HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Atlantic Division > Boston Bruins
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Red Sox/MLB 2012 Thread Part XX-Time for Rebuilding

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
11-28-2012, 03:32 PM
  #576
LSCII
Dark Cloud
 
LSCII's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Central MA
Country: United States
Posts: 29,759
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by EverettMike View Post
I'd rather be signing a bunch of marginal starting pitchers with upside than marginal hitters with upside.

The lineup is already good enough even if you plug average players into the open spots.

The starting pitching is not.
Exactly. Improving your line up is pointless if you roll with the current rotation. The guy they really missed the boat on last year was Buerhle.

LSCII is offline  
Old
11-28-2012, 04:08 PM
  #577
bp13
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 12,199
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by EverettMike View Post
I'd rather be signing a bunch of marginal starting pitchers with upside than marginal hitters with upside.

The lineup is already good enough even if you plug average players into the open spots.

The starting pitching is not.
Agree and disagree.

The pitching is not good. We have two #2's (one is a health risk, the other doubled as a #5 NL starter last season), a #4 (Doubront) and a #5/25 (Horseface). That's it. And our bullpen is mediocre. So yeah, we need at least two more starters that are actual starters, not Aaron Cooke "maybe-I-won't-give-up-nine-in-the-first-three-innings-tonight" starters.

However I don't think the lineup is "good enough" offensively unless you mean "good enough" to not be bad, not good enough to win anything. Ellsbury is now somewhat of a question mark, Papi is that much older and coming off achilles surgery, WMB is still a kid though probably a solid #5 hitter, Gomes is what he is, Salty will never repeat 2012, Lavarnway sucks, Kalish sucks, Iglesias is a whole other level of suck. The bottom 3-4 of that lineup is gross. So I think they need help in the lineup. At the very least you can't be giving a few of those last 3 or 4 guys at-bats on the same nights unless you're looking to turn Fenway into a morgue.

bp13 is online now  
Old
11-28-2012, 04:09 PM
  #578
bp13
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 12,199
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by LSCII View Post
Exactly. Improving your line up is pointless if you roll with the current rotation. The guy they really missed the boat on last year was Buerhle.
Buerhle would have been perfect. Obviously with Lester being an absolute stiff it wouldn't have mattered, but Buehrle was a guy they should been on.

bp13 is online now  
Old
11-28-2012, 04:58 PM
  #579
Avs_19
Peter the Great
 
Avs_19's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Edmonton
Country: Canada
Posts: 43,838
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crossfire View Post
@Buster_ESPN: One very interesting possibility for the Red Sox: Brian Wilson, a N.H. native who likely will be non-tendered by the Giants later this week.

If he and Bailey can stay healthy and Bard doesn't pitch like a ****** the bullpen could be pretty good.
I really don't like Wilson. He's not that good and he's a clown. Tazawa was great last season and if he keeps that up, he'll be perfect for that late inning role Bard had when he was good. Also, I don't know why but I still have faith in Bailey as the closer.

Avs_19 is offline  
Old
11-28-2012, 05:05 PM
  #580
BostonBob
4 Ever The Greatest
 
BostonBob's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Vancouver, BC
Country: Canada
Posts: 5,707
vCash: 500
Tampa Bay just got a lot weaker.


from tsn.ca:

The Atlanta Braves have reportedly made a splash in the free agent market, signing former Tampa Bay Rays centre fielder B.J. Upton to a five-year, $75-million contract. The signing was first reported by Jerry Crasnick of ESPN.

The deal is pending a physical, so the Braves are not expected to announce the news until Thursday.

In his sixth full season with the Rays, the 28-year-old hit a career-best 28 home runs in 2012.

He also posted a .246 average with an OPS of .752 to go along with 78 RBI's and 31 stolen bases.

With their previous centre fielder, Michael Bourn a free agent, the Braves were in the market for a replacement.

BostonBob is offline  
Old
11-28-2012, 05:32 PM
  #581
Shaun
Registered User
 
Shaun's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Country: Italy
Posts: 22,934
vCash: 500
If Upton got 5/75 how much does Ellsbury get now? I don't think theres any chance at all we sign him.


Last edited by Shaun: 11-28-2012 at 06:02 PM.
Shaun is offline  
Old
11-28-2012, 06:06 PM
  #582
kman22
Registered User
 
kman22's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 1,677
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by LSCII View Post
Which young players are you talking about not burning service time for? Middlebrooks already showed he belongs. Kalish has spent a lot of time up, and if he's healthy, he showed he can contribute. Lavarnway is looking like he's not really the answer, so what do you really lose there? Ciriaco is 26-27 years old, so it's not like he's a hot prospect. Iglesias is at the make it or break it portion of his career, so again, what are you really losing if you give him a shot and he shows he belongs? Basically, worrying about service time for young guys versus signing retreads and marginal big league talent is laughable to me. Going with stop gap measures to avoid using their youth is exactly why they're in this position to start with.
Iglesias is 22. Make or break it is a huge stretch. Lavarnway needs a little more time. I was referring to bogaerts, bradley, etc., guys that haven't been up yet. But i still stand by signing stop gaps since I am sold on them not competing this year as is. Also, signing bad long term deals is what got them here I believe.

kman22 is online now  
Old
11-28-2012, 06:07 PM
  #583
JRull86
Formerly Guiledoom
 
JRull86's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: The Bing, MA
Country: United States
Posts: 11,722
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crossfire View Post
If Upton got 5/75 how much does Ellsbury get now? I don't think theres any chance at all we sign him.
More than that if he performs this year.

However, he's really only put together 1 great season. He's had a few good ones, but nothing stellar outside of 2011.

JRull86 is offline  
Old
11-28-2012, 06:36 PM
  #584
MioneRask134
Queen in the North
 
MioneRask134's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Hogwarts-617
Country: United States
Posts: 12,525
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Avs_19 View Post
I really don't like Wilson. He's not that good and he's a clown. Tazawa was great last season and if he keeps that up, he'll be perfect for that late inning role Bard had when he was good. Also, I don't know why but I still have faith in Bailey as the closer.
I remember everyone saying how Tazawa sucked. Now everyone loves the guy? Oh.



And he's not that good? Uh..hes better than what we have now. And as for the clown stuff? GOOD. I'd rather have a fun clown on my team than disrespectful drunks a la Beckett.


His stats from the last three years, ad career.



He's also a 3 time all star, NL saves champion, WS champion and he won the closer of the year award. Whether or not he closes or sets up for us, you can't deny the fact that he would immensely help our team and is not nearly a bum.

MioneRask134 is online now  
Old
11-28-2012, 06:41 PM
  #585
Hnidy Hnight
Registered User
 
Hnidy Hnight's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: North of Boston, MA
Country: United States
Posts: 5,382
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by BostonBob View Post
Tampa Bay just got a lot weaker.


from tsn.ca:

The Atlanta Braves have reportedly made a splash in the free agent market, signing former Tampa Bay Rays centre fielder B.J. Upton to a five-year, $75-million contract. The signing was first reported by Jerry Crasnick of ESPN.

The deal is pending a physical, so the Braves are not expected to announce the news until Thursday.

In his sixth full season with the Rays, the 28-year-old hit a career-best 28 home runs in 2012.

He also posted a .246 average with an OPS of .752 to go along with 78 RBI's and 31 stolen bases.

With their previous centre fielder, Michael Bourn a free agent, the Braves were in the market for a replacement.
I find that signing insane. Maybe I play too much fantasy baseball, but I think the guy is overrated. Every year it seems like people are waiting for him to reach his potential

Hnidy Hnight is offline  
Old
11-28-2012, 06:43 PM
  #586
robert terwilliger
the bart, the
 
robert terwilliger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: sw florida
Country: United States
Posts: 20,256
vCash: 500
i thought the goal was to have a proven closer.

wilson played for a winning team, right? check.
he played in the playoffs, right? check.
he won a world series by striking a guy out, right? check.
he does the "eccentric closer guy" thing that papelbon did, right? check.

the difference is that the red sox might be able to get him on a one or two year deal instead of basically having 4/52 tied up in a closer like it was 2006.

robert terwilliger is offline  
Old
11-28-2012, 06:57 PM
  #587
DKH
Registered User
 
DKH's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 31,745
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to DKH
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hnidy Hnight View Post
I find that signing insane. Maybe I play too much fantasy baseball, but I think the guy is overrated. Every year it seems like people are waiting for him to reach his potential
It is. Can you imagine what Josh Reddick thinks today (not saying he's better or the same player, but he's thinking he's pretty good and that is what awaits)

DKH is offline  
Old
11-28-2012, 07:13 PM
  #588
Hnidy Hnight
Registered User
 
Hnidy Hnight's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: North of Boston, MA
Country: United States
Posts: 5,382
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by DKH View Post
It is. Can you imagine what Josh Reddick thinks today (not saying he's better or the same player, but he's thinking he's pretty good and that is what awaits)
I think the market for Ellsbury is set barring disaster or injury. 20 mil per, 5+ years. Red Sox need to walk away.

Hnidy Hnight is offline  
Old
11-28-2012, 07:14 PM
  #589
robert terwilliger
the bart, the
 
robert terwilliger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: sw florida
Country: United States
Posts: 20,256
vCash: 500
they'll make him the one year offer and get the pick.

robert terwilliger is offline  
Old
11-28-2012, 07:56 PM
  #590
bruinswincup
Black&Gold4ever!!!!!
 
bruinswincup's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: New Hampshire
Country: United States
Posts: 1,784
vCash: 500
Send a message via Yahoo to bruinswincup Send a message via Skype™ to bruinswincup
Ellsbury is gone, JBJ is the future CF and our FO knows it.

bruinswincup is offline  
Old
11-28-2012, 07:59 PM
  #591
Kelly23
Pedroia and Drew
 
Kelly23's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Boston
Country: United States
Posts: 5,458
vCash: 500
Right now Ellsbury should be the guy everybody is trying to trade for he should be on the Market, with the weak Fa class teams might be more willing.

The only way we should hold on to him until the trade deadline is if we believe he will have a monster first half and get more value if a team is close to our demands but wont go there yet.

Kelly23 is offline  
Old
11-28-2012, 08:23 PM
  #592
Shaun
Registered User
 
Shaun's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Country: Italy
Posts: 22,934
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by bruinswincup View Post
Ellsbury is gone, JBJ is the future CF and our FO knows it.
Exactly which is why they should have traded him after 2011.

Shaun is offline  
Old
11-28-2012, 08:33 PM
  #593
Hnidy Hnight
Registered User
 
Hnidy Hnight's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: North of Boston, MA
Country: United States
Posts: 5,382
vCash: 500
I just hope when they do finally walk away from him, its not one of these Rob Braford spin jobs saying they couldnt afford him. They are the Red Sox, they no doubt can.

What I want to hear is we walked away because we felt it didnt make baseball sense.
That would be such a huge statement to the fans that their priority is good baseball decisions

Hnidy Hnight is offline  
Old
11-28-2012, 08:35 PM
  #594
Topshelf88
HFBoards Sponsor
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Country: United States
Posts: 4,993
vCash: 500
I would like to see them sign Wilson. 2 years would be ideal, he's better than any closer they have now.

Topshelf88 is offline  
Old
11-28-2012, 08:38 PM
  #595
Shaun
Registered User
 
Shaun's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Country: Italy
Posts: 22,934
vCash: 500
Jeff Passan ‏@JeffPassan
Sources: Royals "calling everyone" to trade Luke Hochevar and Bruce Chen. KC accelerating timetable to acquire starter, wants to free up $.

Shaun is offline  
Old
11-28-2012, 09:06 PM
  #596
MioneRask134
Queen in the North
 
MioneRask134's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Hogwarts-617
Country: United States
Posts: 12,525
vCash: 500
To be honest, I don't want to walk away from Ellsbury. And would like to sign him to a deal because I like his style of play and think he can be successful.

You can call it the Boras aspect, but here's something some of you might not know. Jackie Bradley Jr is a Boras client too. So when he puts up numbers here and is looking for a deal, are we going to call it the Boras factor too? I mean look. I called it when Kalish was injured and I said he's not ready. Last season he was too timid to even dive for the ball. I don't even consider him a top prospect anymore. I think we need to hold onto special players.

And call me crazy, I think Ellsbury is still special. And I'd like to see him be here for a long time.


That's just me though.

MioneRask134 is online now  
Old
11-28-2012, 09:13 PM
  #597
Hnidy Hnight
Registered User
 
Hnidy Hnight's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: North of Boston, MA
Country: United States
Posts: 5,382
vCash: 500
Still shocked a no time all star got 5/75. Hamilton is gonna crush it on this market

Hnidy Hnight is offline  
Old
11-28-2012, 10:22 PM
  #598
bruinswincup
Black&Gold4ever!!!!!
 
bruinswincup's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: New Hampshire
Country: United States
Posts: 1,784
vCash: 500
Send a message via Yahoo to bruinswincup Send a message via Skype™ to bruinswincup
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hnidy Hnight View Post
Still shocked a no time all star got 5/75. Hamilton is gonna crush it on this market
A lazy, horrible teammate, bust of a player.

bruinswincup is offline  
Old
11-28-2012, 11:51 PM
  #599
Shaun
Registered User
 
Shaun's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Country: Italy
Posts: 22,934
vCash: 500
Quote:
Rob Bradford ‏@bradfo
To reiterate: Red Sox, Royals talks very real, albeit not close to completion. Rays might have more desirable package.


Pete Abraham ‏@PeteAbe
Jon Lester for an OF prospect? That is crazy talk


Nick Cafardo ‏@nickcafardo
The Red Sox would have to know they could sign and/or trade for 2 starting pitchers if they consider tempting deal for Wil Myers for Lester


Alex Speier ‏@alexspeier
Intriguing aside to Lester/Myers speculation: Are power hitters now more difficult to develop than starters?

that makes me laugh

Shaun is offline  
Old
11-29-2012, 07:24 AM
  #600
LSCII
Dark Cloud
 
LSCII's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Central MA
Country: United States
Posts: 29,759
vCash: 500
Not really understanding the love as well as the expectations people have for Ellsbury cashing in. He may want and ask for 5 years at $20 Mill per, but the fact that the guy can't stay healthy will knock that number down substantially. The truth is that he's missed the majority of playing time 2 out of his last 3 seasons. Sure he played at a high level the one year he was healthy, but that season is the anomaly in his career, not the standard. In no way, shape, or form should any MLB executive give him a long term, overpriced dollar value type of deal. The dude is made out of glass.

LSCII is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:23 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2015 All Rights Reserved.