473
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Originally Posted by nickyno72 View Post
I've been trying to find a player with similar size and skill that Mantha projects out to have? If he develops to reach his full potential will he be similar to Ryan Getzlav but a winger? I've never seen the kid play, so honestly I have no basis for that except his size and production. If he ends up 6'5 230 then he's a really interesting piece. I know Getzlav didn't score a lot in the CHL, but he's in the relm of that size.

Does anyone have a projection to who his game is compatible with if he he reaches full potential and if he flops?
He's more Corey Perry than Getzlaf. My comparison for Mantha in the NHL would be Lupul.

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11-09-2013, 02:40 PM
  #474
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What are you talking about? Confuse CHL with KHL?
Did you not read what I quoted or is the pun over your head?

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11-09-2013, 03:44 PM
  #475
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Did you not read what I quoted or is the pun over your head?
I chuckled. I didn't realize I turned him Russian at first, then when I read it out loud I had the lightbulb go off in my head. I've never seen anyone pick up on my misspelling of Getzlaf.

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