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Bettman and his owners are greedy pigs:They already WON

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02-05-2005, 09:47 AM
  #1
RangerBoy
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Bettman and his owners are greedy pigs:They already WON

The NHLPA takes tons of abuse on these boards and in cases it's deserved.The NHL is kidding when they expect the players to just accept the slop they proposed on Wednesday.The NHL was WON this lockout.The players are willing to concede.The players are willing to crack.The players are willing to bend.The players are willing to break.Unfortunately,Bettman won't let them.Not only does Bettman want to win but he wants to break the union.Bettman wants to take back everything the players won in collective bargainning.That is not right.Bettman could have made an excellent deal for the NHL by now which would have allowed the players to come out of this lockout with some dignity and some pride but he won't allow that to happen.Bettman has no idea of the damage this lockout is causing in the U.S.He wants to grab the players by the throat and choke the life out of them.

Bettman was the kid in the neighborhood who was picked last when teams were being selected.He must have said to himself that one day he would show all of these jocks that they made a mistake picking him last.Bettman can make a deal here but refuses.Soft cap with a hard luxury tax.A salary cap not linked to revenue.Bettman will never cancel the season.It would hurt his case with the NLRB and the owners/NHL would have to give back all of the money for 2004-05 season.

As Jeremy Roenick said "Throw the players a bone".Guarantee the cap would be between $45-50 million and none of the floating salary range % of the gross

I agree with John Davidson,Brian Burke,Dean Brown and EJ Hradek.The NHL is asking for far too much.It's not worth destroying the remaining remnants of the NHL.Bettman can make an excellent deal for the owners but he would rather practice his scorched earth policy of his way or no way and his way is the right way

It's February 5th and no hockey has been played.Bettman refuses to cancel the season.Bettman refuses to budge an inch.Roenick,Barrett Jackman and Michael Peca have made comments about the players willing to accept cost certainty if the numbers were better.Cost certainty can be achieved w/o Bettman's system

The NHL will be a better place when Bettman is no longer around to run the league into the ground.No more New York NBA wannabe corporate lawyers

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02-05-2005, 09:51 AM
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Bettman is an employee of the owners.

He is doing what THEY want. Period.

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02-05-2005, 09:55 AM
  #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RangerBoy
The NHLPA takes tons of abuse on these boards and in cases it's deserved.The NHL is kidding when they expect the players to just accept the slop they proposed on Wednesday.The NHL was WON this lockout.The players are willing to concede.The players are willing to crack.The players are willing to bend.The players are willing to break.Unfortunately,Bettman won't let them.Not only does Bettman want to win but he wants to break the union.Bettman wants to take back everything the players won in collective bargainning.That is not right.Bettman could have made an excellent deal for the NHL by now which would have allowed the players to come out of this lockout with some dignity and some pride but he won't allow that to happen.Bettman has no idea of the damage this lockout is causing in the U.S.He wants to grab the players by the throat and choke the life out of them.

Bettman was the kid in the neighborhood who was picked last when teams were being selected.He must have said to himself that one day he would show all of these jocks that they made a mistake picking him last.Bettman can make a deal here but refuses.Soft cap with a hard luxury tax.A salary cap not linked to revenue.Bettman will never cancel the season.It would hurt his case with the NLRB and the owners/NHL would have to give back all of the money for 2004-05 season.

As Jeremy Roenick said "Throw the players a bone".Guarantee the cap would be between $45-50 million and none of the floating salary range % of the gross

I agree with John Davidson,Brian Burke,Dean Brown and EJ Hradek.The NHL is asking for far too much.It's not worth destroying the remaining remnants of the NHL.Bettman can make an excellent deal for the owners but he would rather practice his scorched earth policy of his way or no way and his way is the right way

It's February 5th and no hockey has been played.Bettman refuses to cancel the season.Bettman refuses to budge an inch.Roenick,Barrett Jackman and Michael Peca have made comments about the players willing to accept cost certainty if the numbers were better.Cost certainty can be achieved w/o Bettman's system

The NHL will be a better place when Bettman is no longer around to run the league into the ground.No more New York NBA wannabe corporate lawyers

If Bettman and the owners guaranteed 45 - 50 million cap then owners would lose more money than they did before. The players are not prepared to guarantee any of their proposals so a compromise seems to be in the middle with guaranteed linkage on a sliding scale.

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02-05-2005, 09:56 AM
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Bettman isn't negotiating with Roenick, he's negotiating with Goodenow and Goodenow has only offered slop to the NHL. The 24% non-solution is a total sham (the players have already lost more than 24% by making the lockout last this long). And his 20 cent tax on payrolls of 50 million is a spit in the face to NHL owners. The guy plays hardball, and he struck out big time.

 
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02-05-2005, 09:59 AM
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an about-face, Ranger Boy?


I agree with much of what you have to say, as Stephen A. Smith says, this mess is going on because Gary Bettman refuses to throw the players a bone. The NHL want to keep taking ant taking and taking but they don't want to give.

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02-05-2005, 10:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eye
If Bettman and the owners guaranteed 45 - 50 million cap then owners would lose more money than they did before. The players are not prepared to guarantee any of their proposals so a compromise seems to be in the middle with guaranteed linkage on a sliding scale.
you can't read -

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02-05-2005, 10:04 AM
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The deal is right there before their eyes

Take current NHL proposal and add one more tier 42-50 million at 200% luxury tax. It's a bone that allows big market teams the opporunity to mismanage like Goodenow and some players want. You can also tinker with the arbitration and qualifying offers but the basis for an agreement is RIGHT THERE BEFORE YOUR EYES BOB.

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02-05-2005, 10:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RangerBoy
The NHLPA takes tons of abuse on these boards and in cases it's deserved.The NHL is kidding when they expect the players to just accept the slop they proposed on Wednesday.The NHL was WON this lockout.The players are willing to concede.The players are willing to crack.The players are willing to bend.The players are willing to break.Unfortunately,Bettman won't let them.Not only does Bettman want to win but he wants to break the union.Bettman wants to take back everything the players won in collective bargainning.That is not right.Bettman could have made an excellent deal for the NHL by now which would have allowed the players to come out of this lockout with some dignity and some pride but he won't allow that to happen.Bettman has no idea of the damage this lockout is causing in the U.S.He wants to grab the players by the throat and choke the life out of them.

Bettman was the kid in the neighborhood who was picked last when teams were being selected.He must have said to himself that one day he would show all of these jocks that they made a mistake picking him last.Bettman can make a deal here but refuses.Soft cap with a hard luxury tax.A salary cap not linked to revenue.Bettman will never cancel the season.It would hurt his case with the NLRB and the owners/NHL would have to give back all of the money for 2004-05 season.

As Jeremy Roenick said "Throw the players a bone".Guarantee the cap would be between $45-50 million and none of the floating salary range % of the gross

I agree with John Davidson,Brian Burke,Dean Brown and EJ Hradek.The NHL is asking for far too much.It's not worth destroying the remaining remnants of the NHL.Bettman can make an excellent deal for the owners but he would rather practice his scorched earth policy of his way or no way and his way is the right way

It's February 5th and no hockey has been played.Bettman refuses to cancel the season.Bettman refuses to budge an inch.Roenick,Barrett Jackman and Michael Peca have made comments about the players willing to accept cost certainty if the numbers were better.Cost certainty can be achieved w/o Bettman's system

The NHL will be a better place when Bettman is no longer around to run the league into the ground.No more New York NBA wannabe corporate lawyers
Great post. I agree with you 100%

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02-05-2005, 10:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eye
The deal is right there before their eyes

Take current NHL proposal and add one more tier 42-50 million at 200% luxury tax. It's a bone that allows big market teams the opporunity to mismanage like Goodenow and some players want. You can also tinker with the arbitration and qualifying offers but the basis for an agreement is RIGHT THERE BEFORE YOUR EYES BOB.
Open you eyes bob? What makes you think Gary would accept a luxury tax?? I think your lost in these talks...Gary is NOT going to accept any kind of Luxury tax.

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02-05-2005, 10:17 AM
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How did the owners go from spending ridiculous amounts of money on players to "greedy pigs" in such a short time?

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02-05-2005, 10:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eye
The players are not prepared to guarantee any of their proposals so a compromise seems to be in the middle with guaranteed linkage on a sliding scale.
thats a lie.

the players offered if their luxury tax didnt work, they would swtich to a cap. 3 years of LT and then if it was not working a hard cap.

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02-05-2005, 10:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Crazy Lunatic
Bettman isn't negotiating with Roenick, he's negotiating with Goodenow and the NHL has only offered slop to Goodenow.
i corrected your mistake.

dr

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02-05-2005, 10:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DR
thats a lie.

the players offered if their luxury tax didnt work, they would swtich to a cap. 3 years of LT and then if it was not working a hard cap.

dr
That's not quite true, given that the players haven't made an offer since Dec. 9.

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02-05-2005, 10:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eye
The deal is right there before their eyes

Take current NHL proposal and add one more tier 42-50 million at 200% luxury tax. It's a bone that allows big market teams the opporunity to mismanage like Goodenow and some players want. You can also tinker with the arbitration and qualifying offers but the basis for an agreement is RIGHT THERE BEFORE YOUR EYES BOB.
there is alot more things wrong with the current NHL proposal than simply a linked hard cap.

the NHL's right to abolish arbitration
maximum 3 year contracts to name
14 day signing deadline
arbitration deferal
24% rollback (what a joke, this was an ALTERNATIVE to a cap, not an offer within)

to name a few.

dr

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02-05-2005, 10:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CarlRacki
That's not quite true, given that the players haven't made an offer since Dec. 9.
you have a fair comment. but its not like the players didnt float the offer by the owners.

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02-05-2005, 10:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FLYLine4LIFE
Open you eyes bob? What makes you think Gary would accept a luxury tax?? I think your lost in these talks...Gary is NOT going to accept any kind of Luxury tax.
in fact, i am hearing that the offer on the table is the only offer the NHL will accept. there is no negotiating of those points.

lump it or leave it.

bob left.

dr

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02-05-2005, 10:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CarlRacki
That's not quite true, given that the players haven't made an offer since Dec. 9.
Maybe not a formal ones...doesn mean they werent proposing anything like changes to the NHL one to the NHL since then.

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02-05-2005, 10:30 AM
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How dare those greedy owners not want to lose any more money to feed the egos of those poor players!


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02-05-2005, 10:31 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eye
The deal is right there before their eyes

Take current NHL proposal and add one more tier 42-50 million at 200% luxury tax. It's a bone that allows big market teams the opporunity to mismanage like Goodenow and some players want. You can also tinker with the arbitration and qualifying offers but the basis for an agreement is RIGHT THERE BEFORE YOUR EYES BOB.

Tell this to Gary Bettman! He is the one keeping it at $42 million. There are plenty of players who have come out and said that a higher number would be just fine with them. An agreement is RIGHT THERE BEFORE YOUR EYES, GARY!

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02-05-2005, 10:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by djhn579
How dare those greedy owners not want to lose any more money to feed the egos of those poor players!

its beyond that. the players are prepared to negotiate a system that helps curb spending. the owners are more interested in turning back the clock 20 years and crushing the union.

look at their proposal, it goes well beyond reasonable and into the realm of bullying. these guys who follow the league very closely and know the insiders belive it too.

Quote:
John Davidson,Brian Burke,Dean Brown and EJ Hradek.The NHL is asking for far too much
if they had made a proposal that didnt contain so many "what the hell's?", the players would be voting on it right now. the proposal they made is easy for the players to not let get to vote. there is no pressure on the executive to vote on the garbage offered by the owners.

dr

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02-05-2005, 10:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by djhn579
How dare those greedy owners not want to lose any more money to feed the egos of those poor players!

Over the past 10 years as a group the owners have lost over a billion dollars...the problem is that Gary is trying to get it all back ASAP, and although I am more pro owner than player, if it took 10 years to lose that money, then you shouldn't try and get it all back now...BTW, for the league to move forward IMO both Gary and Bob should be canned!

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02-05-2005, 10:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by go kim johnsson
Tell this to Gary Bettman! He is the one keeping it at $42 million. There are plenty of players who have come out and said that a higher number would be just fine with them. An agreement is RIGHT THERE BEFORE YOUR EYES, GARY!
Just so we're clear, Bettman is an employee of the owners just like Goodenow is an employee of the players. These things aren't being orchestrated by either man individually. They're doing their employees' bidding.

As for the number of players .... it doesn't matter unless the players that count, i.e. the executive council, either takes that offer to the owners and/or lets their membership vote on it. I'd bet that if the players went to the owners with a reasonable cap figure ($45-$47 million) the owners would jump on it.

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02-05-2005, 10:40 AM
  #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BLONG7
Over the past 10 years as a group the owners have lost over a billion dollars...the problem is that Gary is trying to get it all back ASAP, and although I am more pro owner than player, if it took 10 years to lose that money, then you shouldn't try and get it all back now...BTW, for the league to move forward IMO both Gary and Bob should be canned!
Canned for what? Doing as their bosses instruct?

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02-05-2005, 10:43 AM
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Originally Posted by CarlRacki
Canned for what? Doing as their bosses instruct?
They should have been doing this in Sept/Oct... they both have failed miserably...

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02-05-2005, 10:46 AM
  #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BLONG7
Over the past 10 years as a group the owners have lost over a billion dollars...
which is roughly how much the players have lost this season.

what concessions are the owners going to make to allow the players to get back on an even track ?

hmm ?

dr

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